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3800sc Swap Complete Parts List by AustinH
Started on: 03-24-2017 12:01 PM
Replies: 43 (8134 views)
Last post by: AustinH on 03-28-2020 07:41 PM
AustinH
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From: Waterloo, Iowa; Fort Wayne, Indiana; West Lafayette, Indiana
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Report this Post03-24-2017 12:01 PM Click Here to See the Profile for AustinHClick Here to Email AustinHSend a Private Message to AustinHEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Update: The below build worked great (except for random wiring issues) and took me less than 1 month to do. I managed a 13.5 second quarter mile with a 1.9 second 60' time with street tires. I drove this build for nearly two years and MAN IT WAS FUN!!!! It was an extremely easy direct-swap effort, and I would do it to EVERY Fiero in a heartbeat. The total cost for hard parts was around $1700; I bought a car with the engine+transmission+axles in it for $600 and sold the old 2.8. I did use a bonneville torque converter which made me idle around 20mph, so get a different one (listed in build 2). I believe this build generated 280-300 crank horsepower based on air consumption. It is common to put a 3.4" pulley, 180* thermostat+radiator fan temp points changed, and two range colder spark plugs on these stock engines to get an extra 30-60 horsepower out. I have now started a second engine build after buying another lower mile block, primarily because my wiring harness and engine bay are a rat's nest. I decided to rebuild the engine less the short block and shoot for 400 wheel horsepower. You can track my build progress and my other how-to videos (vertical doors, slim headlights, steering wheel, etc) here - https://www.youtube.com/use...4?sub_confirmation=1

I just finished a 3800sc series II swap with a 4t65e-HD automatic into a 1988 fiero GT on a budget. I kept a list of parts I used to do the swap. This list is complete, but keep in mind there are many alternatives to doing this swap.

Here's the parts list of stuff you'll need for the 3800sc swap with a GTP engine. The numbers in ( ) are the quantity. I mostly found the best priced stuff out there. Almost everything can be found at Summit and Autozone.

Heater Hose (for 87-88 fieros, may work for other applications but will need longer hoses) (goes with 5/8" barb, youll have to mount a retaining bracket):
Dayco C87641 - 3/4" 3800sc heater hose elbow (actually 7/8 but can squeeze on) to 5/8" stock fiero heater hose line

Aluminum Heater Hose Elbow:
Dorman 47065HP

5/8-5/8" barb for new dayco heater hose to stock heater hose:
http://www.homedepot.com/p/...903-122501/202254895

T-stat housing to L-side coolant tube (cut a few inches):
Dayco E71082 - 1.25" to 1.25" 3800sc t-stat housing to fiero

Water-pump to R-side coolant tube (cut a few inches):
Dayco E71030 - 1.25" fiero to 1.5" 3800sc water pump hose

Radiator filler neck:
Moroso 63745 1.25"-1.25" hose

Radiator cap:
Stant Products 10203

Trans cooler line barb fitting (2): (replaced in 2nd build below with different parts)
Derale 98104 - 1/4" NPT to 3/8" hose barb trans line

Trans cooler fitting adapter (2): (replaced in 2nd build below with different parts)
Dorman 800-754 - 1/4" NPT to 5/8-18 inverted flare fiero fitting

fittings push lock gas line fittings and hoses: (replaced in 2nd build below with different parts)
Fragola 200106-BL (4) -6 AN push lock fuel hose adapters
Fragola 871006 (10ft) push lock fuel hose

fittings for gas lines:
Vibrant 10229 -6 AN to 14 x 1.5 fiero fuel line return
Vibrant 16619 -6 AN to 16 x 1.5 fiero fuel line
Vibrant 16885 -6 AN to 5/16 fuel rail return 3800sc (replaced in 2nd build below with different parts)
Vibrant 16886 -6 AN to 3/8 fuel rail 3800sc (replaced in 2nd build below with different parts)

Thread sealant for gas line fittings to Fiero:
Permatex Form-A-Gasket No. 2 (Autozone)

air duct flex 4" dia, 41inch long:
Spectre 9751

air filter:
K&N RF-1040

Transmission filter:
Fram FT1129A (replaced in 2nd build below with different parts)

Oil filter:
WIX 51040XP (replaced in 2nd build below with different parts))

Fuel filter:
WIX 33481 (replaced in 2nd build below with different parts)

AC/DRYER:
Four Seasons 33181 (optional)

Muffler 3" right in, 2 2.5" right + left out: - you will have to weld a bend in your own exhaust.
Flowtech 50363FLT (replaced in 2nd build below with different parts)

3-pin Oil pressure sender connector:
STANDARD MOTOR PRODUCTS HP4480

3-pin Oil pressure sender:
AIRTEX/WELLS 1S6635

Accessory Belt Tensioner Pulley:
DAYCO 305217

Supercharger Tensioner Pulley (comes on a 3800sc usually unless coil pack bracket is missing):
GATES 38365

1" frost plug for plugging water pump hole:
Dorman 570-005

Accessory Belt:
Gates K060815 81.5", 6 ribs)

Supercharger belt: (replaced in 2nd build below with different parts)
3.7" pulley - Duralast 665k6 (66.5", 6 ribs)
3.4" pulley - Duralast 660k6 (66", 6 ribs)

Supercharger oil (2 bottles):
GM 12345982 (replaced in 2nd build below with different parts)

