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World's slowest Fiero/Quad 4 Swap by Quad Raider
Started on: 07-15-2017 09:17 PM
Replies: 230 (5637 views)
Last post by: Quadfather on 11-28-2020 09:29 PM
RCR
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Report this Post06-28-2020 07:39 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RCRClick Here to Email RCRSend a Private Message to RCREdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Great build.

I can certainly relate to your frustrations, but keep chugging away. You'l love it when you're cruising around.

Take care,

Bob

------------------

My Build

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Report this Post06-28-2020 07:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for RCRClick Here to Email RCRSend a Private Message to RCREdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

RCR

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double post

[This message has been edited by RCR (edited 06-28-2020).]

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Quadfather
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Report this Post06-29-2020 10:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Quadfather:


Ah, man, it’s great to hear from you. Yes, I still have those tubes. If I recall, I had to cut them to get them to fit in the box, but I marked them carefully so they could be welded back in the right orientation. The box is still in the attic and I think it has your name and address on it.

I’ll get over to the shop in the next day or so and get up there to make sure the box is still there.



I braved the ridiculous heat and humidity and confirmed the box was still in the attic.



And here it is in the back of my truck about to be brought to my house.



If you still want the tubes, drop me a line at 918raider@gmail.com and we’ll figure it out. I’d love to hear your story and I’d be tickled for you to get these tubes if you still want them.
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Quadfather
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Report this Post06-29-2020 10:27 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Quadfather

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While I was over at the shop I spent some time finishing up my homemade HVAC squirrel cage shop fan.

I made this pedestal a year or two ago out of a brake rotor, axle hub and a piece of pipe. My plan was to use it as a computer stand with a swiveling arm, but I changed my mind and it had been sitting in the shop next to the bench grinder ever since.

I added the T section to create a pedestal for the squirrel cage.



Tonight I added a switch and some wire clips to secure everything.



It blows so much air I worry the brake rotor isn’t heavy enough to keep it upright. I may weld another rotor to the bottom of this one. Anyway, it works great considering I spent about $20 on it.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 06-29-2020).]

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Report this Post06-29-2020 10:35 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
On the way home from work I bought a capacitor for the other squirrel cage the parts guy gave me. It was only $8, and when I plugged it in and wired the motor, presto, it worked.

It works so well like this, with the motor side up, I’ll probably cut a piece of plywood for the bottom, then suspend it from the ceiling at the back of the shop.



The shop is just so hot and humid, it’s difficult to focus on any task that requires sustained concentration.
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Report this Post06-29-2020 10:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Quadfather

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I quit using all social media a few weeks ago, and that coupled with finally having broadband means I’ve been spending a lot of time on YouTube over the last few months. In the process, I discovered a series of videos from a guy in Maryland who put a Quad in a Fiero.

Actually, he put a 2.4 twin cam, the later version, in his Fiero. His videos are entertaining and informative, but he hasn’t done an episode specifically on wiring, so I’m anxious to see that.

I think he’s also given up on the twin cam because someone sold him a bored out 2.8 L V-6 with all the fixings.

Here’s one of his episodes.

https://youtu.be/G2xI1JJnN_4
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Report this Post06-29-2020 10:44 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Quadfather

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quote
Originally posted by RCR:

Great build.

I can certainly relate to your frustrations, but keep chugging away. You'l love it when you're cruising around.

Take care,

Bob




Thank you, sir. That’s what I keep telling myself.

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Report this Post07-10-2020 01:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Haven't spent much time in the shop, thanks to the holiday and being busy at work. I've been spending time looking around the internet trying to find the information that I read ten years ago when I first started considering this engine swap.

One small task I have been making progress on is which shifter handle to use. My son found a small aluminum sphere on the street in downtown Tulsa which is just about the perfect diameter for a shifter handle. I somehow haven't managed to take a photo of it, but I will eventually. In the meantime, I've been thinking about how to attach it to my shortened shifter rod. At first I figured I'd just drill a big hole in it and epoxy a nut into it.

