The irony that you guys give liberals on the forum bad ratings until they get banned, then talk about how much free speech exists here
Yeah, all elections are rigged and the electoral college are the problem unless Democrats are winning as well. Act like an idiot and you have to pay the Toll.
If I were to regularly talk like this I would certainly be banned.
I am not going to pretend like every single post I have made on this forum has been without fault, but the VAST majority of my posts have been nothing but debating political topics without personal insult. I have never lied, and the majority of my posts I back up with sources. If you are liberal you must endure personal attack after personal attack on this forum, from people with FAR higher ratings.
I would love for someone to analyze this thread and explain how I was being so much more uncivil than others Link.
The standards here are far different. It is disillusion to thing that this "tyranny of the majority" forum is a bastion of free speech.
My issue is not that you you may be liberal (that is your choice) or that you are uncivil (I can't think of an uncivilized exchange of words?), my issue is that you don't follow through a debate. You leave the thread even when people have asked questions of you in a civil way. I get that you don't want to argue with people, but at least respond to those that treat you with some respect. But then , you don't have to do that either, that is your choice, but it leaves people to conclusions about you that may not accurately portray your intent.
[This message has been edited by Rickady88GT (edited 01-31-2019).]
If I were to regularly talk like this I would certainly be banned.
I am not going to pretend like every single post I have made on this forum has been without fault, but the VAST majority of my posts have been nothing but debating political topics without personal insult. I have never lied, and the majority of my posts I back up with sources. If you are liberal you must endure personal attack after personal attack on this forum, from people with FAR higher ratings.
I would love for someone to analyze this thread and explain how I was being so much more uncivil than others Link.
The standards here are far different. It is disillusion to thing that this "tyranny of the majority" forum is a bastion of free speech. Click to show
I offer this... Browsing through those threads, it looks as if a lot more right leaning members have stopped posting since you began posting.
I am an azzhole. I will not apologize that you hate my life. Your life? I have always wished you the best. I have never reached out towards you negatively other than this forum's walls. I hold my opinion, and while yo may not like it, you always know where I stand on a subject. Even that of ratings. Neutral. Boonie is a negative right now FYI.
Today I am headed to empty my freezer at the Union Gospel Mission. Something that I have done many times before and even mentioned it here several times. Going to take the Fiero, and my new rescue dog Clyde.
Originally posted by olejoedad: Are you operating under the assumption that anyone on this Forum cares about the ongoing tiff between the two of you? Get a life man, who cares?
That was Blacktree. The next message was from me. I said--in my not untypical, artsy-fartsy, What Would Mueller Do? kind of way--that I did not think that this is a "Thread About Another Thread" violation. That's how it strikes me. When I go back to the Original Post or Post #0 from Tony Kania. I do not get the impression that Tony Kania started this thread with the explicit purpose of reviving or extending that other thread that Boondawg started. Which is "In Standup Comedy, Are There Any Limits? Comedian Fined $35,000 For Joke." That just came up again, very naturally, in the course of the conversation in this thread.
I'm not a fan of the "Don't Start A Thread About Another Thread" or DSATAAT Posting Guideline. I think it's often very vague or nebulous--a gray area or borderline call, just waiting to happen. There's another Posting Guideline that literally dwarfs the DSATAAT guideline in terms of meaningful significance.
It's apparent that forum member randye can no longer tolerate any conversation in which his and my paths cross, without resorting to his "Ronald is mentally ill" diagnosis. So he's making new threads about previous threads almost every time that he shows up. He ought to just put that in his Signature and be done with it. Of course, I would report that to the moderator, but who knows? Maybe randye could save himself many hundreds or thousands of future keystrokes.
[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 01-31-2019).]
That was Blacktree. The next message was from me. I said--in my not untypical, artsy-fartsy, What Would Mueller Do? kind of way--that I did not think that this is a "Thread About Another Thread" violation. That's how it strikes me. When I go back to the Original Post or Post #0 from Tony Kania. I do not get the impression that Tony Kania started this thread with the explicit purpose of reviving or extending that other thread that Boondawg started. Which is "In Standup Comedy, Are There Any Limits? Comedian Fined $35,000 For Joke." That just came up again, very naturally, in the course of the conversation in this thread.
I'm not a fan of the "Don't Start A Thread About Another Thread" or DSATAAT Posting Guideline. I think it's often very vague or nebulous--a gray area or borderline call, just waiting to happen. There's another Posting Guideline that literally dwarfs the DSATAAT guideline in terms of meaningful significance.
