quote Originally posted by Ramsespride: That nearly every Republican i have encountered has at times proved to me to be a rather unsavory person. Not saying all of them are but you take the cake from the bday party there fierobear. I pickup a great deal of vehemence from any post you make and as i recall the ONLY time i have seen you post is in Political threads. Monger it seems? Also, i have seen time and time again that the people that are at the forefront of defending the Republican agenda are of the upper monetary levels and dont want anyone to get another cent of their money. Matter of fact, Mr. Bergstrom of Bergstrom GM here in NE Wisconsin, is a Republican and is speaking out against the Democrats and showing support of the Republicans. He makes A LOT of money with the like 14 dealerships he owns.

And in your vast experience of 19 years, you've decided you understand the Republican agenda? Because from your posts here, you seem to have no clue what conservative ideals are.

Oh and by the way, I'm very right-leaning but I'm nowhere near the "upper monetary level".

Republican agenda= Destroy the Middle class and bring about a Feudal serfdom. Yes me lord, right away me lord. And enough with the age thing, age makes no difference in how a person is, Life experience does. I dont have to buy a house or fancy sports car to be on the same level or above you so stop making it out to be that way.

quote Originally posted by Ramsespride: Republican agenda= Destroy the Middle class and bring about a Feudal serfdom. Yes me lord, right away me lord. And enough with the age thing, age makes no difference in how a person is, Life experience does. I dont have to buy a house or fancy sports car to be on the same level or above you so stop making it out to be that way.

Pretty much what I thought, you don't have a clue. I'm going to guess that your circle of acquaintances is mostly liberal folks. You'd do well to seek out other opinions and viewpoints, if for no other reason than to understand them. Right now you're just spouting off talking points that you think sound witty.

And at 19, you don't have a whole lot of life experience. That's not a slam on you, that's just the way it is.

quote Originally posted by Ramsespride: Republican agenda= Destroy the Middle class and bring about a Feudal serfdom. Yes me lord, right away me lord. And enough with the age thing, age makes no difference in how a person is, Life experience does. I dont have to buy a house or fancy sports car to be on the same level or above you so stop making it out to be that way.

Its posts like this that take away from the intelligent discussion in this thread. You say stuff like this as if it is fact.

Ramsespride, can you answer me this? If both the democrats and the republicans that are working for the state get paid the same, and the republicans are the ones that are fine giving up there collective bargaining rights to help balance the budget, who is actually being less greedy?

quote Originally posted by 1988holleyformula: Its posts like this that take away from the intelligent discussion in this thread. You say stuff like this as if it is fact. Ramsespride, can you answer me this? If both the democrats and the republicans that are working for the state get paid the same, and the republicans are the ones that are fine giving up there collective bargaining rights to help balance the budget, who is actually being less greedy?

Why would anyone have to give up their collective bargaining agreements to balance the budget when they agreed to give all the monetary concessions asked for?

quote [B]Originally posted by Ramsespride:[/B Also, i have seen time and time again that the people that are at the forefront of defending the Republican agenda are of the upper monetary levels and dont want anyone to get another cent of their money. Matter of fact, Mr. Bergstrom of Bergstrom GM here in NE Wisconsin, is a Republican and is speaking out against the Democrats and showing support of the Republicans. He makes A LOT of money with the like 14 dealerships he owns.

Apparently, you don't personally know any Republican, Libertarian or Independent (Right Leaning or Centrist) Fiero owners, most of us don't qualify as wealthy. Not by a long shot.

------------------
Ron

quote Originally posted by newf: Why would anyone have to give up their collective bargaining agreements to balance the budget when they agreed to give all the monetary concessions asked for?

I would imagine that they are willing to give these rights up in order to make sure that the budget stays balanced in the future.

quote Originally posted by blackrams: Apparently, you don't personally know any Republican, Libertarian or Independent (Right Leaning or Centrist) Fiero owners, most of us don't qualify as wealthy. Not by a long shot.

