Pennock's Fiero Forum
  Totally O/T
  The evidence against anthropogenic global warming (Page 108)

Post New Topic  Post A Reply
Email This Page to Someone! | Printable Version

This topic is 150 pages long:  1   2   3   4   5   6   7   8   9   10   11   12   13   14   15   16   17   18   19   20   21   22   23   24   25   26   27   28   29   30   31   32   33   34   35   36   37   38   39   40   41   42   43   44   45   46   47   48   49   50   51   52   53   54   55   56   57   58   59   60   61   62   63   64   65   66   67   68   69   70   71   72   73   74   75   76   77   78   79   80   81   82   83   84   85   86   87   88   89   90   91   92   93   94   95   96   97   98   99   100   101   102   103   104   105   106   107   108   109   110   111   112   113   114   115   116   117   118   119   120   121   122   123   124   125   126   127   128   129   130   131   132   133   134   135   136   137   138   139   140   141   142   143   144   145   146   147   148   149   150 
Previous Page | Next Page
next newest topic | next oldest topic
The evidence against anthropogenic global warming by fierobear
Started on: 06-07-2008 02:13 PM
Replies: 5993 (78281 views)
Last post by: cliffw on 04-23-2024 08:37 AM
FlyinFieros
Member
Posts: 1599
From: US
Registered: Oct 2012


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 63
User Banned

Report this Post04-04-2014 11:14 AM Click Here to See the Profile for FlyinFierosSend a Private Message to FlyinFierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
IP: Logged
FlyinFieros
Member
Posts: 1599
From: US
Registered: Oct 2012


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 63
User Banned

Report this Post04-04-2014 11:16 AM Click Here to See the Profile for FlyinFierosSend a Private Message to FlyinFierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

FlyinFieros

1599 posts
Member since Oct 2012
Study: Permafrost Thaw Exacerbates Climate Change
The climate is warming in the arctic at twice the rate of the rest of the globe creating a longer growing season and increased plant growth, which captures atmospheric carbon, and thawing permafrost, which releases carbon into the atmosphere.

This study measured CO2 emissions from permafrost thaw and its impact on the carbon balance on an ecosystem level. According to Dr. Natali, “There is 100 times more carbon stored belowground than aboveground in the arctic, so observed changes in plant productivity are only a very small component of the story. Given the amount of carbon stored belowground in the arctic, it is very unlikely that plant growth can ever fully offset C losses from permafrost thaw.”
IP: Logged
FlyinFieros
Member
Posts: 1599
From: US
Registered: Oct 2012


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 63
User Banned

Report this Post04-04-2014 11:21 AM Click Here to See the Profile for FlyinFierosSend a Private Message to FlyinFierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

FlyinFieros

1599 posts
Member since Oct 2012
Too bad ocean acidification due to human emissions is threatening this negative feedback loop which cools the planet.

Study: Plankton make scents for seabirds and a cooler planet
When phytoplankton are eaten by grazing crustaceans called krill, they release a chemical signal that calls in krill-eating birds. At the same time, this chemical signal — dimethyl sulfide, or DMS — forms sulfur compounds in the atmosphere that promote cloud formation and help cool the planet. Seabirds consume the grazers, and fertilize the phytoplankton with iron, which is scarce in the vast Southern Ocean. The work was published March 3 in the journal Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences.

A role for DMS in regulating climate was proposed by Robert Charlson, James Lovelock, Meinrat Andreae and Stephen Warren in the 1980s. According to the CLAW hypothesis, warming oceans lead to more growth of green phytoplankton, which in turn release a precursor to DMS when they die. Rising levels of DMS in the atmosphere cause cloud formation, and clouds reflect sunlight, helping to cool the planet. It's a negative feedback loop to control the planet's temperature.

[This message has been edited by FlyinFieros (edited 04-04-2014).]

IP: Logged
FlyinFieros
Member
Posts: 1599
From: US
Registered: Oct 2012


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 63
User Banned

Report this Post04-04-2014 11:26 AM Click Here to See the Profile for FlyinFierosSend a Private Message to FlyinFierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

FlyinFieros

1599 posts
Member since Oct 2012
"Arctic sea ice reached its annual maximum extent on March 21, after a brief surge in extent mid-month. Overall the 2014 Arctic maximum was the fifth lowest in the 1978 to 2014 record."

Source.
IP: Logged
FlyinFieros
Member
Posts: 1599
From: US
Registered: Oct 2012


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 63
User Banned

Report this Post04-04-2014 11:35 AM Click Here to See the Profile for FlyinFierosSend a Private Message to FlyinFierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

FlyinFieros

1599 posts
Member since Oct 2012
Study: New Southern Hemisphere climate data provides clearer global picture
Scientists compiled climate data from hundreds of different locations and used a range of methods to estimate Southern Hemisphere temperatures over the past 1000 years.

In 99.7 percent of the results, the warmest decade of the millennium occurred after 1970.

And surprisingly, only twice over the entire past millennium have both hemispheres simultaneously shown extreme temperatures.

One of these occasions was a global cold period in the 17th century; the other was the current warming phase.