To do that, I needed to know the thread size, so I took the shifter to my favorite bolt shop, The Rule Co. which is just east of downtown Tulsa. I love this place. No matter what weird fastener I need, they always have it.



For posterity's sake, the shifter thread is M16 x 1.5mm. I bought a couple nuts for a total of about $2.



But then I got to thinking that the hole would have to be very large in order to accept a nut, and since the ball is aluminum a tap should work pretty well, so I ordered one from Amazon.



The internet says to use a 14.7mm drill for an M16 x 1.5mm tap, but I haven't had a chance to track one down.
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Report this Post07-13-2020 09:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The tapping of the aluminum sphere worked out well. Instead of trying to find a 14.7mm bit I used a 9/16th and it was perfect.





I'll sand it down and paint it sail blue to match the exterior of the car.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 07-13-2020).]

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Report this Post07-13-2020 09:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Also replaced the front radiator hoses, which was a bit of a chore. The upper hose had to be trimmed by 2" but went on easily enough.

Turns out the lower hose also had to be trimmed. Naturally, I cut a little too much off it. Tough to get it to fit because it's so short. Plus, I tried to put it on backward.





I'll order another one.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 07-13-2020).]

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Report this Post07-13-2020 09:55 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Sunday was the first time in a long time that I spent any time UNDER the car, specifically the front end. Years ago I noticed the lower A frame on the passenger side was bent, but didn't closely inspect it until now.

There's an impression in the crossmember from whatever the previous owner hit that also bent the A frame. You can see it right next to the bushing bolt.







Freshening up the front suspension will be the last thing I do before getting the car on the road, so this will have to wait

The front end has a layer of gravel dust on it, but otherwise looks good for a 33-year-old car.
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Report this Post07-20-2020 03:44 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
For the first time in my life, I've rented a storage unit. On the one hand I'm relieved that I can stash my Fiero stuff in a safe place. On the other, I'm not thrilled about having to pay for a place to keep my stuff.

My butthead brother is out of state this week, so this is a good time to be moving items. This was after the first load. Would you say I have a plethora of fascias?



That's about a quarter of my spare Fiero parts. As you can see I also moved over some non-Fiero items that I can't bring myself to part with. Tonight I will move over all three sets of Fiero seats, the deck lid that was original to the car, and the suspension to go with the '88 engine cradle.

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Report this Post07-20-2020 03:48 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

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On a sort-of Fiero subject, this truck belongs to a co-worker. Every time I see it I think, "Man, that would look good on a Fiero."



He's told me the color's name four or five times but I can't seem to remember it. Something sand. Anyway, a Fiero's black trim would really set it off.
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Report this Post07-21-2020 02:31 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Moved another load to the storage unit.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 07-21-2020).]

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Report this Post07-21-2020 02:49 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Look what came in the mail. Haven't had time to study them closely but what I've seen so far is excellent.

Bought them from Faxon for $20. Why didn't I do this sooner?
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Report this Post07-31-2020 10:09 AM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Been busy with work and other aspects of life, so I haven't spent as much time as I'd like studying the wiring for the Quad ECM. What has to be done is mating the two Beretta plugs to the Fiero's C203 connector:



Beretta/Quad 4 connectors on the left, Fiero C203 on the right.



The pinout for the Fiero C203 is pretty common on the internet.



So far I haven't been able to confirm the names of the two Beretta/Quad 4 connectors, but I will eventually.

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Report this Post07-31-2020 10:27 AM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
This page is helpful, too:

http://fieroinfo.com/wiring...rom%20phonedawgz.jpg

I see Cow S. Patoot's name on the page but I'm not sure if he's the creator. This diagram really helps.

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Report this Post08-09-2020 10:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Look what turned up in my favorite salvage.