Fuel pump:
HFP-343 255lpm fiero (quieter, cheaper, higher quality than walbro 255)

Spark Plugs:
Autolite 104 spark plugs, gap to .050 or .055 (6) - two ranges colder than stock plugs (Autolite 606) (replaced in 2nd build below with different parts)

Supercharger Pulley:
Smoothflow 3.4" supercharger pulley: (optional, also see supercharger belts) (replaced in 2nd build below with different parts)
http://www.smoothflowpulleys.com/3800_MPS.html

Thermostat:
180 deg thermostat (drill small hole in):
Duralast 15848

Transmission Fluid:
7.4 quarts (maint.) to 10 quarts (flush) Dexron III trans fluid (replaced in 2nd build below with different parts)

Oil:
4.5 quarts 5W30 oil (replaced in 2nd build below with different parts)

Fierorog brackets:
engine mount
auto trans mount
alternator bracket
dogbone bracket
Find them here http://www.fiero.nl/cgi-bin...orum=4&thread=068855

West Coast Fiero shifter bracket:
http://westcoastfiero.com/p...ion-shifter-adapterx

new driver's side axle:
stock fiero automatic driver's side axle

new passenger's side axle:
Drivers & Passenger GTP axle + any manual fiero axle - see youtube how-to video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D_VKktIEaTE

The parts list is much longer if you don't have a GTP engine e.g. 2000+ bonneville/park avenue:
GTP/Regal Steel Oil Pan
GTP Oil Pan Gasket (needs cutting to fit over oil pickup)
Oil Filter Housing Gasket
GTP/Regal oil filter bracket GM 12569219 ; 24508441
GTP/Regal angled coil pack bracket GM 24507211 ; 24504360 (cut dogbone)
GTP Tensioner pulley on coil pack bracket
3-pin Temperature sender & wire - duralast TU178DG

If you are making your own harness:
In-line fuse holders (2) (replaced in 2nd build below with different parts)
computer
fuel pump relay (can use stock) (replaced in 2nd build below with different parts)


-------------------------------------------------------
Not 3800sc swap related parts below -
bigger tires General Altimax RT43: (optional)
225/60R15 rear (on stock 15x7" rims)
215/60R15 front (on stock 15x7" rims - 1988 fronts came with 15x6.5s)

Rear Brake lines:
Autozone M10 to M10 Copper-Nickel line 60" (1) rear
Autozone M10 to M10 Copper-Nickel line 12" (1) rear
Autozone M12 to M12 Steel Line 36" (1) rear
Autozone M12 to M12 Steel Line 60" (1) rear
Autozone M12 to M14 steel line 12" (2) rear
Autozone M12 to M12 coupler (2) rear
Dot3 brake fluid

stock tire size is -
215/60R15 rear
205/60R15 front

I also have 1988 specific parts #'s:
shocks - KYB KG4513 (optional)
struts - MONROE 71814 (optional)
brake pads (optional)
brake calipers (optional)
headlights # H6054 (optional)

Misc body parts: (optional)
Side scoops - http://fierofiberglass.com/...ages/SideScoops.html
5" raised wing stands - Fierowarehouse (message doug on Ebay) http://stores.ebay.com/Fiero-Warehouse

Other misc part number website (not best prices)
http://www.gmtuners.com/fiero/parts.htm


------------------
Austin H.
1988 GT 3800SC Series II 3.4" Pulley
Fiero How-To Videos at https://www.youtube.com/use...4?sub_confirmation=1
Facebook page at https://www.facebook.com/FieroAustinH/
Build thread - http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/139530.html
Build pictures - https://drive.google.com/dr...OM2I3THM?usp=sharing

[This message has been edited by AustinH (edited 03-17-2020).]

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fieroall
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Report this Post03-24-2017 12:46 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fieroallSend a Private Message to fieroallEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
That's a great list of parts however I think it's a bit misleading. Their are many different ways to do the 3800 swap depending on your abilities and finances. Honestly looking over your list I don''t think I used a single part from it to do any of my swaps.
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AustinH
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Report this Post03-24-2017 12:49 PM Click Here to See the Profile for AustinHClick Here to Email AustinHSend a Private Message to AustinHEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by fieroall:

That's a great list of parts however I think it's a bit misleading. Their are many different ways to do the 3800 swap depending on your abilities and finances. Honestly looking over your list I don''t think I used a single part from it to do any of my swaps.


Thanks for the reply. You are right, there's a lot of other parts out there. But if someone wants to get started, I just finished my swap, and these parts could be used as a quick reference.

------------------
Austin H.
1988 GT 3800SC Series II 3.4" Pulley
Fiero How-To Videos at https://www.youtube.com/use...4?sub_confirmation=1
Facebook page at https://www.facebook.com/FieroAustinH/
Build thread - http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/139530.html
Build pictures - https://drive.google.com/dr...OM2I3THM?usp=sharing

[This message has been edited by AustinH (edited 08-10-2018).]

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BMTFIERO
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Report this Post03-25-2017 10:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BMTFIEROClick Here to Email BMTFIEROSend a Private Message to BMTFIEROEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Thanks for your time and contribution to the cause!!
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Report this Post03-26-2017 01:04 AM Click Here to See the Profile for SpadesluckSend a Private Message to SpadesluckEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Everyone's build will vary for sure depending on wants and needs, however for you to go through the trouble and list what worked for you is greatly appreciated. Thank you. It will, at the very least, give people an idea on what to expect and look for.