Lead author Dr Raphael Neukom from Switzerland said the study showed the ‘Medieval Warm Period’, as identified in some European chronicles, was a regional phenomenon.
IP: Logged
ray b
Member
Posts: 12549
From: miami
Registered: Jan 2001


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 325
Rate this member

Report this Post04-04-2014 12:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ray bSend a Private Message to ray bEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by fierobear:

Well, at least they are starting to be HONEST about their LIEING

Shock peer-reviewed paper advocates ‘information manipulation’ & ‘exaggeration’ in global warming debate to ‘enhance global welfare’
http://www.climatedepot.com... icultural-economics/


want to talk about lies
that is the reason behind the heartland lobby group
built to lie by big tobacco about smoking
now that is over
and they need a new subject to lie about FOR PAYMENTS
so they picked GW with big oil and coal picking up the bills
do you ever research who what when and why ?
or just parrot what ever the bro's K tell you to think
IP: Logged
dratts
Member
Posts: 8373
From: Coeur d' alene Idaho USA
Registered: Apr 2001


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 119
Rate this member

Report this Post04-04-2014 02:01 PM Click Here to See the Profile for drattsSend a Private Message to drattsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by fierobear:

Well, at least they are starting to be HONEST about their LIEING

Shock peer-reviewed paper advocates ‘information manipulation’ & ‘exaggeration’ in global warming debate to ‘enhance global welfare’
http://www.climatedepot.com... icultural-economics/


I see the issue. I don't condone the practice but I can see the similarity to a white lie where the liar believes that the truth will cause more harm than the lie. In this context a lie would do more harm than good anyway that you look at it. When the lie is found out (and science has little tolerance for lies) as they always are, the loss of credibility would cause enormous harm. I do believe that the other side resorts to the practices described. "Information manipulation" is rampant right on this very forum.
IP: Logged
TK
Member
Posts: 10013
From:
Registered: Aug 2002


Feedback score: (2)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 200
Rate this member

Report this Post04-04-2014 02:40 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TKSend a Private Message to TKEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by dratts:


I see the issue. I don't condone the practice but I can see the similarity to a white lie where the liar believes that the truth will cause more harm than the lie. In this context a lie would do more harm than good anyway that you look at it. When the lie is found out (and science has little tolerance for lies) as they always are, the loss of credibility would cause enormous harm. I do believe that the other side resorts to the practices described. "Information manipulation" is rampant right on this very forum.


But in science and especially during peer review, other scientists love nothing more than proving another scientist wrong. It boosts both their ego and standing (on top of stopping bad science in it's tracks.) So even if a group collectively agreed to be misleading (for whatever nefarious or good reason) there are scientists just waiting to pounce on them. We are seeing this play out in the climate sciences. But as you implied, both sides are quite capable of using junk science.
IP: Logged
FlyinFieros
Member
Posts: 1599
From: US
Registered: Oct 2012


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 63
User Banned

Report this Post04-04-2014 03:56 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FlyinFierosSend a Private Message to FlyinFierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by TK:
But in science and especially during peer review, other scientists love nothing more than proving another scientist wrong. It boosts both their ego and standing (on top of stopping bad science in it's tracks.)

Doing it just to prove another scientist wrong is rather narcissistic. A real scientist, in my opinion, is in it for the truth regardless of who is right or wrong in the end. Ego and standing can be tremendous motivation for some, but glory seekers are a set back to the truth. Consider the 'denier blogs' that have sprung up and their clearly evident bias, like Watts before and after the BEST study.

[This message has been edited by FlyinFieros (edited 04-04-2014).]

IP: Logged
newf
Member
Posts: 8704
From: Canada
Registered: Sep 2006


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 116
Rate this member

Report this Post04-04-2014 05:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for newfSend a Private Message to newfEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by FlyinFieros:

"Arctic sea ice reached its annual maximum extent on March 21, after a brief surge in extent mid-month. Overall the 2014 Arctic maximum was the fifth lowest in the 1978 to 2014 record."

Source.

Only fifth lowest. According to some members that shows recovery.
IP: Logged
Hudini
Member
Posts: 9029
From: Tennessee
Registered: Feb 2006


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 165
Rate this member

Report this Post04-04-2014 09:13 PM Click Here to See the Profile for HudiniSend a Private Message to HudiniEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
But it's OK to lie if it furthers the greater good?

"It appears that news media and some pro-environmental organizations have the tendency to accentuate or even exaggerate the damage caused by climate change. This article provides a rationale for this tendency by using a modified International Environmental Agreement (IEA) model with asymmetric information. We find that the information manipulation has an instrumental value, as it ex post induces more countries to participate in an IEA, which will eventually enhance global welfare. From the ex ante perspective, however, the impact that manipulating information has on the level of participation in an IEA and on welfare is ambiguous."

http://ajae.oxfordjournals....ajae.aau001.abstract
IP: Logged
PFF
System Bot
TK
Member
Posts: 10013
From:
Registered: Aug 2002


Feedback score: (2)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 200
Rate this member

Report this Post04-05-2014 02:04 AM Click Here to See the Profile for TKSend a Private Message to TKEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by FlyinFieros:

Doing it just to prove another scientist wrong is rather narcissistic. A real scientist, in my opinion, is in it for the truth regardless of who is right or wrong in the end. Ego and standing can be tremendous motivation for some, but glory seekers are a set back to the truth. Consider the 'denier blogs' that have sprung up and their clearly evident bias, like Watts before and after the BEST study.



It's competition which is good. The best science is often brutal.

Edit: I'll leave my other post for context to your response (which I agree with) but in re-reading mine it's not what I meant to say. I am not saying scientist is evil, mean or nasty (don't step on the grass,Sam) but if they disagree with some hypothesis or proposal they will jump on it pretty quick. The competition to get heard/published/accepted is strong as you know and if there is disagreement they won't stay quiet. I don't mean to imply they will do it strictly to be jerks since defenders will jump on them. In the end, it's all good for science other than the occasional hurt feelings.