It's apparent that forum member randye can no longer tolerate any conversation in which his and my paths cross, without resorting to his "Ronald is mentally ill" diagnosis. So he's making new threads about previous threads almost every time that he shows up. He ought to just put that in his Signature and be done with it. Of course, I would report that to the moderator, but who knows? Maybe randye could save himself many hundreds or thousands of future keystrokes.
My issue is not that you you may be liberal (that is your choice) or that you are uncivil (I can't think of an uncivilized exchange of words?), my issue is that you don't follow through a debate. You leave the thread even when people have asked questions of you in a civil way. I get that you don't want to argue with people, but at least respond to those that treat you with some respect. But then , you don't have to do that either, that is your choice, but it leaves people to conclusions about you that may not accurately portray your intent.
See, that is fair. I understand that is an issue. I should stay, but there are a couple things about this.
1. I don't always have the time to stay at each conversation, but that is hardly an excuse.
2. I have actually mostly stopped posting all together, only coming on once in a while. Mostly because its hard to respond when I have one or two civil posts in response and the rest look like either
this:
quote
Originally posted by Tony Kania: I offer this... Browsing through those threads, it looks as if a lot more right leaning members have stopped posting since you began posting.
I am an azzhole. I will not apologize that you hate my life. Your life? I have always wished you the best. I have never reached out towards you negatively other than this forum's walls. I hold my opinion, and while yo may not like it, you always know where I stand on a subject. Even that of ratings. Neutral. Boonie is a negative right now FYI.
Today I am headed to empty my freezer at the Union Gospel Mission. Something that I have done many times before and even mentioned it here several times. Going to take the Fiero, and my new rescue dog Clyde.
Where people post about something which is at best loosely related to the topic, and not discussing the evidence or question.
OR, something like this:
quote
Originally posted by randye:
The real problem is that you are clearly one seriously butt hurt little Marxist.
Simple answer is to follow advice I got as a young man - CHOOSE YOUR BATTLES.
Answer questions from those who post intelligent questions in a civil manner, and ignore the responses you feel are filled with personal attacks.
Filter.
If you believe in your position on a subject, follow through and defend or expound on your position. Those that attack aren't interested in your opinion anyway, or interested in swaying your opinion via debate.
EDIT TO ADD - I don't know why there is a red angry face, I can not edit it out of the header. I will blame it on my fumble fingers.
[This message has been edited by olejoedad (edited 02-01-2019).]
Simple answer is to follow advice I got as a young man - CHOOSE YOUR BATTLES.
Answer questions from those who post intelligent questions in a civil manner, and ignore the responses you feel are filled with personal attacks.
Filter.
If you believe in your position on a subject, follow through and defend or expound on your position. Those that attack aren't interested in your opinion anyway, or interested in swaying your opinion via debate.
Precisely!
Can't say how many long winded and aggravated posts I just roll on past and ignore. Most likely, just like folks pass right on by my own posts.
Where people post about something which is at best loosely related to the topic, and not discussing the evidence or question.
I am literally on topic. Literally on topic for a conversation that I started. In no way was I even remotely off target when it came to the words that I chose? Yet, I am off topic?
Your hate of me confuses your comprehension. You misinterpret much.
Originally posted by olejoedad: Simple answer is to follow advice I got as a young man - CHOOSE YOUR BATTLES.
Answer questions from those who post intelligent questions in a civil manner, and ignore the responses you feel are filled with personal attacks.
Filter.
YEP!
Choose your battles. Don't feed the trolls. It's just the internet. etc etc
I can't tell you how many times I've typed out a scathing response to something somebody said, then hit the Back button instead of the Submit button. Self-discipline is a valuable life skill.
Choose your battles. Don't feed the trolls. It's just the internet. etc etc
I can't tell you how many times I've typed out a scathing response to something somebody said, then hit the Back button instead of the Submit button. Self-discipline is a valuable life skill.
Trust me, I know, I very rarely engage with them anymore.
That is why I often stop posting in threads. In this case I was just responding to a civil comment.
All I am saying is that I am not going to waste a ton of effort on a thread where I have to sift through crap to get to a civil discussion. That is why O/T is "dying", people with liberal/different opinions come in for a few months and try to contribute, but it becomes far more effort than it is worth so they slowly stop posting and leave.
[This message has been edited by Threedog (edited 02-01-2019).]
people with liberal/different opinions come in for a few months and try to contribute, but it becomes far more effort than it is worth
"Contribute" what son?
