Unless they say something you disagree with apparently.
I have nothing against him personally. He, or anyone in life really can discuss the same topics, I'm saying discuss them in a better manner.
"People have demonstrated against General McNuts that he felt compelled to withdraw from a speaking engagement at the National Prayer Breakfast. Thoughts?"
Is that so f'ucking hard?
I went and looked and he has 2 threads in the trash can that I saw, 1 more on its way and I guarantee there will be no resolution because apparently racism and bigotry and all the rest are perfectly acceptable.
I would hope, should I ever post a thread title of the same nature, that "someone" reads me the riot act in no uncertain terms.
I don't ever see that happening. Too me, you seem to be viewed as completely beyond reproach, not entirerly unlike the owner of this forum. Not saying you asked for it, just that it is.
To look at your presence here, one would think you never made a mistake, a bad desision, broke the law, had a doubt, felt bad about yourself, had a regret, been depressed, lied, cheated, took advantage, wronged someone, lost your temper, etc. etc. etc. or any of the other human things that many of us have & do struggle with.
Or maybe you just never felt it proper to share those "undesirable" personality hiccups.
Either way, the absense of the admission of those common things that we all are faced with about ourselves in our lives could lead one to be looked upon as "beyond reproach". Then again, maybe you really are perfect. And if that's true, the rest of us might as well just walk off a cliff.
[This message has been edited by Boondawg (edited 02-05-2012).]
I have nothing against him personally. He, or anyone in life really can discuss the same topics, I'm saying discuss them in a better manner.
"People have demonstrated against General McNuts that he felt compelled to withdraw from a speaking engagement at the National Prayer Breakfast. Thoughts?"
Is that so f'ucking hard?
I went and looked and he has 2 threads in the trash can that I saw, 1 more on its way and I guarantee there will be no resolution because apparently racism and bigotry and all the rest are perfectly acceptable.
Cool.
Skirting the obscenity filter is a clear violation the rules so that means we should vote you off the island next?
Sorry but every new post you make just shows you are more and more of a hypocrite. But guess what, i wont try and stop you nor claim you cant keep talking, as I'm not one.
As Public Relations Officer, I am obliged to inform you that no such group exsists. There is no secret hand shake, no dues, and even the term "Group" is only used to relate in conversation to those that DO group. And if any such group actually did exsist, it is not something you could join, as it is simply a matter of "you either are, or you aren't". So you have to ask yourself, are you or aren't you? Advice? Pray you are not.
As Public Relations Officer, I am obliged to inform you that no such group exsists. There is no secret hand shake, no dues, and even the term "Group" is only used to relate in conversation to those that DO group. And if any such group actually did exsist, it is not something you could join, as it is simply a matter of "you either are, or you aren't". So you have to ask yourself, are you or aren't you? Advice? Pray you are not.
Today, here and now, make a stand that despite personal feelings on whatever subject, we as a group will not tolerate racist, bigoted or prejudiced remarks from members of the forum.
And Cliff, I ask that this become a policy of the forum. I ask that this go above the rating system. I don't think a "majority rules" system, ie. ratings will achieve the desired result. I really think we should do something to make sure that ANY member be welcome.
OK, are you really Jazzy and somehow got ahold of another username?
Want a forum without a voting system? Go create one. I like PFF as it is, even with people like you spreading hate on it it is 100 times better than the next Fiero forum.
Being bigoted doesn't make it any less benevolent than racism. And many people are intolerant bigots to economic refugees in our country. But they portray themselves "righteous" and some even proclaiming they have the voice and hand of "Jesus Christ", yet they express huge disdain and bigotry to economic refugees, which is basically boiled down to racism.
Yes, but so what? Being racist is not the exact same thing as being bigoted. And... since my mom is Hispanic, I get really tired of people always calling it a race. I'm WHITE... but I have heritage that is hispanic.
quote
Originally posted by Wichita:
If you had a huge number of economic refugees from Canada or Europe that happen to be of the Caucasian mix, there wouldn't be the outcry there is now on these suppose "illegal immigrants breaking the law".... No! They are economic refugees trying to survive and make a better life for their families. But they speak another language and they have darker skin and have a different de facto culture and that is what makes people uncomfortable. It has nothing to do with that they are here illegally working at McDonalds making Happy Meals for your Ritalin induced bratty kids.I It's because they look different than your fat white butt. Where is the Christian heart when it comes to this? Nope! Because most people are racist, bigots and homophobes. The so called kind heart of Jesus Christ takes a back seat... hell, thrown out the window for many so called Christians when it comes to other people who are not like them.
