Now now... Let's not be too hard on our nasty friend here... At least he is consistent. Those consistent people on the board make it that much easier for us to identify disinformation...

[This message has been edited by Songman (edited 12-19-2003).]

Terdtser, Butt, Brainless and however it MAY concern:
This is from Terdsters link:

Unlike John F. Kennedy, who obtained an IQ score of 119, or Al Gore, who achieved scores of 133 and 134 on intelligence tests taken at the beginning of his high school freshman and senior years, no IQ data are available for George W. Bush. But we do know that the young Bush registered a score of 1206 on the SAT, the most widely used test of college aptitude. (The more cerebral Al Gore obtained 1355.)

The feisty, sometimes-irreverent Bush's mental acuity may lack a little of the sharpness of his tongue, but plainly it is sharp enough. The real test for the president-elect will be whether he possesses the emotional intelligence — the triumph of reason over rigidity and restraint over impulse — to steer the course.

So IT says there are no real data confirm absolute his very low IQ
backlash and goes on to say that it his emotion that matters? WTF?
Plus:

It's tempting to employ Al Gore's IQ:SAT ratio of 134:1355 as a formula for estimating Bush's probable intelligence quotient — an exercise in fuzzy statistics that predicts a score of 119. If the number sounds familiar, it's precisely the IQ score attributed to Kennedy, whom Princeton political scientist Fred Greenstein, in "The Presidential Difference," commended as "a quick study, whose wit was an indication of a subtle mind."

This link is worse than the one I found in 5 minutes [EXCERSISE IN FUZZY STATISTICS???? THE PREVIOUS LEVONSTEIN HAD DEGREED PROFESSIONALS DILLAM ETC>YOU guys crack me up...

And whoever asked me about HOW he got into Stanford-: His DADDY
And pretender from ND: Is North Dakota a repub state? If your State govt is repub owned (controlled ie: more than 50% of representatives are Repubs) like ours here in TX then you have a point. But in all seriousness my taxes did goe up almost 50%. I was pissed today and talked to CMMC today as I thought it was an escrow mistake. It was county taxes. Our governer Rick Perry brought this about.

*I'll try to have a nice weekend regardless of the zealots that tried to rationalize thier blatant stupidity & uncanny love for a retarded president. I watched Return of King last night & that eye & its armies remind me of the current U.S.of A

<SLAM DUNK>BOOYAAA!!!

[This message has been edited by G-Nasty (edited 12-20-2003).]

quote Originally posted by G-Nasty: Terdtser, Butt, Brainless

And this is where I stopped reading.

I never cited the link. I never said based on emotion. I said based on decision-making and determination.

Somehow it is so necessary for you that because you disagree with him, he somehow must be so stupid.

Well, let's take inventory. He found a way to get elected governor of one of the largest states. He found a way to get elected president of the U.S. And HE is stupid. Oh yeah, I forgot, it was because of his DAD. His DAD persuaded millions of americans to vote for him. Oh yeah. And he may have got in to school because of his DAD. I suppose he PASSED because of his dad, too.

I'm not saying those accomplishments make him smart. I'm just saying there is no way to paint him as stupid. YOU just come off looking stupid and petty for trying to do it.

That's a pretty remarkable feet, "slam-dunking" from the hole your mouth has dug you in.

How about a practical use of the ratings bar? It might be interesting for everybody to rate him as to their opinion of his arguments at the top of the next hour,within 5 minutes timespan, view the results,on his ratings bar, and then reverse your opinion by then voting neutral !! Could it be done? Might get a realist display of general perception of His postings!!
fierofetish

I guess the arguement boils down tho this: No one on the Political Right is saying GWB is a genious. We are pretty accurate in describing him as a pretty sharp guy. Those on the political left would have us believe that Bill Clinton had a 182 IQ (better than Einsein) and the GWB would be 85 (Forrest Gump).

Credibility anyone?

He had no arguments, nor any facts... only accusations and vulgar talk.. I think the ratings bar is showing about right.

On THIS you base your claim??? You can't be serious. From the site:

" rated based on scholarly achievements, writings that they alone produced without aid of staff, their ability to speak with clarity, and several other psychological factors which were then scored in the Swanson/Crain system of intelligence ranking."

Scholarly achievements have NOTHING to do with IQ and if you want to discuss speaking with clarity, have a conversation with Stepehn Hawkings sometime. I suppose his IQ is lower because he doesn't speak well?? Give me a break. This "rating" was specifically designed to show how long individuals had been in academia, not how intelligent they are and no, the two are NOT related.

