I own page 4 !!! lol

quote Originally posted by fieroguru: No updates this week... Just too cold to get motivated, so I spent the week pondering the next round up upgrades for the SBC car - and took it out for a couple of spins when it was over 40. That TPI throttlebody on the CPI intake is interesting. Is the stock throttle body a restriction, or was it done for the challange of it?

He is turbo charging it and has done the injectors etc... that is a stock syclone throttle body
I have a question for you....
could you find out sometime, no rush, how far up from the water neck mount surface is the trunk lid brace ?
last time i measured it i left the passenger side vent off and it was easy to measure.

i may do the throttle body and injectors too if it will clear.
thanks

the stock throttle body on the CPI will support over 400 hp when turbocharged
(2.5 id will support 400 hp)

[This message has been edited by vortecfiero (edited 01-24-2008).]

Paul,
Realizing it's colder than a well digger's butt outside right now, what ya got planned for this weekend?

------------------
Ron

It's the Soldier, not the reporter
Who has given us the freedom of the press.
It's the Soldier, not the poet,
Who has given us the freedom of speech.
It's the Soldier, not the politicians
That ensures our right to Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness.
It's the Soldier who salutes the flag,
Who serves beneath the flag,
And whose coffin is draped by the flag.

quote Originally posted by vortecfiero: I have a question for you.... could you find out sometime, no rush, how far up from the water neck mount surface is the trunk lid brace ?

I can do that once the wiring is done and the engine goes back in.

quote Originally posted by blackrams: Paul, Realizing it's colder than a well digger's butt outside right now, what ya got planned for this weekend?

Nothing really planned. Had kicked around the idea of firing up the wood stove, cleaning up the garage (again) and start running the wires for the harness.

quote Originally posted by fieroguru: Nothing really planned. Had kicked around the idea of firing up the wood stove, cleaning up the garage (again) and start running the wires for the harness.

Well, if ya get bored, load up yer helper and come on up.

------------------
Ron

It's the Soldier, not the reporter
Who has given us the freedom of the press.
It's the Soldier, not the poet,
Who has given us the freedom of speech.
It's the Soldier, not the politicians
That ensures our right to Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness.
It's the Soldier who salutes the flag,
Who serves beneath the flag,
And whose coffin is draped by the flag.

Heat is a good thing!

The two coolant tubes were painted, but can not be installed with the wiring mock up brackets.

Wiring is one of my least favorite things to do, but progress is being made. The 500 connector was taped in its proper position and left another few inches of slack. Then ran the wires for the auto/shifter connector along the front valve cover/intake and connected to the tranny. These wires appear to be just the right length which saves some work.

The wires to everything on the lower front side of the engine will run down the face of the engine behind the serpentine belt and between the AC compressor and the engine block. I will probably have to make a wire holder to keep them safe from the belt. The stock 2.8 battery cable to the starter will work as will the power cable to the Alternator (even though it is now on the front of the engine vs. the rear). Once those larger wires were set, the rest of the wires for the lower front of the engine were ran starting at the terminating end. The front side of the engine has: Knock Sensor, Fan Switch, Oil Press Switch, AC, Alternator, Starter. As the harness is built, the wires are wrapped in black tape and will eventually be covered with OEM wire looms (recycled from the demo'd harnesses).

No pics so far... I will take some pics once the wiring is complete - the goal is for the wires to be as non-visible as possible.

I just want to write and thank you for the time your putting into the post. I have an 88 at home that I am going to install the 4.3 and I have to tell you this thread is going to be a lot of help. I can't wait to see what is in the future. Thanks again for a well detailed post. Anthony 88 GT auto Good Luck

------------------
"Do what you want, just don't get caught."

Not much new on the update front... Sara and Carrera were sick this week, so I spent most of the week tending to them.

I did get a couple hours in the garage today and hung up a couple more lights over the engine work table - helps a bunch! Then I did a little work on the harness. There will be room to run the harness between the valve cover and intake to keep it mostly hidden which makes me happy.

[This message has been edited by fieroguru (edited 02-03-2008).]