In the 50s and 60s, foreigners were pretty much looked down upon regardless of where they came from. My dad is from Holland, and he was always getting looked down upon because he was from another country. Of course, he assimilated, thinks in English, is a proud American, has an American flag outside his house, etc.
But of course, I'll leave the most obvious example for last... the Irish... they pretty much don't get more white than that, and they were treated horribly when they came to America during the potato famine. They were practically used for slave labor. So, not sure exactly what you mean? And what exactly does Jesus Christ have to do with racism?
quote
Originally posted by twofatguys:
And that's not to say we don't hate other illegal immigrants as well. We hate people that are Canadian and in this country illegally, Egyptian and in this country illegally, etc. etc.
We don't hate the race, or the country, we hate the fact that they are in this country illegally.
Brad
Heh... well, I don't mind the Coptic Egyptians so much. I know Wichita is a HUUUUGE fan of them.
quote
Originally posted by Patrick:
No no no...
I think your political views suck, but I don't find you personally to be vile and offensive.
No, unfortunately the guy is a fellow Canadian. If nothing else, it at least proves that it isn't only Americans who can be full of themselves. (Calm down fellas, I'm just teasing y'all.)
Hahah... I'm trying!
I'm going to Canada later this year for business... should be fun. I don't think it's in a big city or anything like Toronto or anything though.
Originally posted by twofatguys: OK, are you really Jazzy and somehow got ahold of another username?
Want a forum without a voting system? Go create one. I like PFF as it is, even with people like you spreading hate on it it is 100 times better than the next Fiero forum.
Brad
I'm spreading hate?
Do you people even think before you type, or do you just mash your paws on the keyboard and hope something useful comes out?
For 3 pages, I have advocated FOR people-people of color, people of a different orientation and people of a different religious affiliation. Yet, I'm spreading hate.
What has this guy done that you people are so ready to join behind him? I'm all for free speech, but not at the expense of others. Is that wrong? Has this forum been populated by such negativity that using a term like queer trash and muslim scum is not only accepted, but almost celebrated?
Yes, I advocate to over-ride the voting system. I submit that this is so important that it should NOT be left to the choice of the majority, but that someone(in this case Cliff) needs to make the call that this is a forum where such language is inappropriate and unacceptable.
Do you people even think before you type, or do you just mash your paws on the keyboard and hope something useful comes out?
For 3 pages, I have advocated FOR people-people of color, people of a different orientation and people of a different religious affiliation. Yet, I'm spreading hate.
What has this guy done that you people are so ready to join behind him? I'm all for free speech, but not at the expense of others. Is that wrong? Has this forum been populated by such negativity that using a term like queer trash and muslim scum is not only accepted, but almost celebrated?
Yes, I advocate to over-ride the voting system. I submit that this is so important that it should NOT be left to the choice of the majority, but that someone(in this case Cliff) needs to make the call that this is a forum where such language is inappropriate and unacceptable.
People of color? This entire thread has absolutely NOTHING to do with black people. It has to do with illegal immigrants, and apparently athiests who also happen to be homosexual.
Do what you want. I don't care. I don't think I have made any hateful comments in this thread, and you aren't willing to look for any.