It looks very similar to the Fiero I saw on the highway in 2010 that inspired me to buy my own. Wouldn't it be something if it's the same one?

This one was someone's parts car, so it's missing a lot of things. No engine or trans, no brake calipers, no console or shifter surround and no instrument cluster.

However, the dash is in good shape so I bought it.





Some kind of non-Fiero seats that weren't bolted in.

But look at this. It's the C200 connector I needed two months ago.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 08-09-2020).]

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Report this Post08-09-2020 11:09 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The thing I really need is the lower right front control arm. I could probably straighten the one that's on my car, but I like using a salvage yard car to learn how to disassemble these parts. I also wanted the rotors because I'll probably do the Grand Am brake upgrade some day.



I had a head start because the calipers were gone. Popped the tie rod end and the sway bar link loose and removed the lower shock bolt. I wrapped a chain around the spring then popped the lower ball joint loose. The spring came out easily.

Trouble began with the A frame bolts. The rear one broke but came out. The nut came off the front one, but the bolt would not come out of the hole. It's rusted to the center sleeve. I beat on it for a couple hours yesterday and went back this morning, but couldn't get it out.





I tried cutting it with a sawsall but didn't have the right blade. I'll go back this week and try again.

The car also had replacement carpets which look good so I may get them, too.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 08-09-2020).]

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Report this Post08-09-2020 11:25 PM Click Here to See the Profile for pmbrunelleClick Here to Email pmbrunelleSend a Private Message to pmbrunelleEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
When the bolt is stuck to the sleeve, I normally grind each end of the bolt flush with the mounting ears, or below the surface if possible.

Then, I spread apart the mounting ears (or crossmember), and slip out the bushing that way.

Not sure if your junkyard will allow cutting/grinding tools...

[This message has been edited by pmbrunelle (edited 08-09-2020).]

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Report this Post08-10-2020 06:09 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by pmbrunelle:

When the bolt is stuck to the sleeve, I normally grind each end of the bolt flush with the mounting ears, or below the surface if possible.

Then, I spread apart the mounting ears (or crossmember), and slip out the bushing that way.

Not sure if your junkyard will allow cutting/grinding tools...



They didn't say anything about my sawsall so I bet a grinder would be OK. I don't have a cordless one, so I bought a better, shorter blade for my sawsall and I think it will work.
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Report this Post08-10-2020 06:16 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Having to rent a storage unit for my Fiero stuff inspired me to clean out and organize my own garage, which led to the discovery of some treasures.

My first car was a 1970 Pontiac LeMans Sport, which I got as a hand-me-down from one of my sisters in 1981. As much fun as it was, it made me wish for a GTO, which is why I bought these magazines as a teenager right about then. Look how much copy was given to the Fiero.









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Report this Post08-10-2020 06:19 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Quadfather

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Also found this, which I'd forgotten I'd bought in 2008 when I replaced the head in my Beretta GTZ.



If it seems I'm working on various other tasks as an excuse to avoid figuring out the ECM wiring for the engine swap, it's because that's exactly what I'm doing.
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Report this Post08-23-2020 10:52 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Spent some time at the salvage yesterday but still couldn't get that control arm off.



I did pull the carpets and interior trim. I think the carpets are aftermarket.

Also, I never realized the rear trim pieces on an '84 wouldn't have speaker covers but it's obvious why they don't.



I bought this car's C203 connector to have an extra one to experiment with.

Once the weather begins to cool down I'll get back to work in the shop.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 08-23-2020).]

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Report this Post09-20-2020 03:24 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Haven't made it back to the salvage yard. There's no hurry.

The weather has cooled off so I'm back in the shop. I'm still moving spare parts to my storage unit and that's how I found these.



I thought I had just ONE extra sway bar. I know the one on the bottom of the photo is a stock front Fiero unit. Anyone recognize the top one? Maybe it came off the '88 cradle I bought.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 09-20-2020).]