[This message has been edited by Spadesluck (edited 03-26-2017).]

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AustinH
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Report this Post11-08-2017 07:15 PM Click Here to See the Profile for AustinHClick Here to Email AustinHSend a Private Message to AustinHEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
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[This message has been edited by AustinH (edited 04-30-2018).]

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Report this Post11-12-2017 05:05 PM Click Here to See the Profile for bulldog85043Click Here to Email bulldog85043Send a Private Message to bulldog85043Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I have my engine (3800 SC) out of a 2002 Grand Prix 40th Ann. so I'll be watching VERY close for those vids...

[This message has been edited by bulldog85043 (edited 11-12-2017).]

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AustinH
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Report this Post11-20-2017 01:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for AustinHClick Here to Email AustinHSend a Private Message to AustinHEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by bulldog85043:

I have my engine (3800 SC) out of a 2002 Grand Prix 40th Ann. so I'll be watching VERY close for those vids...




Well I am tearing down my 2nd 3800sc engine for a rebuild now and doing a how-to about it.

I decided to launch a Facebook page, as Facebook seems to have replaced some Forums as a modern source of information in many ways. You can find it here:

https://www.facebook.com/pg/FieroAustinH/



------------------
Austin H.
1988 GT 3800SC Series II 3.4" Pulley
Fiero How-To Videos at https://www.youtube.com/use...4?sub_confirmation=1
Facebook page at https://www.facebook.com/FieroAustinH/
Build thread - http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/139530.html
Build pictures - https://drive.google.com/dr...OM2I3THM?usp=sharing

[This message has been edited by AustinH (edited 08-10-2018).]

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Report this Post11-20-2017 01:53 PM Click Here to See the Profile for VanGTP5000Click Here to Email VanGTP5000Send a Private Message to VanGTP5000Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by AustinH:
Well I am tearing down my 2nd 3800sc engine for a rebuild now and doing a how-to about it.

I decided to launch a Facebook page, as Facebook seems to have replaced some Forums as a modern source of information in many ways. You can find it here:

https://www.facebook.com/pg/FieroAustinH/




Great job on the video Austin...I enjoyed watching it. I am sure it will be very helpful to many!!!

-Van
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AustinH
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Report this Post12-24-2017 12:03 PM Click Here to See the Profile for AustinHClick Here to Email AustinHSend a Private Message to AustinHEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I never included these earlier. Here are pictures of diagrams for my first swap. Just to centralize information.

Coolant lines, fuel lines, and transmission line fitting diagram:


Axle building diagram (these parts are NOT the only ones that will work. Do your interchange parts research.):


Fuel pump hotwire (courtesy of GMTuners / Darth Fiero / Sinister Performance:


Custom fuel rail design (Not included in above parts list. Part #s on diagram):


Harness wiring diagram (For a GTP harness that works manual Fiero trans. For automatic harnesses, you will need to ground the VSS LOW Fiero input pin and add the buffer circuit shown here between the GTP computer and the fiero pin: http://www.gmtuners.com/fiero/fmods.htm ):


------------------
Austin H.
1988 GT 3800SC Series II 3.4" Pulley
Fiero How-To Videos at https://www.youtube.com/use...4?sub_confirmation=1
Facebook page at https://www.facebook.com/FieroAustinH/
Build thread - http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/139530.html
Build pictures - https://drive.google.com/dr...OM2I3THM?usp=sharing

[This message has been edited by AustinH (edited 02-18-2020).]

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Report this Post12-25-2017 10:07 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Curtisk1060Click Here to Email Curtisk1060Send a Private Message to Curtisk1060Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I have not heard of most people re-designing the existing fuel pump circuit. I believe most have utilized the original circuit, especially the oil pressure switch and just upgraded the fuel pump fuse to a 15 amp. Some have replaced the original relay with a newer model, but the wiring has remained the same.. curtis
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AustinH
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Report this Post12-25-2017 10:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for AustinHClick Here to Email AustinHSend a Private Message to AustinHEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Curtisk1060:

I have not heard of most people re-designing the existing fuel pump circuit. I believe most have utilized the original circuit, especially the oil pressure switch and just upgraded the fuel pump fuse to a 15 amp. Some have replaced the original relay with a newer model, but the wiring has remained the same.. curtis


I actually did leave mine the same initially. After having some troubles I rewired it as in the diagram. Nothing really improved that I could tell. It is a more direct path which should lower resistance and decrease voltage drop across the whole circuit but probably doesn't matter if you don't have a huge pump. However it is a LOT simpler than the diagram leads you to believe.

------------------
Austin H.
1988 GT 3800SC Series II 3.4" Pulley
Fiero How-To Videos at https://www.youtube.com/use...4?sub_confirmation=1
Facebook page at https://www.facebook.com/FieroAustinH/
Build thread - http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/139530.html
Build pictures - https://drive.google.com/dr...OM2I3THM?usp=sharing

[This message has been edited by AustinH (edited 08-10-2018).]

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AustinH
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[This message has been edited by AustinH (edited 04-30-2018).]

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AustinH
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Report this Post03-01-2018 12:24 PM Click Here to See the Profile for AustinHClick Here to Email AustinHSend a Private Message to AustinHEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
So here is my build 2 parts list so far for my 400whp goal 3800sc. I am using a Series 2 motor but I am putting a Series 3 / Gen V supercharger on.I have purchased most of these items. This build I am porting heads and putting a new cam in. I am not taking the bottom apart (crankshaft, rods, pistons). All of these can be purchased from SUMMIT, RockAuto, eBay, INTENSE Racing, or ZZP Performance.