As for this thread, I am totally unqualified to even remotely express an opinion on the OP. I will say that the question of humans affecting the climate it centuries old (if), the concern is over 100 years old and the effort to understand if the question AND concerns are valid is over 70 years old. It's not something dreamed up by Al Gore. Just because he jumped on the bandwagon doesn't make him the source. Therefore I won't dismiss it just because I don't understand the technical details ("if one doesn't understand it - it must not be true" syndrome.) I do understand just enough of the concern to believe we need to be taking it seriously and not stopping research just because some don't understand the science.

[This message has been edited by TK (edited 04-05-2014).]

IP: Logged
fierobear
Member
Posts: 27079
From: Safe in the Carolinas
Registered: Aug 2000


Feedback score: (2)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 383
Rate this member

Report this Post04-08-2014 10:16 AM Click Here to See the Profile for fierobearSend a Private Message to fierobearEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by FlyinFieros:

"Arctic sea ice reached its annual maximum extent on March 21, after a brief surge in extent mid-month. Overall the 2014 Arctic maximum was the fifth lowest in the 1978 to 2014 record."


- Wait, I thought 30 years of data wasn't enough to draw a conclusion? Oh, wait, that's right...the same rules don't apply to proof of WARMING.

- FIFTH warmest? Yawn. They're REALLY stretching the arm waving now.

[This message has been edited by fierobear (edited 04-08-2014).]

IP: Logged
fierobear
Member
Posts: 27079
From: Safe in the Carolinas
Registered: Aug 2000


Feedback score: (2)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 383
Rate this member

Report this Post04-08-2014 10:20 AM Click Here to See the Profile for fierobearSend a Private Message to fierobearEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

fierobear

27079 posts
Member since Aug 2000
Follow up to the peer reviewed paper saying it's ok to lie if it's for global warming. Well put by Rush Limbaugh.


Gawker: Arrest Global Warming Deniers

BEGIN TRANSCRIPT

RUSH: I mentioned Jonah Goldberg's column at National Review. I think it was also published concomitantly and coherently at the New York Post. (interruption) Concomitant? It's not... (interruption) No, I didn't make up the word. You've never heard of concomitantly? (interruption) Look it up! It was published concomitantly and coherently with the New York Post.

Cohesively, too -- meaning it looks the same in the New York Post as it does at National Review. Same words. "Climate Activists Uncaged." (interruption) What? (interruption) I told you it was a word. Concomitant is a word. They thought I was making up a word on the other side of the glass. "Gawker's Adam Weinstein suggests arresting those on the wrong side of the climate change debate."

By the way, our buddy Marc Morano, former "our man in Washington" from Rush The TV Show, he's got a website in Climate Depot where he chronicles all of the leftist propaganda on this issue and apparently two accredited, concomitant climate scientists have come out and said that it's perfectly fine to exaggerate and lie about global warming impacts in order to get people's attention and money.

It's perfectly the fine to make it up, perfectly fine to exaggerate. It's entirely within the bounds of propriety to really, really hype things to get people's attention and get their money. Do you realize, folks, the left... I don't care where you find them, global warming movement, militant feminist, militant gays. Do you realize there literally is no moral foundation propping them up?

The whole notion of right and wrong, truth or fact versus lies and BS is irrelevant.

Whatever they believe is going to be what everybody else believes no matter what it takes to make that happen. What they believe does not have to be true. If they want it to be true, you're gonna agree with it or you're gonna be harassed and threatened and intimidated. They establish these rules for themselves no matter what it takes. This threat is so existential that even if we have to lie, we'll do it.

This is the way they think -- proving, by the way, this is a religion. That's a technique that people oftentimes use to permit evil in what they're doing. If what they're fighting is indeed the essence of evil, then you are entitled to do anything to beat it back. There are no rules. So this is what the left reserves for themselves. That is that we, everybody who opposes them, are the essence of evil.

So whatever they have to do to stop us is permissible, even called for. So if we've got if exaggerate global warming to get people's attention and get money for it, then that's perfectly fine. There is no moral foundation. Right and wrong, justice and truth, are irrelevant. Our desired outcome is all that matters. "A writer for..." This is Jonah Goldberg writing here in National Review Online, concomitantly with the New York Post.

"A writer for the website Gawker recently penned a self-described 'rant' on the pressing need to arrest, charge, and imprison people who 'deny' global warming. In fairness, Adam Weinstein doesn't want mass arrests. (Besides, in a country where only 44 percent of Americans say there is 'solid evidence' of global warming and it's mostly due to human activity, you can't round up every dissenter.)"

So this guy, see, he's reasonable. He doesn't want to put everybody in jail. Oh, no, no! No. 'Cause he knows he can't put everybody who dissents in jail.

"Fact-checking scientists are spared. So is 'the man on the street who thinks Rush Limbaugh is right. ... You all know that man. That man is an idiot." He only thinks what he thinks because he listens to Limbaugh. "He is too stupid to do anything other than choke the earth's atmosphere a little more with his ... F-150's gassy exhaust.'" So you people, you drive Ford F-150s or whatever.

You're not gonna be jailed. Don't worry about it. You're just idiots. It is I, the man poisoning your minds, that they want to imprison. "But Weinstein's magnanimity ends there. Someone must pay. Weinstein suggests the government simply try the troublemakers and spokespeople. You know, the usual suspects. People like Limbaugh himself as well as ringleaders of political organizations and businesses that refuse to toe the line.

"'Those malcontents must be punished and stopped,'" says this guy at Gawker. Now, I don't know why a guy at Gawker is getting the attention of Jonah Goldberg. Well, actually I do, 'cause he's not just a guy at Gawker, which most people never heard of. What it is is this is going to be become mainstream thought if it isn't already. That is the whole point here. This stuff isn't new. We've been laughing at it for 25 years.

