Has anyone done a swap with a 3400 V6 like what came in a 2001 Olds Alero? What is involved ? is it the same as the mid 90's Camaro 3.4's. I have an Alero and it seems much faster then my 85 4 speed GT. Is this a good swap candidate?
[This message has been edited by BJR (edited 08-18-2006).]
I had a 2000 Olds Alero v6 and it was a very peppy engine. The tranny started to fail (shift valve problem) at about 60,000 mi. so I dumped the car for a 2003 Alero with the Ecotec.
I think it fits like the earlier DOHC engines.
I'll be watching this thread
Arn
IP: Logged
12:10 PM
RCR Member
Posts: 4453 From: Shelby Twp Mi Registered: Sep 2002
Someone one here has swapped in a complete GenIII 3400SFI without using any of the Fiero intake, heads, etc. I forget the username, but a search might turn up something. From what I recall, it was much faster than stock (obviously) and the 3400 is physically smaller than the 2.8, and lighter. Other than wiring, it sounds like a very easy swap.
I'm wondering about the 3.9L in the G6 GTP. 240 HP normally aspirated in a 60° V6. It should be about the same physically as bolting in the 3400. The electronics are the big question. And it even comes with the 6-speed manual.
Someone one here has swapped in a complete GenIII 3400SFI without using any of the Fiero intake, heads, etc. I forget the username, but a search might turn up something. From what I recall, it was much faster than stock (obviously) and the 3400 is physically smaller than the 2.8, and lighter. Other than wiring, it sounds like a very easy swap.
This is exactly what I was thinking of doing. And using my stock 4 speed to keep it low cost if it would work. If any one has a link to this build please post it, I have done many different searches and not found much info on this swap. Any and all info will be appreciated. Thanks Brian
IP: Logged
01:25 PM
Formula88 Member
Posts: 53788 From: Raleigh NC Registered: Jan 2001
Someone one here has swapped in a complete GenIII 3400SFI without using any of the Fiero intake, heads, etc. I forget the username, but a search might turn up something. From what I recall, it was much faster than stock (obviously) and the 3400 is physically smaller than the 2.8, and lighter. Other than wiring, it sounds like a very easy swap.
I'm wondering about the 3.9L in the G6 GTP. 240 HP normally aspirated in a 60° V6. It should be about the same physically as bolting in the 3400. The electronics are the big question. And it even comes with the 6-speed manual.
Smaller? Perhaps at the top end, the block is nearly identical. Personally if I were to do the swap I'd keep the aluminum heads and 3400 intake, the heads breathe WAY better and my '05 Grand Am revs quite happily to 5500 with not nearly the power drop when approaching 6000. I think the aluminum top end would be a far better candidate for modifications to make real power. I imagine the real issue would be with the OBDII and the fact the 3400 never came with a manual transmission. Though it's been proven time again that just about anything can be done.
IP: Logged
09:52 PM
PFF
System Bot
Formula88 Member
Posts: 53788 From: Raleigh NC Registered: Jan 2001
Smaller? Perhaps at the top end, the block is nearly identical.
I knew somebody would try to nitpick that comment. Guess I should have included blueprints and GM specifications as to exactly which dimensions I was referring to with sources verified by independant mechanics and a survey done by J.D. Powers.
IP: Logged
10:07 PM
Unsafe At Any Speed Member
Posts: 2299 From: Cheyenne, WY Registered: Feb 2003
Of course you were even. The Alero was dressing out at 3200+ lbs with gas and a driver aboard.
Arn
Yeah, I know that. I'm not saying that his engine wasn't putting down more power. In the original post it sounded as if the Alero was significantly faster than the Fiero. That's what I was asking about.
IP: Logged
10:24 PM
Aug 20th, 2006
Shadow_Wolf Member
Posts: 759 From: Sherwood Park, Alberta, Canada Registered: May 2003
I knew somebody would try to nitpick that comment. Guess I should have included blueprints and GM specifications as to exactly which dimensions I was referring to with sources verified by independant mechanics and a survey done by J.D. Powers.
I was just curious where, I've had the blocks side by side and notice any dimensional differences, though I didn't exactly start measuring either. I know the oilpan is different, as far as the heads, <shrug>. Regardless, the 3400 is definately an upgrade for the 2.8 .