I got a few hours in the garage this weekend and made more progress on the harness. Almost all the ternimations on the engine are complete and about all the wires are loomed. Just a little more work and the engine/500 end of the harness will be complete, then it will be time to work on the ECM/203/relays that will be in the center console. No pics until the wiring is complete.

here is the ECM wiring schematic and the pinout chart. please excuse the noobie attempt at scanning lol

http://www.flipdrive.com/fi...7bafd300e6936052.pdf

for the 16197427 ecm

------------------



87 Fiero GT 5sp with Vortec L35 4300 Turbocharged V6
Bully Stage 2 clutch
Syclone intake manifold and engine management with Moates adapter and chip burner
Air/water intercooler and Devil's Own progressive water/alky injection
50lb injectors, 3 bar map sensor, Walboro fuel pump and Jabasco Intercooler pump
LM1 wideband on custom manifolds and 3" stainless exhaust system
T31/T04B S4 turbo with a Super T61 in the box
S10 caliper conversion.
Murphy's Constant Matter will be damaged in direct proportion to its value
Murphy's Law of Thermodynamics Things get worse under pressure.
Arthur C. Clarke "Any significantly advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic"

I finally got some shop time this weekend. An old SBC dist on the shelf was hacked up and made into this priming tool. Ground the teeth off the gear and ground a hex pattern on the other end so it would be easy to chuck into the hand drill.



Once the engine was primmed (hasn't been ran in nearly 2 years) the dist was installed. Then I finished up all the terminations on the engine/tranny and installed the bulkhead connector in the proper location. I still need to tape up the ends of the looms, but this will give you an idea of the routing of the harness.

Here is the 500 connector end and the positive battery cable. The harness comes across from the chassis and half of it goes down the face of the engine (Starter, Alt, A/C, Oil, Temp Sender, and Knock sensor). These wires are attached to the engine to keep them clear of the belt. The EFI related wires (IAT, EGR, IAC, TPS, MAP, Injector, plenum valve, and 1st engine ground) join the harness at the corner of the front valve cover and run across the engine to the bellhousing side. I used one of the thin plastic looms from the 2.8 to make the harness narrow enough to fit between the intake and the side of the valve cover.



The harness from the rear of the engine (trunk side) contains the 2nd knock (yes, this 4.3 has a knock sensor per head), temp switch, VSS and O2. This harness runs across the top of the tranny and up the bell housing of the block and picks up the wires for the Coil and Dist and the 2nd engine ground .


You can also see the tranny shifter harness in the pic above, it travels down the tranny and picks up the TCC connector and joins the rest of the harness. At the corner of the valve cover, all the harness portions come together and the portion of the harness that needs to go to the ecm, 203 connector and ALDL go through the bulk head connector.


I still need to finish all the ECM and 203 connections, the 3rd chassis ground point in the center console, and mount the A/C, Fuel, and plemun valve relays in the center console.

During the last week, I purchased the new bolts for the 4 mounts. The original ones were too long and I did not want to cut them down (88 suspension bolt and I might need them someday), so McMaster-Carr hooked me up with the M14 bolts and the self-locking nuts.


Summit Racing hooked me up with 4 Mandrel J-bends in 2 1/2" 16ga aluminized tubing and the 3" in dual 2 1/2" out Flowtech Afterburner muffler. This is the same muffler used on my SBC car, so the 4.3 will be alittle on the load side I think.

Well I put the 4.3 back in the fiero hopefully for the last time... still lots of stuff to hookup but it is getting closer. Looks like I will be able to use the stock 4cly A/C lines (need to put the insulating sleeve back on).





I am about 75% done shortening/ternimating the ECM wires inside the car, but still need to finish the relays, 203 and ground. Maybe work will be kind this week and let be get home early so I can finish the wiring before next weekend.

looking awsome as usual. ain't wireing fun
You might want to check this outfit next time you need mandrel bends. they just had a price increase, but are still sustantially less than anywhere else I've found so far. quick service also.
http://www.magnumforce.com/ubend.asp

cheerio,
Russ544

Russ544, thanks for the compliment and the source for tubing. They are about $2 cheaper per bend, excluding shipping. I might have to try them out next time.

