Just a thought... If I were to start a religion, and one of my beliefs were that black people were unnatural, and I do not want to associate with them. Then I could refuse service to blacks and it will be fine?
Just a thought... If I were to start a religion, and one of my beliefs were that black people were unnatural, and I do not want to associate with them. Then I could refuse service to blacks and it will be fine?
If I pass a law that says the government only has to follow the Constitution when it damn well pleases, can I step on your rights all the time and it will be fine?
If I pass a law that says the government only has to follow the Constitution when it damn well pleases, can I step on your rights all the time and it will be fine?
If we pass a law that forces our daughters, granddaughters and wives to allow these deviants in the same toilet area against their will, then WHOSE rights are being stepped on?
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 04-12-2016).]
I've heard of one of those two guys, thought the one I knew of was dead..............
Why would anyone care what these two think?
Whether it's politics or favorite color of underwear, I mean really, who cares what they think............
The bring nothing to the table worth getting upset over IMHO.
------------------ Ron
Isn't it strange that after a bombing, everyone blames the bomber, his upbringing, his environment, his culture, his mental state but … after a shooting, the problem is the gun?
My Uncle Frank was a staunch Conservative and voted straight Republican until the day he died in Chicago. Since then he has voted Democrat. Shrug
[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 04-12-2016).]
Based on your obvious "vast knowledge" on the issue isn't it time for you to get yourself over there in person and start helping your spiritual brothers and sisters and _________ out with your "special talents".
For all you pro-queer/gay/lezbo/tranny people.....
Let's assume (or perhaps you do) have a little 5 year old girl that needs to go the the "ladies" room at the park or mall. She goes in and less than a minute later a 26 year old "guy" dressed as a girl goes into the same "ladies" room.
For me, a father of 4, currently with 4 grand daughters and 6 grand sons: Probably the same way I would feel if a 26 year old woman dressed as a woman walked in a minute after my 5 yr old daughter entered or if a 26 year old male dressed as a male entered 1 minute after (back in the day) one of my young sons or now, young grandsons entered. You worry about your kids no matter what, especially since a father doesn't usually enter the lady's room before hand to check out who may already be in there before daughter goes in. Crap can and most often does happen even when there is no transgender or L/G within 100 miles.
The long term answer will probably be individual bathrooms in areas where required or the removal of any public toilets whatsoever due to high costs or threat of litigation.
Originally posted by randye: If we pass a law that forces our daughters, granddaughters and wives to allow these deviants in the same toilet area against their will, then WHOSE rights are being stepped on?
Are you suggesting that this is all some ploy so that transgender women can get into womens bathrooms? You know they are not interested in seeing women naked, right? Also, why is it our wives that we have to be worried about, what about the men?
For all you pro-queer/gay/lezbo/tranny people.....
Let's assume (or perhaps you do) have a little 5 year old girl that needs to go the the "ladies" room at the park or mall. She goes in and less than a minute later a 26 year old "guy" dressed as a girl goes into the same "ladies" room.
How would you feel then?
I don't really understand why we even have gendered bathrooms. I appreciate a urinal as much as the next guy but besides that there isn't really a point.
I wouldn't think twice about it. And that's if a guy walks in dressed as a woman, which is unlikely, as a male crossdresser who identifies as male is more likely to want to use the men's room. Now, a transgendered individual, that person is likely to enter what you perceive as the wrong bathroom. Either way, I couldn't care less.
Originally posted by randye: If we pass a law that forces our daughters, granddaughters and wives to allow these deviants in the same toilet area against their will, then WHOSE rights are being stepped on?
Oh no, Heaven forbid they use the same toilet as them. The horror!
Oh no, Heaven forbid they use the same toilet as them. The horror!
Now its time for me to tell you to *grow up*. The issue isn't principally about the toilet bowl, but I think you know that so please stop being ridiculous.
The issue is properly the right of the majority to establish social morals and conscience and enact laws as they see fit to support those values. The issue is properly the right of the majority not to be forced to bend to the whims of a deviant tiny minority.
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 04-13-2016).]
Everyone understands that the North Carolina law protects and restricts access to public school showers and locker rooms, right?
The law defines "Multiple occupancy bathroom or changing facility" thusly:
quote
A facility designed or designated to be used by more than one person at a time where students may be in various states of undress in the presence of other persons. A multiple occupancy bathroom or changing facility may include, but is not limited to, a school restroom, locker room, changing room, or shower room.
It is not simply a matter of men in the women's restroom.
[This message has been edited by williegoat (edited 04-13-2016).]
That is not necessarily true. I have known two "males who identified as females". One had a "boyfriend" and one had a "girlfriend".
I am editing this to include a third that I met once, who also had a "girlfriend".
I could have lived a very happy life not knowing any of this.
Your anecdotal evidence holds no weight if we want to draw any meaningful conclusions. Besides, it doesn't even make sense. Why would would someone lie about being an oppressed minority? They want to be called names and discriminated against for the fun of it? They want to be forced to use the wrong bathroom all the time?
Anyway, here are some studies and reports about what will actually happen if we allow people to use bathrooms they want to.
If anybody can provide evidence that is not anecdotal I would be more than happy to discuss it. The fact is, claiming we are going to all of a sudden see a bunch of "fake trans girls" sneak into bathrooms to assault women is ludicrous because it just doesn't happen. Let people choose what they want to do, and pay attention to your OWN junk, not someone else's.
I've spent an inordinate amount of time in ladies bathrooms.
I can unequivocally state that they are way cleaner, plus they get a couch.
I don't think they fart, either. . . . . . . . . . . . . My wife was wheelchair bound by MS and needed help with bathroom issues so I accompanied her into the ladies room many times.