Are you laboring under some misconception we don't have a clue what your leftist ideology is? Your opinions are as predictable as the sunrise.
Most of us here know what it was like to be young, idealistic and so absolutely certain that we knew everything and just as certain that anyone else who didn't share our "opinions" were just ignorant, unenlightened and backward.
You're no different. You're not special. You've demonstrated that over and over here.
quote
Originally posted by Threedog:
...A lot of conservatives believe that all change is bad and liberals are retarded, while many liberals believe that the current system is completely broken and conservative are backwards idiots.
It's evident that you really don't even have a basic understanding of conservatism and I'm certain that you really don't have a full understanding of the basis of the ideology that you espouse.
If you really think that you're going to prance in and preach to the adults in the room and show them the "error of their ways", you're delusional.
Conversely, those of us that have been just like you in our youth know full well that only ONE thing will change your thinking eventually. MATURITY
Sadly that doesn't happen for every young idealistic leftist like you. All too many just remain children in aging bodies, forming their opinions and making their life decisions based on their ever changing emotions and utopian fantasies.
Forever soft children of the left.
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 02-02-2019).]
I see three things that often stifle productive discourse: misinformation, mischaracterization and personal insults.
I could post something like: “I like red cars”
and the response might be: “You are a moron. Only a nazi would demand that all cars be red. Besides, it is a well known fact that red paint causes pregnancy.”
Now, replace “I like red cars” with “I don’t like antisemitic humor”
(or more accurately “Your image is far outside my bounds of comfort and I dare say that is likely true for most adults.”)
Then, replace “moron” with “snowflake” and replace “nazi” with “hypocrite”.
Do these substitutions alter the validity of the analysis?
Each of us has opinions on many subjects. Opinions may be invalidated only by contradictory facts, not alternate opinions.
Opinions are not censorship. Censorship is a tool of the government. I have always made it abundantly clear that government should play only a minimal role in our daily lives.
I will always judge people by their actions and the principles that they demonstrate. That is my right.
Opinions are not censorship. Censorship is a tool of the government. I have always made it abundantly clear that government should play only a minimal role in our daily lives.
Further, this forum is NOT a hallowed sanctuary of "free speech", particularly as defined by the United States Constitution.
Nobody's "rights" are being violated here any more than they would be at a local bar.
In point of fact, this forum has a uniquely "pure" form of democracy in it's "one man, one vote" ratings system that, most ironically, the more vocal leftist members here now rant against.
The reason for their angst over the system is as obvious as the cognitive dissonance necessary to voice it.
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 02-01-2019).]
In point of fact, this forum has a uniquely "pure" form of democracy in it's "one man, one vote" ratings system that, most ironically, the more vocal leftist members here now rant against.
The problem with that is that we have seen it demonstrated that one man may occasionally have more than one vote. There have been those who have from time to time built their own little army of "terracotta warriors".
Originally posted by williegoat: The problem with that is ...
While true, democracy is not perfect. The Dumbs continually use dead people to vote and illegal immigrants. Even some immigrants who are legal but can not vote.
Originally posted by Threedog: I understand that is an issue. I should stay, but there are a couple things about this.
1. I don't always have the time to stay at each conversation, but that is hardly an excuse.
Hardly ? It was your first excuse.
Your second excuse ?
quote
Originally posted by Threedog: 2. I have actually mostly stopped posting all together, only coming on once in a while. Mostly because [color=red]its hard to respond when I have one or two civil posts in response and the rest look like either ...
I will get to either later. First you say "it is hard to". It sounds just like you are saying "it is too hard" to respond. Why is that ?
Now, let me get to either.
quote
Originally posted by Threedog: Where people post about something which is at best loosely related to the topic, and not discussing the evidence or question.
Do you not know how conversation flows ? I bet you don't let conversation flow in your 'social justice' indoctrination classroom.
What an astounding quote ! How many times I have seen Dumbocrats do exactly that when they didn't want to answer a question ? I don't know. I wish I had a dollar for every time, including your dollar, for doing the exact same thing you accused others of doing.
You, did not have time to post an answer to questions. You did have time to offer excuses. Hmm ... !
quote
Originally posted by Threedog: Where someone resorts to simple insults instead of actually having a discussion.
quote
Originally posted by Threedog: Why would I want to continue having a conversation when the thread is filled with stuff like this?
Two posts are considered 'filled', ? You are as transparent as cellophane.
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Threedog: Why would I want to continue having a conversation when the thread is filled with stuff like this?
