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I want to help out a member, I have an idea, and I need your help. PLEASE READ!!! by Hulki U. My-BFF
Started on: 10-30-2009 11:35 AM
Replies: 3149 (130709 views)
Last post by: JohnWPB on 05-27-2022 03:58 PM
Synthesis
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Report this Post11-10-2009 11:22 AM Click Here to See the Profile for SynthesisSend a Private Message to SynthesisEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Fiero STS:

Chris,

Are we doing anything with the suspension? New shocks, struts, tie rods, ball joints?


Tim,

I am having it inspected today. I am not sure what it needs yet, but am about to make a phone call.

Honestly, I'd LOVE to toss all new Sensa-tracs into the car all the way around, but I don't know how feasible that is currently from a cost perspective.
What are you thinking?
651-737-4400 Call me if you'd like.

Edit: Two pages in a row!

[This message has been edited by Synthesis (edited 11-10-2009).]

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Report this Post11-10-2009 11:29 AM Click Here to See the Profile for SynthesisSend a Private Message to SynthesisEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Synthesis

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Member since Feb 2002
The Mechanics at Tires Plus are determined to do the work on the car. I mentioned that Nereson's would do the labor, and Tires Plus said "Thank you, but no. We want to do this for Tyler."

The suspension is tight on the vehicle according to the inspection. Ball joints and tie rods are solid. There is a little play in the front bearings, but those will be inspected and repacked with the brake job.

More info incoming as I get it.

Edit: Jim at Tires Plus stated that the suspension is very tight. No ball joints/tie-rods needed. He also stated the shocks and struts look good all the way around. He is not seeing any leakage on them, and they feel fine.

They are just waiting on the parts to do it.
The car will go to the Body Shop today, I need to find a way to get it over there ASAP. Jim will be at Tires Plus until 6PM tonight, but the sooner it goes to the Body Shop, the better.

[This message has been edited by Synthesis (edited 11-10-2009).]

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Report this Post11-10-2009 11:47 AM Click Here to See the Profile for infinitewillSend a Private Message to infinitewillEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Chris,

Can you have someone at Tires plus get the number we discussed? I am against the wall on this deadline

\/\/
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Report this Post11-10-2009 11:52 AM Click Here to See the Profile for GTGeffSend a Private Message to GTGeffEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Synthesis:


Great. I am on the phone with the Fiero Store right now, getting a kit put together. I know other members are working on a kit as well, so extra clips and fasteners won't hurt.

I just want to make sure we have everything we need for the complete reassembly.

Tim, it will be great to have you there..


I will bring what I can dig up. I ordered a lot of this stuff from the Fiero STore for the "Stinger" re-paint that I ended up not using.
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Report this Post11-10-2009 11:57 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Fiero STSSend a Private Message to Fiero STSEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Well that is good that the suspension is in good shape. I just wanted to know so I could bring the proper tools. I will just bring my general tool box for doing body, interior, brakes and engine. Is the underside pretty rust free? just wondering about brake lines and such.
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Report this Post11-10-2009 12:01 PM Click Here to See the Profile for SynthesisSend a Private Message to SynthesisEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by GTGeff:


I will bring what I can dig up. I ordered a lot of this stuff from the Fiero STore for the "Stinger" re-paint that I ended up not using.


Jeff, Thanks! Can always use extras on hand, just in case.

Will, PMing you shortly. Sorry, it slipped my mind. Have my hands full. lol
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Report this Post11-10-2009 12:02 PM Click Here to See the Profile for SynthesisSend a Private Message to SynthesisEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Synthesis

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quote
Originally posted by Fiero STS:

Well that is good that the suspension is in good shape. I just wanted to know so I could bring the proper tools. I will just bring my general tool box for doing body, interior, brakes and engine. Is the underside pretty rust free? just wondering about brake lines and such.


From what I can tell, yes, it is fairly clean. Will ask since I am on the phone with Tires Plus right now.
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Hulki U. My-BFF
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Report this Post11-10-2009 12:08 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Hulki U. My-BFFSend a Private Message to Hulki U. My-BFFEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Is there anything you guys want me to help with? Whatever I can do.
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Report this Post11-10-2009 12:28 PM Click Here to See the Profile for SynthesisSend a Private Message to SynthesisEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Hulki U. My-BFF:

Is there anything you guys want me to help with? Whatever I can do.


Stand there and look good. :P

You have helped an immense amount simply by starting this thread.

We are all hyped up to do this, I can't believe we are still a week and a half away...