In the meantime, I thought I'd go and find some of the wonderful posts by uhlanstan so that everyone who is so willing and able to come to his defense, can have a true taste of whom they stand behind:
quote
Originally posted by uhlanstan: "......Kurdistan ,,another friend in a land of moslem porta potty pig feces write your gongressman ,or gongressbabe,,lets have Kurdistan,,the Turks really need a big piece of thier country turned into KURDLAND,the old red white and green,with yellow sun,The Turks are all devious scum pig feces,,and the eurotrash would be morons to accept this scheming band of throat cutting baby murderers into euroutopia ..only Saddam killed more kurd babies,,but he has weapons of mass destruction.. ,..I imagine the gay,crossdressing leather faction will favor the Turks ,,they like rough anal sex ..The Kurd are tough ,,all the other moslems hate them ,THIS IS THIER REDEEMING QUALITY ,,I KNOW A FEW OF YOU WILL DO THIS, VERY FEW,,LETS try to convert them to christians,and the peshmerga will actually form a goverment that likes America,sunni porta potty muslem or Christians,once the current america hater and his scum usa hating family return to Chicago,and the coruption they really know & love so much,,KURDISTAN FROM TURKEY,IRAQ,IRAN..with an Air Force and some tanks ,,the kurds would send other moslems to the Kmarter bottom of the porta potty where childmolester,Rapist, Big Mo the prophet is swallowing in pig crap.. EDIT -for got the Kurds really digg democrazy,and education and kurdish babes are hot compared to smelly mustached turk porta potty babes ,tho the turks seem to have larger breast ,,Im a suckler so this is important to me(turks only win),as you get into kurd country the women start to improve in looks,,really noticible.."
Originally posted by uhlanstan: "Pole sitters ,panty boys(my fave),crossdressers,Ram cucumber pirates,, child moslesters,gay priest,Glory holers,dress wearing weight lifters,queer midgets, the giant dildo lovers & quilting society and those to deviant for even me to mention march to protest some law passage that does not kiss thier brown vaselined stroke pleasure chute,,While they were all grouped together why was the squad automatic weapon (saw) and 81 mortars not set up and swung into action,, think of the young boys lives that would not be ruined if battery airburst or fuze variable time(VT) was used along with grazzing fire from the saw,,add the democraps wearing the soviet hammer and sick hel that were just in the news,,Dirtbag has won so they can show the true colors now on TV !! and you have a true pity party I can enjoy..
GOD GUNS GUTS AND FIERO,S MADE AMERICA GREAT understand what this says and put the pride and steel back in your limp wristed action ,, you could still wear panties with a little donkey on them you know what they say about donky,s whos to know!!"
Originally posted by twofatguys: OK, are you really Jazzy and somehow got ahold of another username?
Brad
sSince you have made this comment on every page, apparently you need some recognition of your superb sense of humor. It is hysterical, insightful, and relevant. I will learn from this how to properly troll and bait other members. So when someone appears to me to be an ignorant bigot trailer dweller, I will say "Brad, is that you?" Oh, the jocularity!
sSince you have made this comment on every page, apparently you need some recognition of your superb sense of humor. It is hysterical, insightful, and relevant. I will learn from this how to properly troll and bait other members. So when someone appears to me to be an ignorant bigot trailer dweller, I will say "Brad, is that you?" Oh, the jocularity!
LOL!
Yeah, I'm not jazzman. I've never been jazzman, and other than knowing there was a dude on the forum named 'jazzman', I don't know jazzman.
I will also add, that I joined this forum as Gridlock. I have always been Gridlock, and if enough of the bigots get together to ban my username, I will not come back as "Gridlock 2.0" or any other name. So as I said, if what I put is so hateful, go nuts and take me out. You'll only have to do it once.
[This message has been edited by Gridlock (edited 02-05-2012).]
Do what you want. I don't care. I don't think I have made any hateful comments in this thread, and you aren't willing to look for any.
I'm 100% willing . I just asked for a little reimbursement. It would take a little time to quote every post you have made in this thread, since it's all aimed at you hating a member.
Yeah, I'm not jazzman. I've never been jazzman, and other than knowing there was a dude on the forum named 'jazzman', I don't know jazzman.
I will also add, that I joined this forum as Gridlock. I have always been Gridlock, and if enough of the bigots get together to ban my username, I will not come back as "Gridlock 2.0" or any other name. So as I said, if what I put is so hateful, go nuts and take me out. You'll only have to do it once.
"Oh, he's just Stan." "He's allowed, he served." "It's understandable, he had a bad expirence." Pah-leeze. How is any of that a free pass to break the rules. "Oh, that's just Hitler." "He's allowed, he served." "It's understandable, he had a bad expirence."