Two posts are considered 'filled', ? You are as transparent as cellophane. [/QUOTE]
When it is 2 out of 3 or 4 responses, yes it is "filled". More than half of the responses are ones that I have to ignore, which would be fine, but...
All I have posted in the last week or so is in this thread. I would absolutely argue that I have been nothing but civil, and while you may disagree with my reasoning I have done my best to remain tied to the conversation and present my opinion. Yet still, I have watched my rating continue to go down over this week. I simply can not continue to speak here, whether civilly or uncivilly, opinion or fact, respectful or not, or I will be banned.
It is not government censorship, I am not demanding that I have a right to speak here, as I do not(it is a private forum). However, some of the conservative voices in O/T absolutely censor things they do not like to hear.
It is not government censorship, I am not demanding that I have a right to speak here, as I do not(it is a private forum). However, some of the conservative voices in O/T absolutely censor things they do not like to hear.
No individual user here has the power to censor anything.
It has been my observation that you stop posting in a thread when you cannot defend your position. That is your choice.
[This message has been edited by williegoat (edited 02-04-2019).]
No individual user here has the power to censor anything.
It has been my observation that you stop posting in a thread when you cannot defend your position. That is your choice.
Just like in this thread, I stop posting because if I continue(even a civil way, like here), my rating continues to go down. I would like to continue to be a part of this forum, as it is an amazing resource for Fiero owners, but I can not continue to post in O/T because even if I do so in a civil way I will be banned. Mostly because, even in this thread, I have received too many negative ratings.
Originally posted by randye: ...said the mentally ill little character that actually started TWO entire threads, (so far), that were solely and specifically to attack another member of the forum.
The very same mentally ill little fellow that has openly called for the DEATH of another forum member on multiple occasions and then whines about "rules".
GET HELP Ronald. You're sick and you desperately need professional psychiatric treatment.
I may have more to say about the original topic here, or post#0, as the day wears on. First, some housekeeping. Because forum member randye has been jammin' and spammin' this Pennock's Off Topic section since just about forever with this Off HIs Rocker crap, like a broken record. He says "GET HELP, Ronald." So where do I find a counselor or a clinic that will "randye-ize" me, and give me the unique, randye-like ability to lull myself to sleep at night by imagining that I, too, am sucking on TRUMP'S C*CK, just like good ole randye?
quote
Originally posted by randye: Because the owner and moderator of OptiBoard had to shut down the "off topic" / "general discussion" section because of YOUR constant disruptive behavior.
Your "Radio Free Rinsel" and other un-ending spamming and nonsense angered the other members of the forum who ARE eye care professionals, whereas YOU ARE NOT.
Click to show
You are so psychotic that you believe that the OptiBoard members needed a "compendium" of all your mentally ill posts!
Nope...That's not crazy at all...
You have a "history" Ronald, and it isn't a good one.
The biggest irony is YOU posting in this thread and complaining that "certain people" are the cause of decreased participation on a forum.
I am currently a member in good standing of that other online discussion forum--OptiBoard--and always have been, after registering as "rinselberg" in 2004. I posted as recently as January 28, 2019, and before that, on January 22. As confirmed by this screen capture: Click to show
The owner and moderator did not eliminate the "Just Conversation" section. He decided to put an end to political conversations. He was already leaning that way, towards the end of 2013. "Political Posts and Civility - Can they co-exist?" I was part of that conversation, as confirmed by this screen capture: Click to show
Anyone could follow that conversation from the beginning, and they would find not even a scintilla of hostility or blame directed at "rinselberg". To wit: https://www.optiboard.com/f...ty-Can-they-co-exist
Does it strike anyone as just plain odd, that I am still an OptiBoard member in good standing, with full posting privileges, after having, in randye's own words, "spammed", "angered" and "disrupted" all of those Eye Care Professionals to the point where they decided to shut down part of their discussion forum? Wouldn't they have decided to shut me down (membership ban), instead of shutting down part of their own forum? Does any of what randye is saying make any sense?
CLICK FOR FULL SIZE
Just plain nuts.
[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 02-09-2019).]
Just like in this thread, I stop posting because if I continue(even a civil way, like here), my rating continues to go down. I would like to continue to be a part of this forum, as it is an amazing resource for Fiero owners, but I can not continue to post in O/T because even if I do so in a civil way I will be banned. Mostly because, even in this thread, I have received too many negative ratings.
As I understand it the arrow has to be quite a bit left for that risk? Or is it cumulative amounts of red overall?