You have done a lot already. The flag is spectacular, and I can't wait to see it myself.

If you would like, the flag can ship to me, and I can put it in the case for Tyler, as long as it gets here before next Friday. The case would need to be here at the same time.

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Hulki U. My-BFF
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Report this Post11-10-2009 12:37 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Hulki U. My-BFFSend a Private Message to Hulki U. My-BFFEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The flag will never make it there by then. When it leaves here on Thursday, it will take roughly 14-16 days to get to you. Sending you a PM.
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Report this Post11-10-2009 12:42 PM Click Here to See the Profile for SynthesisSend a Private Message to SynthesisEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Hulki U. My-BFF:

The flag will never make it there by then. When it leaves here on Thursday, it will take roughly 14-16 days to get to you. Sending you a PM.


Ok. We can still get the Flag up to Tyler.. If you can "expedite" shipping, I can help with costs.

I helped Fieroguy123 in getting the ground effects shipped. Big package, almost 70 bucks to ship.
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Hulki U. My-BFF
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Report this Post11-10-2009 12:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Hulki U. My-BFFSend a Private Message to Hulki U. My-BFFEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Synthesis:


Ok. We can still get the Flag up to Tyler.. If you can "expedite" shipping, I can help with costs.

I helped Fieroguy123 in getting the ground effects shipped. Big package, almost 70 bucks to ship.


HAHA!!! Expedite! Do you remember where I'm at, Chris? 14-16 days is as expedited as it gets. It's all in when planes come in.
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Report this Post11-10-2009 12:54 PM Click Here to See the Profile for SynthesisSend a Private Message to SynthesisEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Hulki U. My-BFF:


HAHA!!! Expedite! Do you remember where I'm at, Chris? 14-16 days is as expedited as it gets. It's all in when planes come in.


Bah! Strap it to a rocket. My co-ordinates are....
lol
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Report this Post11-10-2009 12:58 PM Click Here to See the Profile for lynxerSend a Private Message to lynxerEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I can definitly bring the car to Frazee, but when I went by Tires Plus this morning the Fiero was in the shop so I assumed it wasn't done.

So Tires Plus is going to do the Brakes?

Do I need to go get the parts from Hedauls and bring them to Tires Plus?

When should it go to Frazee and does Dave want to strip the car down?
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Report this Post11-10-2009 01:05 PM Click Here to See the Profile for R RunnerSend a Private Message to R RunnerEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Great post Chris. Thank you for writing this. I think is sums it up very well.
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Report this Post11-10-2009 01:09 PM Click Here to See the Profile for SynthesisSend a Private Message to SynthesisEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by lynxer:

I can definitly bring the car to Frazee, but when I went by Tires Plus this morning the Fiero was in the shop so I assumed it wasn't done.

So Tires Plus is going to do the Brakes?

Do I need to go get the parts from Hedauls and bring them to Tires Plus?

When should it go to Frazee and does Dave want to strip the car down?


Ok... I was going to call you, but ended up busy here...

Here is the itinerary...

The car is ready at Tires Plus. Just walk in, talk with Jim or Mark. Run it to the Body Shop..

Dave will dig into the car. I spoke with him. It will be easier in the long run to do a body off paint job. Especially because he will be able to prep the panels off the vehicle, and we can work on the car without worrying about paint. Fiero people will be on hand to help reassemble the car, which won't take too long and save Dave and Karen some labor.

Brakes should only take a few hours. Hedahl's will deliver the parts to Frazee Auto Body according to Karen as soon as they come in.

The brake lines will be in tomorrow from The Fiero Store. Unpack them. There should be fittings and all. I am not sure if they will all be in one bag or not. Drop those off at Frazee Body.

When Dave has all of the panels off of the car with the exception of the Fastback clip, it will be ready to drive to Tires Plus. They are expecting the car anytime between now and Monday or Tuesday. The sooner it gets there, the better though. Dave will be able to tell when it is ready to go.
Tires Plus will start working on it as soon as the car gets there and a bay opens up.

Once the brakes are done, it is back to the shop to have the rear clip removed and prepped/painted along with the rest of the panels. The clip has to be on so that the tail lights can mount in order to drive it.

The car will now be ready for everything else we need to do. The car appears to be fairly rust free. We can check the trunk out and possibly patch it if needed.

Any questions? Just ask.

YAY Progress! And we still want photos of the interior, engine and front bay of the car!
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Report this Post11-10-2009 01:31 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5Send a Private Message to 2.5Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Price for shirts and hats!?
Price for shirts and hats!?