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Report this Post10-04-2020 06:01 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Minor progress. Today I cleaned up the shop a bit and rearranged some tools. Then I took a look at my HO quad. The block has been sitting in a plastic bag for a few years.





I thought I'd done a good job of cleaning it. But then I came across a guy who races quads, doing YouTube videos on how to rebuild them.

https://youtu.be/p5_0V4gHrXE

I will take mine apart and clean it the way he recommends.

I decided to start reassembling the engine as part of the process of mating the quad’s wiring harness to the car’s. Years ago I bought all the parts for the rebuild, with the exception of the timing chain, gears and tensioner.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 10-04-2020).]

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Report this Post10-04-2020 06:15 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Also started a little side project. After years of thinking about it, I started building my own hydraulic press. The materials are scrap I had lying around, including parts of an old Soloflex, boat trailer, and a dirt scraper my dad bought at a flea market probably 25 years ago.



My mig welder ran out of gas so no more progress today.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 10-04-2020).]

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Report this Post11-17-2020 08:32 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Quadfather:





Well, the salvage yard has made a bunch of changes in the last couple of months, including the length of time it leaves cars in the yard. My family took a trip back east last month to attend a wedding, and by the time I got back to the yard, this car was gone. I’m not too sad that I didn’t get the A frame off of it, but I’m bummed that the extra parts I stashed in a van in the next row are gone.

After getting a new bottle of argon for my welder, I discovered the regulator was leaking. I ordered a new one and installed it tonight. Hope to finish up the press this weekend or next.

Next up will be disassembling the Quad, cleaning the block and then finishing the reassembly.
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Report this Post11-25-2020 04:29 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Pretty much finished the DIY hydraulic press. I’ve been hoping to find a deal on Craigslist for a 20-ton jack, but Tractor Supply has them for 50 bucks.

Still have to source a couple springs for the return mechanism. Thinking about trying a couple hood struts from the salvage.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 11-25-2020).]

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Report this Post11-25-2020 04:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I’ve been cleaning up the shop, doing maintenance on tools and getting ready to reassemble my Quad. That has me thinking about removing the engine cradle from my car, which has me thinking about all the work I need to do to the cradle and suspension.

I saw this post by Chris Hodson and it clicked.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Chris Hodson:

Decided to go with 1989 Grand Am calipers on the rear. New rotors, pads, brake lines, Joints, etc. Took a bit to locate the parts I needed for the Held bump steer setup but I managed. New Boots on the axels. I got into the passenger side too. Built coilovers, took out the rust and repainted. So the rear is pretty much good to go. I'm going to flush new brake fluid through the lines before I connect the new calipers.

[QUOTE]

That reminded me of something Sardonyx posted in this thread three years ago, when he commented on me shortening the rear tie rods by 3”:

“I think ideally would be to move the tie rods to the control arms, but yet I have never seen anyone do it, except the ‘bump steer kit.’ It would completely eliminate the bump steer.”

So today I pulled a rear wheel off and had a look.



Sure seems as though it would be straightforward to beef up the A arm from the bottom, then weld a piece of heavy plate to the top and use a link like the one Chris used from the Held kit.

I set a piece of scrap angle iron on the A frame to demonstrate. Has anyone else tried this?

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 11-25-2020).]

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Report this Post11-28-2020 09:29 PM Click Here to See the Profile for QuadfatherClick Here to Email QuadfatherSend a Private Message to QuadfatherEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Found some springs that are perfect. After realizing hood struts wouldn’t work because they push the wrong direction, I thought “Heck, I’ll just get a couple hood springs.”



I couldn’t remember the last time I saw a car in my favorite salvage yard that had hood springs. Didn’t even know when the domestic manufacturers switched from springs to struts, but I figured it was in the 80s.

The salvage had ONE vehicle to choose from, a 1976 El Camino.

[This message has been edited by Quadfather (edited 11-28-2020).]

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