quote I like the idea because I generally like making things as clean and simple as possible. The big question, that some people with the stock intakes would have to answer, is whether it would be possible to bolt the plenums to the middle intake and then bolt it to the lower intake? Also, the issue of whether people would be comfortable drilling the holes out. The upside is it would also save a good bit of labor in assembling the bolt on plenums = lower price. Something to look into for sure.

Yes it is possible to bolt the plenums to the middle intake then bolt the assembly to the lower intake, more than enough room. I can drill holes out, no problems there.

I am going try to determine a price for the intakes next week. I like the bolt-from-the-bottom design (thanks Raydar ), so I will concentrate on that.

I am hoping to be back to 100% next week and get to work on the other requests.

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I got two extra throttle bodies sitting in my garage... I think they need to be put to use.... I think I need your set up....

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can you make a shift knob in this shape with the Fiero emblem engraved on the top?

http://www.streetbeatcustoms.com/tuctk226.html

Out of straight billet alum of course

quote Originally posted by doublec4: I got two extra throttle bodies sitting in my garage... I think they need to be put to use.... I think I need your set up....

I think I like what you're thinkin... Nice 'chop (your sig).

quote Originally posted by Scurvy: can you make a shift knob in this shape with the Fiero emblem engraved on the top? ...Out of straight billet alum of course

Can do. I'll work on a price for you. When I get some momentum going with developing these models I should be able to do one of that knob and figure out a price...

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[This message has been edited by toddshotrods (edited 08-04-2007).]

quote Originally posted by toddshotrods: I am going try to determine a price for the intakes next week. I like the bolt-from-the-bottom design (thanks Raydar ), so I will concentrate on that.

Well cool! I was certain that I had overlooked something. That's usually the story.

Are the flanges going to be gasket matched?
IIRC, there's a little bit of extra material in the middle intake that can be ported out. Not much, though.

BTW... I think I've got a spare middle intake.
I'lll send it to you for development if you need it. (Not like they're really uncommon, though.)
I really want to see this happen.

I am in for a dual tb intake as long as I dont have to give up a kidney for it.

quote Originally posted by Raydar: ...Are the flanges going to be gasket matched?...

Yes, I am going to model the part from a gasket.

quote Originally posted by Raydar: ...I think I've got a spare middle intake. I'lll send it to you for development if you need it. (Not like they're really uncommon, though.) I really want to see this happen.

That would really help. Every second and penny I can save will get it done faster and hopefully cheaper.

quote Originally posted by ceverhart: I am in for a dual tb intake as long as I dont have to give up a kidney for it.

I am trying my best to keep your kidneys in your body We'll see how that goes next week when I get together with my CNC guy... With the new mounting plan, setup and welding will be pretty simple. Three continuous beads...

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Somebody made a bar that attached to both shock towers in the rear to cut down on flexing and help handling. They no longer make these parts. Any chance of you making them up?

a cover for the thermostat cap would be perfect too

and the P/S setup and 16 gallon fuel tank I am interested in also

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1988 Fiero Formula T-tops
CJB 143 of 1252 "factory T-top cars"

I am looking forward to seeing your finished design, I am sure it will be worth every penny. I think I will also get a plain ball shifter head from you.

quote Originally posted by htexans1: ...Somebody made a bar that attached to both shock towers in the rear to cut down on flexing and help handling. They no longer make these parts. Any chance of you making them up?...

That would be fairly easy to fabricate, but I don't have a Fiero here. Maybe someone reasonably local will want one and volunteer to be a guinea pig Might even be cheaper for one of two of them to just modify a readily available aftermarket piece. Should just be a matter of modifying the brackets to fit the Fiero strut towers, and possibly make up any difference in width.

quote Originally posted by htexans1: ...a cover for the thermostat cap would be perfect too...

Do you mean radiator cap?

quote Originally posted by htexans1: ..and the P/S setup and 16 gallon fuel tank I am interested in also...

P/S as in power steering? If so, I'd better go back over this thread because I don't remember that one.