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Report this Post11-10-2009 01:33 PM Click Here to See the Profile for infinitewillSend a Private Message to infinitewillEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Please add me to the shirt list. 2XL to cover this body, built for comfort not for speed............

\/\/
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Hulki U. My-BFF
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Report this Post11-10-2009 01:37 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Hulki U. My-BFFSend a Private Message to Hulki U. My-BFFEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by infinitewill:

Please add me to the shirt list. 2XL to cover this body, built for comfort not for speed............

\/\/


Gotcha Will.
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Report this Post11-10-2009 02:05 PM Click Here to See the Profile for pontiackid86Send a Private Message to pontiackid86Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Add me to the shirt list for an XL dude
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Report this Post11-10-2009 02:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for lynxerSend a Private Message to lynxerEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Sounds Great Synthesis! I will bring the car to Frazee after class (3:30) today!

I haven't been home, but my dad called me and said there is a huge box in the garage for me so I assume that is the front bumper

Its good now we have everyone on the same page


On a side note, but is it just me or all of you Fiero guys could be football players or atleast your all just big guys! Last night talkting to Synthesis he told me he was 6'4" and had to modify the seat in his car for extra leg room. Then VikingRedBaron told me when he was talking to Bazooka he said he was like 6'3" now looking at all the shirt sizes I am seeing a pattern ya'll must wear these fieros like hats! I am 6' and hoping in the cockpit of Tyler's Toy was a littler different then hoping in the jeep

As Tyler has displayed the fiero does have passenger carrying capabilities

I give you

"Three Guys One Fiero"

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Report this Post11-10-2009 02:45 PM Click Here to See the Profile for SynthesisSend a Private Message to SynthesisEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by lynxer:

Sounds Great Synthesis! I will bring the car to Frazee after class (3:30) today!

I haven't been home, but my dad called me and said there is a huge box in the garage for me so I assume that is the front bumper

Its good now we have everyone on the same page


On a side note, but is it just me or all of you Fiero guys could be football players or atleast your all just big guys! Last night talkting to Synthesis he told me he was 6'4" and had to modify the seat in his car for extra leg room. Then VikingRedBaron told me when he was talking to Bazooka he said he was like 6'3" now looking at all the shirt sizes I am seeing a pattern ya'll must wear these fieros like hats! I am 6' and hoping in the cockpit of Tyler's Toy was a littler different then hoping in the jeep

As Tyler has displayed the fiero does have passenger carrying capabilities

I give you

"Three Guys One Fiero"



OMG! I am laughing so hard right now!
I have had three in my Fiero at once as well. Me, my then girlfriend, and one other sitting on her lap leaning over the console onto me.

To add to that, I was all painted up at the time. I was wearing all black, and my skin was covered in red grease paint.
My then girlfriend, Nikki was red as well, and the other guy, who we were driving home was purple..

Don't believe me? All pictures I post below are from this thread... Grease Paint, a Bald Man costume cap, liquid latex, and a Pontiac Fiero...

Me and my Fiero.


This poor fiddler... Didn't see us coming...


On Fox News...


You missed a spot!


We parked over there!


Sadly, no pictures IN the Fiero, but suffice it to say, I still have a purple smudge on the headliner from hauling Steve home.. lol

For the record, I play with professional grade Hollywood makeup for fun...
This is me this Halloween..

And last Halloween
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Report this Post11-10-2009 03:03 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fieroguy123Send a Private Message to fieroguy123Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Big thanks to chris cook for his donation of the sail panels, I recieved them this morning. Will be shipped today.
If you wish to contact him for sail panels of your own, simply e-mail Ccook03@comcast.net
I highly highly recommend him and his work. Stand up guy with quality products. His donation should say enough about his character.

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Report this Post11-10-2009 03:17 PM Click Here to See the Profile for SynthesisSend a Private Message to SynthesisEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by fieroguy123:

Big thanks to chris cook for his donation of the sail panels, I recieved them this morning. Will be shipped today.
If you wish to contact him for sail panels of your own, simply e-mail Ccook03@comcast.net
I highly highly recommend him and his work. Stand up guy with quality products. His donation should say enough about his character.