Yeah people that rate instead of debating are weak. Its sad that it silences opinions.
It could be some time before I return here, and I don't want to get into any kind of "tit for tat" or free-ranging discussion at this moment.
As to "call out" threads, I don't think they need to be taken all that seriously, but I will "'cop" to exactly ONE. Not two. The "OptiBoard" one doesn't count in my book, because that had already come up in more than one thread or topic, and it clearly deserved it's own new "home" as a separate thread. If I had tried to do it without giving it its own new thread, it would have "clogged up" the other discussion which motivated me to want to do it. The other "call out" thread was--well, it was what it was. Or is what it is. I think it was before the OptiBoard one. I may try to find it, later.
Here's the OptiBoard thread, for reference; I wouldn't suggest going straight there. First, I would suggest backing up in this discussion until you see my Big Red Upwards Pointing Arrow image and coming to grips with that message, which is not a particularly long message. It contains two screen grabs or captures and a link to a conversation inside of the OptiBoard forum. The screen grabs for sure; the link--probably not. #ReleaseTheOptiboardMemo. For everyone's best 'bud', from the great state of Florida. https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum6/HTML/122230.html
I consider what is going on here to be a forum-wide issue, and something that cannot be restricted to just any specific thread. Forum member randye has "evaluated" my mental health (or lack thereof) on what I believe are now over 100 separate instances, spread across at least 20 different threads or topics.
"Death threats" are a more serious matter. I "cop" to NONE. And I cannot imagine that any of the messages that forum member randye is calling a "death threat" would ever be taken seriously by any lawyer or law enforcement agency.I think I could just as reasonably contend that forum member randye's GET HELP messages are an attempt on his part to "gaslight" me into attempting suicide or harming someone else. At times, he has added that connotation to his messages of that kind.
Could any of these messages be a Cliff Pennock issue? Maybe. Here's what I can offer:
Death threat #1 "Get a coffin, you imbecile." I have not located that message. i thought that I knew where it was. Could I have deleted those words? Maybe.
I would suggest that anyone who wants to delve into the "Death threats" issue should use these links and review the "rinselberg" message itself, and then consider it within the context of that thread. Consider it in relation to the "randye" message(s) that it appears to be most directly linked with.
Let me close with yet a third "rinselberg" message, about the same length as the one that I just referenced. Another "read." But not a "book." (I have one of those, too, if anyone wants to have it. But that is not related to this discussion.) https://www.fiero.nl/forum/F...L/123210-5.html#p176
[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 02-06-2019).]
I think I should work on improving my coarseness or vulgarity game, and focus on staying away from any references, however indirect or figure-of-speech like, to any kind of End Of Life event.
Another good background or example type thread, and not very long. I did not start this Topic:
I would like to put a suggested resolution on the table.
I am committed to staying away from any future references, however indirect or figure-of-speech like, to any kind of End Of Life event. That's unconditional on my part, and already accepted.
From randye:
No more references to OptiBoard.
No more of these very personal and direct comments about "mental illness", or "get help", and no more references to any psychiatric facilities or telephone hotlines.
I consider this a kind of harassment that has no purpose, other than to try to make the forum exactly to randye's own liking, by trying to exclude discussion and topics that would otherwise be well within the Posting Guidelines.
I would be glad not to see any further opportunities on my part to create messages that are my expression of push back against these two kinds of harassment.
I think I would be creating fewer messages, or at least, not any more messages or any more longer messages, were this resolution to be achieved.
I would like to put a suggested resolution on the table.
I am committed to staying away from any future references, however indirect or figure-of-speech like, to any kind of End Of Life event. That's unconditional on my part, and already accepted.
From randye:
No more references to OptiBoard.
No more of these very personal and direct comments about "mental illness", or "get help", and no more references to any psychiatric facilities or telephone hotlines.
I consider this a kind of harassment that has no purpose, other than to try to make the forum exactly to randye's own liking, by trying to exclude discussion and topics that would otherwise be well within the Posting Guidelines.
I would be glad not to see any further opportunities on my part to create messages that are my expression of push back against these two kinds of harassment.
I think I would be creating fewer messages, or at least, not any more messages or any more longer messages, were this resolution to be achieved. Click to show
I would be glad not to see any further opportunities on my part to create messages that are my expression of push back against these two kinds of harassment.
.
Regardless of the attacks of anyone, the opportunities not to respond are always there, for any of us. As are opportunities for any way one wishes to respond.
? You are as transparent as cellophane.