Very true

Once again, the Tea Party extremists are outnumbered by real people:

quote Majority in Poll Back Employees in Public Sector Unions By MICHAEL COOPER and MEGAN THEE-BRENAN Published: February 28, 2011 As labor battles erupt in state capitals around the nation, a majority of Americans say they oppose efforts to weaken the collective bargaining rights of public employee unions and are also against cutting the pay or benefits of public workers to reduce state budget deficits, according to the latest New York Times/CBS News poll. Americans oppose weakening the bargaining rights of public employee unions by a margin of nearly two to one: 60 percent to 33 percent. While a slim majority of Republicans favored taking away some bargaining rights, they were outnumbered by large majorities of Democrats and independents who said they opposed weakening them. Those surveyed said they opposed, 56 percent to 37 percent, cutting the pay or benefits of public employees to reduce deficits, breaking down along similar party lines. http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/01/us/01poll.html

The WI union members have already agreed to everything EXCEPT giving up their right to bargain in the future.
Would you give up your right to vote just to cut your state budget?

Are you naive enough to believe that that would cut your taxes by any noticeable amount?

Do you really want to live in a place where every service is performed by the lowest bidder?

What do you want, BLOOD?

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Drive safely!

[This message has been edited by NEPTUNE (edited 03-01-2011).]

quote Originally posted by blackrams: Apparently, you don't personally know any Republican, Libertarian or Independent (Right Leaning or Centrist) Fiero owners, most of us don't qualify as wealthy. Not by a long shot.

See Page 5, I am wealthy. Very very wealthy.

Brad

[This message has been edited by twofatguys (edited 03-01-2011).]

quote Originally posted by twofatguys: Ahhh, but this was started because they would not agree to the concessions. The Unions are currently running around screaming that they will allow whatever is needing, while at the same time in the background saying that they will not. Just a second, I will dig up a link. Brad

So the Governor didn't ask for the dissolution of the collective bargaining until after the union turned down the concessions? Is he just doing it to stick it to the union now as a punishment for them not accepting the concessions right away?
I thought most negotiations had some back and forth like if he asked for everything and then the union came back and said he could have all the budgetary items but not the collective bargaining then that might be seen as middle ground.

Watching the news tonight and they mentioned as this is going on there is also a capital gains tax break?

Something very similar to what is happening in Florida:

quote Wisconsin voters express buyer’s remorse over Gov. Scott Walker Two months into his first term, a new poll shows Wisconsin voters are unhappy with GOP Gov. Scott Walker--and would send him packing if they were given a do-over of the 2010 election that sent him to the statehouse in Madison. Amid the firestorm Walker touched off in going after the state's public-sector unions, voters indicated to Public Policy Polling (PDF) that Walker would lose a rematch with his Democratic opponent, Milwaukee mayor Tom Barrett, if the election were held today. Fifty-two percent of respondents said that today they would vote for Barrett and 45 percent said they would vote for Walker. Walker's job approval/disapproval was also 46 to 52 percent in the poll. PPP is considered to be a Democratic-allied firm Those numbers are a complete reversal of November's election. Back then, Walker received 52 percent and Barrett received 46 percent of the vote. The Wisconsin state capitol has been in disarray since Walker proposed ending collective bargaining for most state workers. Critics say Walker's simply embarked on a union-busting power grab. President Obama earlier this month said Walker's proposal "seems like more of an assault on unions."

Edited to add the source:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ybl...ver-gov-scott-walker

[This message has been edited by NEPTUNE (edited 03-02-2011).]

quote Originally posted by newf: So the Governor didn't ask for the dissolution of the collective bargaining until after the union turned down the concessions? Is he just doing it to stick it to the union now as a punishment for them not accepting the concessions right away? I thought most negotiations had some back and forth like if he asked for everything and then the union came back and said he could have all the budgetary items but not the collective bargaining then that might be seen as middle ground. Watching the news tonight and they mentioned as this is going on there is also a capital gains tax break?

The very loosely quoted cliff notes version.

The Governor said, We need the workers to take a certain percentage of this, and a certain percentage of that. The Unions came back and said, No. The Governor said, it's not an option, they will either take this, or I will have to let a certain number of people go because we do not have the money. The Unions said, No, we will do no such thing. The Governor said, I'm doing it today, because I don't want to have to fire people if I don't have to. Then the Democrats ran away, and people started protesting "losing money".
Then the Unions said, We said we would do it. Like all of this was because the Governor just likes to screw with people.

Brad

quote Originally posted by twofatguys: See Page 5, I am wealthy. Very very wealthy. Brad

Brad, can I have a loan?