I've been running a 3400 SFI OHV engine from a 2000 Montana (Same as Alero but 185 HP) with Muncie-Getrag 5 speed in my 88 Fiero for three years now. It has awsome gas mileage (SFI working) and torque. We won a 2nd place trophy at the Fiero gathering a few years ago in Pontiac, Michigan. I am using a OBD I.5 flash type PCM from a 94/95 F-body (V6/Manual Trans). You can also use a 3100 PCM of the same vintage and reflash the VIN of a F-Body (V6/Manual Trans) into it if you have access to a Tech 2 and someone who knows what they are doing. I built a vats bypass card (found wiring on the net) for under ten bucks and modified an adaptor from early 3.8 to install the mushroom type egr. Wired it and fired it. No codes. The only problem I have ever had came from a worn out ignition switch on my high mileage GT. I highly recomend the swap.
IP: Logged
02:58 PM
HitesFiero Member
Posts: 401 From: St. Charles, MO, USA Registered: Sep 2003
Hmm, I was under the impression that you could use an ECM from an early 90's 3.1 from a Berreta or Cav and not need to reflash it. Am I way off base here?
IP: Logged
05:30 PM
Unsafe At Any Speed Member
Posts: 2299 From: Cheyenne, WY Registered: Feb 2003
Hmm, I was under the impression that you could use an ECM from an early 90's 3.1 from a Berreta or Cav and not need to reflash it. Am I way off base here?
The ECM from a 3.1 may work fine but I wanted to utilize the Sequential Fuel Injection and next generation processing of the F-Body PCM. If you find a PCM from a 94/95 Camaro/Firebird with V6 and manual transmission it has everything you need and does not need to be reflashed.
What PCM is in the 94/95 F-body (OBD 1.5 ... V6/manual) and the 3100 PCM. I am looking into the 7730 (1227730) upgrade as per Darth Fiero ( https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/079574.html ). I want to eventually use the 3400. The 7730 upgrade for the 2.8/3.1/3.4 iron block/head is the best upgrade yet for driveability and programming and ease. It is the easiest to adapt to the fiero with little modification to the Fiero harness. What PCM is in the early 90's Barreta. Is that the 7730? Does it not allow SFI? Does the 94/95 Camaro PCM.
IP: Logged
01:16 AM
3084me Member
Posts: 1035 From: Bucks County, PA Registered: Apr 2005
Also keep in mind that if you happen to find an earlier 99-2000 Alero that the 3400 had some intake gasket failures. We had a 1999 Alero (worst car we ever had) that we dumped at 40,000 miles 2 years after we bought it and paid it off. In addition to overall crappy build quality , the icing on the cake was my wife pulling up , shutting the car off and while we were talking in the driveway, the car starts "peeing" antifreeze all over the ground.
After opening the hood, I find that the intake manifold was covered in coolant. It was under warranty (I think there is a TSB on it but no Recall). I've seen quite a few Alero's and other cars that share the 3400 where the problem was never fixed so I just wanted to throw that out there incase anyone was looking to do the swap.
As far as performance, I was really surprised at the performance of that car. Not blistering fast but pretty quick. I would imagine in a fiero, it would be a fun ride.
IP: Logged
12:10 PM
PFF
System Bot
Formula88 Member
Posts: 53788 From: Raleigh NC Registered: Jan 2001
If you're considering the Gen III 3400SFI, also think about the 3500SFI used in the Malibu. Same basic engine, but 200HP.
I'm very interested in the 3.9 pushrod engine (240HP) and the 3.6 DOHC (252HP) engines. I believe they both have the same bellhousing as the Fiero, but I don't know about engine mounts and electronics.
IP: Logged
03:23 PM
May 29th, 2007
mtownfiero Member
Posts: 1779 From: Mansfield, Mass Registered: Mar 2007
I have a 3400 and tranny sitting on the floor in my garage waiting for me to get motivated and funded to install it in my 88GT... Its all going in... intake, heads and ODBII because of the 4T65E that is connected to it.
And yes the 3400 had a lower intake manifold gasket problem.. but if the motor is already out of the car its damn easy to get at and replace with the newer version of the gasket that prevents the failure. Other than that gasket the 3400 is a pretty reliable engine. I have a friend with a 2000 Alero and the only problem he has ever had with the car was the driver side power window electronics.
[This message has been edited by carbon (edited 05-29-2007).]
IP: Logged
10:30 PM
Formula88 Member
Posts: 53788 From: Raleigh NC Registered: Jan 2001
I have a 3400 and tranny sitting on the floor in my garage waiting for me to get motivated and funded to install it in my 88GT... Its all going in... intake, heads and ODBII because of the 4T65E that is connected to it.