Others have been booted for much less. What cracks me up is that many of the "rightous" (you know who you are) here would NEVER put up with HALF the abuse he piles on others, if it was you or YOUR "group" he was abusing. You would call him on his bullsh!t INSTANTLY and RUTHLESSLY. But you utter narry a word, when you know damn well he is in the wrong for what he says and calls people RIGHT HERE to your own fellow members. Makes me want to puke.
What do I think of Stan? I grew up with men just like him. They were not bad men. They were just stuck on hate. It made them feel alive and powerfull. It was really all they had.
I did not hate them. I found them sad.
Ask yourself this: Would you allow Stan to talk to your kid, your Mom, your daughter that way? Call them names and directly accuse them of being an "undesirable" to this country based on thier religion, sexual orientation, political choice, or any of the other things HE deems unacceptable? You would allow that, unchallanged?
If it is not right, it's not right. No excuses. Most of the "core" here dispise excuses, of any kind, for anything. But you allow it for Stan? Why is that?
I've stayed out of this precisely because the unwritten rules on the forum are so well known by now that typing them here would be a simply re stating the obvious. I'll just make a few brief comments, and bow out before the usual personal attacks and negative ratings come. And because I don't want to be banned again. I really like most of the people here. Really. 1) any thread about banning someone is a violations of the TOS, right? Except for sometimes. 2) The person being discussed is conspicuously absent from this discussion. 3) Once when I made a joke about a particularly annoying paste, I was temporarily banned. Had I posted anything REMOTELY resembling the title of this thread, I would have vanished forever. Yet Stan gets a pass, again and again, because the cool popular kids like him and even worse, agree with him.
4) I hope to God that Stan never finds out where I live. Wait! What was that noise outside my window?
It has to do with muslims(which the last time I checked, weren't white) and the gay community.
It then expanded in terms of the excuses made for Stan to include illegal immigrants.
Nice try though.
What color is a Muslim? (Caucasoid, Negroid or Mongoloid?)
What color is a Christian? (Caucasoid, Negroid or Mongoloid?)
What color is a Jew? (Caucasoid, Negroid or Mongoloid?)
What color is a Hindu? (Caucasoid, Negroid or Mongoloid?)
My assumption with Stan is that when he references "Moslems", he's lumping all Muslims into Islamic Extremist with loyalties to the Middle Eastern countries and their extremist ideologies. Same with illegal immigrants. Bigotry stems from a bad reference point with people in the past. We all have bigotry and prejudicial views. It's how we manage those views in our lives.
I have no time in the day nor trust in any Muslim with rooted ties to the Middle East. My viewpoint. My prejudice.
My father-in-law is probably rolling in his grave knowing that his grandsons are friends with and have dated Hmong immigrants in my neighborhood. He hated visiting us because of the large population of Hmong in my suburb.
Please, correct me if I'm off-base here, Maryjane.... What goes through your mind if you have to deal with a Hmong immigrant? My bet is at the very least, in your mind your voicing ethnic slurs of hate. You may even voice your opinion out loud. It may only be out loud to your immediate family or closet friends. It's all on how one manages their prejudices.
At least one knows where Stan stands. To me that's a bit better than closeted bigots who are in denial of their prejudices. And like it or not, in many cases Stan's right on or not far off target of reality with many of his statements.
I'm usually in agreement with "The Cool Kids" (as Boonie would say ), but I hate the hate. I don't have Stan rated, but I wouldn't care if he were banned. Posts like this just aren't okay... I've made a worse post than this before though, and it included a larger group of people. That's why I can't really give out a negative over this.
I am kinda surprised at the ferocity of all sides on this subject. I usually don't read his posts because they are so hard to understand. I guess that's why I don't feel that strongly about it.
Every post I have made from page 1-3. Scroll up for page 4.
Find the hate.
1.
quote
Well...here's another member that is getting sick of his **** . I'm not getting used to it, and I don't think he means well.
2.
quote
ONE MORE TIME? Ok.
