Jazz is that you??? Oh, and just because he is a vet, he does get my respect, as does Don, and the other people on here that fought for me and my family to be free. Even though I don't agree with them all the time, they each get my deepest respect for the sacrifice they gave for my family.
And for the record, there is no racism in his first post, he even made a comment against racism if you could look past your hate for a second.
Brad
shhhh stop making sense.
EDIT: Hey, page 3 is mine.. all mine
[This message has been edited by Nurb432 (edited 02-04-2012).]
OK, maybe we can't find racism i the first lines, I'm not even sure because his posts aren't in english, but I consider the term "athiest queers" to be bigoted and offensive. Especially considering I know of one gay member of the board.
So despite all the wonderful excuses how "illegals have caused him personal harm, he just hates illegals(which btw, muslims can be legal immigrants) this is america and he's entitled to his opinion and he's a vet", so he just deserves respect on that front, should the primary goal of a forum such as this not be to be inclusive of all members?
He may be entitled to his opinion, but I don't think he should be entitled to share it on all occasions.
[This message has been edited by Gridlock (edited 02-04-2012).]
OK, maybe we can't find racism i the first lines, I'm not even sure because his posts aren't in english, but I consider the term "athiest queers" to be bigoted and offensive. Especially considering I know of one gay member of the board.
So despite all the wonderful excuses how illegals have caused him personal harm, he just hates illegals(which btw, muslims can be legal immigrants) this is america and he's entitled to his opinion and he's a vet, so he just deserves respect on that front, should the primary goal of a forum such as this not be to be inclusive of all members?
He may be entitled to his opinion, but I don't think he should be entitled to share it on all occasions.
Hah... funny that you say "...this is america..." as you post from a computer in Canada, to a website presumeably hosted in the Netherlands.
OK, maybe we can't find racism i the first lines, I'm not even sure because his posts aren't in english, but I consider the term "athiest queers" to be bigoted and offensive. Especially considering I know of one gay member of the board.
So despite all the wonderful excuses how illegals have caused him personal harm, he just hates illegals(which btw, muslims can be legal immigrants) this is america and he's entitled to his opinion and he's a vet, so he just deserves respect on that front, should the primary goal of a forum such as this not be to be inclusive of all members?
He may be entitled to his opinion, but I don't think he should be entitled to share it on all occasions.
I hate illegals too. They are criminals in our country without permission. "invaders" if you like, and they should be shipped out as soon as they are found. That make me a racist?
Wont even get into the hypocrisy of the last line of your statement.
should the primary goal of a forum such as this not be to be inclusive of all members?
He may be entitled to his opinion, but I don't think he should be entitled to share it on all occasions.
Primary goal? That, would be up to the creator of the forum (for the most part anyway) "should the primary goal of a forum such as this not be to be inclusive of all members"?
Think, about the irony of that question, considering that some have called for outright bans on other members..
Some of you know and others do not know that Stan hates illegals and is opinionated for a very good reason. I would be pissed off too if I had the same thing happen to me in my life.
I've got to remember that one, next time I insult a group of people. I just say "hey, I have a very good reason to hate you" and all will be well.
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]: Hah... funny that you say "...this is america..." as you post from a computer in Canada, to a website presumeably hosted in the Netherlands.
It's funny you can't read as I was providing a list of all the excuses that people have used for him in this thread.
Primary goal? That, would be up to the creator of the forum (for the most part anyway) "should the primary goal of a forum such as this not be to be inclusive of all members"?
Think, about the irony of that question, considering that some have called for outright bans on other members..
You people really are only interested in reading what you want to see.
I wrote that as a questioning statement, as in "should the goal", not "the goal" as in if Cliff wants to post in this thread saying, "no, the goal of this forum is to be exclusive of white middle class folks from Canada" then that is his prerogative. I pack up and you guys can be Canada free. I don't get the sense that he feels that way, so I'm safe for another day. Given that he himself as posted about racist rants, I *think* he's a bit more towards the "let's have an inclusive community" as opposed to "inclusive of all the colors and lifestyles we choose appropriate"
I'm adding that given that there is at least 1 openly gay member, we don't need to talk in abstracts-we can talk about specifics. Do we want a forum where a member should feel less of himself, unwanted, harassed or hated so one racist bigot can feel good about himself that he got to express his opinion?
And yes, I will go so far as to suggest banning as an option. If you can't curtail the racist and bigoted views to the point where you can have a discussion in public, then yeah, maybe banning is the way to go.
Wont even get into the hypocrisy of the last line of your statement.
Awesome. Let me drive that home for you.
Freedom of speech, and the rights to your opinion is not a weapon that you should freely use to beat people with. Just because you CAN do something doesn't mean you HAVE to.
Therefore, I fully believe that he is entitled to his opinion. I truly do. I also believe he is entitled to stick it up his ass and shut up on a public forum. I think that's something that anyone can do. Just because he has an opinion that is offensive to people, rude, crude and really not helpful to many conversations doesn't mean he needs to share it all the time, does it?