But all the while they have been deadly serious about it. They really mean this stuff. There ought to be trials. There ought to be people like me put in cages, made an example to show you idiots out there what awaits you if you get too vocal along with me. Now, "Weinstein says that this 'is an argument that's just being discussed seriously in some circles.'

"He credits Rochester Institute of Technology philosophy professor Lawrence Torcello for getting the ball rolling. Last month, Torcello argued," and we told you about this, "that America should follow Italy's lead. In 2009, six seismologists were convicted of poorly communicating the risks of a major earthquake.

"When one struck, the scientists were sentenced to six years in jail for downplaying the risks. "Torcello and Weinstein want a similar approach for climate change." 'Cause apparently six seismologists downplayed the earthquake risk, then an earthquake happened, so they want to put these guys in jail. Well, ergo, I (and a few nameless others) are opposing global warming.

When it happens, they want me put in jail -- and it's happening now. They put me on trial. Mr. Goldberg writes, "This is a great standard for free speech in America. Let's just agree that the First Amendment reads, 'Nothing in this clause shall be considered binding if it contradicts legal practices in the Abruzzo region of Italy.' The truth is this isn't as new an outlook as Weinstein suggests.

"For instance, in 2009, New York Times columnist Paul Krugman insisted that 'deniers' in Congress who opposed the Waxman-Markey climate-change bill were committing 'treason' while explaining their opposition on the House floor. (That same year, Krugman's fellow Timesman Thomas Friedman wrote that China's authoritarian system was preferable to ours, in part, because it lets 'enlightened' leaders deal with climate change.)" And enlightened leaders get to people the people they disagree with in jail.

Now, if we followed Italy's lead like this guy wants us to for sentencing people for getting their predictions wrong about earthquakes? Shouldn't we jail the global warming alarmists? They're the ones whose predictions have turned out to be wrong, not mine. They're the ones who are wrong. They're the ones claiming the sea levels are gonna rise and all this is gonna happen.

Notice that they always make these predictions to come true in a hundred years when none of us are gonna be alive. There hasn't been any warming for 15 years. If you ask me, they -- guys like this Adam Weinstein -- are the fraudsters. If anybody needs to be put in jail, it's them for misleading people, if that's the route we're gonna go. But that's not what the jail is for.

The reason they're putting people in jail is not to punish them. It's to shut them up. Shut them up and get rid of them so they can't influence anybody else. And by getting rid of them, you frighten everybody else about speaking up so that they don't. So you end up with no opposition. Jail the prominent leaders of your option and you have silenced all opposition, which is what the left is all about.

We can sit here and you can say, "Come on, Rush. Nobody's gonna put you in jail over this. Come on, Rush, are you really trying to get us afraid for you that you're gonna go to jail?" No. What I'm telling you is there are people who would do it if they could. I just call your attention to what just happened this poor guy out at Mozilla. It's always been an objective of mine to make sure people really, honestly understand who liberals are and what the left is.

(interruption) How is it different than Third World banana republic?

Well, in terms of persuading, no. You're not gonna convince anybody that this is a banana republic, is the problem. (interruption) My point is that you're not gonna change any minds by say, "You know, these people are just like a banana republic." Most people are gonna think, "This could never be a banana republic. It's United States of America." So they're gonna discard your characterization of this as like what happens in a banana republic.

They'll laugh at it and joke about it.

BREAK TRANSCRIPT

RUSH: Frank Newport, Gallup poll: "Americans Show Low Levels of Concern on Global Warming." The current level of worry about global warming, current level of concern is 34%. Thirty-four percent in a Gallup poll are concerned about global warming. That 34% is the same number that it was in 1989. That's what Gallup has revealed today. In 1989, 34% were very concerned about global warming; in 2014, it's 34%.

This is why they are in a state of panic, because they have failed to gin up anywhere near majority worry or concern on this. People, so far, are rejecting the idea that they are to blame for destroying the planet and therefore must pay higher taxes and must agree to bigger, more oppressive and controlling governments. People are just not signing on to that. Therefore, the global warming people today have come out and said, "Well, this just means that we are entitled to exaggerate and make things up in order to get people's attention."

Go check ClimateDepot.com. I'm not making that up. Two renowned (if there are such things) climate scientists have said that they are totally justified in exaggerating and making things up to get your attention and your money. "Americans' concerns..." This is from the actual Gallup poll. "Americans' concerns about global warming and climate change have held steady over the past year, while concerns about other environmental threats tested by Gallup have increased.

"The percentage expressing a great deal of worry about pollution of drinking water, as well as contamination of soil and water by toxic waste, increased by seven percentage points." Worry? How can people in this country not be worried about everything, given what the news is every day? Hell, people are worried about coffee! People are worried about virtually everything. Worry and concern is what is the news.

IP: Logged
rinselberg
Member
Posts: 16118
From: Sunnyvale, CA (USA)
Registered: Mar 2010


Feedback score: (2)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 147
Rate this member

Report this Post04-08-2014 11:08 AM Click Here to See the Profile for rinselbergClick Here to visit rinselberg's HomePageSend a Private Message to rinselbergEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
That was a paper that was published in the American Journal of Agricultural Economics. Judging from that journal title, that would not be my "go to" publication for the best in scientific climate research. So it's a ways off topic--as far as the scientific aspects of this discussion.

This paper makes no pretense of being rooted in research of natural sciences. That is not its purpose or intention. Not defending it. Just saying "It is what it is" and "It aint what it aint".

[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 04-08-2014).]

