"[The] Inflation Reduction Act includes a rebate of up to $840 for an electric stove or other electric appliances, and up to an $500 to help cover the costs of converting to electric from gas."
"Methane and NOx Emissions from Natural Gas Stoves, Cooktops, and Ovens in Residential Homes" From the four Stanford University-affiliated researchers: Eric, Colin, Zutao and Robert. Greta was "on assignment" and could not participate. https://pubs.acs.org/doi/10.1021/acs.est.1c04707
[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 01-09-2023).]
So, now when some nut, criminal or terrorist knocks out a substation (however), entire neighborhoods, cities or if it's the right place, regions are cut off in all electric homes.
Yeah, that sounds like a great idea............ Don't even suggest it can't happen!!
Rams
[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 01-09-2023).]
How many ways are there to cook a steak? Or a hamburger?
It would not be a stretch to imagine that the days of the backyard cookout are numbered. A 4th of July cookout is so MAGA anyway. Probably started by white supremacist slave owners.
Besides, who will be able to afford beef, in the future feudal America?
Microwaved, soy and mealworm stew with tofu dumplins! Mmm, Mmm, good!
During my earliest years, in my very first assignment as a Former Fetus, I was raised and nurtured in a second story flat and than a small suburban home with gas-fired kitchen ranges and ovens.
According to news that I just observed, the Biden administration is backing off this to a certain point, apparently 40%+ of the nation has provided negative feedback. Not sure why that makes a difference, that 40%+ must be mostly Democrats.
Our propane gas stove top (the oven is electric) and propane logs in our fireplace will come out right after they pry my handgun from my (and my wife's) cold dead hands. You can take that to the bank. Oops, forgot about the tankless (Propane) water heater. Will defend that with my life. Love that thing. Take as shower as long as you wish, will not run out of hot water until you're out of gas.
Rams
[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 01-11-2023).]
Originally posted by williegoat: It would not be a stretch to imagine that the days of the backyard cookout are numbered. A 4th of July cookout is so MAGA anyway.
It's not beyond the realm that gas HVAC heaters and gas water heaters are numbered also.
No more camping or roughing it with charcoal or propane. Be prepared to bring some of these and pray hope for sunny days. May take a while to heat due to cloud cover and movement. I feel bad for scouts (not many anyways due to wokeness) or those who like a few days camping in the winter. Chemical fires, Sterno. But by then, no fires, they'll be outlawed. Distopia, baby.
There hasn't even been a decision yet to do anything about gas-fired cooking ranges and ovens in homes.
As I've documented previously in this thread, there are two arguments that are being put forward as reasons for phasing out of gas-fired cooking ranges and ovens in homes.
One argument is greenhouse gas emissions from gas-fired cooking, and particularly, carbon dioxide. That's a "climate" reason, and it stands up equally, whether there is gas-fired cooking inside of a home, or outdoors, as referenced in the forum post just before this one. Although it seems less arguable in the context of outdoor settings, because what would be the alternative?
The other argument is about the effects of NOx gases and fine particular matter that become part of the air inside of a home when there's gas-fired cooking inside the home. That is being cited as a cause of elevated case rates of asthma among the occupants of these homes, and particularly, the children as they grow up in these homes and are exposed to NOx and FPM (fine particulate matter) in their earliest years. I don't see this as being arguable when the gas-fired cooking takes place in outdoor settings. I see it as a negligible amount of exposure in any outdoors setting. But in the more confined air within a home—not negligible. Referring again, to the forum post immediately before this one.
[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 01-11-2023).]
* Not a medical doctor, just the MSM wants you to believe she is.
Can I just address this for a moment? This is the super-awesome Jenn-Air "Expressions" modular down-draft gas stove. I can't tell if she has the 30", 36", or 48"... but it's one of the nicest gas "cooktop" stoves you can get. It's so bad-as. They have modular attachments including a wok attachment, a deep fryer, a griddle, a rotisserie, and even a grill that you can swap out. The thing is totally awesome.
I had the electric one in my home in Texas in San Antonio. I really, really miss that house. I personally renovated the house myself. The only thing I didn't do in this picture, was cut and install the countertops, and / or make the cabinet doors and the facing. I completely renovated my Texas kitchen.