"Among comments made concerning the specific testing of President GW Bush, his low ratings were due to his apparent difficulty to command the English language in public statements, his limited use of vocabulary (6,500 words for Bush versus an average of 11,000 words for other presidents), his lack of scholarly achievements other than a basic MBA, and an absence of any body of work which could be studied on an intellectual basis."

So his life didn't revolve around academics. Who'd have thunk it? Guess which party the NEA is supporting? It couldn't have anything to do with Bush wanting to remove some of their control over schools by the use of vouchers now, could it?

"He has no published works or writings, so in many ways that made it more difficult to arrive at an assessment. We had to rely more heavily on transcripts of his unscripted public speaking."

As opposed to that genius Bill Clinton who never uttered a word that wasn't scripted for him by Hillary or his speech writers.

" This study was commissioned on February 13, 2001 and released on July 9, 2001 to subscribing member universities and organizations within the education community. "

Gee, what a surprise. It was commissioned by universities for their subscribers and most of them not particularly friendly to the President.

If that's the best you can do, then it's a poor reflection on what you take as proof.

John Stricker

PS, I have no idea why you included the second link as I couldn't find anything on it to support your claim of the IQ's. Where was it at?

quote Originally posted by G-Nasty: *http://www.strausplace.com/article.php?sid=626 http://www.smh.com.au/yoursay/2003/10/08/index5.html

I checked this one out on snopes and it is false. Keep posting urban legends.
http://www.snopes.com/inboxer/hoaxes/presiq.htm
Make sure you click on this link for my proof, you can even do your own searches for the non existant institute that is supposed to have written it.
Also check below for a different link that proves the article is false. Is that proof enough?

[This message has been edited by avengador1 (edited 12-21-2003).]

Avengador: That report may or may not be a hoax. PROVE IT. I will remain objective as my brothers wife brought up his IQ info. But according to that 'hoax' no president has agreed to IQ test (publicly) this may present a problem for both sides of this arguement HOWEVER:

I WANT THOSE WHO DOUBT ME TO GO TO THESE TWO SITES BELOW. READ HIS PERSONAL WRITINGS. A LETTER TO LAURA ETC. THESE ARE NOT URBAN MYTHS.
<REPEAT> THESE ARE NOT URBAN MYTHS.

GNasty cliffnote: Everytime I see our president he looks like he amped on some kind of drug. Be it anti-deppressant or alcohol or cocaine (i dont believe hes kicked either habit).
When he was walking around the halls of queen elizabeths castle-did you see his face? His walk and movement? This guys taking something for stress or something.
His interview w/ Barbara Walters???? Where in the hell have you guys been?
There is no real cognitive deep discussion or extended language in any of his own speeches.
*THAT IS WHY THIS PRESIDENT RARELY ADRESSES THE NATION. WHEN HE DOES-
YOU BET THERES A TELEPROMPTER NEARBY.

http://www.chronicle.duke.edu/vnews/display.v/ART/2003/11/13/3fb3793f88b34

http://radio.cbc.ca/programs/asithappens/international/dubya100_043001.html

Roses are red,
Violets are blue,
Oh my lump in the bed,
How I've missed you.

Roses are redder,
Bluer am I,
Seeing you kissed by that charming French guy.

The dogs and the cat, they missed you too;
Barney's still made you dropped him, he ate your shoe.
The distance, my dear, has been such a barrier;
Next time you want an adventure, just land on a carrier.

<I rest my case> IQ =90

I'll quit making fun of the President (for now) as its touched a nerve w/ a few decent (respectful) and powerful members. It is after all, the Holiday season.

OUT>

Well then...a very Merry Christmas to you to G-Nasty!

Hmmm...

I've written many a silly poem in my life. What is my IQ? 80?

quote Originally posted by G-Nasty: <I rest my case>

Why don't I believe this?

G-nasty, I guess you haven't met too many Texans. They are very laidback with the way they talk and act. That doesn't mean they aren't smart. As for IQs, you don't become president by being dumb, and the scores you mention for the Bush's are way below a normal level. It sounds like you just hate Republicans and will blindly post anything that support your position. I know we all are guilty of this, but we also should be big enough to accept when we are wrong and someone has been able to put some doubt into what we say. The facts don't support the statement about the Bush's IQs.

So the only real evidence we have is an SAT score of 1206. There is absolutely no way someone with an IQ of 90 could score 1206 on the SAT.

G-nasty, You wrote:

quote So IT says there are no real data confirm absolute his very low IQ backlash and goes on to say that it his emotion that matters? WTF?"

