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The Turbo Super Duty Build. by FastIndyFiero
Started on: 09-27-2004 06:50 PM
Replies: 615 (80548 views)
Last post by: ericjon262 on 07-10-2017 10:57 PM
Kohburn
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Report this Post10-13-2004 07:33 AM Click Here to See the Profile for KohburnSend a Private Message to KohburnEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

if GM had just made SD4's common engines instead of the iron goose then we'd be able to get em at a reasonable price
but they aren't so we find other options

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Oreif
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Report this Post10-13-2004 11:56 AM Click Here to See the Profile for OreifClick Here to visit Oreif's HomePageClick Here to Email OreifSend a Private Message to OreifEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Nice build-up thread. Can't wait to see it running. As for SD4 power, The drag race car built by the Rod Shop hit 550hp normally aspirated using alcohol fuel. Vanderley Engineering use to build SD4's for the race teams and sell engines for street use. They started at 232hp for fuel injected and emission compliant 2.7L version and a 285hp with a 4-bbl carb non-emission compliant 2.7L (it had a larger cam and higher compression). It was around $10k for the 232hp version and $12K for the 285hp version. Not to mention they would build them to suit. You could get the engines in 2.5L, 2.7L. 3.0L, and 3.3L.

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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post10-14-2004 03:14 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Grrrr....still waiting on the rear seal adapter from KRP. As soon as I get it the short block is going together, and is getting a nice coat of Aluminum POR block enamel.

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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post11-01-2004 07:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

FINALLY got KRP to start making me a rear seal adapter. $175, but should be done in a couple days. Meanwhile, I've been trying to do some research on the engine managment aspect of my build, investigating options for wideband oxygen sensor/controllers, and ignition control. I would LOVE to have an MSD Digital 7 ignition, but they're a little pricey. I have also started on a prototype (ghetto, IOW) 90* adapter for the manifold to the throttle body. Goes from the squarebore manifold, 90* to the drivers side, with pressure and temp fittings in the middle. I'm going to try to find a nice LS1 TB somewhere, might go junkyard surfing.

So far I have alot of pics of parts and what not, but it would be nice to get something put together soon. In any case, one step closer...

Nate

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carbon
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Report this Post11-07-2004 10:36 AM Click Here to See the Profile for carbonSend a Private Message to carbonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

What kind of torque can be expected from one of these? I am just curious... I have absolutely no idea about the SD4's capabilities.

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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post11-08-2004 01:52 AM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by carbon:

What kind of torque can be expected from one of these? I am just curious... I have absolutely no idea about the SD4's capabilities.

The strokers can be VERY torquey motors (NA in the 200-300 range). I hope to hit 400 ft lbs, not sure if that will happen.

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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post11-11-2004 11:59 AM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Small update. Add another gadget to the list. I'll be getting a DIY wideband O2 unit to make tuning this sucker easier. Should work very well, as the MegaSquirt injection unit has provisions for wideband. Still waiting on the rear seal adapter, though.

I'm about to go crazy waiting on that thing, I don't understand the big delay.

Nate

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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post11-16-2004 06:49 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Wooohooo!

Rear seal adapter came. Made me feel kinda bad, I had just called the company up and whined about it, about 5 minutes before UPS came. I'll take it in to the shop tomorrow, and have the short block assembled.

Nate

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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post11-16-2004 07:28 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Here's the rear seal adapter sitting on a random page of my engineering graphics textbook :


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Kento
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Report this Post11-16-2004 09:54 PM Click Here to See the Profile for KentoClick Here to Email KentoSend a Private Message to KentoEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by FastIndyFiero:

Here's the rear seal adapter sitting on a random page of my engineering graphics textbook :

YEAH RIGHT!!! Random page!!! Im not buying that one DUDE!

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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post11-17-2004 07:01 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

I finally managed to snap a couple final pics before assembly:
Crankshaft, after journal polish:

Straight cut timing gear:

Torrington roller cam bearing:

Block, after honing:

No more pictures of the unassembled short block, I promise.

Edit: to fix the pics cause I'm a tard

[This message has been edited by FastIndyFiero (edited 11-18-2004).]