I AM REUSING THE PARTS FROM THE FIRST LIST THAT ARE NOT LISTED HERE, SO SEE ABOVE LIST IN ADDITION. SOME PARTS ON THIS LIST WILL REPLACE PARTS ON THE FIRST LIST; THEY WILL BE MARKED BY "REPLACES"

Air/Intake/Throttle/Supercharger:
Series III/GENV Supercharger - upgrading from Series II / Gen 3
Series III/GENV Intake Manifold - ACDELCO 12603871 - upgrading from Series II / Gen 3
Series III/GENV Supercharger Alumimum Lower Intake Manifold Gasket Set - FEL-PRO MS96847 - upgrading from Series II / Gen 3
Year 2000+ Cadillac Northstar Throttle Body from junkyard
JBweld and 3 dimes for sealing throttle body coolant holes and EGR delete
LQ4 MAF
Throttle Body Adapter Plate - ZZP ZZ-NSAP (available on eBay for cheaper. They sell a whole kit including MAF and TB too)
Permatex Ultra Black RTV Gasket Maker - 82180
Intake Manifold Gasket Set - ACDelco 89017825
Valve cover seals - MAHLE VS50332
Supercharger Oil - GM 12345982 - DUPLICATES OIL IN ABOVE POST
Re-using GENIII SC bolts, but in addition, one M8x1.25x120mm and one M8x1.25x140mm bolts are needed. Can get from Menards.
2.8" Supercharger Pulley (modular pulley system also needed) - SmoothFlow Pulleys - enter custom size - REPLACES PULLEY IN ABOVE POST
One 1/2" freeze plug+JB Weld for EVAP system delete
3/4" to 3/4" nipple ball valve shutoff (for shutting off coolant into the heater circuit in the summer)
Throttle Body Adapter Cables for Northstar TB to LQ4 MAF - ZZP ZZ-MAFADP-SIII-LQ4
ZZP 1" Phenolic Spacer for gen 5 supercharger - ZZ-M90HNSPC-G5-1 - OPTIONAL, NOT COMPATIBLE WITH INTERCOOLER (They sell 1/4" spacers you could stack with an intercooler).
Cable stop end for throttle/cruise cable - Dorman 03336

Exhaust:
2x 90 degree stainless exhaust bends - SUM-622118 - REPLACES EXHAUST PARTS IN ABOVE POST
Muffler VPE-10632 - REPLACES MUFFLER IN ABOVE POST. REQUIRES CUTTING OUT BOTTOM SECTION OF TRUNK TO FIT!
Stainless Chinese exhaust headers on eBay - search "GTP Exhaust" - REQUIRES CUTTING OUT BOTTOM SECTION OF TRUNK TO FIT!
Exhaust wrap - Design Engineering 010130 (2" by 100' roll) - exhaust wrapping the chinese headers sucks but is a MUST, the exhaust headers get extremely hot, especially in the tight Fiero engine bay.

Fuel:
Fuel Rails and Fittings - See part numbers for fuel line fittings for custom rails in diagram above. Also see original parts list. REPLACES FITTINGS IN ABOVE POST.
Recommended fuel rails instead of custom mentioned above - Aeromotive 14131 or custom adapted from stock parts by people on Facebook.
Injectors - Siemens DEKA EV1 80# Injectors - Intense FIS-840-x or ZZP 110324-6; DO NOT BUY ON EBAY - THEY'RE FAKES. You can tell by the DEKA words on the injection molding; fakes do not have DEKA on them.
Fuel Pressure Regulator and gauge- Tanks, Inc. AFPR1

Heads/Pushrods/Lifters:
Re-using stock valves and porting GENIII heads. Stock Series III valves are .030" larger than stock Series II valves. Machining off .061" off of valve guides, valve job, gasket match intake runners, widened exhaust runners (maintain D shape). Head surface was decked.
TEFLON TAPE HEAD BOLT STUD THREAD SEALANT (DO NOT USE ARP THREAD SEALANT)
Head Gasket - MLS Head Gasket .065" - INTENSE HGP-0xx or Cometic. Stock cylinders measure out of hole .025", and my engine measures about the same. You want .038"-.046" of quench according to INTENSE, so I am going .040" quench + .025" stock = 0.65" thick gasket.
Spark Plugs - Autolite AR103 - Autolite Racing Plugs; last longer and burn better (according to marketing). Have a back cut electrode. They are 3 ranges cooler than stock plugs (Autolite 606) - REPLACES SPARK PLUGS IN ABOVE POST
Rockers - light 1.65 rockers with re-usable rocker bolts (yields) - ZZP ZZ-165RA
Valve Springs - PAC 1218 - 130# valve springs, .600" lift
Spring Retainers - LS1 Spring retainers reused from another engine. They allow for more clearance!
Valve Stem Seals x6 - MAHLE B45911 (intake)
Valve Stem Seals x6 - MAHLE B45910 (exhaust)
LS7 Lifters - INTENSE Racing GMH-VVL
Pushrod length Checker - ZZP ZZ-PRDLCKR
Head Studs bolts (yielded) - APR 193-4001
ARP 7/16"-14 Thread Chaser - ARP 911-0004
Loctite 272
Intake Pushrod (stock size 7.029") - MELLING MPR605 (MPR-605) - MEASURE YOURS! YOURS WILL BE DIFFERENT DEPENDING ON CAM, DECKING, VALVES, AND HEAD GASKET SETUP!
Exhaust Pushrod - 7.00" - ZZ-CUSPRD-7.00-5/16-12