I am unaware of any sexual assault as the result of the CT gender identity or expression law. I'm pretty sure it would have come to our attention. [Email exchange, 3/6/14]
quote
In Hawai`i, the protection against discrimination in public accommodations on the basis of sex, including gender identity or expression, has not resulted in increase sexual assault or rape in women's restrooms. The HCRC is not aware of any incidents of sexual assault or rape causally related or attributed to the prohibition against discrimination on the basis of gender identity or expression.
quote
We have not seen that. I doubt that's gonna encourage the behavior. If the behavior's there, [sexual predators are] gonna behave as they're gonna behave no matter what the laws are. [Phone interview, 3/13/14]
quote
I have never heard of any issues like this in Portland. We have a very low rate of sexual assault/rape crimes here overall. [Email exchange, 3/7/14]
quote
I have only been here a short time so was checking with my staff to find out if they were aware of any issues. ... We are not aware of any other issues or problems similar to this caused by prohibiting discrimination against those who are transgendered. [Email exchange, 3/7/14]
(etc etc) I understand your point, but you don't get to have it both ways--you can't on one hand USE anecdotal evidence to try to prove "YOUR" point while telling everyone else that they cannot use it to illustrate THEIR side.
[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 04-13-2016).]
I think the concern is mostly pervs pretending (or not) to be the other sex in order to get pervy. Who could prove otherwise?
Which is what I was getting at in this.........
quote
Originally posted by Thunderstruck GT:
For all you pro-queer/gay/lezbo/tranny people.....
Let's assume (or perhaps you do) have a little 5 year old girl that needs to go the the "ladies" room at the park or mall. She goes in and less than a minute later a 26 year old "guy" dressed as a girl goes into the same "ladies" room.
How would you feel then?
------------------ If sugar-coating is what you crave... Willy Wonka doesn't live here.
Originally posted by jaskispyder: And... what is stopping pervs from dressing up and going into a womens (or mens) restroom? Are you saying that transgender people are pervs?
I'm saying you cant tell them apart, thats what I said.
Its not so much about dressing up. One thing new proposed ideas seem to be saying is even if you clearly look like a man, you could be "transgender" and use a womens bathroom, right? Has more to do with what you "identify" yourself as?
[This message has been edited by 2.5 (edited 04-13-2016).]
Its not so much about dressing up. One thing new proposed ideas seem to be saying is even if you clearly look like a man, you could be "transgender" and use a womens bathroom, right? Has more to do with what you "identify" yourself as?
Walk into a woman's rest room.... you might get a look or someone asking you why you are there and just tell them it is an emergency and men's is closed (holding your stomach will help with the story). Who will turn you in? Who will tell you no? Not many, I bet.
(etc etc) I understand your point, but you don't get to have it both ways--you can't on one hand USE anecdotal evidence to try to prove "YOUR" point while telling everyone else that they cannot use it to illustrate THEIR side.
That is fair, I will take that. Anyone can be an "expert" if they claim.
But how about this? Stats show that assaults just do not happen in bathrooms. Why do we have to prevent something that is not an issue?
Originally posted by jaskispyder: Walk into a woman's rest room.... you might get a look or someone asking you why you are there and just tell them it is an emergency and men's is closed (holding your stomach will help with the story). Who will turn you in? Who will tell you no? Not many, I bet.
"Yvette Cormier was in the dressing room at her exercise club “Planet Fitness” last month when she saw a man enter the women’s locker room. Cormier was unsettled about this, so she immediately informed management. After hearing her concerns, Planet Fitness explained that the man is transgender and identifies as a woman. They told her that Planet Fitness allows any man who sincerely self-identifies as a woman to make use of the women’s locker room.
This response did little to settle Cormier’s concerns, which she began to share with other members of the club. So Planet Fitness took decisive action. They kicked Cormier out of the club. They revoked her membership saying that she violated Planet Fitness’s “no-judgment zone” policy.
Cormier’s concerns highlight the inconsistencies of the transgender revolution that is unfolding in places of public accommodation. How does Planet Fitness know the difference between a man who “sincerely” identifies as a woman and a man who pretends to identify as a woman. Certainly, being able to tell the difference is beyond the competency of an athletic club. Nevertheless, they are asking every female member to trust the “sincerity” of strangers who wish to enter the women’s dressing room. Is there anyone who can’t see the insanity of that proposition?
Another problem with the transgender policy is that many people don’t know what transgender is. A transgender person is someone who embraces a gender identity that does not correspond to their biological sex. Being transgender says nothing about that person’s sexuality. There are plenty of men who embrace a female gender identity but who nevertheless remain attracted to the opposite sex. In other words, the man in the dressing room may genuinely fit someone’s definition of transgender. But he may also be sexually attracted to women. That means that Cormier’s concern is not necessarily mitigated by the sincerity of transgender identity.
This situation reveals at least two important things. First, transgenderism requires accommodations that contradict common sense. Nevertheless, those forcing this change appear to feel no obligation to address the legitimate concerns of people like Yvette Cormier. The Cormier’s of the world either have to get with the program or get steamrolled."
OH on that case lets dismiss all laws for anything.
LOL...I guess those Catholic priests who abused children, even though it was against the law and against their religion, but that didn't stop them. Pervs don't let a sign on the door stop them.
Frankly, I think this discussion should take place about bathrooms, gender, etc. I am sure it scares the hell out of "some" people... as it makes them very uncomfortable as they believe gays/transgender/whatevers are walking sinners. Grab the popcorn and watch the show!
For me, I would like more information and discussion, so a reasonable solution/accommodation can be found.
