My project for the weekend... can't believe I missed this one!
Thanks $RICH$
------------------ * 1984 Black Fiero SE (1995-1998) blown tranny - rest her soul * 1988 Black Fiero Formula (2001-2004) Was to be a 3800SC, badly rusted rear frame. * 1988 White Fiero GT (2009 - Present) This one's a keeper!
So all you gotta do is pull the negative lead and tighten an extra ground wire under it and run the wire to the frame somewhere and you're good to go???
So all you gotta do is pull the negative lead and tighten an extra ground wire under it and run the wire to the frame somewhere and you're good to go???
Apparently so from the pics and threads I read. So I'm going to pick up two or three braided grounding straps and start attaching to different places on the block. You could just run one cable to a distro-block or something to mount to different places?
------------------ * 1984 Black Fiero SE (1995-1998) blown tranny - rest her soul * 1988 Black Fiero Formula (2001-2004) Was to be a 3800SC, badly rusted rear frame. * 1988 White Fiero GT (2009 - Present) This one's a keeper!
I have yet to do this, I ran into autozone the other day and I see the sell double end eye cables for 5bucks they say they're for starters but they look like they'd be thick enough gauge *about half inch around I'd say* to be used as another negative battery cable
a good cheap way of doing this is to get some of those cheap jumper cables and some battery terminal copper crimp eyelets. i did that when i was doing my battery relocation. now i have a red (+) and a black (-) wire going from the front to the back. i used 6ga cables too. you can get them down to 2 or 0 ga if i remember right.
a good cheap way of doing this is to get some of those cheap jumper cables and some battery terminal copper crimp eyelets. i did that when i was doing my battery relocation. now i have a red (+) and a black (-) wire going from the front to the back. i used 6ga cables too. you can get them down to 2 or 0 ga if i remember right.
I can't remember where or who, but I've read using jumper cables is not a good idea for some reason. It might have been because that is not what they are designed for but I think it was more than that. I thought of it too and obviously it would work but some said not to....
[This message has been edited by countach711 (edited 04-19-2010).]
can i do this mod with one of those braided ground wires? Like the one on the decklid? Or do i need a larger gauge wire? Just curious cause i happen too have an extra one of those braided ground wires laying around..
Hello All I have completed this additional ground but have a question. I ran the cable from the block to the negative battery post instead of the chassis. Is this acceptable or should it go to the chassis? Also what are the main grounds on a 2.8 as the one from the block to the decklid is gone. I want to make sure all are in place as I am chasing a slight idle surge issue.
Originally posted by loveliesbleeding: Also what are the main grounds on a 2.8 as the one from the block to the decklid is gone. Thanks so much for any help
quote
Originally posted by jetman
The 4 main ground ties and positive leads.
#1. (-)Braided block to body ground deck lid hinge. The main braided strap is critical. #2. (-)Trans to body. The trans to body is a backup. #3. (-)Battery to body. Battery (-)post to tray. #4. (-)Battery to engine block. The big batt cable (-)post to bolt on engine hoist hook.
Positive leads (+)
#5. (+)Battery to starter #6. (+)Battery to main terminal below C500. #7. (+)Alternator feed to main terminal below C500.
NOTE. The Ogre has mentioned that if #7 is bad, you will get large voltage drops under load just like a bad ground. We all know what bad grounds do to a Fiero's electrical systems!
All my life I have been a real stickler about good grounds and connections. It was theogre who taught me about those grounds and also the positive feeds on the Fiero so credit where the credit is due, all I did was to put it on a list for everyone to see.
This is a great thread. I'm going to check all of my grounds this weekend, and replace what is needed.
I've already changed the main, braided ground strap from the engine to chassis and it helped a bit. But I think there may still be some bad grounds (very slow electric windows and the headlights are not so bright).
This is for the new guys without manuals (and to help me focus on the grounds). It helps to find the stock grounds and confirm that they are in functional and making good contact.
I hope this helps people.
------------------ Jim Martin White '86 GT California
Read an interesting article the other day related to this. (sorry if this was talked about in this post but have not read through all the pages.)
A guy kept replacing his CV joints and hub bearings because they would fail after a year or less. Turned out it was due to a bad engine ground. What was happening is in the case of his model of car it had a heavy engine ground as well as body ground. (unlike the Fiero small body grounds.) Whenever he started the car since the engine ground was faulty the current would flow through the body ground, through the hub bearings and the cv joints and transmission to start the engine. This caused small pit to be burned into the bearing and cv joint contact points causing them to fail often. Replacing the engine ground solved the problem.