I have to jump in here and say that I respect Stan. He fought for my/our country. I have to give him that. I'm taken aback by - and disagree with - some of the things that he says, but I also recognize that that's his opinion. He's not tactful, but you know where he stands. Fair enough. I'll take honesty instead of tact any day of the week.
What I find of great interest is that he has an uncanny perception of how this world works. He correctly predicted any number of events that are now old news, but at the time those predictions had people scratching their heads. So yeah. Stan may be off the wall at times, but hes right on the mark at other times. And usually he's funny as hell.
Edit - He writing is a bit difficult to understand, but if you can wrap your mind around the writing style, you'll understand. It's consistent, if nothing else.
[This message has been edited by Raydar (edited 02-04-2012).]
I have to jump in here and say that I respect Stan. He fought for my/our country. I have to give him that. I'm taken aback by - and disagree with - some of the things that he says, but I also recognize that that's his opinion. He's not tactful, but you know where he stands. Fair enough. I'll take honesty instead of tact any day of the week.
What I find of great interest is that he has an uncanny perception of how this world works. He correctly predicted any number of events that are now old news, but at the time those predictions had people scratching their heads. So yeah. Stan may be off the wall at times, but hes right on the mark at other times. And usually he's funny as hell.
Edit - He writing is a bit difficult to understand, but if you can wrap your mind around the writing style, you'll understand. It's consistent, if nothing else.
Agree completely. It is really quite easy to not read a post if you think it will bother you
Agree completely. It is really quite easy to not read a post if you think it will bother you
It's also easy to ignore criticism in response to someone else's posts. If someone making a reply of outrage, disgust, or plain eye-rolling "I cannot believe any human being could possibly be this stupid" bothers you, you also should not read the replies.
It's also easy to ignore criticism in response to someone else's posts. If someone making a reply of outrage, disgust, or plain eye-rolling "I cannot believe any human being could possibly be this stupid" bothers you, you also should not read the replies.
It's also easy to ignore the criticism of someone's criticism, of someone else's criticism in a response. If you don't want to read it, that is.
"Oh, he's just Stan." "He's allowed, he served." "It's understandable, he had a bad expirence." Pah-leeze. How is any of that a free pass to break the rules. "Oh, that's just Hitler." "He's allowed, he served." "It's understandable, he had a bad expirence."
Others have been booted for much less. What cracks me up is that many of the "rightous" (you know who you are) here would NEVER put up with HALF the abuse he piles on others, if it was you or YOUR "group" he was abusing. You would call him on his bullsh!t INSTANTLY and RUTHLESSLY. But you utter narry a word, when you know damn well he is in the wrong for what he says and calls people RIGHT HERE to your own fellow members. Makes me want to puke.
What do I think of Stan? I grew up with men just like him. They were not bad men. They were just stuck on hate. It made them feel alive and powerfull. It was really all they had.
I did not hate them. I found them sad.
Ask yourself this: Would you allow Stan to talk to your kid, your Mom, your daughter that way? Call them names and directly accuse them of being an "undesirable" to this country based on thier religion, sexual orientation, political choice, or any of the other things HE deems unacceptable? You would allow that, unchallanged?
If it is not right, it's not right. No excuses. Most of the "core" here dispise excuses, of any kind, for anything. But you allow it for Stan? Why is that?
"Oh, he's just Stan." "He's allowed, he served." "It's understandable, he had a bad expirence." Pah-leeze. How is any of that a free pass to break the rules. "Oh, that's just Hitler." "He's allowed, he served." "It's understandable, he had a bad expirence."
Others have been booted for much less. What cracks me up is that many of the "rightous" (you know who you are) here would NEVER put up with HALF the abuse he piles on others, if it was you or YOUR "group" he was abusing. You would call him on his bullsh!t INSTANTLY and RUTHLESSLY. But you utter narry a word, when you know damn well he is in the wrong for what he says and calls people RIGHT HERE to your own fellow members. Makes me want to puke.
What do I think of Stan? I grew up with men just like him. They were not bad men. They were just stuck on hate. It made them feel alive and powerfull. It was really all they had.
I did not hate them. I found them sad.
Ask yourself this: Would you allow Stan to talk to your kid, your Mom, your daughter that way? Call them names and directly accuse them of being an "undesirable" to this country based on thier religion, sexual orientation, political choice, or any of the other things HE deems unacceptable? You would allow that, unchallanged?
If it is not right, it's not right. No excuses. Most of the "core" here dispise excuses, of any kind, for anything. But you allow it for Stan? Why is that?
"Oh, he's just Stan." "He's allowed, he served." "It's understandable, he had a bad expirence." Pah-leeze. How is any of that a free pass to break the rules. "Oh, that's just Hitler." "He's allowed, he served." "It's understandable, he had a bad expirence."
Others have been booted for much less. What cracks me up is that many of the "rightous" (you know who you are) here would NEVER put up with HALF the abuse he piles on others, if it was you or YOUR "group" he was abusing. You would call him on his bullsh!t INSTANTLY and RUTHLESSLY. But you utter narry a word, when you know damn well he is in the wrong for what he says and calls people RIGHT HERE to your own fellow members. Makes me want to puke.