Camshaft install and balance shaft removal stuff:
ZZP XPZ Camshaft - XPZ-1
Camshaft Lube GM 12345501
Extra thick front cover gasket - ZZP ZZ-FCGG
Water Pump Gasket Aluminum - Fel-Pro 35804
Double Roller Rollmaster Timing Chain Set - ZZP CS6150
Camshaft Bolt - INTENSE GMH-BCM (yields)
Crankshaft Bolt - GMH-BCR (yields)
Machined oil pump cover required for rollmaster double timing chain clearance - I surface grinded the non-oil pump side of the cover down by grinding off .023", or you can buy ZZP's Machined Oil Pump Cover # ZZ-OILPCVR
Balance shaft delete: 440 camshaft bearing - ENGINETECH CC476 - POUND THIS IN TO BLOCK OIL PASSAGE, WITH OILING HOLES ON OPPOSITE SIDES SO ITS PLUGGED
Crankshaft Seal - Fel-Pro BS40649 - REAR
Crankshaft Seal - NATIONAL 710162 - FRONT

Transmission:
ZZP 4340 Hardened Input Shaft (needs GM J-tool to be installed properly, must take off valve body to access and replace gaskets)
Chrome Moly Pump Shaft - ZZP ZZ-CMPS-4T65E
8x Flexplate Bolts (yields) - GM # 24501365
Trans line fitting - 5/8"-18 INVERTED FLARE TO UNF -6AN x2 - SUM-220667B - REPLACES TRANS LINE FITTINGS IN ABOVE POST
Trans line fitting: - -6AN to 3/8" 90 deg barb x2 - 209006-BL - REPLACES TRANS LINE FITTINGS IN ABOVE POST
Hardened 4th Clutch Shaft ZZ-HRD4CLSH - must take off chain to access
Torque Converter DAACO B21JXFM reman
Gasket and Seals Kit - PIONEER 750240
Side cover gasket - FEL-PRO TOS18723
Engineered Performance Positraction Differential - http://www.engineered.net/eplsd.htm
Transmission Filter - WIX 58837 - REPLACES FILTER IN ABOVE POST
TBD: 3.29 Gear Set, 7/8" chain and sprockets
Transmission Hose - Derale 13016

Misc.
Knock Sensor - STANDARD MOTOR PRODUCTS KS45
Fuel Filter - WIX 33481 - DUPLICATES FILTER IN ABOVE POST
Oil Filter - WIX 51040XP (I am using synthetic since I changed all my seals - use conventional if you keep factory seals or you could get oil leaks!)
5qt of 5W30 Oil full synthetic - DUPLICATES OIL IN ABOVE POST
10qt of Dexron III Mercon transmission oil - DUPLICATES OIL IN ABOVE POST
2x Competition Cams 159 Engine Break-In Additive Oil
PRESTONE AF3000 (AF3000/F) universal antifreeze 10qt (you can really use whatever you want, as long as you don't mix two colors)
Magnetic Oil Drain Plug - Dorman 090091 (65372)
Wiring Harness ordered from James L. Brown on Facebook. - REPLACES INLINE FUSE HOLDERS IN ABOVE POST.
AC Hose - I had a radiator shop make one. You need an R12 port for the sensor. I cut one off of a bonneville AC hose and welded it onto the Fiero side. I also used the GTP compressor side AC hose fitting. Beware, there were at least 2 types of compressors/AC hoses on 3800 engines. LostNotForgotton has a video, and people on Facebook fiero pages make the hoses.
Longer battery ground cable from Adavance Auto
Spark Plug Wires - Taylor Cable 83253 (45 degree boots) - you need a vice and a spark plug crimper (below)
Spark plug wire crimper - Accel 170040

------------------
Austin H.
1988 GT 3800SC Series II 3.4" Pulley
Fiero How-To Videos at https://www.youtube.com/use...4?sub_confirmation=1
Facebook page at https://www.facebook.com/FieroAustinH/
Build thread - http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/139530.html
Build pictures - https://drive.google.com/dr...OM2I3THM?usp=sharing

[This message has been edited by AustinH (edited 11-21-2019).]

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AustinH
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Report this Post03-01-2018 06:41 PM Click Here to See the Profile for AustinHClick Here to Email AustinHSend a Private Message to AustinHEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Below is a chart I put together to help select camshafts. It lists 3800 camshaft specs. Generally, red means either bad performance or hard to achieve (expensive or lots of other supporting mods requried), This chart shows ALL M90 3800sc build track times that are on various forums that I could find, shown with different camshaft and mod selections.

If you want an Excel you can download from here https://drive.google.com/op...BhWo_-7onmDaVip8EFwo



------------------
Austin H.
1988 GT 3800SC Series II 3.4" Pulley
Fiero How-To Videos at https://www.youtube.com/use...4?sub_confirmation=1
Facebook page at https://www.facebook.com/FieroAustinH/
Build thread - http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/139530.html
Build pictures - https://drive.google.com/dr...OM2I3THM?usp=sharing

[This message has been edited by AustinH (edited 06-24-2019).]