Doug

[This message has been edited by doug.s (edited 03-01-2011).]

quote Originally posted by doug.s: Brad, can I have a loan? Doug

Hahahahaha, I knew it was only a matter of time before the Commoners came begging!!

Grovel commoner, GROVEL!!

Brad

quote Originally posted by newf: So the Governor didn't ask for the dissolution of the collective bargaining until after the union turned down the concessions? Is he just doing it to stick it to the union now as a punishment for them not accepting the concessions right away? I thought most negotiations had some back and forth like if he asked for everything and then the union came back and said he could have all the budgetary items but not the collective bargaining then that might be seen as middle ground. Watching the news tonight and they mentioned as this is going on there is also a capital gains tax break?

Yes he is. Because the unions do not negotiate fairly. They threaten to smear anyone who tries to cut their costs and vote them out of office. This is why they always get what they want. Public sector unions have grown into a spoiled child. They are now throwing a tantrum since daddy has decided to take the car keys away.

quote Originally posted by twofatguys: Hahahahaha, I knew it was only a matter of time before the Commoners came begging!! Grovel commoner, GROVEL!! Brad

Please...please...please? I'll come down and wash all your Fieros.

Doug

So say they do give up collective bargaining. Does this mean that their wages/benefits will never again change, will they be forever frozen at the level they are at now?

just an honest question.

quote Originally posted by Ramsespride: That nearly every Republican i have encountered has at times proved to me to be a rather unsavory person.

I'd say the same for liberals and many Democrats. Great. We're even.

quote Not saying all of them are but you take the cake from the bday party there fierobear. I pickup a great deal of vehemence from any post you make and as i recall the ONLY time i have seen you post is in Political threads. Monger it seems?

I've owned at least one Fiero since 1996. There's only so much you can talk about after all this time. Besides, my biggest concerns these days are about politics. This country is in serious trouble, and people like you don't seem to get it. Democrats either don't get it, don't believe it, or don't care. These are serious times.

quote Also, i have seen time and time again that the people that are at the forefront of defending the Republican agenda are of the upper monetary levels and dont want anyone to get another cent of their money. Matter of fact, Mr. Bergstrom of Bergstrom GM here in NE Wisconsin, is a Republican and is speaking out against the Democrats and showing support of the Republicans. He makes A LOT of money with the like 14 dealerships he owns.

Your demonizing and hatred of the rich equals two things: socialism and jealousy, neither of which are good traits. But if that's what gets you through life, or distracts you from the reality of your situation, then all I can say to you is "good luck with that."

As for your assessment of me, that's a joke. You're 19 years old. I'm more than twice your age, have worked for small, medium and large companies. I've been an employee, independent contractor, temporary worker, and full time. I've had benefits and not. I was in a union for 6 years. I've been rich and poor.I know what works and what doesn't. I know what the hell I'm talking about. You can take that or leave it, I don't give a s***.

quote Originally posted by twofatguys: http://www.jsonline.com/new...aukee/104085584.html Now, as my math figures, this was long before Walker was elected. Now, what else do we have to prove to you so you will stop calling us names? Brad

I see no statement here that Walker announced he was going to bust unions, trick Dems, and lie to his own staffers. Can you point that out to me?

Also, do you support Walker busting unions, and lying to staffers? I won't ask about tricking Dems... I think I already know the answer to that.

quote Originally posted by ktthecarguy: Well put, sir. I am getting sick and tired of his ageism as well. When you lose an argument, ad hominem attack attack attack.

My point simply is that at 19, a person doesn't have a whole lot of life experience to draw on. It's not an attack on him, it's just the way it is. We all knew everything at 19, at least we thought we did, but your perspective changes a lot as the years go by.

And most of the ad hominem attacks in this thread are coming from Ramses, in case you hadn't noticed

quote Originally posted by GT86: My point simply is that at 19, a person doesn't have a whole lot of life experience to draw on. It's not an attack on him, it's just the way it is. We all knew everything at 19, at least we thought we did, but your perspective changes a lot as the years go by. And most of the ad hominem attacks in this thread are coming from Ramses, in case you hadn't noticed

I had noticed, and I don't care for it either. Would you like me to defend you?