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bryson
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Report this Post11-17-2004 09:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for brysonSend a Private Message to brysonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

That crank is beautiful....

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Toddster
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Report this Post11-18-2004 02:49 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ToddsterClick Here to Email ToddsterSend a Private Message to ToddsterEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by FastIndyFiero:

Rods?


Erm, no thanks, I'll take my chances with some SBC rods.

.

HEY! I recognize that rod. I got it hang on my wall.

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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post11-18-2004 03:05 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Toddster:


HEY! I recognize that rod. I got it hang on my wall.

Hehe, I use mine as a paperweight. At least it's still intact.

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Toddster
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Report this Post11-18-2004 03:11 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ToddsterClick Here to Email ToddsterSend a Private Message to ToddsterEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by FastIndyFiero:


Hehe, I use mine as a paperweight. At least it's still intact.

But far less conversational.

I love what you're doing. I have similar plans but I don't have the block yet.

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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post11-19-2004 10:52 AM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Thanks Toddster (and Orief) for your compliments. In one more month I'll be a year into this project. Time flies, especially now that I'm taking the equivalence of about 21 hours at WSU. Doesn't leave alot of time for work, which, consequently, doesn't leave alot of money left in the bank. I guess this is the time to thank Dad for footing most of the bill for now.

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Report this Post11-19-2004 10:59 AM Click Here to See the Profile for RWDPLZClick Here to visit RWDPLZ's HomePageSend a Private Message to RWDPLZEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Good to see this thread active again, and the project continuing to move forward! What page is that in the textbook, I still have an old Engineering Graphics textbook upstairs...

------------------

1984 Fiero SE

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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post11-19-2004 11:13 AM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by RWDPLZ:

Good to see this thread active again, and the project continuing to move forward! What page is that in the textbook, I still have an old Engineering Graphics textbook upstairs...

Page 354, I think? The other people in my class didn't understand my excitement on that page.

Here's still my biggest problem with this swap:

The SBC bolt pattern on the end. My plan so far is to retain the pattern on the crank, and machine a bellhousing spacer to sit in between the engine and the trans. Then of course a custom aluminum flywheel.

Now I play the waiting game again, though.

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Fastback 86
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Report this Post11-19-2004 03:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Fastback 86Send a Private Message to Fastback 86Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Its actually going to get assembled now? I don't believe it.

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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post11-19-2004 04:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Fastback 86:

Its actually going to get assembled now? I don't believe it.

Well, it might take longer still if I don't get the right flywheel.

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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post11-26-2004 06:56 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Recipe for one bullet proof bottom end:

One (1) Super Duty block:

Four (4) forged, heat-treated, shot-peened, 4340 steel, KRP rods with 7/16" ARP bolts:

Four (4) forged aluminum, lightweight Diamond Racing pistons:

One (1) billet steel SCAT crankshaft:

Mix at 9000RPM, add boost. Repeat.

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bryson
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Report this Post11-26-2004 07:29 PM Click Here to See the Profile for brysonSend a Private Message to brysonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

You may have mentioned this earlier -- but what kind of compression are you planning on having with those pistons? It looks great!
--Bryson

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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post11-26-2004 07:51 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by bryson:

You may have mentioned this earlier -- but what kind of compression are you planning on having with those pistons? It looks great!
--Bryson

Thanks! When will you start on Quad #2? I'm sure I will be following that as closely as the original.

I'll be sitting at right around 8.35:1 CR. Couldn't have come out better. Another bonus is that the pistons top out at .070" under the deck surface, so I won't have to have them recessed for valve clearance. I will have to figure out a way to mount the oil pump pickup, as the bottom end was previously set up for a dry sump system, so it doesn't have a stud on the main cap where the oil pump pickup bolts on.

All in all, though, I'm very happy with the way it looks. Clearances all checked out (well they better!), not too tight and not too loose, no runout on the gears. I'll be coating the block soon with Aluminum POR engine enamel. Should improve the looks alot. After all, what good is HP if it doesn't look pretty?

