quote Originally posted by Jaygee79: Now there's a point that I finally agree with you on.

--how can you be sure??

quote Originally posted by pontiackid86: heres my opinion on the whole thing (by any means i am not gay i have a girlfriend and am as straight as a drag race strip) but i think they should be able to do what they want they should be able to be happy or as misrable as any other married couple adoption as long as they raise the child right who cares and as far as pda's and stuff like that that might be going a lil far in public but behind closed doors who cares it not affecting our lives.

X2

and I just dont see how people can believe that being gay is a choice, why would people choose to be discriminated against?

[This message has been edited by chucks85fastback (edited 11-12-2008).]

Its so they can claim that they are special, They can now claim that they are a minority and have special rights. So so that they can get attention and march.

haha, ok. i dont believe that for a second.



quote
Originally posted by Pyrthian:
God may have wrote it originally, but men changed it to suit their needs.

Quote from cliffw
Incorrect. The Bible of today is a factual interpretation of the original Bible. An international group of Biblical scholars oversee translations of the Bible.


so what about the very first group of people who collected all of the separate books and letters and put them into what became the bible? there were several books that were left out, so in other words they edited it to suit their own intrests.

Those are the uncanonized books or gospels. More than several--probably hundreds. I may be misspelling it, but they are called the Acrophylla. Some from the Old Testament days--some from the New Testament and after the Crucifixion of Jesus Christ.
In the first few decades after the Crucifixion, a lot of really strange prophecies, practices, and 'laws' were put out by people claiming to be the bearer of the word of God. Among those, was one a little bit related to the current discussion. The practice of semen ingesting. Supposedly, a "sacred" substance according to some sects.

If you have ever read the history of Islam, the 'Prophet' Mohamed, attempted to get his writings canonized, but was turned away by those who oversaw such things. It was not long after this, that Islam made a dramatic shift, and declared all other beliefs, to be those of infidels. Prior to that, Islam and the rest of the Mideast religious views had a lot in common, and got along very well.

[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 11-12-2008).]

quote Originally posted by maryjane: --how can you be sure??

Eh....I don't know. I'm confused...

quote Originally posted by Jaygee79: Yup. Just like black people choose to be black so they can be a minority and have special rights. Makes perfect sense.

Like I said before no one is making you sit at the back of the bus, eat in the kitchen at a restarunt, Denying you from voting, or denying you an education. So no not like Black people.
Frankly I dont care if you marrie or even have kids of your own. So I dont really see any problem.

quote Originally posted by Jaygee79: Eh....I don't know. I'm confused...

Carefull there--that's what a lot of people are inferring as being the main problem.

[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 11-12-2008).]

quote Originally posted by chucks85fastback: so what about the very first group of people who collected all of the separate books and letters and put them into what became the bible? there were several books that were left out, so in other words they edited it to suit their own intrests.

Well, if they didn't leave anything out, it would be called The complete history of the earth and beyond.

quote Originally posted by maryjane: I will relate a true event--with fake names.

Very good point, this kind of stuff this happens. No onw gains anything from this sort of denial.
Thank you for sharing.

choose to be gay.
well, it quite obviously IS a choice. at least as a definition by me.
is gay not someone who HAS sex with someone of the same sex?
if so - this means the act itself is the choice.
now, if gay means someone who WANTS to have sex with someone of the same sex - this would NOT be a choice.

and - again - I truly find it silly to sit here and argue about where someone puts their dick. I see noone else putting out descriptions of what they do with their dick. I myself am gonna be getting red wings on mine tonight. noone wants to hear it. so why do we make such a deal over this? no, I certainly dont want to think about skid marks - so dont bring it up, eh? how/why does this even matter? because men are simple beings. farts jokes. beer. and - of course - our endless lust for the boobies. wait - what? you no like boobies? and its all downhill from there. now must walk on eggshell to NOT offend this funny one over there. well, sorry - I am a stample beast. I walk no eggshells. I was born that way just like the foriegners - learn the language - muslims coming here and making lifestyle demands and junk like that. whats fair is fair. get married. adopt kids. matters not one bit to me. and, just as I dont accept MANY types of people - I do understand fairness.

oh, yes - most men dont think much of other men who dont like beer or fart jokes either. and - they too are easy to spot, tho, some more than others

hey - and I dont like football

.