I have three words..
Hoooooo Leeeeee Craaaaap!
Those are BEAUTIFUL!
Now, tint them up a little bit, and good to go.
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Report this Post11-10-2009 03:30 PM Click Here to See the Profile for lynxerSend a Private Message to lynxerEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
sweet! Those windows look awesome

Talked to Tyler I am bringing the car to Frazee after class and him and his dad are giving me a ride back to DL. They got a different van for a while and Tyler must be able to get in and out of it now, because you can tell he wants to go for a ride (and see his fiero all cleaned up)

I will post pictures tonight! (forgot Camera at home when I went to school)

You never know I might get some more at the body shop today. Maybe ever with Tyler

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Report this Post11-10-2009 03:32 PM Click Here to See the Profile for katatakSend a Private Message to katatakEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by fieroguy123:

Big thanks to chris cook for his donation of the sail panels, I recieved them this morning. Will be shipped today.
If you wish to contact him for sail panels of your own, simply e-mail Ccook03@comcast.net
I highly highly recommend him and his work. Stand up guy with quality products. His donation should say enough about his character.



Very nice!
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Report this Post11-10-2009 03:32 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fieroguy123Send a Private Message to fieroguy123Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Quarter windows boxed and shipped.
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Report this Post11-10-2009 03:56 PM Click Here to See the Profile for SynthesisSend a Private Message to SynthesisEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by fieroguy123:

Quarter windows boxed and shipped.


Paypal sent to cover shipping.

If anyone is shipping something, and needs help shipping it, let me know..

I ordered the SPAL door locks today. Those will arrive at my place before next Wednesday.
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Report this Post11-10-2009 04:53 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 1984whitescClick Here to visit 1984whitesc's HomePageSend a Private Message to 1984whitescEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by lynxer:

On a side note, but is it just me or all of you Fiero guys could be football players or atleast your all just big guys!



Well not all of us. I am only 5'7" and 153 pounds. I think I might be the smallest one out of the bunch. Being small has it's advantages, but boy do I get a lot of grief lol.

------------------

Thank for the sig. Bobadoofunk
1984 Fiero Sport Coupe
1990 Buick Reatta
2002 Chevy Impala base

[This message has been edited by 1984whitesc (edited 11-10-2009).]

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Report this Post11-10-2009 04:53 PM Click Here to See the Profile for SynthesisSend a Private Message to SynthesisEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Several people and vendors were missed for the back of the shirt....

I wanted to specifically mention them here..

bowrapennocks, thank you for your donation. It is very much appreciated.

Lawrence of Web Electric Products donated a third lamp pulser, and the sequential turn signals... These two donations will take the vehicle over the top. The sequential turn signals really add a nice accent to the vehicle and help to turn heads...

I am sorry I was unable to get you guys onto the shirt. With work, and projects after work, and organizing this along with Hulki, I lost track of several names. Please accept my sincerest apologies.

I realize you aren't concerned with getting your names on the shirt, but I want to specifically thank you, and anyone else I may have missed for the hard work and dedication you provide to help the Fiero community by providing products, helping to support others, or just by being a productive member.

This place would not be the way it is without all of you.
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Report this Post11-10-2009 05:07 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 96HawkCnvtClick Here to visit 96HawkCnvt's HomePageSend a Private Message to 96HawkCnvtEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
OK so I joined this forum specifically because of this thread/situation & to see if I can help in any way. I'm not a Fiero owner, but I am a "car guy" and am not surprised but impressed by the way you folks have rallied around Tyler. Looks like most all of the bases have been covered but I wanted to check in anyway. I do live in the Twin Cities & would be happy to help with picking folks up at the airport and/or running them up north or whatever.

Not sure it is needed but I also would be happy to help out with computer tuning if that is required for what is being done on the car. From what I've read (haven't had time to read every post!), it looks like the engine is remaining fairly stock but if there are tweaks needed in the computer, I would be happy to bring what is needed and help out. What else is needed?

Todd
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Report this Post11-10-2009 05:11 PM Click Here to See the Profile for SynthesisSend a Private Message to SynthesisEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by 96HawkCnvt:

OK so I joined this forum specifically because of this thread/situation & to see if I can help in any way. I'm not a Fiero owner, but I am a "car guy" and am not surprised but impressed by the way you folks have rallied around Tyler. Looks like most all of the bases have been covered but I wanted to check in anyway. I do live in the Twin Cities & would be happy to help with picking folks up at the airport and/or running them up north or whatever.

Not sure it is needed but I also would be happy to help out with computer tuning if that is required for what is being done on the car. From what I've read (haven't had time to read every post!), it looks like the engine is remaining fairly stock but if there are tweaks needed in the computer, I would be happy to bring what is needed and help out. What else is needed?