It looked like this originally,
and
and then I moved the fridge, rebuilt the oven and microwave box so it could take a larger unit, enlarged the kitchen sink "window", refaced the cabinets, and tiled floor and backsplash, and ran more outlets, scraped the popcorn, removed all the drop lighting and installed recessed lighting, etc. The appliances I bought on eBay... all either lightly used or floor models, and installed an updraft vent as well as retained the original Jenn-Air down-draft vent for when I replaced it with the Expressions model like Jill Biden has.
Unfortunately, my home didn't have gas, so I had to use the electric one, you can just make it out on the left... but I loved that unit. It was bad-ass...
Again... sorry for the pics... but I loved that house. Damn. I hated moving from there, but i had to move for work. I got that house for SOOOO cheap because the entire home was original from 1983... every square inch of it, including the CARPET IN THE BATHROOM AROUND THE TOILET... so it was a labor of love over 4 years. I completed it only a year before I moved... so I only got to enjoy it for a year.
The house I'm in now... the kitchen is no where near that nice... it sucks. So I'm going to have to renovate this one too... and now I have to scramble to buy a gas cooktop before I no longer will be allowed to.
[This message has been edited by 82-T/A [At Work] (edited 01-11-2023).]
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]: Can I just address this for a moment? This is the super-awesome Jenn-Air "Expressions" modular down-draft gas stove. I can't tell if she has the 30", 36", or 48"...
Sorry Todd, I didn't see Dr. Jill in your house in any pics. But based on her picture, I have sincerely doubts she's even close to a 36B.
Ah, the photoshop image. Is it a meme? Or just a photoshop? Whatever. Back here on Earth One, however:
quote
"To be clear, CPSC isn’t coming for anyone’s gas stoves. Regulations apply to new products,"... adding the newly passed Inflation Reduction Act includes a $840 rebate to replace equipment like gas stoves.
In a statement Tuesday, a spokesperson for the CPSC said there was not yet an official proposal on the matter, and that any action to regulate the appliances would involve a "lengthy process."
"Agency staff plans to start gathering data and perspectives from the public on potential hazards associated with gas stoves, and proposed solutions to those hazards later this year," the statement said. "Commission staff also continues to work with voluntary standards organizations to examine gas stove emissions and address potential hazards."
"Ban new gas stoves, a federal safety commissioner proposes; CPSC says no such official plan yet"
quote
The Consumer Product Safety Commission official cited concerns about potentially harmful emissions from the appliances.
The fact that the idea was floated and then backed off says the Biden Administration saw the feedback and didn't think it was worth pursuing with his intent to run again. Just my opinion but, Biden has definitely moved to the far left and it shows in virtually everything he does.
Scroll back to that photo of Jill Biden cooking on a gas range, and compare it with this. A considerably more modest apartment or home, with a conspicuously smaller kitchen area. The emissions from this gas-fired range are in a residence with far less interior space (and air) and a less robust HVAC and air filtration system (in all likelihood) than that Biden residence.
In terms of the "greenhouse" (climate-related) concerns, which are the carbon dioxide emissions from the combustion of natural gas, and the methane emissions from incomplete combustion and gas leaks—inevitable, even if barely noticeable to the occupants—and even the NOx emssions (also greenhouse gases), there's no fundamental difference between the gas range in this small apartment or flat or (very) entry-level home and a more upscale setting like the Biden residence.
In terms of exposure of the occupants, and children in particular, to the NOx emissions and the Fine Particulate Matter or FPM, there's an adverse health impact that's measurable, in terms of elevated case numbers of asthma and other respiratory damage. And that would be more severe in the very small home or apartment that I've posted here, than in a larger and more upscale home like the Biden residence.
This is what is driving the considerations that could lead to a regulatory phase-out of newly manufactured gas-fired cooking ranges and ovens. Or restrictions on where new gas-fired ranges and ovens can be installed. Is there enough air circulation, outside ventilation and air filtration?
I'm just looking at this from a scientific perspective.
I see merit in what "blackrams" just posted, right before this one. That's a political perspective.
[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 01-13-2023).]
Ya know, I'm beginning to believe that this whole "gas" debacle is meant to be a distraction to get our attention off of the Security Violations of classified documents. Biden doesn't need any more bad press but, the gas thing has gotten us talking about other things than the obvious security violations.