IP: Logged
FlyinFieros
Member
Posts: 1599
From: US
Registered: Oct 2012


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 63
User Banned

Report this Post04-08-2014 11:31 AM Click Here to See the Profile for FlyinFierosSend a Private Message to FlyinFierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
fierobear, you're trying to pass off political and entertainment news as scientific evidence.

 
quote
Originally posted by fierobear:
- Wait, I thought 30 years of data wasn't enough to draw a conclusion? Oh, wait, that's right...the same rules don't apply to proof of WARMING.

Who said 30 years of data wasn't enough? Provide evidence.

 
quote
Originally posted by fierobear:
- FIFTH warmest?

Fifth lowest, not warmest. The long term downward trend continues.

 
quote
Originally posted by fierobear:
Yawn. They're REALLY stretching the arm waving now.

Just a poor attempt on your part to downplay inconvenient evidence.

 
quote
Originally posted by fierobear:
Follow up to the peer reviewed paper saying it's ok to lie if it's for global warming.

Yet the paper says nothing of climate scientists. It's talking about the news media and "pro-environmental organizations". The meat of the paper suggests the news media's reporting has a impact on participation in international environmental agreements. But funny enough, the paper's research is based on a model, something deniers consistently doubt and discredit.

 
quote
Originally posted by fierobear:
Two renowned (if there are such things) climate scientists have said that they are totally justified in exaggerating and making things up to get your attention and your money.

Irony abound. This is a total lie. No surprise considering its coming from Rush, a political entertainer.

The two authors of the paper are economists, not climate scientists.

 
quote
Originally posted by fierobear:
Well put by Rush Limbaugh.

Nice joke. I had a good laugh. Who do you plan to cite next for scientific evidence? John Boehner?

 
quote
Originally posted by fierobear:
By the way, our buddy Marc Morano, former "our man in Washington" from Rush The TV Show, he's got a website in Climate Depot..

More proof Climate Depot is political and biased.

[This message has been edited by FlyinFieros (edited 04-08-2014).]

IP: Logged
newf
Member
Posts: 8704
From: Canada
Registered: Sep 2006


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 116
Rate this member

Report this Post04-08-2014 02:23 PM Click Here to See the Profile for newfSend a Private Message to newfEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by fierobear:

Follow up to the peer reviewed paper saying it's ok to lie if it's for global warming. Well put by Rush Limbaugh.


Gawker: Arrest Global Warming Deniers

BEGIN TRANSCRIPT
Hot air


 
quote

Fact-checking scientists are spared. So is "the man on the street who thinks Rush Limbaugh is right. … You all know that man. That man is an idiot.


This images is larger than 153600 bytes. Click to view.
Rush as a boy.

[This message has been edited by newf (edited 04-08-2014).]

IP: Logged
fierobear
Member
Posts: 27079
From: Safe in the Carolinas
Registered: Aug 2000


Feedback score: (2)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 383
Rate this member

Report this Post04-13-2014 01:11 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierobearSend a Private Message to fierobearEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Democrats concern for the environment? Or just crony capitalism?

FIGHT GLOBAL WARMING! GO GREEN, GO SOLAR! (Line our pockets!!)

U.S. Senator Reid, son combine for China firm's desert plant
http://www.reuters.com/arti...dUSBRE87U06D20120831

$737 Million Green Loan to Pelosi Kin Fuels Outrage
http://www.newsmax.com/Insi...412909#ixzz2ymrRv2Wa
IP: Logged
rinselberg
Member
Posts: 16118
From: Sunnyvale, CA (USA)
Registered: Mar 2010


Feedback score: (2)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 147
Rate this member

Report this Post04-13-2014 04:04 PM Click Here to See the Profile for rinselbergClick Here to visit rinselberg's HomePageSend a Private Message to rinselbergEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I haven't seen anything that makes me think that large thermo-solar power generating facilities are a risky play, in terms of low-carbon energy. If one of these thermo-solar projects has backfired or not met expectations, it has not come to my attention. These installations need substantial acreage in a year-round sunny environment, which is why they are being sited in the Nevada desert. They can have some negative impact on desert flora and fauna (like tortoises), but how does that stack up against the negative impacts from all the other ways of generating electricity? Based on what I can see at this moment, these thermo-solar plants seem like a smart play, if they are integrated intelligently with the already existing power grids.

So the question becomes, how much of this was politically motivated cronyism involving Democrats in government and Democrat-leaning players in the private sector getting payback for political contributions, in the form of these contracts and loan guarantees? Can anyone show that the Obama admin went out of its way to sideline potential players here because they were Republican-leaning or didn't come up with enough campaign contributions for the Democrats? Were the Koch brothers (or anyone like them with known Republican connections) already placed to receive these contracts and loan guarantees, and then got suspiciously passed over in the process for granting these site permits and loan guarantees?
IP: Logged
FlyinFieros
Member
Posts: 1599
From: US
Registered: Oct 2012


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 63
User Banned

Report this Post04-14-2014 11:11 AM Click Here to See the Profile for FlyinFierosSend a Private Message to FlyinFierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Instead of divisional politics from the usual suspect, how about energy solutions to combat climate change from the community level.

Community sponsored solar energy project with ROI for investors, grew $500,000 in just 5 weeks:
"Plymouth Energy Community is now enabling community-owned renewable energy installations across the city. To do this, we have set up PEC Renewables Ltd to install solar panels on schools and community buildings. These panels convert the energy from the sun into a green source of electricity."
Source.

[This message has been edited by FlyinFieros (edited 04-14-2014).]