Yes I agree perspective changes with the ongoing years. But I think it is a mistake to overlook someone's life experiences, just because they are young. Take it with a grain of salt if you will, but don't discount it too much. That's all I am saying.

quote Originally posted by ktthecarguy: I had noticed, and I don't care for it either. Would you like me to defend you? Yes I agree perspective changes with the ongoing years. But I think it is a mistake to overlook someone's life experiences, just because they are young. Take it with a grain of salt if you will, but don't discount it too much. That's all I am saying.

No thanks, I'm not all that bothered by internet name-calling

I'm not dismissing anyone's point of view, but you'd probably agree that at 19 most people have a very narrow perspective simply because they haven't experienced an awful lot. Someone who has such hard and fast opinions at such a young age is likely doing themselves a disservice, because those opinions normally aren't formed from experience, but generally are come 2nd hand from other people.

quote Originally posted by ktthecarguy: I see no statement here that Walker announced he was going to bust unions, trick Dems, and lie to his own staffers. Can you point that out to me? Also, do you support Walker busting unions, and lying to staffers? I won't ask about tricking Dems... I think I already know the answer to that.

KT, I have went and found, for you, everything you asked me to "prove". Changing the wording of what happened does not change that he did exactly what he campaigned to do, and nothing more.

He wants to put an end to collective bargaining in state jobs, that seems pretty clear cut to me, how do you think that is done?

I'm not sure how he tricked Democrats, first off, Democrats did not vote him onto office, Republicans did, and he is doing just what he told them he would.

Lying to staffers? Really I doubt that that is happening, I mean seriously.

I think at this point I could show you a hand written letter from Mr. Walker saying that he was going to do exactly what he is doing now, and you would come up with another reason to argue. You hate the guy, we get that. Your not going to get over it. At this point your not making any points, or even sense sometimes.

I gotta go count my money again, I think one of my "people" here may be stealing from me. I can't believe I give them all this stuff, bread, and water out of the goodness of my heart, and they steal!!


Dang lower middle class. Can't trust any of em.

Brad

[This message has been edited by twofatguys (edited 03-02-2011).]

quote Originally posted by twofatguys: KT, I have went and found, for you, everything you asked me to "prove". Changing the wording of what happened does not change that he did exactly what he campaigned to do, and nothing more. He wants to put an end to collective bargaining in state jobs, that seems pretty clear cut to me, how do you think that is done? I'm not sure how he tricked Democrats, first off, Democrats did not vote him onto office, Republicans did, and he is doing just what he told them he would. Lying to staffers? Really I doubt that that is happening, I mean seriously. I think at this point I could show you a hand written letter from Mr. Walker saying that he was going to do exactly what he is doing now, and you would come up with another reason to argue. You hate the guy, we get that. Your not going to get over it. At this point your not making any points, or even sense sometimes. I gotta go count my money again, I think one of my "people" here may be stealing from me. I can't believe I give them all this stuff, bread, and water out of the goodness of my heart, and they steal!! Dang lower middle class. Can't trust any of em. Brad

As I said, when did he say he was going to destroy unions' collective bargaining power (and I mean before the election)?

As for tricking Dems, did you even listen to the prank phone call with "Koch"? OMG was that eye-opening.

As for his lying to his own staff, that is what THEY are saying. That he acts like a petulent child if he does not get his way, lies to staff members, and if caught, tells them "I'm the boss, get used to it." These are his staffers' allegations. Are they true? I don't know. But why would they claim that, knowing they could get fired for making such allegations?

quote Originally posted by ktthecarguy: As I said, when did he say he was going to destroy unions' collective bargaining power (and I mean before the election)? As for tricking Dems, did you even listen to the prank phone call with "Koch"? OMG was that eye-opening. As for his lying to his own staff, that is what THEY are saying. That he acts like a petulent child if he does not get his way, lies to staff members, and if caught, tells them "I'm the boss, get used to it." These are his staffers' allegations. Are they true? I don't know. But why would they claim that, knowing they could get fired for making such allegations?

Who's tricking who? Some leftwinger tricked Walker by impersonating a major donor. Guess what? Walker humored who he thought was a major donor. Do you really think a Democrat would do any different?

quote Originally posted by Scottzilla79: Who's tricking who? Some leftwinger tricked Walker by impersonating a major donor. Guess what? Walker humored who he thought was a major donor. Do you really think a Democrat would do any different?