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1MohrFiero
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Report this Post04-09-2018 09:10 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 1MohrFieroSend a Private Message to 1MohrFieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I dont know how I missed this before. Thanks for the huge effort in documentation.
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AustinH
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Report this Post04-09-2018 10:09 AM Click Here to See the Profile for AustinHClick Here to Email AustinHSend a Private Message to AustinHEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
removed

[This message has been edited by AustinH (edited 04-30-2018).]

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AustinH
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Report this Post04-22-2018 01:08 AM Click Here to See the Profile for AustinHClick Here to Email AustinHSend a Private Message to AustinHEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Finally here, part 2 of my 400whp goal 3800sc build. How-to video of tearing down and re assembling the Camshaft and timing chain. Block is ready for heads!



------------------
Austin H.
1988 GT 3800SC Series II 3.4" Pulley
Fiero How-To Videos at https://www.youtube.com/use...4?sub_confirmation=1
Facebook page at https://www.facebook.com/FieroAustinH/
Build thread - http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/139530.html
Build pictures - https://drive.google.com/dr...OM2I3THM?usp=sharing

[This message has been edited by AustinH (edited 08-10-2018).]

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longjonsilver
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Report this Post05-17-2018 09:36 PM Click Here to See the Profile for longjonsilverClick Here to visit longjonsilver's HomePageClick Here to Email longjonsilverSend a Private Message to longjonsilverEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Thanks Austin: lots of good information here. Everybody's swap is different, so the more info we get the more options we have to choose from and the better decisions we make. The electrical diagrams you posted are especially helpful, as are your videos on youtube.
thanks again
jon

------------------
I'm the original owner of a white ' 84 2M4 purchased Dec 10, 1983 from Pontiac. Always garaged, no rust, 4-wheel drifts are fun! 3800 SC swap to come!

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0z
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Report this Post03-14-2019 09:52 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 0zSend a Private Message to 0zEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
How did it turn out?
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Shho13
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Report this Post03-17-2019 12:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Shho13Click Here to Email Shho13Send a Private Message to Shho13Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Amazing post and lots of valuable information here. Thanks for documenting your swap and all the information so well!

------------------
"Discord"
Red 1988 GT under restoration!

Let's Go Mets!

( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

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AustinH
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Report this Post05-09-2019 06:07 PM Click Here to See the Profile for AustinHClick Here to Email AustinHSend a Private Message to AustinHEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
To clear up a LOT of misinformation out there, THIS is how to run a PCV system with a Gen 5 Supercharger and a N* (Northstar) Throttle Body, and this is what it does.

There is no way to run a catch can without bypassing the actual PCV in some way, since it sits directly in the Gen 5 Supercharger intake.



All you do is attach a hose from the Northstar TB nipple (before butterfly valve but after MAF) to the nipple on the supercharger by the PCV.
The air goes from the throttle body, through the supercharger nipple, through the intake manifold, through the heads to the crank case, back up through the heads, back through the intake manifold, through the PCV valve, and back into the supercharger intake.

Correct me if I'm wrong...


Austin H.
1988 GT 3800SC Series II 3.4" Pulley
Fiero How-To Videos at https://www.youtube.com/use...4?sub_confirmation=1
Facebook page at https://www.facebook.com/FieroAustinH/
Build thread - http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/139530.html
Build pictures - https://drive.google.com/dr...OM2I3THM?usp=sharing

[This message has been edited by AustinH (edited 05-11-2019).]

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LornesGT
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Report this Post05-09-2019 06:52 PM Click Here to See the Profile for LornesGTSend a Private Message to LornesGTEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
It’s not like I am an expert but the crank becomes positive so I believe the flow will be opposite of your explanation.
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AustinH
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Report this Post05-09-2019 08:26 PM Click Here to See the Profile for AustinHClick Here to Email AustinHSend a Private Message to AustinHEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by LornesGT:

It’s not like I am an expert but the crank becomes positive so I believe the flow will be opposite of your explanation.


Air through the PCV valve can only travel the direction shown. Intake vacuum sucks air directly into the blower through the PCV from the crank case.

Austin H.
1988 GT 3800SC Series II 3.4" Pulley
Fiero How-To Videos at https://www.youtube.com/use...4?sub_confirmation=1
Facebook page at https://www.facebook.com/FieroAustinH/
Build thread - http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/139530.html
Build pictures - https://drive.google.com/dr...OM2I3THM?usp=sharing

[This message has been edited by AustinH (edited 01-16-2020).]

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AustinH
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Report this Post05-31-2019 09:02 AM Click Here to See the Profile for AustinHClick Here to Email AustinHSend a Private Message to AustinHEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Finally, part 3 of the 3800sc swap rebuild. Give me some feedback! Did I screw something up?


Austin H.
Fiero How-To Videos at https://www.youtube.com/use...4?sub_confirmation=1
Facebook page at https://www.facebook.com/FieroAustinH/
Build thread - http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/139530.html
Build pictures - https://drive.google.com/dr...OM2I3THM?usp=sharing
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AustinH
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Removed.

[This message has been edited by AustinH (edited 01-13-2020).]

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DimeMachine
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Report this Post06-18-2019 06:30 PM Click Here to See the Profile for DimeMachineSend a Private Message to DimeMachineEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by AustinH:

Today's video is everything you need to know about a 3800sc.

Part 4 of the swap coming soon!