[This message has been edited by JazzMan (edited 12-03-2008).]

quote Originally posted by Pyrthian: hey - and I dont like football

Now you've done it.
In before the trashcan......

quote Originally posted by JazzMan: And here's why so many good Christians are willing to torture and kill someone because they're gay. Right here in black and white, a commandment from God. Couldn't be any plainer than that. If a Christian doesn't agree to this they're not really Christians. Are they... (and some people wonder why I'm not and never will be a Christian, hehehe...) JazzMan

well, yeah, havent ya heard? God Hates Fags.

yes - if they could work up the nerve - they would KILL KILL KILL

but, their convictions are not strong enough. God will accept none of these into heaven. All these christians, jews & muslims who allow the fags to continue fornicating will walk up the gates, and see them closed. because they would not dispose of the fags, as god asked. They know what they must do - but will not do it, for their own selfish reasons.

Are you kinding, what is this some sort of bad joke.

quote Originally posted by Pyrthian: well, yeah, havent ya heard? God Hates Fags. yes - if they could work up the nerve - they would KILL KILL KILL but, their convictions are not strong enough. God will accept none of these into heaven. All these christians, jews & muslims who allow the fags to continue fornicating will walk up the gates, and see them closed. because they would not dispose of the fags, as god asked. They know what they must do - but will not do it, for their own selfish reasons.

quote Originally posted by aconesa: Are you kinding, what is this some sort of bad joke.

kinda - its what their books say, aint it?



but - yes - I understand the concern - maybe there are weak minded enough folk to run with it, eh?

Unfortunately, there are some that will take that comment to heart and run with it.
Matthew Sheppard is a direct result of that.

quote Originally posted by Pyrthian: kinda - its what their books say, aint it? but - yes - I understand the concern - maybe there are weak minded enough folk to run with it, eh?

quote Originally posted by aconesa: Unfortunately, there are some that will take that comment to heart and run with it. Matthew Sheppard is a direct result of that.

I cant and wont educate everybody. I thrive on the fact that there are fools among us.
I betcha someone in Detroit dies today for an even stupider reason.

oh, and yay for connecticut, eh?

quote Originally posted by Pyrthian: oh, and yay for connecticut, eh?

I saw the news. I am please with the results. I am hoping that soon it will come to New Jersey.

quote Originally posted by JazzMan: What it fundamentally means is that religious people don't want gays raising children, and the only reason they don't want this is because the parents are gay. Not because they aren't capable of raising children, that's proven wrong already; not because the child will be harmed in any way, that's proven wrong also. No, simply because they're gay, and no other reason. Excluding minorities is bigotry, pure and simple. Attempts to say otherwise only suffice to make it more clear. JazzMan

Well thank you all knowing ruler, I guess I can't say anymore because it will only make you more right. But I will.

What proved it wrong? That they are just as capable and no harm will come to the child? I don't hink we'd know that for quite a few years of letting this fly, and probably only a non partisan psychiatrist would know.

quote Originally posted by 2.5: Well thank you all knowing ruler, I guess I can't say anymore because it will only make you more right. But I will. What proved it wrong? That they are just as capable and no harm will come to the child? I don't hink we'd know that for quite a few years of letting this fly, and probably only a non partisan psychiatrist would know.

well, it has been shown that one of the MOST damaging type of parent is the single highly christian mother.

besides the obvious drunken physical abusers - and even from them worst case scenarios, golden children emerge against all odds.

this is why humans are so amazing. there are no absolutes. all rules have exceptions.

quote Originally posted by Pyrthian: well, it has been shown that one of the MOST damaging type of parent is the single highly christian mother. besides the obvious drunken physical abusers - and even from them worst case scenarios, golden children emerge against all odds. this is why humans are so amazing. there are no absolutes. all rules have exceptions.