OMG are you serious? Walker SPILLED THE BEANS bigtime!!! Did you even listen to the conversation? Ian ("Koch") simply asked him some questions, opening the door, and Walker walked right through! Astonishing!

Go back and listen to the phone call. It will leave you thunderstruck - unless you are a total partisan.

quote Originally posted by Ramsespride: Republican agenda= Destroy the Middle class and bring about a Feudal serfdom. Yes me lord, right away me lord. And enough with the age thing, age makes no difference in how a person is, Life experience does. I dont have to buy a house or fancy sports car to be on the same level or above you so stop making it out to be that way.

That's actually not true. Their agenda, such that it is, is not target the middle class, or any class. They do, however, want to do what it takes to increase profits to businesses and, since their party is fairly well funded by those at the top of the economic ladder, increase wealth to their "shareholders". There's nothing inherently wrong with that in principle. However, the indirect result is, and has been, to push more and more people down the economic ladder, particularly those from the middle class. They're not intending that to happen, but it's happening as a result of their actions and policies. What I find disappointing about the Republican party is that they really don't seem to care in a way that matters. They'll talk about it, but when it comes down to brass tacks they just look the other way.

I actually agree with some of what they (on paper, anyway) call their principles, such as fiscal responsibility. They don't actually follow that principle, look at starting two trillion dollar wars and doing trillion dollar tax cuts at the same time for example. Then they did all the war funding off-budget by calling it emergency expenditures, year after year after year. I could see the first year being an emergency, but after that we had a pretty good idea how much it was going to cost. That huge off-budget expense has come back to haunt us because that was real money spent, not some wall-street derivative shell game.

Fact is, the lower and middle class comprises the bulk of the 70% of economic activity that is consumer spending. Bill Gates doesn't buy any more products such as toasters than the little guy, and there's a lot more little guys than there are Bill Gates's. Neither party is recognizing that fact very well, but the Republican party seems to be going out of their way to ignore it entirely. Hence Wall Street and financial types are doing a booming business while the other 95% are having to make decisions like choosing between rent or food because gas to get to work is more important than both.

As to the civility, I didn't catch where you'd called Republicans pricks, and wish you hadn't. That was uncivil. Just because they act like they do doesn't mean you should stoop to their level. It's important, because one of their main debating tactics is to get you to their level and therefor ceding the moral high ground. I didn't realize that was what they were doing until recently, and now am striving to climb back up out of their sewer. I'd recommend the same to you. Don't go to them in their sewage, make them climb up to you by being civil and showing decorum. If we all work hard at being civil and polite the real stinkers will start standing out, and there really aren't that many of them.

quote Originally posted by GT86: My point simply is that at 19, a person doesn't have a whole lot of life experience to draw on. It's not an attack on him, it's just the way it is. We all knew everything at 19, at least we thought we did, but your perspective changes a lot as the years go by.

Someone needs to hurry up and hire ramesespride, while he still knows everything.

quote And most of the ad hominem attacks in this thread are coming from Ramses, in case you hadn't noticed

Of course kt doesn't see it. But who cares, he's the guy who thinks they should just keep rich people from moving if they try to tax them.

quote Originally posted by JazzMan: That's actually not true. Their agenda, such that it is, is not target the middle class, or any class. They do, however, want to do what it takes to increase profits to businesses and, since their party is fairly well funded by those at the top of the economic ladder, increase wealth to their "shareholders". There's nothing inherently wrong with that in principle. However, the indirect result is, and has been, to push more and more people down the economic ladder, particularly those from the middle class. They're not intending that to happen, but it's happening as a result of their actions and policies. What I find disappointing about the Republican party is that they really don't seem to care in a way that matters. They'll talk about it, but when it comes down to brass tacks they just look the other way. I actually agree with some of what they (on paper, anyway) call their principles, such as fiscal responsibility. They don't actually follow that principle, look at starting two trillion dollar wars and doing trillion dollar tax cuts at the same time for example. Then they did all the war funding off-budget by calling it emergency expenditures, year after year after year. I could see the first year being an emergency, but after that we had a pretty good idea how much it was going to cost. That huge off-budget expense has come back to haunt us because that was real money spent, not some wall-street derivative shell game. Fact is, the lower and middle class comprises the bulk of the 70% of economic activity that is consumer spending. Bill Gates doesn't buy any more products such as toasters than the little guy, and there's a lot more little guys than there are Bill Gates's. Neither party is recognizing that fact very well, but the Republican party seems to be going out of their way to ignore it entirely. Hence Wall Street and financial types are doing a booming business while the other 95% are having to make decisions like choosing between rent or food because gas to get to work is more important than both. As to the civility, I didn't catch where you'd called Republicans pricks, and wish you hadn't. That was uncivil. Just because they act like they do doesn't mean you should stoop to their level. It's important, because one of their main debating tactics is to get you to their level and therefor ceding the moral high ground. I didn't realize that was what they were doing until recently, and now am striving to climb back up out of their sewer. I'd recommend the same to you. Don't go to them in their sewage, make them climb up to you by being civil and showing decorum. If we all work hard at being civil and polite the real stinkers will start standing out, and there really aren't that many of them.