IP: Logged
avengador1
Member
Posts: 35467
From: Orlando, Florida
Registered: Oct 2001


Feedback score:    (7)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 571
Rate this member

Report this Post04-14-2014 02:49 PM Click Here to See the Profile for avengador1Send a Private Message to avengador1Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
We could try that and get fined.
http://www.newser.com/story...living-off-grid.html
IP: Logged
PFF
System Bot
FlyinFieros
Member
Posts: 1599
From: US
Registered: Oct 2012


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 63
User Banned

Report this Post04-15-2014 03:35 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FlyinFierosSend a Private Message to FlyinFierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by avengador1:
We could try that and get fined.

You're really good at stretching a story that doesn't fit and being completely wrong at the same time.

"Clean, renewable energy is now flowing to hundreds of homes in rural Delaware, courtesy of Delaware Electric Cooperative’s Bruce A. Henry Solar Energy Farm near Georgetown. A portion of the 20 acre solar array began producing power in July, but the entire facility became operational on August 21st."
Source.

"Cherryland Electric Cooperative is proud to offer the Solar Up North (SUN) Alliance program. Members have the opportunity to purchase SUN shares and receive a monthly bill credit for their shares output without the risk and maintenance costs involved with traditional net metering."
Source.

"Lake Region Electric Cooperative members now have the opportunity to purchase part of the output from the HQ Prairie solar project being built on the restored native prairie at LREC headquarters."
Source.

"Florida Keys Electric Cooperative consumer-members interested in solar energy now have an innovative new green power option.

The Simple Solar Program is available only to FKEC members and is part of the cooperative’s dedication to the environment and the future."
Source.
IP: Logged
FlyinFieros
Member
Posts: 1599
From: US
Registered: Oct 2012


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 63
User Banned

Report this Post04-15-2014 03:45 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FlyinFierosSend a Private Message to FlyinFierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

FlyinFieros

1599 posts
Member since Oct 2012
Study: Discovery of a novel methanogen prevalent in thawing permafrost
"Scientists from The University of Queensland have discovered a microbe that is set to play a significant role in future global warming."

"UQ's Australian Centre for Ecogenomics researcher Ben Woodcroft said the methane-producing micro-organism, known as a ‘methanogen’, was thriving in northern Sweden’s thawing permafrost in a thick subsurface layer of soil that has previously remained frozen."

"[Mr Woodcroft] said global warming trends meant vast areas of permafrost would continue to thaw, allowing the microbes to flourish in organic matter and drive methane gas release, which would further fuel global warming."
Source.

[This message has been edited by FlyinFieros (edited 04-15-2014).]

IP: Logged
FlyinFieros
Member
Posts: 1599
From: US
Registered: Oct 2012


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 63
User Banned

Report this Post04-15-2014 05:07 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FlyinFierosSend a Private Message to FlyinFierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

FlyinFieros

1599 posts
Member since Oct 2012
Study: Nitrogen isotopes in ice core nitrate linked to anthropogenic atmospheric acidity change

"Geng’s work showed that the long-term decrease in the nitrogen-15 isotope since 1850, and its leveling off in 1970, are linked to changes in air chemistry. Airborne nitrate can exist as a gas or a particle, and nitrate with lighter isotopes tends to exist as a gas. But he found that the total fraction of nitrate present as gas or particle varies with the acidity of the atmosphere, and the acidic air causes more of the light isotopes to exist as a gas."

"“The isotope records really closely follow the atmospheric acidity trends,” said co-author Becky Alexander, a UW associate professor of atmospheric sciences. “You can really see the effect of the Clean Air Act in 1970, which had the most dramatic impact on emission of acid from coal-fired power plants.”"
Source.
IP: Logged
FlyinFieros
Member
Posts: 1599
From: US
Registered: Oct 2012


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 63
User Banned

Report this Post04-18-2014 10:48 AM Click Here to See the Profile for FlyinFierosSend a Private Message to FlyinFierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Michael Mann wins another legal battle: "This is a victory for science, public university faculty, and academic freedom."
Source.

Deniers are crying over this, but quite frankly, there's nothing in Mann's private correspondence that will overturn Mann's work or the multiple large scale temperature reconstructions that all agree with Mann's work. This attempt to abuse FOIA was a fishing expedition to manufacture political controversy.

Always nice to see a bully who picked a fight lose. Now they get to pay University of Virginia's legal fees.

[This message has been edited by FlyinFieros (edited 04-18-2014).]

IP: Logged
Arns85GT
Member
Posts: 11159
From: London, Ontario, Canada
Registered: Jul 2003


Feedback score: (1)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 202
Rate this member

Report this Post04-20-2014 12:17 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Arns85GTSend a Private Message to Arns85GTEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by FlyinFieros:

Michael Mann wins another legal battle: "This is a victory for science, public university faculty, and academic freedom."
Source.

Deniers are crying over this, but quite frankly, there's nothing in Mann's private correspondence that will overturn Mann's work or the multiple large scale temperature reconstructions that all agree with Mann's work. This attempt to abuse FOIA was a fishing expedition to manufacture political controversy.

Always nice to see a bully who picked a fight lose. Now they get to pay University of Virginia's legal fees.



to quote your article Flyinfieros,

The instrumental temperature record only covers the last 150 years at a hemispheric or global scale, and reconstructions of earlier periods are based on climate proxies. In an early attempt to show that climate had changed, Hubert Lamb's 1965 paper generalised from temperature records of central England together with historical, botanical and archeological evidence to produce a qualitative estimate of temperatures in the north Atlantic region.