Are you sure you want to use writing ability as a measure of intelligence?

Bush's IQ score was a hoax.read it here:

http://urbanlegends.about.com/library/bliq-bush.htm

hope this helps somehow

For crying out loud, objective ? You haven't said an objective thing about Bush since he's been in office.

The links you posted are unbelievable. The first one, about the poem to Laura (supposedly)....

The only place this was reported, that I can find, is in Duke University school paper?? Of course, they have such a presence in the White House press corps that they can get these little tidbits of private, personal notes from the President to his wife. No doubt it was photographed as it laid on her pillow. What a crock.

Do a google of "george bush poem" and about all you find is examples like your second link.

I know, maybe we should try that with quotes from Bill and Hillary!! Yeah. It would be simple to write. Every other line would be "I don't have any recollection of that" and the grand finale could be "and of course, my love, that depends on the meaning of Is, Is"

John Stricker

quote Originally posted by G-Nasty: I WANT THOSE WHO DOUBT ME TO GO TO THESE TWO SITES BELOW. READ HIS PERSONAL WRITINGS. A LETTER TO LAURA ETC. THESE ARE NOT URBAN MYTHS. <REPEAT> THESE ARE NOT URBAN MYTHS. GNasty cliffnote: Everytime I see our president he looks like he amped on some kind of drug. Be it anti-deppressant or alcohol or cocaine (i dont believe hes kicked either habit). When he was walking around the halls of queen elizabeths castle-did you see his face? His walk and movement? This guys taking something for stress or something. His interview w/ Barbara Walters???? Where in the hell have you guys been? There is no real cognitive deep discussion or extended language in any of his own speeches. *THAT IS WHY THIS PRESIDENT RARELY ADRESSES THE NATION. WHEN HE DOES- YOU BET THERES A TELEPROMPTER NEARBY. http://www.chronicle.duke.edu/vnews/display.v/ART/2003/11/13/3fb3793f88b34 http://radio.cbc.ca/programs/asithappens/international/dubya100_043001.html

To rip apart a Man's personal edicts to his Wife, be he President or Pauper,in this distructive, "superior" and vindictive fashion, only merits the contempt that any Reader, with a balanced outlook on life, irrespective of Political beliefs, would feel.To presumably have stolen such a personal item, and then publicly air it, and then subsequently belittle it from such giddy heights of snobbishness is unforgivable, and vicious.Above all, unnecessary.I disregard its implication entirely.
fierofetish

quote Originally posted by DRH: Are you sure you want to use writing ability as a measure of intelligence?

ROFLMAO. Very good. I believe you have brought up a very good point. Of course, you will now be accused of using grammer and spelling errors to distract the argument because you "have no real counter".

The more I read what YOU write, the more impressed I am. You say you lived in GB for a time, now your username shows you in Spain, I'm just curious what your nationality is?

John Stricker

quote Originally posted by fierofetish: To rip apart a Man's personal edicts to his Wife, be he President or Pauper,in this distructive, "superior" and vindictive fashion, only merits the contempt that any Reader, with a balanced outlook on life, irrespective of Political beliefs, would feel.To presumably have stolen such a personal item, and then publicly air it, and then subsequently belittle it from such giddy heights of snobbishness is unforgivable, and vicious.Above all, unnecessary.I disregard its implication entirely. fierofetish

quote Originally posted by fierofetish: To rip apart a Man's personal edicts to his Wife, be he President or Pauper,in this distructive, "superior" and vindictive fashion, only merits the contempt that any Reader, with a balanced outlook on life, irrespective of Political beliefs, would feel.To presumably have stolen such a personal item, and then publicly air it, and then subsequently belittle it from such giddy heights of snobbishness is unforgivable, and vicious.Above all, unnecessary.I disregard its implication entirely. fierofetish

What a refreshing and articulate observation.

Bravo!

I don't want presidents, republican or democrat, doing IQ tests. I don't want them to have to face they silly, stupid attempt to be embarrassed by the media, either, by asking them questions like who is the ambassador of ???, where is such and such city in the U.S., or such and such 3rd world country.

It is just STUPID to do that to them. Hey, look it up on a map. That's what they are for. Or how to pronounce some foreign minister's name. Hey, it's FOREIGN. It's not our language. A republican OR democrat president may mess it up. So what?

I heard some audio of Dean babbling incoherently in front of a microphone in the last 2 weeks. Didn't even bring it up. Why not? Irrelevant. Only bringing it up now to say politicians on both sides mis-speak, but only when a republican does is it "news".