Thanks for being civil in your explanation and post. I am taking into consideration what you have said. Yes, calling Republicans Pricks and Nazis was wrong to an extent but i will not apologize for the way i feel about them.

I was bullied in grade school- alot- over some things that are slightly weird i suppose in my family and when it got out, the regular playground tough guys targeted me, taking away things i had and trying to sway others to do the same. I see nearly the same thing going on in my states Capitol and it infuriates me to no end that it is going on unchecked.

Thursday of last week, they opened a vote in the assembly that lasted a total of 48 seconds in which the republicans members hit the "aye" vote and then the voting was closed- leaving 28 of the members having not given the chance to vote. Against the law? Not technically BUT they did violate their set codes of conduct and as such have shown the world that they are childish in the way that they are playing their game.

Do i see Democrats doing things like this? No, i do not. I see nothing more than Wealthy Republicans playing unfair and treating Democracy like it is nothing more than a word.

If i wanted to live in a country that was modeled after what the south wanted during the Civil War, then i would be striving to do so myself. However, i do not, and as such, will stand up for what i beleive in and be vocal against those that are supporting the Republican party with the only reason being so because that is the party they have identified themselves with. .

EX. If your skin color is white and an African American starts a fight with another white guy, whom is a White Supremacist, over the civil war and the freeing of slaves, are you going to stand up to the African American guy because you are also white? I would hope not, seeing as it has been deemed wrong to be a white supremacist in this country. Would you be required to take the AA mans side? Of course not, you can be okay with letting both sides fight it out, as they have been doing since Lincoln signed the Emancipation Proclamation.

Here is one Wisconsin Democrat that is making headlines for all the wrong reasons. Maybe he is one of the guys Ramesespride looks up to.
http://www.wisgop.org/hintz...-for-dirty-business/

quote Hintz Open for Dirty Business March 1, 2011 Madison, WI…A week after reports surfaced that State Representative Gordon Hintz (D-Oshkosh) was apparently busted in a prostitution sting, Hintz was back at it, this time making death threats on the floor of the state Assembly. “Death threats and intimidation are offensive, inappropriate, and a disgusting example of the lengths some people, link Hintz, will sink to in order to get their way,” said Mark Jefferson, Executive Director of the Republican Party of Wisconsin. “Hintz’s reckless behavior deserves the strongest repudiation from his Democrat leaders. How much is this guy going to be allowed to get away with?” After last week’s Assembly vote on the budget repair bill, which seeks to clean up the fiscal disaster Democrats left the state while in the majority, Hintz reportedly turned to Republican Rep. Michelle Litjens (R-Winneconne) and others, apparently telling his legislative colleague, “you’re F'n dead.” His outburst comes just weeks after Hintz was issued a citation for other dirty business, this time while apparently visiting a “massage parlor” that was the subject of a prostitution sting. Hintz is hoping his righteous bloviating on the budget repair bill will help voters forget about his astonishing personal misconduct while he refuses to answer questions about his dirty words or deeds. “Not only are his bad budgeting practices hurting Wisconsin families, his bad ethics are a stain on the state Assembly,” Jefferson said. Hintz also has friends in low places. The Oshkosh Northwestern reported Hintz’s fellow Assembly Democrat Rep. Chris Danou (D- Trempealeau) has been accused of throwing an object that hit a Republican on the other side of the aisle on the night of budget repair bill passage. Reports from the floor indicate the object was a full soda can. “Democrats continue to engage in intimidation, violence, and dirty business while they’re supposed to be doing the people’s work,” Jefferson said. “At some point they need to learn that the rules actually apply to them, too.”