In otherwords, the notion of significant climate change occurring since the 19th Century, is largely manufactured by using calculated data or "proxies"

Again, we know that the Northern Hemisphere suffered a mini ice age and that it has been in recovery, gradually warming for a couple of centuries. We do not have any evidence of actual and dramatic Global Warming as foisted on the public by the charlatans in East Anglia and IPCC.
IP: Logged
newf
Member
Posts: 8704
From: Canada
Registered: Sep 2006


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 116
Rate this member

Report this Post04-20-2014 10:14 PM Click Here to See the Profile for newfSend a Private Message to newfEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Arns85GT:


to quote your article Flyinfieros,

The instrumental temperature record only covers the last 150 years at a hemispheric or global scale, and reconstructions of earlier periods are based on climate proxies. In an early attempt to show that climate had changed, Hubert Lamb's 1965 paper generalised from temperature records of central England together with historical, botanical and archeological evidence to produce a qualitative estimate of temperatures in the north Atlantic region.

In otherwords, the notion of significant climate change occurring since the 19th Century, is largely manufactured by using calculated data or "proxies"

Again, we know that the Northern Hemisphere suffered a mini ice age and that it has been in recovery, gradually warming for a couple of centuries. We do not have any evidence of actual and dramatic Global Warming as foisted on the public by the charlatans in East Anglia and IPCC.


How do you not see the flaw in your statements?
IP: Logged
masospaghetti
Member
Posts: 2477
From: Charlotte, NC USA
Registered: Dec 2009


Feedback score:    (10)
Leave feedback

Rate this member

Report this Post04-21-2014 12:51 PM Click Here to See the Profile for masospaghettiSend a Private Message to masospaghettiEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Arns85GT:

to quote your article Flyinfieros,

The instrumental temperature record only covers the last 150 years at a hemispheric or global scale, and reconstructions of earlier periods are based on climate proxies. In an early attempt to show that climate had changed, Hubert Lamb's 1965 paper generalised from temperature records of central England together with historical, botanical and archeological evidence to produce a qualitative estimate of temperatures in the north Atlantic region.

In otherwords, the notion of significant climate change occurring since the 19th Century, is largely manufactured by using calculated data or "proxies"

Again, we know that the Northern Hemisphere suffered a mini ice age and that it has been in recovery, gradually warming for a couple of centuries. We do not have any evidence of actual and dramatic Global Warming as foisted on the public by the charlatans in East Anglia and IPCC.


Are you saying, Arn, that since it wasn't directly observed, it can't be true?

IP: Logged
FlyinFieros
Member
Posts: 1599
From: US
Registered: Oct 2012


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 63
User Banned

Report this Post04-21-2014 01:09 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FlyinFierosSend a Private Message to FlyinFierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by masospaghetti:
Are you saying, Arn, that since it wasn't directly observed, it can't be true?

Except for the 17th century global mini ice age. Apparently those proxy records are fine.

All of Arn's typical nonsense aside, the proxy record matches the instrument record.

Source.

[This message has been edited by FlyinFieros (edited 04-21-2014).]

IP: Logged
FlyinFieros
Member
Posts: 1599
From: US
Registered: Oct 2012


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 63
User Banned

Report this Post04-24-2014 03:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FlyinFierosSend a Private Message to FlyinFierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Study: Pronounced zonal heterogeneity in Eocene southern high-latitude sea surface temperatures

"Today’s Antarctic region once as hot as California, Florida"

"The findings, published the week of April 21 in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, underscore the potential for increased warmth at Earth’s poles and the associated risk of melting polar ice and rising sea levels, the researchers said."

"Led by scientists at Yale, the study focused on Antarctica during the Eocene epoch, 40-50 million years ago, a period with high concentrations of atmospheric CO2 and consequently a greenhouse climate. Today, Antarctica is year-round one of the coldest places on Earth, and the continent’s interior is the coldest place, with annual average land temperatures far below zero degrees Fahrenheit."
Source.
IP: Logged
FlyinFieros
Member
Posts: 1599
From: US
Registered: Oct 2012


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 63
User Banned

Report this Post04-24-2014 03:24 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FlyinFierosSend a Private Message to FlyinFierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

FlyinFieros

1599 posts
Member since Oct 2012
McKinsey & Company: Myths and realities of clean technologies
"So, is cleantech failing? In a word, no. Rather, the sector has experienced a cycle of excitement followed by high (and often inflated) expectations, disillusionment, consolidation, and then stability as survivors pick up the pieces. We’ve seen this before with other once-emerging technologies, such as cars, railroads, elevators, oil, and the Internet. Much of cleantech is just leaving its disillusionment or consolidation phase. For example, in transport, Tesla Motors is looking good; Fisker Automotive went into bankruptcy in 2013. In energy, SunPower is making healthy margins and SolarCity raised $450 million in 2013, but over a hundred other solar companies are gone. The shakeout is brutal—and typical. It has weeded out weaker players, making the industry as a whole more robust. Despite the rough patch, annual growth is at double-digit rates."


Source.

"… McKinsey has been ranked in the number one position of the "The Best Consulting Firms: Prestige" list of the Vault.com career intelligence website and was cited as the "most prestigious consulting firm of all" in a 2011 New York Times article. As of September 2013, over 100 McKinsey offices exist in 60 countries." Source.
IP: Logged
PFF
System Bot
Cheever3000
Member
Posts: 12398
From: The Man from Tallahassee
Registered: Aug 2001


Feedback score: (1)
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 178
Rate this member

Report this Post04-24-2014 04:04 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Cheever3000Send a Private Message to Cheever3000Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post


You're still here? Why? It's over! Go home!
IP: Logged
FlyinFieros
Member
Posts: 1599
From: US
Registered: Oct 2012


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 63
User Banned

Report this Post04-24-2014 04:21 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FlyinFierosSend a Private Message to FlyinFierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Cheever3000:
You're still here? Why?

Water skiing.

 
quote
Originally posted by Cheever3000:
It's over!

Agreed, the science is settled.