I went to school with asbestos insulation. I don't use my good heals as a way to dismiss the dangers of asbestos. There may not be absolutes in child rearing but that is no reason to ignore that the ideal situation for raising a child is with both a mother and father, not two mothers or two fathers.

quote Originally posted by Pyrthian: well, it has been shown that one of the MOST damaging type of parent is the single highly christian mother. besides the obvious drunken physical abusers - and even from them worst case scenarios, golden children emerge against all odds. this is why humans are so amazing. there are no absolutes. all rules have exceptions.

Highly Christian mother? "highly" by whose definition? Do not golden children emerge from that scenario as well?
Of course they do, but you conveniently left that out. Made your disclaimer at the end, but made sure you attached one directly to the worst case scenarion regarding drunken abusers.

quote Originally posted by Doug85GT: I went to school with asbestos insulation. I don't use my good heals as a way to dismiss the dangers of asbestos. There may not be absolutes in child rearing but that is no reason to ignore that the ideal situation for raising a child is with both a mother and father, not two mothers or two fathers.

I think we all agree on "the ideal".
since we accept the WAY less ideal single mother or a single father - I dont see why something in the middle is unacceptable.

We accept it because we have no choice. Whatcha gonna do? Assign dads(or moms)?

Actually mentoring is good too.

quote Originally posted by maryjane: Highly Christian mother? "highly" by whose definition? Do not golden children emerge from that scenario as well? Of course they do, but you conveniently left that out. Made your disclaimer at the end, but made sure you attached one directly to the worst case scenarion regarding drunken abusers.

yup...aint it fun

the joys of painting with a wide brush. fine for fags tho, eh?

Please do not use the F word. I find it very offensive.

quote Originally posted by Pyrthian: yup...aint it fun the joys of painting with a wide brush. fine for fags tho, eh?

quote Originally posted by Pyrthian: ..... because men are simple beings. farts jokes. beer. and - of course - our endless lust for the boobies. wait - what? you no like boobies? and its all downhill from there. now must walk on eggshell to NOT offend this funny one over there. well, sorry - I am a stample beast. I walk no eggshells. I was born that way .....

I am for your free will - please allow mine as well.

quote Originally posted by aconesa: Please do not use the F word. I find it very offensive.

It seems that the Q word is ok for gays to use, but not ok for staights to use. I've also heard gays openly use the f word when speaking among themselves, and referring to themselves.
You know the next question--don't you? "What is the politically correct noun for straight people to use at this juncture in time?"
And, it seems you may have just verified the assertion that gays activly seek 'victims status'?

That is fine, but not when someone has to insult the others just to get their point across. Are we back in high school? I do understand why there would have to be insults thrown around. A good debate can be handled in an adult manner.

quote Originally posted by Pyrthian: I am for your free will - please allow mine as well.

quote Originally posted by Pyrthian: ..... because men are simple beings. farts jokes. beer. and - of course - our endless lust for the boobies. wait - what? you no like boobies? and its all downhill from there. now must walk on eggshell to NOT offend this funny one over there. well, sorry - I am a stample beast. I walk no eggshells. I was born that way .....

quote Originally posted by Pyrthian: I am for your free will - please allow mine as well.

Arguing with yourself now?

[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 11-12-2008).]

quote Originally posted by aconesa: That is fine, but not when someone has to insult the others just to get their point across. Are we back in high school? I do understand why there would have to be insults thrown around. A good debate can be handled in an adult manner.

I insulted noone. and - yes - much of the mentality you are up against is in fact juvinile high school mentality - tho, some may take that as an insult.
fag is just a word. just like marriage. there was nothing deragatory in its use.

aconesa:
Just so you don't mis-interpret your ratings change a few seconds ago. Gave you a + for your civility, openeness, patience, and tenacity. It can't be easy.
edit: Oops-I just realized you don't have a ratings bar yet.........

[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 11-12-2008).]

quote Originally posted by Pyrthian: I think we all agree on "the ideal". since we accept the WAY less ideal single mother or a single father - I dont see why something in the middle is unacceptable.

I believe that I give a middle position in my first response. Gay couples should be able to adopt but hetero couples should have preferrence.