What did you get your 3400 out of? In the Grand Am (Alero, etc.) it comes with a 4T40E or 4T45E. Not a particularly strong tranny. Do the minivans use the 65E?
I guess so... I have no idea what the engine came out of... makes finding a specific manual/wiring diagram kind of difficult. Can't find a way to id the ECM enough to lock down a vehicle model. I am pretty sure it is out of a minivan with the tranny that it came with. The only issue is that on Darth Fiero's website the tranny identifier says that this transmission came out of a lumina... but no Luminas had a 3400, just the 3100 and 3.4TDC, and the minivan in 2000 was the Venture, not the Lumina APV. So I just don't know.
[This message has been edited by carbon (edited 06-07-2007).]
My 2000 Alero had intake gaskets replaced as well. If you find an engine with low miles, chances are you should replace the gaskets before installing it. Other than that, the engine is a goody.
My 2000 Alero had intake gaskets replaced as well. If you find an engine with low miles, chances are you should replace the gaskets before installing it. Other than that, the engine is a goody.
Arn
And then be ready to replace the gaskets again in 10,000 miles, and then again at 20,000, and then again at... well you get the idea. I had a gorgeous 99 Alero, gasket went 3 times. F that car and that engine.
IP: Logged
10:03 AM
clok1966 Member
Posts: 146 From: West Fargo, ND USA Registered: Nov 2003
My 99 alero has had no engine work ever (has 132,000) but i have replaced the heater fan resistor (hasnt everybody with an alero) and the front Hubs 2x (I bought cheap hubs (NEVER EVER BY VALUECRAFT HUBS!!!!!!!!) and they lasted 7 months, good hubs have been on car for about 30,000 now). I think the car is pretty dang .... OK not great but not as bad as some would lead you to believe. The engine gasket thing (talk to a GM mechanic) is almost a givin, you will replace it. But the newer felpro gaskets almost eliminate the problem. The part of this engine i cant stand is the Piston slap when its cold. it goes awya in about 90 seconds and GM swears its nothing (I guess they are right as mine has done it since new and still doenst burn oil and the slap still doenst last for more then 90 seconds when cold) I have heard lots of newer GM cars ith it also at the dealership with testdrives. Im amazed when I go with a friend to look at cars and they never even notice it.
The 3.4 in my alero will easily take my stock 86 GT even with its extra wieght. I will be wathcing this thread also to see how it goes.
IP: Logged
10:37 AM
clok1966 Member
Posts: 146 From: West Fargo, ND USA Registered: Nov 2003
My 99 alero has had no engine work ever (has 132,000) but i have replaced the heater fan resistor (hasnt everybody with an alero) and the front Hubs 2x (I bought cheap hubs (NEVER EVER BY VALUECRAFT HUBS!!!!!!!!) and they lasted 7 months, good hubs have been on car for about 30,000 now). I think the car is pretty dang .... OK not great but not as bad as some would lead you to believe. The engine gasket thing (talk to a GM mechanic) is almost a givin, you will replace it. But the newer felpro gaskets almost eliminate the problem. The part of this engine i cant stand is the Piston slap when its cold. it goes awya in about 90 seconds and GM swears its nothing (I guess they are right as mine has done it since new and still doenst burn oil and the slap still doenst last for more then 90 seconds when cold) I have heard lots of newer GM cars ith it also at the dealership with testdrives. Im amazed when I go with a friend to look at cars and they never even notice it.
The 3.4 in my alero will easily take my stock 86 GT even with its extra wieght. I will be wathcing this thread also to see how it goes.
And then be ready to replace the gaskets again in 10,000 miles, and then again at 20,000, and then again at... well you get the idea. I had a gorgeous 99 Alero, gasket went 3 times. F that car and that engine.
Meh.
[This message has been edited by carbon (edited 06-10-2007).]
IP: Logged
04:22 PM
Formula88 Member
Posts: 53788 From: Raleigh NC Registered: Jan 2001
And then be ready to replace the gaskets again in 10,000 miles, and then again at 20,000, and then again at... well you get the idea. I had a gorgeous 99 Alero, gasket went 3 times. F that car and that engine.
GM redesigned the gaskets in 2002, I believe. The new design gaskets have a metal o-ring around the bolt holes to prevent over torquing from cracing the plastic gasket.