What do I think of Stan? I grew up with men just like him. They were not bad men. They were just stuck on hate. It made them feel alive and powerfull. It was really all they had.
I did not hate them. I found them sad.
Ask yourself this: Would you allow Stan to talk to your kid, your Mom, your daughter that way? Call them names and directly accuse them of being an "undesirable" to this country based on thier religion, sexual orientation, political choice, or any of the other things HE deems unacceptable? You would allow that, unchallanged?
If it is not right, it's not right. No excuses. Most of the "core" here dispise excuses, of any kind, for anything. But you allow it for Stan? Why is that?
Haha... well, have you read most of Ray B's posts? He rails about the Hispanics in Florida (of which I was one of), telling them that they need to all go back, etc... etc... but I love the guy. In a having-a-beer-with kind of way, not in an athiest-queer way.
I wouldn't ban RayB either... as a matter of fact, he has a positive from me, not sure why... but I think he's a cool guy. Some of the best bar buddies I've had are people who I share absolutely NOTHING in common with at all. My wife is a Jewish Liberal Democrat, and I'm a Roman Catholic Conservative Republican Hispanic.
Love thy enemy Boondawg... It's what Jesus would have wanted.
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]: Haha... well, have you read most of Ray B's posts? He rails about the Hispanics in Florida (of which I was one of), telling them that they need to all go back, etc... etc...
And the "rightous" here tear him a new one EVERY SINGLE TIME, like it's a hobby. They play symantics with him and ignore even the occassional completely valid questions he sometimes asks. And take great fun in it, to boot.
quote
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]:
Love thy enemy Boondawg... It's what Jesus would have wanted.
And I do more then most others. Remember, I'm usually the guy that speaks up for the "underdog" here. And PAY for it by being unjustly catigorized as something I supposedly support or labeled for something I supposedly am. I have actually been called a DEMOCRAT (the bad word kind)!
I hate less people then probibly anyone here. And I don't hate Stan, or even have him neg'ed. I understand him, I just can't blindly forgive him his deliberate blanket trespasses against others he does not even know.
[This message has been edited by Boondawg (edited 02-04-2012).]
And the "rightous" here tear him a new one EVERY SINGLE TIME, like it's a hobby. They play symantics with him and ignore even the occassional completely valid questions he sometimes asks. And take great fun in it, to boot.
Some do, not all do... most people realize it's a difference of opinion, and participate in the discussion.
quote
Originally posted by Boondawg:
I have actually been called a DEMOCRAT
I am VERY sorry for that, whoever did that, it was VERY uncalled for. No one deserves that kind of treatment, seriously...
I wouldn't even consider banning Stan for simply being Stan.
There have been posts of his that, had they been even marginally coherent, I likely would've considered exceedingly offensive. However, more often than not, he reminds me of a lunatic uncle the family simply tolerates.... "That's just Stan, baby....He can be a couple aces short of a full house sometimes.." In some rare instances, I even find his rantings highly entertaining....particularly his ongoing obsession with drinking women's bathwater and his forays into the joys of panty aromas. If some of his statements were made by more "grounded" members of PFF, I'd most certainly take issue with them.
But this IS Stan we're talkin' about here and some of the rules just don't apply.
You have to give Stan credit for the most eye-popping thread title though.
"Atheist queers" - It's award winning.
It got my attention. I usually don't even click on his posts, but this one I just had to see. Having been called names by him previously, I find its best to ignore him entirely.
It got my attention. I usually don't even click on his posts, but this one I just had to see. Having been called names by him previously, I find its best to ignore him entirely.
I don't believe that he can't communicate without the hate. In my case I would consider what he posts as a lot more valid if he just skipped that part. In no way would I encourage him like it seems some here do. Birds of a feather?
And yes, I will go so far as to suggest banning as an option. If you can't curtail the racist and bigoted views to the point where you can have a discussion in public, then yeah, maybe banning is the way to go.
Why cant bigoted views be discussed in public? I don't see any reason why they cant. Sure it may not go well if hypocrites get involved, but i see no reason it cant be done just because someone has a strong dislike..
Ask yourself this: Would you allow Stan to talk to your kid, your Mom, your daughter that way? Call them names and directly accuse them of being an "undesirable" to this country based on thier religion, sexual orientation, political choice, or any of the other things HE deems unacceptable? You would allow that, unchallanged?
But he isn't doing that, so i think its a unfair comparison. Here you can tune someone out you disagree with, if they are standing on your doorstep it would be a different situation.
Tho myself, id still say he has every right to feel how he does, and express it out on public property. And of course its our right to disagree if we want.
Just because he has an opinion that is offensive to people, rude, crude and really not helpful to many conversations doesn't mean he needs to share it all the time, does it?
Considering its who he is, and not just to incite a riot, id say yes, he can 'express away'. ( just as you can ) If he ( or anyone else ) gets too over the top for me, guess what, i close the window.. No harm done.
But i think the horse is dead around here.. everyone is saying the same stuff over and over.. so its time for me to close that window..
[This message has been edited by Nurb432 (edited 02-04-2012).]