Austin H.
Fiero How-To Videos at https://www.youtube.com/use...4?sub_confirmation=1
Facebook page at https://www.facebook.com/FieroAustinH/
Build thread - http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/139530.html
Build pictures - https://drive.google.com/dr...OM2I3THM?usp=sharing


Fantastic thread young man! I'll be watching as you seem to be doing a fine job!

------------------
84/87 NB, 3800SC, E-85, VS Cam, 2.8 Pulley, 4T65E-HD, HP Tuners, AEM Wideband, Regal GS Gauges, S-10 Brake Booster. 1/4 mile -11.85 at 114mph

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DimeMachine
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Report this Post06-18-2019 06:33 PM Click Here to See the Profile for DimeMachineSend a Private Message to DimeMachineEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

DimeMachine

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Member since Sep 2011
You seem to be very analytical in your approach - researching and then making informed decisions. Curious what your conclusion was regarding the Gen 3 M90 ported vs Gen 5.

Thanks!
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AustinH
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Report this Post06-18-2019 06:54 PM Click Here to See the Profile for AustinHClick Here to Email AustinHSend a Private Message to AustinHEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by DimeMachine:

You seem to be very analytical in your approach - researching and then making informed decisions. Curious what your conclusion was regarding the Gen 3 M90 ported vs Gen 5.

Thanks!


Hey Dime.

I honestly picked up my Gen V + the two series III heads + the Lower Intake Manifold for $150 total... maybe got lucky.

The hype online is that a ported Gen III blower is equal airflow to a Gen V blower.

I think that the 9% more efficiency efficiency (HP), 13% less HP parasitic, and 15% less heat would remain with the Gen V blower however.

Here are the exact numbers from Eaton found here: http://www.grandprixforums....en-five-gen-5-a.html
The 90-cubic inch Gen V supercharger is very compact. Its housing includes the throttle-body adaptor, crankcase ventilation plumbing,
coolant passages, the evaporative emissions purge valve and the rotor
drive mechanism. The drive mechanism is sealed and permanently
lubricated, obviating the need for oil connections and eliminating a
potential source of leaks. Moreover, the Gen V features all-cast
components and a larger, low-restriction outlet port. The tuned inlet
port is also less restrictive, compared to previous-generation
superchargers, allowing a larger (75 millimeter) throttle body. As a
result, more air is pumped by the supercharger through the Series III’s
induction system. The Gen V’s rotor is finished with Abraidbable Powder
Coating (APC) rather than epoxy. APC is a patented material containing
graphite that is electrostatically applied to the rotor and baked on. As
a result, the rotor requires less clearance within the supercharger
housing, resulting in less leakage around its edges, greater airflow at
a given operating speed and lower operating temperature. The Gen V’s
rotor bearings have been enlarged to increase durability and reduce
operating noise and vibration.

As a result, the Gen V operates at considerably higher efficiency than
its predecessors. At wide open throttle, the Gen V turns at 700 fewer
rpm (a 9 percent reduction), draws 13 percent less power from the
crankshaft, decreases operating temperature 15 percent and increases
volumetric efficiency 9 percent. For the customer, that means a 9
percent increase in horsepower (see product specifications), and best-
in-class acceleration times for the Grand Prix.

[This message has been edited by AustinH (edited 02-24-2020).]

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DimeMachine
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Report this Post06-18-2019 09:19 PM Click Here to See the Profile for DimeMachineSend a Private Message to DimeMachineEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by AustinH:


Hey Dime.

I honestly picked up my Gen V + the two series III heads + the Lower Intake Manifold for $150 total... maybe got lucky.

The hype online is that a ported Gen III blower is equal airflow to a Gen V blower.

I think that the 13% less HP parasitic and 15% less heat would remain with the Gen V blower however.

Here are the exact numbers from Eaton found here: http://www.grandprixforums....en-five-gen-5-a.html
The 90-cubic inch Gen V supercharger is very compact. Its housing includes the throttle-body adaptor, crankcase ventilation plumbing,
coolant passages, the evaporative emissions purge valve and the rotor
drive mechanism. The drive mechanism is sealed and permanently
lubricated, obviating the need for oil connections and eliminating a
potential source of leaks. Moreover, the Gen V features all-cast
components and a larger, low-restriction outlet port. The tuned inlet
port is also less restrictive, compared to previous-generation
superchargers, allowing a larger (75 millimeter) throttle body. As a
result, more air is pumped by the supercharger through the Series III’s
induction system. The Gen V’s rotor is finished with Abraidbable Powder
Coating (APC) rather than epoxy. APC is a patented material containing
graphite that is electrostatically applied to the rotor and baked on. As
a result, the rotor requires less clearance within the supercharger
housing, resulting in less leakage around its edges, greater airflow at
a given operating speed and lower operating temperature. The Gen V’s
rotor bearings have been enlarged to increase durability and reduce
operating noise and vibration.

As a result, the Gen V operates at considerably higher efficiency than
its predecessors. At wide open throttle, the Gen V turns at 700 fewer
rpm (a 9 percent reduction), draws 13 percent less power from the
crankshaft, decreases operating temperature 15 percent and increases
volumetric efficiency 9 percent. For the customer, that means a 9
percent increase in horsepower (see product specifications), and best-
in-class acceleration times for the Grand Prix.