My first thought was to fabricate the tanks, and take them already tack-welded, to one of the shops I sub work to for welding, but I am not satisfied with the turn-around time I received from them on a job. I will be looking for a new weld shop next week, because I have some stuff I need done ASAP. I do some welding here but not hours of it at a time. After I develop the parts and processes I start looking for sub contractors that can deliver for the same price I can or hopefully even better because they are better suited to volume work.

quote Originally posted by ceverhart: I am looking forward to seeing your finished design, I am sure it will be worth every penny. I think I will also get a plain ball shifter head from you.

Thanks c. Ready when you are on the shifter

This weekend has been great so far. I got some much needed r&r and should be ready to dig in next week. I am behind on everything, so don't expect miracles just yet; but at least the ship should be ready to sail...

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im glade to see your doing better. let me know if there is any thing you need from me or if you want i can pm you my number if you ever want to chat about cars or anything to keep your mind clear

no he meant thermostat housing cover (in Fieros, its out in the open)

PM sent

quote Originally posted by BobadooFunk: no he meant thermostat housing cover (in Fieros, its out in the open)

I see. Something that matches the MAP sensor cover would be nice huh?

Speaking of which (MAP sensor cover) if all goes according to plans, I might have one (or a few) this week.

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I verified that I have a spare middle intake.
It's a little bit dirty, but other than that...

If you shoot me your addy, I'll get it on the way. May take a few days.

quote Originally posted by toddshotrods: Finally got around to cutting the end of the rack shaft down and threading it. Here is the narrowed rack assembly. I am going to turn oil-impregnated bronze bushings to fit in the ends, and make custom boots. The inner tie rods will be replaced with new ones eventually, and the outer te rods will be replaced with road ends and custom bump steer adjustment bushings. Next up, before all that, I am going to narrow the FIero crossmember and get it set up on the vehicle.

Think you could do something with a Chevette power rack to widen it the same as the Fieros? It has the same mount points.

quote Originally posted by USFiero: Think you could do something with a Chevette power rack to widen it the same as the Fieros? It has the same mount points.

There are a couple options. If the mount design and spacing is the same as the Fiero's, inner tie rod spacers can be used. THese are common with Mustang II IFS suspensions for street rods. Ideally there might even be some with the same thread diameter and pitch, in the needed lengths.

If the mounts are the same but too narrow, it may be possible to widen the housing but I would have to at least see pics of one disassembled to know for sure.

You may know this already but the goal is keeping the inner tie rod pivot points the same width as the Fiero LCA pickup point width.

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[This message has been edited by toddshotrods (edited 08-07-2007).]

quote Originally posted by toddshotrods: ...On another positive note, I think I found a new weld shop to sub work to. I asked him if he can do the "row of nickels" TIG beads I need and he pulled out a scrap piece of aluminum and laid a couple nice beads right there! If his work ethic matches his quality I may be abl to start cranking out some parts! Here's hoping...

Totally incompetent He almost ruined a lot of work! The welds were horrible, and he even managed to weld one of the parts backwards! I didn't even say anything I was so mad, I just took the parts and left. I had only noticed the bad welds, and when I got back to the shop where the project is the owner of the car (Vega mentioned in the beginning of this thread) saw the backwards part. I am glad I didn't see it before I took them because I might have lost it.

I wanted to take some pics of the damage but I didn't have my camera. I couldn't stand seeing my hard work so mangled so I cut the backwards part loose with a Dremel and removed all the weld; so it could be welded on in the right direction. The parts were supposed to be fabricated parts, with perfect TIG welds showing how they were made, but since he messed them up so bad I had to blend them - now they look like ordinary billet stuff

This is one of them before I took them to be abused:


I'll post pics of the salvaged parts when I get a chance. The barrel-shaped part was welded on backwards on one of them.

Sorry for the rant... Did I mention that I am

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[This message has been edited by toddshotrods (edited 08-08-2007).]

I just sent the rough draft models and info to get a quote on having the dual plenum parts cut. I am scrapping the low-budget, profile-cut, base plate idea. They will all be fully radiused at the port's entry in to the plenum.