Todd


Todd,

Welcome to the greatest car forum on the planet! At least, in my opinion.

The ECM on the Fiero is an OBD1 ECM, and does not support tuning unless you have a chip burner. Just FYI.

Thank you for joining up and offering your services! Just keep reading, and stick around... We'll get you hooked on these fun little cars very soon.
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Report this Post11-10-2009 05:16 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 96HawkCnvtClick Here to visit 96HawkCnvt's HomePageSend a Private Message to 96HawkCnvtEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Synthesis:


Todd,

Welcome to the greatest car forum on the planet! At least, in my opinion.

The ECM on the Fiero is an OBD1 ECM, and does not support tuning unless you have a chip burner. Just FYI.

Thank you for joining up and offering your services! Just keep reading, and stick around... We'll get you hooked on these fun little cars very soon.


Thanks for the welcome & I can already see that this is a great place to hang out.

I've got what is needed to do the tuning if it is required so let me know if that would help.

And I'll admit that I've been looking for something to stuff an LS1 into for awhile & it could get very expensive for me if I hang around here very much

Todd

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Synthesis
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Report this Post11-10-2009 05:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for SynthesisSend a Private Message to SynthesisEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by 96HawkCnvt:


Thanks for the welcome & I can already see that this is a great place to hang out.

I've got what is needed to do the tuning if it is required so let me know if that would help.

And I'll admit that I've been looking for something to stuff an LS1 into for awhile & it could get very expensive for me if I hang around here very much

Todd


Stick around.. We could use another LS1 Fiero, especially here in MN.

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GTGeff
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Report this Post11-10-2009 05:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for GTGeffSend a Private Message to GTGeffEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by 96HawkCnvt:


Thanks for the welcome & I can already see that this is a great place to hang out.

I've got what is needed to do the tuning if it is required so let me know if that would help.

And I'll admit that I've been looking for something to stuff an LS1 into for awhile & it could get very expensive for me if I hang around here very much

Todd


The "Stinger" LT1 Chop-top here thanks to V8 Archie. He has already done LS1s,LS3s, and LS9s. Check out the "Perfect Union" build thread.
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RandomTask
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Report this Post11-10-2009 05:44 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RandomTaskSend a Private Message to RandomTaskEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Subscribed.
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Synthesis
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Report this Post11-10-2009 06:18 PM Click Here to See the Profile for SynthesisSend a Private Message to SynthesisEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I just received a phone call that made me smile from ear to ear.

Nick, AKA fierofetish called me from Salou, Spain to tell us all thank you for doing this for Tyler.
Completely unexpected, and very cool.

Nick, you and Ellie helped just as much as anyone else in this. No matter how little, or how much someone gives to this cause, all donations are equal.
Good wishes are just as valuable as $100 or expensive car parts.

On a side note: I ordered the SPAL door locks today. I did not get a chance yesterday. 39 and change normally, he dropped the price 25% and packed them up to ship today.
I ordered them from GNU industries.
SPAL makes OE grade automotive power accessories ranging from window motors, cruise controls and door locks to radiator fans and other electrical items. Their products are top quality, and can't be beat for the price.
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maryjane
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Report this Post11-10-2009 06:54 PM Click Here to See the Profile for maryjaneSend a Private Message to maryjaneEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Ellie is a sweetheart, but that Nick person? I have no idea what she sees in him. Destructive old cuss that he is---He took a jackhammer & wrecking mall to their wonderful home!!
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2.5fierose
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Report this Post11-10-2009 07:52 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 2.5fieroseSend a Private Message to 2.5fieroseEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
hey guys just keeping you updated went to the shop again today and met nick there and the car is super clean they did an amazing job and i got a chance to talk to dave and karren im so excited to see the car getting worked on this will be the longest 2 weeks of waiting ever thanks guys have a great night

Tyler Shipman
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Report this Post11-10-2009 07:58 PM Click Here to See the Profile for skuzzbomerSend a Private Message to skuzzbomerEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by 2.5fierose:

hey guys just keeping you updated went to the shop again today and met nick there and the car is super clean they did an amazing job and i got a chance to talk to dave and karren im so excited to see the car getting worked on this will be the longest 2 weeks of waiting ever thanks guys have a great night

Tyler Shipman


Excited...? Good to hear. I think we're all in the same boat on this one- I can't wait to see how this build turns out.

Anyone else think this may end up being the first "real-time" build thread in history? At the very least, it will be the best documented.
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