The reason I bring this up is related to this post. The standard Fiero body grounds would never be heavy enough to start the engine as they would not carry enough current. If you add new heavy body grounds without making sure the engine ground is good you could develop this same issue with your car. If you engine is starting well it probably would not happen but in the future if your engine ground failed it could happen. Of if you have poor starting issues now and think adding the body grounds will help you could have the same issue. Since the main object of this fix it to add a better ground from the engine to the body it would also likely not occur.
Just food for thought...
[This message has been edited by Dodgerunner (edited 03-06-2011).]
A guy kept replacing his CV joints and hub bearings because they would fail after a year or less. Turned out it was due to a bad engine ground. What was happening is in the case of his model of car it had a heavy engine ground as well as body ground. (unlike the Fiero small body grounds.) Whenever he started the car since the engine ground was faulty the current would flow through the body ground, through the hub bearings and the cv joints and transmission to start the engine. This caused small pit to be burned into the bearing and cv joint contact points causing them to fail often. Replacing the engine ground solved the problem.
Wow. How did he EVER diagnose that?
BTW, nice markup of the manual, Jim_Martin29. Good research that made the job easier for all. '+' for you.
This thread has serious staying power.
[This message has been edited by fyrebird68 (edited 01-28-2011).]
..It starts with cleaning all the original cables wire brush the battery post/connectors,,even a hard toothbrush will help connection,,remember everything starts at the battery the duke especially needs the ground wire battery to engine CLEAN,bright always clean the small wire battery to inner fender,brush screw/bolt AND the metal it threads into,use bigger screw if needed add at least ONE engine block to frame ground ,if you do nothing else. thick braided wire is prefered but even a heavy wire will do the job..if low on rubles Your other cars benefit from great clean, bright ground connection . Good grounds save on purchase of electronic parts,helps lengthen there life ,zap, pop arching ,zap
[This message has been edited by uhlanstan (edited 01-28-2011).]
The reason I bring this up is related to this post. The standard Fiero body grounds would never be heavy enough to start the engine as they would not carry enough current. If you add new heavy body grounds without making sure the engine ground is good you could develop this same issue with your car. If you engine is starting well it probably would not happen but in the future is your engine ground failed it could happen. Of if you have poor starting issues now and think adding the body grounds will help you could have the same issue. Since the main object of this fix it to add a better ground from the engine to the body it would also likely not occur.
Just food for thought...
My college roommate has a 67 mustang that did the same thing, only through the c4 transmission. After 2 rebuilds on warranty, the transmission shop pointed out to him that he forgot to add a engine block ground when he swapped the v8 in.
As per Dodge Runners info ---- Grounding thru the CV joints was a somewhat common problem with the chrysler k-cars when the mechanic loosened the (slotted) motor mount to realign the front cradle as the ground strap was on the cradle bolt. As a parts store we repalced a large number of axles for mechanics before this was figured out. Can't have enough good grounds!
My apologies as I did not read all nine pages of this thread...
Would adding another ground to an 84 4cyl engine help at all? If so, where could it be placed?
Thanks!
It sure would not hurt. Any bolt on the block run to a hinge bolt would probably work fine. The 4's don't set as close to the fire wall as the 6's so would probably need a little longer strap.
It sure would not hurt. Any bolt on the block run to a hinge bolt would probably work fine. The 4's don't set as close to the fire wall as the 6's so would probably need a little longer strap.
Thanks for the response. + for you. Definitely a useful upgrade.
Read ALL 9 pages amd I have to say, this is the VERY NEXT thing Im doing to my 85 3800 SC I, since I am currently trying to sort out electric issues. I know what kind of problems a bad ground can cause so reading this has definitally "shined new light" on my problems. PLUS 1 MILLION
I put a ground from the battery to the block and pleunum, but noticed no changes. What did I do wrong? I thought I saw someone say that would work on here.
I told you I'd read your thread Rich, but I didn't realize it was going to be 7-years long and popular as this. Easy to understand why though. Funny how something so simple can be overlooked so much, and cure so many ill's. Makes me want to go out and check all of my grounds now; although I don't have any issues, other than my windows have always been slow. My car spent most of it's life in storage or a garage before I got it...so, knock of wood, no grounding issues yet. But I'm definitely going to check them all out. Maybe get my windows to go up faster..?
One other thing I wanted to mention: Along with ground cables getting old and tired...My Fiero expert mechanic told me to replace all my fuses, as they tend to get old and less conductive also. I did so, and it did make a difference in my dash lights, radio, and probably some other things too. You are a smart guy...must be those dread-locks ;-) Good thread...see you on face book...I'm looking forward to seeing some pictures of your Formula that you like so much!