Wisconsin Rep. Gordon Hintz, cited for sexual misconduct, wasn't aware of it
http://www.greenbaypressgaz...or-sexual-misconduct

quote OSHKOSH — State Rep. Gordon Hintz said Tuesday that he was unaware that Appleton police had cited him for sexual misconduct in connection with a prostitution sting until the information was posted on Facebook over the weekend. Appleton police said the citation, which was issued Feb. 10, stemmed from the department's ongoing investigation of Heavenly Touch Massage Parlor, 342 W. Wisconsin Ave. Police searched the business and a nearby residence Jan. 28 after investigators had staked out the properties for several days after receiving a tip. The ordinance under which the 37-year-old Oshkosh Democrat was charged prohibits paying or receiving "a fee, directly or indirectly, or to offer or ask for anything of value, for touching or offering to touch the sexual parts of another." Hintz released a statement Tuesday saying he learned about the citation 10 days after it was issued and saw it for the first time on Monday: "I just learned about the citation on Sunday night from someone on Facebook. Until I went to get a copy of the citation yesterday I had not seen it." Appleton police declined to release additional information about the incident, but confirmed the citation was related to the ongoing investigation. Six people involved in the operation of the business were arrested. Hintz was not among those six people and he was not booked into the Outagamie County Jail, according to jail officials. It was not immediately clear how Hintz was involved. Hintz has not returned phone calls to his office, home or mobile phone. "I am willing to take responsibility for my actions," Hintz said in a statement released Monday by his office. "My concern right now is that my personal situation is distracting from the much more important issue facing our state. We have tens of thousands of working people at the Capitol every day and that must remain our focus. I will continue to do my job and stand up for Wisconsin's working families." According to online court records, the citation carries a $2,667.50 fine if Hintz is found guilty. He is scheduled to appear April 27 before an Outagamie County court commissioner.

quote Originally posted by avengador1: Here is one Wisconsin Democrat that is making headlines for all the wrong reasons. Maybe he is one of the guys Ramesespride looks up to. http://www.wisgop.org/hintz...-for-dirty-business/

You butthole, why would i look up to a guy getting a massage at an oriental massage place? I dont let anyone but me gal pal near my back and i cant understand why anyone would pay someone to poke and prod your back causing pain. baffles me.

[This message has been edited by Ramsespride (edited 03-02-2011).]

Apperently you were not paying too much attention to the healthcare issues on a national level.

quote Originally posted by Ramsespride: Thursday of last week, they opened a vote in the assembly that lasted a total of 48 seconds in which the republicans members hit the "aye" vote and then the voting was closed- leaving 28 of the members having not given the chance to vote. Against the law? Not technically BUT they did violate their set codes of conduct and as such have shown the world that they are childish in the way that they are playing their game. Do i see Democrats doing things like this? No, i do not. .

quote Originally posted by ramesespride You butthole, why would i look up to a guy getting a massage at an oriental massage place? I dont let anyone but me gal pal near my back and i cant understand why anyone would pay someone to poke and prod your back causing pain. baffles me.

So... he isn't one of your Liberal heroes? Nice name calling by the way, but it only shows your life inexperience and your need to insult those you don't agree with and hate. I can play he insult game too. You are only an ass wipe on the lowest rung of the ladder of life. You cry foul, like a whinny immature little brat, because you know your views are so extreme and inexperienced that they border on ridiculous.

Now to get back on topic.
Wisconsin Governor Releases 'Reform' Budget as Stalemate Continues
http://www.foxnews.com/poli...e-intentions-budget/