IP: Logged
FlyinFieros
Member
Posts: 1599
From: US
Registered: Oct 2012


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 63
User Banned

Report this Post04-25-2014 01:25 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FlyinFierosSend a Private Message to FlyinFierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Hey fierobear, I'm still waiting for you to respond to your baseless claim:
 
quote
Originally posted by fierobear:
- Wait, I thought 30 years of data wasn't enough to draw a conclusion? Oh, wait, that's right...the same rules don't apply to proof of WARMING.

Who said 30 years of data wasn't enough? Provide evidence.

IP: Logged
FlyinFieros
Member
Posts: 1599
From: US
Registered: Oct 2012


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 63
User Banned

Report this Post04-25-2014 02:54 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FlyinFierosSend a Private Message to FlyinFierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

FlyinFieros

1599 posts
Member since Oct 2012
Study: Tradeoffs and Synergies between Biofuel Production and Large Solar Infrastructure in Deserts
"Growing agave and other carefully chosen plants amid photovoltaic panels could allow solar farms not only to collect sunlight for electricity but also to produce crops for biofuels, according to new computer models by Stanford scientists."
Source.

[This message has been edited by FlyinFieros (edited 04-25-2014).]

IP: Logged
FlyinFieros
Member
Posts: 1599
From: US
Registered: Oct 2012


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 63
User Banned

Report this Post04-25-2014 02:59 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FlyinFierosSend a Private Message to FlyinFierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

FlyinFieros

1599 posts
Member since Oct 2012
Community based hydo power:

"The plan is to install a 100kW micro hydroelectric generating plant on the south side of the River Calder at Whalley, Lancashire – green renewable energy"
Source.
IP: Logged
FlyinFieros
Member
Posts: 1599
From: US
Registered: Oct 2012


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 63
User Banned

Report this Post04-25-2014 03:08 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FlyinFierosSend a Private Message to FlyinFierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

FlyinFieros

1599 posts
Member since Oct 2012
More info on the community hydro project:
"Residents of Whalley in Lancashire opened a community share offer in November 2013 in a bid to raise the money needed to generate community-owned clean energy on the River Calder. Charity Bank agreed to lend Whalley Community Hydro half the amount required as long as the share offer generated the other half. The share offer has now raised more than £400k, and as a result Charity Bank has approved a loan for the remainder."
Source.

"Charity Bank is an independent ethical bank with a social purpose. It operates across the UK, with offices in Tonbridge, London, Cardiff and York." Source.
IP: Logged
FlyinFieros
Member
Posts: 1599
From: US
Registered: Oct 2012


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 63
User Banned

Report this Post04-25-2014 03:26 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FlyinFierosSend a Private Message to FlyinFierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

FlyinFieros

1599 posts
Member since Oct 2012
Study: A 12-Million-Year Temperature History of the Tropical Pacific Ocean
"New research by Yale University scientists challenges a long-standing paradigm for temperature variability in the Pacific Ocean, casting doubt on the existence of a past period of “permanent” El Niño-like conditions and suggesting that the tropics could grow markedly hotter."

"“There’s good news and bad news about future global warming,” said Mark Pagani, professor of geology and geophysics at Yale and an author of the research, published April 4 in the journal Science."

"“The good news is that global warming does not drive the Pacific Ocean into a permanent El Niño-like condition with all the other regional climate impacts that come with that. The bad news is that the tropics will warm as we continue to add greenhouse gases to the atmosphere — and the recent past was probably much warmer than generally assumed.”"
Source.
IP: Logged
FlyinFieros
Member
Posts: 1599
From: US
Registered: Oct 2012


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 63
User Banned

Report this Post04-25-2014 03:31 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FlyinFierosSend a Private Message to FlyinFierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

FlyinFieros

1599 posts
Member since Oct 2012
Study: Assessing the effects of anthropogenic aerosols on Pacific storm track using a multiscale global climate model
"In the first study of its kind, scientists have compared air pollution rates from 1850 to 2000 and found that anthropogenic (man-made) particles from Asia impact the Pacific storm track that can influence weather over much of the world."
Source.
IP: Logged
FlyinFieros
Member
Posts: 1599
From: US
Registered: Oct 2012


Feedback score: N/A
Leave feedback





Total ratings: 63
User Banned

Report this Post04-25-2014 03:36 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FlyinFierosSend a Private Message to FlyinFierosEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

FlyinFieros

1599 posts
Member since Oct 2012
Interesting graphic of the pacific storm track: here.

Troubling uploading it due to size or would have included it here.
IP: Logged
Previous Page | Next Page

This topic is 150 pages long:  1   2   3   4   5   6   7   8   9   10   11   12   13   14   15   16   17   18   19   20   21   22   23   24   25   26   27   28   29   30   31   32   33   34   35   36   37   38   39   40   41   42   43   44   45   46   47   48   49   50   51   52   53   54   55   56   57   58   59   60   61   62   63   64   65   66   67   68   69   70   71   72   73   74   75   76   77   78   79   80   81   82   83   84   85   86   87   88   89   90   91   92   93   94   95   96   97   98   99   100   101   102   103   104   105   106   107   108   109   110   111   112   113   114   115   116   117   118   119   120   121   122   123   124   125   126   127   128   129   130   131   132   133   134   135   136   137   138   139   140   141   142   143   144   145   146   147   148   149   150 
next newest topic | next oldest topic

All times are ET (US)

Post New Topic  Post A Reply
Hop to:

Contact Us | Back To Main Page

Advertizing on PFF | Fiero Parts Vendors
PFF Merchandise | Fiero Gallery | Ogre's Cave
Real-Time Chat | Fiero Related Auctions on eBay



Copyright (c) 1999, C. Pennock