THIS ISN'T 'AMERICA'!!!! This is a privately owned website, owned and operated by a person that isn't even American with a server located stateside.
Your constitution is meaningless in this case.
OH! So that takes care of one half of this thread. Here's the other half. I would more than love to ignore his bs posts, and do when they are in a thread and he pops up and gives his whatever opinion. I opened this crap specifically because I don't even want to look at the thread title on the screen, let alone his wonderful follow up to the title.
And just to finish off anything else that remains: just because he's a vet, does not make him a god. The only thing that would make this remotely understandable is if he took a bullet to the head during duty, not just because he showed up for duty.
3.
quote
OK, maybe we can't find racism i the first lines, I'm not even sure because his posts aren't in english, but I consider the term "athiest queers" to be bigoted and offensive. Especially considering I know of one gay member of the board.
So despite all the wonderful excuses how "illegals have caused him personal harm, he just hates illegals(which btw, muslims can be legal immigrants) this is america and he's entitled to his opinion and he's a vet", so he just deserves respect on that front, should the primary goal of a forum such as this not be to be inclusive of all members?
He may be entitled to his opinion, but I don't think he should be entitled to share it on all occasions.
4.
quote
It's funny you can't read as I was providing a list of all the excuses that people have used for him in this thread.
You people really are only interested in reading what you want to see.
I wrote that as a questioning statement, as in "should the goal", not "the goal" as in if Cliff wants to post in this thread saying, "no, the goal of this forum is to be exclusive of white middle class folks from Canada" then that is his prerogative. I pack up and you guys can be Canada free. I don't get the sense that he feels that way, so I'm safe for another day. Given that he himself as posted about racist rants, I *think* he's a bit more towards the "let's have an inclusive community" as opposed to "inclusive of all the colors and lifestyles we choose appropriate"
I'm adding that given that there is at least 1 openly gay member, we don't need to talk in abstracts-we can talk about specifics. Do we want a forum where a member should feel less of himself, unwanted, harassed or hated so one racist bigot can feel good about himself that he got to express his opinion?
And yes, I will go so far as to suggest banning as an option. If you can't curtail the racist and bigoted views to the point where you can have a discussion in public, then yeah, maybe banning is the way to go.
4.
quote
LOL. A little tool to keep in your back pocket. A "get out of racist jams free" card.
5.
quote
Awesome. Let me drive that home for you.
Freedom of speech, and the rights to your opinion is not a weapon that you should freely use to beat people with. Just because you CAN do something doesn't mean you HAVE to.
Therefore, I fully believe that he is entitled to his opinion. I truly do. I also believe he is entitled to stick it up his ass and shut up on a public forum. I think that's something that anyone can do. Just because he has an opinion that is offensive to people, rude, crude and really not helpful to many conversations doesn't mean he needs to share it all the time, does it?
6.
quote
Yes, the post is for sure more offensive on the basis of bigotry, not racism. There may be a racist rant in his original post, I just can't understand what he's saying to know if there is or not.
For people that are looking to provide more excuses for Stan, I don't think he means "hey, I f'ing love these guys!" when you combine the word moslem with "athiest queers"
I think the best post in this thread is the one that descibes the double standard of as long as he doesn't offend your personal group, its ok.
In my mind, providing an acceptable outlet for bigotry and hate and general offense to people is as bad as being that yourself, or saying it with your own mouth, or writing.
Read closely, because that's not a knock on Cliff, that's a knock on every bigoted member of this forum(of which there are many) saying, "oh, its just Stan"
I've been a member since 2002. That's 10 years I've been logging into PFF off and on, and for the last 8 I haven't even owned a Fiero. I took a break for a few years, and come back and notice a significantly more negative tone in O.T. Maybe its the fact that a lot of other people have already left? I don't know. I do know that right now, I don't really want to post here, or read excuses for hate like its acceptable.
This isn't a "poor me" statement at all. I guess I'm just putting out there that if this is the level of acceptability for statements such as this, then I guess I'm left to vote with my feet and actions.
7.
quote
I don't get the impression that he just hates the illegal ones. I get the impression that he hates them all.
You people tell me how "queer trash and moslem scum" can be read in any other way than hate inspired?