Ha. Makes it an easy decision when a deal like that falls into your lap....
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TexasT
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Report this Post06-19-2019 08:48 AM Click Here to See the Profile for TexasTClick Here to visit TexasT's HomePageClick Here to Email TexasTSend a Private Message to TexasTEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Just wanted to add my "keep on moving forward"!
You are doing FINE work, so keep it(the work), the posts, and vids on youtube coming. I'm sure I'm not the only one taking it all in.

How are you doing the computer? We are looking at hptuners and efilive for a programmer for our sc gtp swap into an 85 Fiero.
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Dennis LaGrua
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Report this Post06-19-2019 09:01 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Dennis LaGruaClick Here to Email Dennis LaGruaSend a Private Message to Dennis LaGruaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by TexasT:

How are you doing the computer? We are looking at hptuners and efilive for a programmer for our sc gtp swap into an 85 Fiero.


I would recommend that the OP use HP Tuners to tweak the program as there is a long history with that software. It takes a while to learn how to use editing software but if you add any mods, having it is essential.

------------------
" THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Spintech/Hedman Exhaust, P-log Manifold, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, Champion Radiator, S10 Brake Booster, HP Tuners VCM Suite.
"THE COLUSSUS"
87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H
" ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "

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AustinH
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Report this Post06-19-2019 09:47 AM Click Here to See the Profile for AustinHClick Here to Email AustinHSend a Private Message to AustinHEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by TexasT:

Just wanted to add my "keep on moving forward"!
You are doing FINE work, so keep it(the work), the posts, and vids on youtube coming. I'm sure I'm not the only one taking it all in.

How are you doing the computer? We are looking at hptuners and efilive for a programmer for our sc gtp swap into an 85 Fiero.


Thanks! The above post is correct, I have a friend with HPTuners. James L Brown (who manufactures 3800sc swap harnesses) also programs the PCM for you.
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Report this Post08-27-2019 07:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for AustinHClick Here to Email AustinHSend a Private Message to AustinHEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Quick update:
Use teflon tape+high temp silicone to seal your head bolts instead of ARP thread sealant!

[This message has been edited by AustinH (edited 11-04-2019).]

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AustinH
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Report this Post11-21-2019 09:12 AM Click Here to See the Profile for AustinHClick Here to Email AustinHSend a Private Message to AustinHEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
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Fiero Ron
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Report this Post11-21-2019 03:18 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Fiero RonClick Here to Email Fiero RonSend a Private Message to Fiero RonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I have been subscribed for a while, I love the videos, they are very informative. When I saw the part about the A/C compressor, I was laughing because I did the same exact thing torquing the nuts to 74 ft-lbs because of how it was described in the list of torque specs. I pulled the threads right out of the compressor bracket, I ended up tapping to the next size with the same thread pitch and using a Time-Sert. Glad to have you and LostNotForgotten giving tips with the 3800 Supercharged install, it definitely helps many of us a lot. I hope you get over 1,000 subscribers soon, you definitely deserve it. Keep up the good work!

Ron
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Report this Post01-13-2020 09:11 AM Click Here to See the Profile for AustinHClick Here to Email AustinHSend a Private Message to AustinHEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Everything you need to know (except history) about a 3800sc engine.

This is an updated version of a previous video I made. It is much corrected and improved!



Austin H.
Fiero How-To Videos at https://www.youtube.com/use...4?sub_confirmation=1
Facebook page at https://www.facebook.com/FieroAustinH/
Build thread - http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/139530.html
Build pictures - https://drive.google.com/dr...OM2I3THM?usp=sharing

[This message has been edited by AustinH (edited 03-09-2020).]

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VROOMZ28
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Report this Post02-14-2020 12:03 AM Click Here to See the Profile for VROOMZ28Send a Private Message to VROOMZ28Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
AustinH,

Thank you for the updated video. I am in the process of getting all my parts required to perform my 3800sc swap and I have been watching your videos and “LostbutNotForgotten’s” videos. You guys are my inspiration and my guides in doing this swap. I can’t thank you enough for sharing the information.

I have a 3800sc Series II L67, but I’ve aquired a Gen V M90 and L32 lower intake manifold.

Do you know is there any VATS or PASSKEY on the Gen II that needs to be disabled in the ECU? I’d like to test run my engine before I mount it in the Fiero.

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Report this Post02-14-2020 10:11 AM Click Here to See the Profile for AustinHClick Here to Email AustinHSend a Private Message to AustinHEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote

Do you know is there any VATS or PASSKEY on the Gen II that needs to be disabled in the ECU? I’d like to test run my engine before I mount it in the Fiero.


You are welcome! Glad to hear.
Yes, there is VATS you must disable. You can do that with a programming tool like HPTuners. I have a friend handle all that stuff for me. If your harness came from Danny (Canada) or James Brown, then they would have disabled it already. You can send out your PCM to one of them or take it to a shop to have done otherwise. What are you doing for a harness?
James Brown - https://www.facebook.com/pr...p?id=100010340077920
Danny - https://www.facebook.com/danny.mcilmoyle
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Report this Post02-22-2020 10:53 PM Click Here to See the Profile for VROOMZ28Send a Private Message to VROOMZ28Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I wasn’t sure if I should try to use the existing harness and splice into the Fiero wiring or try to get a harness made. The harness is really the only thing I am missing to perform my swap. My engine is from a 1998 Grand Prix GTP so hopefully its not too challenging. What are your recommendations? I pretty handy, but I’d be willing to buy one too save me some headaches...
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