Michael
[This message has been edited by hypo327 (edited 07-02-2011).]
I favorited this post a few weeks ago and ordered my new cables and they finally arrived today! Just got done reading all nine pages but im still a bit confused as to where i should hookup wires! Can someone just make a quick simple list to where i should hookup cables to? I no the answer is probably in the thread so please dont hate me! :0
I took 10 gauge wire & ran from the frame to engine, frame to body, body to engine,battery to engine, battery to frame. ya can't have too many grounds & it's incredibly cheap. works for both 4 and 6 cylinder, all engine swaps.
For what it's worth, if you are serious about connectivity, use some anti-corrosive grease on the connections - you can get it in the electrical department of the home improvement store. aircraft commonly will also use Belleville washers to maintain tension - you can stack them to get the tension you require. www.mcmaster.com
I've been meaning for some time to replace my positive cable end, as the one I have now has all sorts of issues and consistently loosens up. This is because there was an adapter on there put on a few owners back and I never really got around to sorting it out.
I did clean the main engine ground and all the other major grounds about a year ago. I took them all apart, scuffed where they install clean, and then reattached everything. Never really ran all that better for me.
So today since I had some time off I decided to finally work out the issues with the positive cable on my car, and while I was down there working with things install this ground from my EGR bracket to the small ground bolt on the battery tray. Oh man. This made a world of difference. Before, my passenger-side window was going a wee bit slow and my driver's side headlight motor was beginning to have minor issues. Not anymore. Now both the windows roll up and down at the same speed and faster than before, and my headlights now almost both rise in unison (driver's still a tad slower, but not much).
This is all on a car that has right below 280,000 miles.
I really should have done this before. The OP gets a plus.
------------------ 1986 Fiero GT... with REALLY high mileage
This is a great thread. I'm going to check all of my grounds this weekend, and replace what is needed.
I've already changed the main, braided ground strap from the engine to chassis and it helped a bit. But I think there may still be some bad grounds (very slow electric windows and the headlights are not so bright).
This is for the new guys without manuals (and to help me focus on the grounds). It helps to find the stock grounds and confirm that they are in functional and making good contact.
Thanks for the diagrams... + for you! I saw one picture showed a 4 cylinder, got my hopes up. I hope the diagrams are true for my duke, I have an 84. I recently went through a wiring nightmare. I have eveything in the engine bay upgraded, though I think I might add yet another engine to body ground to be safe... A club memeber made a NICE big one. I even beefed the battery cables to a 2 gauge. Not easy to find. Napa made the ground one! So now I need your diagrams to go over all my interior grounds and front end grounds! I got to get those windows going. They won't go up unless the car is idled up... LOL! ------------------ Rescued & resuscitated 1984 Indy Fiero SE Pace Car Replica #770 presently reversibly modified! SE: Stormtrooper Edition
Everything is the Previous owners fault
[This message has been edited by redraif (edited 11-30-2011).]
I too added an extra earth strip last year. See the pic below. From the Fiero Plenium to the right hand rear strut. And then from the Strut to the Battery. Thus creating a new Chassis earth at the same time. Before i had over 100ohm's resistance from the Chassis to the engine. Now its 0 Ohms. I also noticed Smoother Idling, and about 2MPG better gas millage.
I tried doing what Paul said last night and came up unsucessful! My problem is 1, I dont know how to connect the strap from the chassis to the battery and 2, I cant get that damn plenum bolt off for the life of me! Any suggestions?
Originally posted by nyranger6830: Just got done reading all nine pages but im still a bit confused as to where i should hookup wires! Can someone just make a quick simple list to where i should hookup cables to? I no the answer is probably in the thread so please dont hate me! :0
We're in the same boat Tony -- just pulled the battery from our 88 GT (automatic) and want to check the grounds while it's out. Read this thread nearly a year ago and I've been looking for 'cliff notes' or a similar 'cookbook' for awhile. Hoping for something like Jetmans list, but with photos. Until then I'm pulling what I can from the 9 pages ^^0^^, it's in there -- Thanks ya'll -- Laura
My car has had a problem for many years where the lights dim and the voltmeter dips down when the fan comes on, and if my foot is also on the brake, the turn signals freeze. I'd definitely like to give this a try.
Someone else asked it, and I'd like to know too, would the braided ground strap from the block to the decklid hinge be suitable? Because I too have an extra.
My problem is 1, I dont know how to connect the strap from the chassis to the battery and 2, I cant get that damn plenum bolt off for the life of me! Any suggestions?