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Report this Post11-26-2004 09:21 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TaurusThugClick Here to Email TaurusThugSend a Private Message to TaurusThugEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

:kicks and screams: i wanna see it boost... :ends kicking and screaming:

that looks like a nice motor... when is the head going on???

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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post11-27-2004 01:15 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by TaurusThug:

:kicks and screams: i wanna see it boost... :ends kicking and screaming:

that looks like a nice motor... when is the head going on???

The head will go on when the valve train is finished. I still need to pick up some 1.5:1 rockers, valve springs, and pushrods.

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shop_rat45
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Report this Post11-27-2004 04:21 PM Click Here to See the Profile for shop_rat45Click Here to Email shop_rat45Send a Private Message to shop_rat45Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by cancerkazoo:

Page 2:

This images is larger than 100K. Click to view.

And pages 3 & 4:

This images is larger than 100K. Click to view.

Steve

Is it me, or does this head look a lot like the head on an ecotec?

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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post11-28-2004 02:46 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

That would be interesting shop_rat, an Ecotec head on a SD. (Sorry I wasn't paying attention in chat last night, lol)

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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post11-29-2004 05:01 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Well, I recieved my Tech Edge WB02 2A0 kit today. Should help with the tuning alot. After doing the MegaSquirt, it looks like I can whip this thing together in no time. 'Course the MegaSquirt doesn't work, but now I have some experience. I'll toss up some pics of the kit when I can.

later
Nate

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Report this Post11-29-2004 05:56 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Fastback 86Send a Private Message to Fastback 86Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Better get that flywheel first, or you ain't boostin' nowhere Indy!

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yosemitefieros
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Report this Post11-29-2004 06:13 PM Click Here to See the Profile for yosemitefierosSend a Private Message to yosemitefierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

"I will hit at least 400hp, and then some."

You will. The motors start out at 400hp-450hp, and then break in to nearly 500hp.

All I can say for you is to make sure your brakes and suspension are up to the task or you will be a quite challenged driver of such a ride. To put it mildly, you will be in a Fiero shaped Viper... without the big disks.

Keep up the good work, Gary.

(1988 SD Fiero under construction)

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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post11-29-2004 07:16 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by yosemitefieros:

"I will hit at least 400hp, and then some."

You will. The motors start out at 400hp-450hp, and then break in to nearly 500hp.

All I can say for you is to make sure your brakes and suspension are up to the task or you will be a quite challenged driver of such a ride. To put it mildly, you will be in a Fiero shaped Viper... without the big disks.

Keep up the good work, Gary.

(1988 SD Fiero under construction)

Thank you, how is your project going? I would love to see you restart your build thread.

I wasn't able to spend huge $$$ on the brakes or suspension. I just don't have the cash right now. I did install a vented front brake kit, for what it's worth. I plan on doing coilovers sometime, as well. Right now I'm concentrating on how to get this thing mounted, and actually keep it in the engine bay. I think I may try to fit in an extra dogbone on the top of the engine, but who knows, with all the plumbing that is yet to be done.

Nate

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Report this Post11-29-2004 09:49 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Key Of DavidClick Here to Email Key Of DavidSend a Private Message to Key Of DavidEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by yosemitefieros:

"I will hit at least 400hp, and then some."

You will. The motors start out at 400hp-450hp, and then break in to nearly 500hp.

All I can say for you is to make sure your brakes and suspension are up to the task or you will be a quite challenged driver of such a ride. To put it mildly, you will be in a Fiero shaped Viper... without the big disks.

Keep up the good work, Gary.

(1988 SD Fiero under construction)

Oh I like the sound of that!

Wasn't it California Kid who got his signed by Carroll Shelby calling it the "Cobra of the 90s"?

Now if I can just find a SD for cheap.

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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post12-02-2004 01:32 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Here's a couple pics of the next toy:

TechEdge wideband 2A0 unit. I still need to purchase the LSU sensor. It doesn't look very hard to assemble, hopefully I can get that done sometime next week.

Nate

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yosemitefieros
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Report this Post12-02-2004 06:07 PM Click Here to See the Profile for yosemitefierosSend a Private Message to yosemitefierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by FastIndyFiero:


Thank you, how is your project going? I would love to see you restart your build thread.