By the way, I've looked for Corvette Security Protocol twice now in the Federal Register. Not one mention of it being alright to store classified documents in a garage with a Presidential Corvette being OK.
Scroll back to that photo of Jill Biden cooking on a gas range, and compare it with this. A considerably more modest apartment or home, with a conspicuously smaller kitchen area. The emissions from this gas-fired range are in a residence with far less interior space (and air) and a less robust HVAC and air filtration system (in all likelihood) than that Biden residence.
I literally see a large hood vent above the stove, which is clearly not a re-circulation vent, but an exhaust vent. This works considerably better than the down-draft vent of the Jenn-Air Expressions modular gas system that Jill Biden has. I know this because I literally installed the electric version of this, and opted to also install an overhead vent to further augment the air filtration (see the pictures I posted above).
I also see a MASSIVE window directly facing the stove, which I personally would be opening almost every time I was using it, if that were my apartment.
You think they would ban fentanyl instead of gas stoves, if it was really about your health.
But we all know, that the leftist and government, it isn't about your health.
When they are making this rash decision because of a "new study" or the "experts say", that it 'may' cause child asthma, we all know the study is a complete fabrication and lie. Because they always lie.
Who is the influence peddler who is feeding Dems this lie? You are talking about 40 million homes that have gas stoves.
Is that all you got to your bs cabal 2030 NWO 2030 crap you always post, a lame joke? You always seem to do that. This is you right now, but probably with a huge gut and you wouldn't really be on a bicycle, I'm thinking a Rascal in reverse. Seriously, who is your A.I. programmer(s)?
Call me a skeptic, I don't believe this was ever intended to happen.
I honestly believe this was intended as a distraction to take our minds and conversation off Biden's current Classified Documents FUBAR. I think this was "leaked out" with no intent to actually do anything about it. Politicians wonder why the public has no confidence in what we're told or see on the news.
The similar issues with DJT have just been neutralized IMHO.
Call me a skeptic, I don't believe this was ever intended to happen.
I honestly believe this was intended as a distraction to take our minds and conversation off Biden's current Classified Documents FUBAR. I think this was "leaked out" with no intent to actually do anything about it. Politicians wonder why the public has no confidence in what we're told or see on the news.
The similar issues with DJT have just been neutralized IMHO.
Rams
I'm not for sure about that. The left does believe in pseudoscience. NY and California have already paved the way with bans of natgas appliances in new homes. They also get a rise in ruffling the right.
Here is a picture of an assault gas stove.
[This message has been edited by Wichita (edited 01-14-2023).]
[Almost 13 percent] of current childhood asthma nationwide is attributed to gas stove use, which is similar to the childhood asthma burden attributed to secondhand [tobacco] smoke exposure
It's nothing to sneeze at.
[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 01-14-2023).]
That's probably what someone said about leaded gasoline.
"Lead from gasoline blunted the IQ of about half the U.S. population, study says"
quote
Leaded gas was banned in 1996, but exposure to the poison cost people born before then several IQ points on average, researchers estimated.
EXCERPT
quote
Principal study author Michael McFarland, an associate professor of sociology at Florida State University and a faculty member of the university’s Center for Demography and Population Health, called the number of people affected by lead exposure “staggering.”
“This is important because we often think about lead as an issue for children, and of course it is,” he said. “But what we really wanted to know is what happens to those children who were exposed?”
In many cases, McFarland said, a 2 to 3 point IQ difference is nominal, unless an individual is on the lower side of IQ distribution.
“If you’re more toward cognitive impairment, a couple points can mean a lot,” he said.
But on a population basis, shifting the average IQ down even a small amount could have large consequences, said Sung Kyun Park, an associate professor of epidemiology and environmental health sciences at the University of Michigan School of Public Health. The entire bell curve shifts, he explained, with more of the population at what was once the extreme low end of IQ scores.
No one is going to have their gas range/oven confiscated. There could (eventually) be a decision to phase it out by banning the manufacture and sale of home kitchen gas ranges and ovens, requiring contractors to install only electric models in new or remodeled homes and apartments, and incentivizing home and apartment owners to replace their gas ranges with electric.
I think the electric induction-type kitchen ranges do a nice job.
Take it from the "commish" ...
[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 01-14-2023).]