I am going to stick with the welder I had before, until I find someone better and faster. I'll have an estimate from him today or tomorrow on welding them up. He's good, just really busy with big money projects; so little guys like me have to take a number. I'll take quality over quantity though.

I'm going to try to get a rough draft model of the 3800 intake by the end of the weekend; hopefully before then.

Edit - The CNC guy sent me an email within minutes letting me know he received the info and will get back to me ASAP. He's also really busy, but he goes out of his way to help little guys like me climb the ladder...

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[This message has been edited by toddshotrods (edited 08-10-2007).]

Wow, it seems there is no end to the threads about people getting shafted on Fiero parts and services! I know I am moving slow on these parts but its mainly because of these statements I made to start this thread:

quote Originally posted by toddshotrods: ...If possible, I will do the part(s) requested with no deposit required; unless the person feels confident enough and wants to place a deposit. I will fabricate the parts, post pictures, and if possible even have a local PFF member take a look and post his/her comments here before requiring payment. Only when the customer feels confident will they be required to make the payment. The product will be boxed, ready for shipping, with an exact quote from my local UPS/FedEx store. If someone requests a part that costs more in materials and labor than I can cover I will do everything I can to make it happen, and keep as much of the burden on me as possible. I will continue to work this way, here in this community until confidence is built in my services...

quote Originally posted by toddshotrods: Thanks everyone for the interest. One more detail about how all this will happen. As actual work orders for parts are developed I will start scheduling the jobs accordingly. One thing I won't do is over book myself to the point where I end up getting overwhelmed and people are waiting indefinitely for their parts. If and when we get to that point, if I tell you I can't start on your part (and even refuse to take a deposit) it's to guarantee that the jobs I have get done on a timely basis. If you have the time and patience to wait for me to give the current customers the best servic I can, I will get to it. I have learned a lot in the years I have been in business, and I would rather lose a customer (or even refer them to another business) than make promises I can't meet.

I just wanted to re-post those two points to be open and clear about what's going on here. If it seems like nothing is happening it's just because I am trying to balance everything so it doesn't spiral out of control. I am also trying to make sure my business is setup so that even if I get sick or die my clients and customers don't get the short end of the stick. That is the reason I use subcontractors for the volume parts. If something happens to me all my (hopefully temporary) successor would have to do is pick up and deliver the parts. I know I am babbling but considering the history of this community with suppliers, too much communication is better than too much silence.

It may take a few days for the machine shop quote, but I am optimistic about being able to deliver the intakes for a reasonable price. Back to work...

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[This message has been edited by toddshotrods (edited 08-10-2007).]

Take your time and have fun doing it! I'm in no hurry whatsoever, but am eagerly awaiting the final piece, can't wait to see it Looks great so far!

cant wait to see what it will look like

I forgot about a critical measurement - the height. I am assuming this has to fit under Fiero decklids, and W-body (???) hoods. We need to find out how clearance there is. The measurement can be taken from a point on the lower intake, e.g. the thermostat housing flange, an intake mounting bolt hole, etc.

Also a disclaimer is needed here.
I can't guarantee any specific power increase from such an intake. I would imagine it would provide some benefit, from being less restrictive. I can provide the creativity and quality, but if the goal is maximum performance we would need to have someone onboard to develop the ideal runner and plenum size. I just don't want to mislead anyone into thinking I am doing something more than what I am.

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any progress on MAP cover?

Sorry for the delay on the MAP sensor . I wanted to have a couple ready for sale by today, but correcting the bad welder's mistakes (with some other problems) threw my timing off. If I have enough aluminum rod here I may try one before the weekend is up. If not, by Monday or Tuesday, I should have one or two ready. I'm gas welding them to hone one of my "old school" skills. I need to keep that one sharp because I have some aluminum body parts to make that I want to gas weld (mainly for the experience of doing it).

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i will get you the hight, the supercharger fits under the hood with a intercooler so i will just take a measurement off that

We've been emailing back and forth all weekend, plus email and phone calls today, working out the details of machining the parts for the plenums, and Fiero intake base plates. A lot of this will apply to the 3800, as it will use the same basic plenum, with a different tb flange.

After we establish the height, and I can get the basic runner shape nailed down, I can start working on a price for that as well. Work on the model should resume soon.