quote MADISON, Wis. -- Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker unveiled Tuesday the rest of his two-year spending plan that has already gripped the nation's attention with its explosive proposal to take nearly all collective bargaining rights away from most public workers. With the union rights proposal stuck in a legislative stalemate thanks to the state Senate's runaway Democrats, the Republican governor forged ahead with the release of his spending plan that includes major cuts to schools and local governments to help close a projected $3.6 billion budget shortfall. "This is a reform budget," Walker said in the state Assembly chamber as protesters banged on drums and screamed on the floor below where he was speaking. "It is about getting Wisconsin working again -- and to make that happen, we need a balanced budget that works -- and an environment where the private sector can create 250,000 jobs over the next four years." Assembly Democrats did not stand to greet or applaud Walker as he entered the chamber and Senate Democrats remain out of state in protest over his bill. Earlier, Senate Majority Leader Scott Fitzgerald said he met secretly Monday with some of the 14 Senate Democrats who fled to Illinois to avoid voting on the bill. Fitzgerald said no agreement was reached about returning during the two-hour meeting, but added that he expects talks to continue. Wisconsin Business Owner Targeted By Protesters Boycott businesses that support Walker? On Tuesday, a Dane County judge ordered Wisconsin officials to open the Capitol to all members of the public during normal business hours. Police on Monday blocked public entry to the Wisconsin Capitol following two weeks of massive protests against Walker's proposal. Only a handful of people testifying at public hearings or visiting legislators were allowed to come in during normal business hours -- where hundreds had camped out for multiple nights -- though police did not forcibly remove several dozen protesters who hadn't left the rotunda a day before. Meanwhile, Democracy for America, the political action committee founded by Howard Dean and led by his brother, is attempting to raise $150,000 in support of the 14 Senate Democrats by asking donors for contributions of $14. The group said it has raised $5,269 so far. "Similar attacks on unions are being planned in Ohio, New Jersey, and at least 10 more states," the group says in a fundraising e-mail. "How we win -- if we win - may determine whether those attacks go forward.We have a chance to stop them all right here, right now. D.O.A." Walker says if the Democrats don't return soon, thousands of teachers and state employees could be laid off in order for his budget to balance. Schools last week started putting teachers on notice that their contracts may not be renewed for next year given the budget uncertainty. Walker is proposing cutting education aid by about $900 million, or 9 percent statewide. Labor leaders and Democratic lawmakers say Walker's proposal is intended to undermine unions and weaken a key Democratic voter base. The state's largest public employee union filed a complaint Monday alleging Walker has engaged in unfair labor practices by refusing to negotiate. Walker insists Wisconsin is broke and has nothing to offer. He spent another day touring the state Monday, renewing his threat of deeper cuts and layoffs if his proposal isn't passed by Tuesday. Walker has warned he will start issuing layoff notices to state workers as soon as this week if the bill isn't passed, but he hasn't said who would be targeted. School leaders are bracing for more bad news. Walker announced a new revenue limit that would require a $500 per-pupil reduction in property tax authority. The limits, in place since 1993, have gradually grown to reflect increasing education costs. That part of Walker's proposal alone would reduce the money available to the state's 424 districts by 7 percent, or nearly $600 million, based on a study done by University of Wisconsin-Madison economics professor Andrew Reschovsky. Wisconsin's average teacher salary of about $48,000 ranks in the top half of states nationally, though it remains significantly behind the $60,000 average salaries in the top-paying states of California and Connecticut, according to U.S. Census Bureau figures. Wisconsin students also rank in the top half nationally on standardized tests, scoring a full percentage point better than average on the ACT college entrance exam. Walker's stalled collective bargaining proposal would require state workers to contribute 5.8 percent of their salaries toward pensions and double their health insurance contribution beginning April 1. Those changes would be expanded to nearly all other public workers, except those operating under existing union contracts, beginning July 1. The higher benefit contribution would equate to an 8 percent pay decrease for the average worker. The state would save $30 million this fiscal year and $300 million over the next two years. Walker said not realizing those savings would mean laying off 1,500 workers between now and July and 12,000 state and local employees over the next two years. The statewide teachers union and state workers unions, in an attempt to compromise with Walker, have said they will agree to the benefit concessions as long as they retain collective bargaining rights. The bill takes away collective bargaining except as it pertains to wage increases that don't go above the rate of inflation. State Sen. Jon Erpenbach, one of the 14 Democrats who fled to Illinois, scoffed at Walker's layoff threat, saying such a move ignores that public employees have agreed to abide by the financial concessions demanded by the governor. Erpenbach and other Democrats who fled say Walker's unwillingness to deal motivates them to stay away. The bill passed the Assembly on Friday following a three-day filibuster. Americans oppose efforts to weaken the collective bargaining rights of public employee unions by a margin of almost two to one -- 60 percent to 33 percent -- according to the latest New York Times/CBS poll.

[This message has been edited by avengador1 (edited 03-02-2011).]