I wasn't able to spend huge $$$ on the brakes or suspension. I just don't have the cash right now. I did install a vented front brake kit, for what it's worth. I plan on doing coilovers sometime, as well. Right now I'm concentrating on how to get this thing mounted, and actually keep it in the engine bay. I think I may try to fit in an extra dogbone on the top of the engine, but who knows, with all the plumbing that is yet to be done.

Nate

Well, I got sidetracked on another project. My daughter got married (and I got broke!) then I completely rebuilt and restored a 1960 Ford F350 2 ton flat bed truck for my new son in law. When you get old like me, you get pretty relaxed or you have a coronary. I just finished and shipped out the truck last week... 390 ci big block, C6 tranny, dana 77 posi rear end with duallies... 2 tone Dodge Viper Blue and GM brilliant white, DuPont professional clear coat... 4 coats.

Now I am FINALLY back to cleaning out the truck mess and getting back on my 1988 SD4 Fiero with the opening side vents. I have lots of digital photos, but my camera died now and I need to get another one before I can take any more.

I have been enjoying your thread though... kinda gets my gumption up for the continuing construction. Thanks! BTW, you will need to seriously plan to improve your brakes for your SD4. It will be 'hecka' fast and you must live to build again someday. That is why I started an SD4 build with an '88.

Gary

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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post12-05-2004 04:22 AM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Well, between studying for finals and working on the car, I've somehow managed to keep myself busy this week. I'm just finishing up the wideband sensor cable. The controller end of the cable turned out to be quite a ____ . After I get done with the cables, which shouldn't take long, I can get started on the main unit.

More later
Nate

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Report this Post12-05-2004 11:20 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ToddsterClick Here to Email ToddsterSend a Private Message to ToddsterEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

Did the Super Duty only come in a 2-bolt main version? I'm sure it specs out as pretty durable but I would have guessed a 4-bolt version would have been built.

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FastIndyFiero
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Report this Post12-05-2004 01:37 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FastIndyFieroClick Here to visit FastIndyFiero's HomePageClick Here to Email FastIndyFieroSend a Private Message to FastIndyFieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

 
quote
Originally posted by Toddster:

Did the Super Duty only come in a 2-bolt main version? I'm sure it specs out as pretty durable but I would have guessed a 4-bolt version would have been built.

Nope, no 4-bolt versions were made. In fact, even KRP uses the two-bolt in all of their engines, and there are several KRP engines out there revving to 12,000 RPM consistently. They said they have never had a report of a main failure, or a SCAT crankshaft failure that wasn't due to oil pump failure. Another thing is that the crankshaft doesn't stress the mains as much with excessive flex. The mains are obviously very much improved over the stock engine, no comparison, really. They're also held on with some big 1/2" hardware.

Nate

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84Fiero2M4
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Report this Post12-17-2004 03:34 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 84Fiero2M4Click Here to Email 84Fiero2M4Send a Private Message to 84Fiero2M4Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

any updates on the build?

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FastIndyFiero
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Lately I've been working on assembling the WBO2 unit. I should have that done in a couple days, and I'm finally out of school, so things may start going at a faster rate. My '93 Grand Am daily driver has been keeping me busy enough to not get any real engineering done on the mounts or tranny spacer. Not having a heated shop kinda sucks. I did pop my calipers off to paint them. Word of warning, NEVER buy spray-on VHT caliper paint. I'm going to be spending part of tomorrow sandblasting a caliper.

That being said, I'm not moving forward as fast as I would like to. That and the band saw decided to try to kill me by falling on me, but it's all good. Anyway, I'm going to mock up one of my spare boat anchors on the cradle with the tranny, to see how far I can move the engine over, taking into consideration I'll be using a harmonic balancer as well. After that, then it's getting the plate made, and after that, the motor mounts.

Anyone have tips on fabricating a wiring harness?
Nate

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WBO2 is done. Just need to power it up, make sure everything is ok, and download the firmware. Hmm...Guess that old junk computer is useful as SOMETHING.

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