I still didn't get any of the MAP sensor covers welded up yet but it's a coming... If there's enough demand for them (after the first few are sold) I'll probably switch to MIG, or possibly even drop a couple dozen of them off at a time to be TIG'd.

More to come...

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[This message has been edited by toddshotrods (edited 08-14-2007).]

SORRY I FORGOT!! about the measurements form the bottom of that plate to the top of the supercharger is 9" and im pretty shure you can also fit a 2" intercooler core with out any issues. if you get that maped out i will take your 3d model to clubgp and get them to do there worst and come up with some more tweeks for you

quote Originally posted by toddshotrods: I received the quotes from the cnc shop and the weld shop; and I am working out the final pricing - I think you guys are going to be okay with it It would help me in determining pricing if I could "see a show of hands" for how much potential interest there is in the dual plenum Fiero intake. I am not asking for commitments, as per the orginal post in this thread. If I think it's worth the risk, I'll take that on myself and have the sitting here ready to be shipped - whether they sell or not.

Raising my hand up high for the manifold

I know this is kind of late in the game, but has anyone considered trying to modify a SBC TPI runners and plenum to work with our lower intake? This would be similar to a Truleo but with aluminum pieces and a better throttle-body. I remember seeing an actual Baretta Indy Pacecar with a fabbed plenum/short runner intake. Maybe a little cut-n-weld on the plenum, eliminate one/rotate one runner, fab a triangular lower adapter. Whaddaya think?

quote Originally posted by toddshotrods: It would help me in determining pricing if I could "see a show of hands" for how much potential interest there is in the dual plenum Fiero intake.

I'm intrigued by this idea, but my guess is that you might get a better handle on interest in a dual throttle body plenum if at this point you started a new thread with a title something like "New Dual Plenum Intake for the Fiero V-6"

I find the present thread an interesting one, but frankly, one possibly in need of more focus to ascertain interest in a dual plenum intake, as opposed to interest in some of the other ideas being floated here (shift knobs, steering wheels, engine cradles, and so on).

Right now, my guess is that a person might not know from the title of this thread or some of its content whether it would be worth his while to read through the whole thread if he was interested in a dual plenum intake for his V-6 Fiero. A new thread with a new title whose name and content better focuses on a dual plenum intake might help. (By the way, I've no criticism of your overall efforts here, and am just trying to be helpful.)

Incidentally, if you haven't already seen it, a thread that may be of interest to you is "How to build a dual TB intake" which is accessible via this link: https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/077346.html (Despite its title, that thread doesn't have all the answers, but I found it interesting, and you may as well.)

quote Originally posted by project34: I'm intrigued by this idea, but my guess is that you might get a better handle on interest in a dual throttle body plenum if at this point you started a new thread with a title something like "New Dual Plenum Intake for the Fiero V-6" I find the present thread an interesting one, but frankly, one possibly in need of more focus to ascertain interest in a dual plenum intake, as opposed to interest in some of the other ideas being floated here (shift knobs, steering wheels, engine cradles, and so on). Right now, my guess is that a person might not know from the title of this thread or some of its content whether it would be worth his while to read through the whole thread if he was interested in a dual plenum intake for his V-6 Fiero. A new thread with a new title whose name and content better focuses on a dual plenum intake might help. (By the way, I've no criticism of your overall efforts here, and am just trying to be helpful.) Incidentally, if you haven't already seen it, a thread that may be of interest to you is "How to build a dual TB intake" which is accessible via this link: https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/077346.html (Despite its title, that thread doesn't have all the answers, but I found it interesting, and you may as well.)

Good advice, I'll get that posted tonight

I did see that thread and read it from beginning to end...

Here's where I am going with the MAP sensor cover. Simple aluminum cover, will be welded on the corners, with slotted mounting holes in back (as requested).

If you guys like this idea, I was going to drop this one off tomorrow to have TIG'd. Once you guys see it and approve, I will have at least a dozen more done and they'll be here ready when you want them; and probably on eBay.

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[This message has been edited by toddshotrods (edited 08-15-2007).]