This "he hates illegals" thing is just another method of creating an excuse. Fail. Try again.
8.
quote
Ok, let's not even get bogged down in the racist side.
There is at least one gay member here that I know of(and probably more if stats hold-I don't know, do we have a lot of republican congressmen on the forum?) that gets to read about how he's a child molester.
"because athiest,child moslesting queers"
I can't even begin to start dissecting his post, and what is right and wrong about it. I don't want to. It's crap.
Fine, I'll leave out the "I get the impression bs" part and make a clear and easy to follow statement: It's hate filled.
And after 3 pages, I'm left with the feeling that this **** is accepted in this membership. Is that true, or false. If its false, then do something about it.
I vote to ban Uhlanstan from the forum.
I ask others that agree to join.
Today, here and now, make a stand that despite personal feelings on whatever subject, we as a group will not tolerate racist, bigoted or prejudiced remarks from members of the forum.
And Cliff, I ask that this become a policy of the forum. I ask that this go above the rating system. I don't think a "majority rules" system, ie. ratings will achieve the desired result. I really think we should do something to make sure that ANY member be welcome.
I have nothing against this member on a personal level. I have no issue with the subject matter being discussed.
CAP LETTERS SO YOU CAN READ IT.
I HAVE EVERYTHING AGAINST THE METHOD AND MANNER IN WHICH HE DISCUSSES THESE THINGS.
It is hate filled and offensive. I don't need to sit here and split the hairs of whether people are dark enough to have color, whether their back ground actually splits them into a race or not. It's bigoted. That's enough for me.
ACEMAN That last post about what one thinks about when dealing with Hmong surprised me a bit coming from you. I am not sure I fully understand what you are trying to say. When you asked Don if he voiced ethnic slurs of hate, what was that about? Why would you assume that he would use hateful slurs about people with his family. I can't say that my actual real life exposure to him was more then a couple of days almost 10 years ago, but he did not strike me as the crass type of person that would speak hatefully of anyone. He has more control then to allow someone else to have that power over him.
I see what you mean about Stan, and how you know where he stands. I, too, enjoy a reputation of being straightforward with my opinions to the point of bluntness. However, I have been able to do that without ever referring to someone as a homosexual or queer, panty sniffer, glory holer, etc. Somehow I would wager that you, along with all of your fellow supporters of Mr. Uhlan, would have a negative rating for me.
So, just those two things are kind of hard for me to wrap my head around, can you help?
[This message has been edited by WhiteDevil88 (edited 02-05-2012).]
Why would I assume that about Don? He was trained to hate and not trust anyone from that area. It's not easy to flush that out of one's system over a lifetime. I listened to my father-in-law and nearly all those my senior that served in Vietnam refer to someone from that area as a Gook or even worse.
As for my rating towards you. It's a Positive rating. Always has been.
As for Stan's colorful postings. I don't see him changing his language for anything or any event.
[This message has been edited by aceman (edited 02-05-2012).]
Every post I have made from page 1-3. Scroll up for page 4.
Find the hate.
1. I have nothing against this member on a personal level. I have no issue with the subject matter being discussed.
CAP LETTERS SO YOU CAN READ IT.
I HAVE EVERYTHING AGAINST THE METHOD AND MANNER IN WHICH HE DISCUSSES THESE THINGS.
It is hate filled and offensive. I don't need to sit here and split the hairs of whether people are dark enough to have color, whether their back ground actually splits them into a race or not. It's bigoted. That's enough for me.
Oops... didn't mean you there Gridlock. I was going to write in that I didn't see any hate on your end at all, but thought that went without saying.
I think you have been extremely patient with your opinion.
That was aimed at twofatguys that said there had been 14 posts of hate from me, compared to one from stan.
I corrected him, and suddenly he didn't post anymore.
Sooner or later, people are going to run out of excuses and bullshit and crap and we're going to discuss, right here in this thread what type of forum its going to be.
There is a whole lot of world outside the deep south of the United States. We going to include it?
. I just asked for a little reimbursement. It would take a little time to quote every post you have made in this thread, since it's all aimed at you hating a member. 