The wiring is getting very close to being complete. I just need to solder on the eyelit for the bundle of ground wires in the console. Other than that, the wiring is complete and here is a pic of inside the center console:


I need to work on getting the fuel lines connected and then the exhaust... then it will be close to starting it for the first time.

Today was my daughter Carrera's 2nd birthday... so that took most of my time today. But, she takes daily naps, so I did get a couple hours in the garage.

I cut the metal compression ends from the stock fuel lines. This left me with the hose barbs that will connect to the hard fuel lines at the intake. I also put a balloon flare on them to ensure the hoses will not slide off.


The fuel tanks was also removed to replace the current 5.7 TPI pump with a CPI rated pump (it runs at a higher pressure).


While the fuel tank is out I am planning to do a fuel tank capacity mod with the same end result as the one 84bill did but with a completely different approach:
https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/082612.html

This car is an 88, so it has the expansion tank on the upper passenger frame rail.

Excellent progress. It's always nice to see a plan come together.

Ron

Here is my version of the 84bill fuel tank capacity increase... I call it the snorkle version... USE AT YOUR OWN RISK.

Fuel expands/contracts with changes in temperature and it is important to ensure there is enough room in the tank for it to expand or it could push fuel into the evap canister. Gasoline expands at a rate of 0.00069 per degree F. So a 100 degree change in temperature with a 12 gallon tank will require .828 gallons of additional space. Expecting a 100 degree change is probably extreme, but it provides a since of scale.

Since my car is an 88, it has an external expansion tank on the upper passenger frame rail (I never measured it, but it might be .5 gallon). The top of the fuel fill vent tube is about 3" from the top of the tank. This creates an air pocket about 3" x 7" x 20" which is room for about 1.8 gallons of fuel (1 gallon more than needed for a 100 degree change - and assuming there was no secondary expansion tank). The goal is to lessen the size of this air pocket and allow more fuel in the tank.

Step 1: Drop the tank and remove fuel pump.
Step 2: Find someone with hands small enough to fit inside the fuel tank (my hands are now scraped and gouged, but I got the job done).
Step 3: Use a round tapered punch and insert it into the vent tube. You want to work it around the inside of the vent to smooth out the entrance.


Step 4: get some 1/2" aluminum tube from Home Depot (about $5 for a 3 foot piece) and bend it to this general shape.


Step 5: File/sand the end that will go into the vent tube. It needs to be tapered so it will slide into the vent tube and be held in place tight (the pic above has one end tapered already).

Step 6: Drill the smallest hole that you can in the bottom of the bend.


Step 7: Apply a thin coating of RTV to the tapered end (make sure to stay away from the hole) and insert into place. Apply pressure while rotating and slide it in as far as possible and make sure the tube is held snugly into place.


With this mod, the top of the vent is now 1" from the top of the tank. This should allow me to fill the tank with 1.2 additional gallons of gas which is more than a 10% increase for $5 and a little time. This will leave about .6 gallons of air space in the tank + the approximate .5 gallons in the expansion tank for expansion of the fuel.

A potential problem with the snorkle concept is that once the fuel goes over the top, the fuel will go down the new vent tube and be trapped there. This may (or may not) hinder the next fill up. A quick application of the brakes once the tank was 3/4 tank or less would most likely clear the snorkle. However, the very small hole will allow the fuel to seep out of the vent tube once the fuel level in the tank drops below the vent. The hole will also allow the fuel to enter once the fuel level is above the vent tube, but I think the last 1.0 to 1.5 gallons of fuel will enter the tank before the small hole will allow enough fuel to fill the vent tube... just have to wait and see.

I also took the time to see how close the fuel pump was to the bottom of the tank. With a nail wire tied to the bottom of the pump and sticking out about 1.5" from the bottom, the assy was put back into the tank. The nail hits the bottom first and then is pushed up the side of the pump. Make sure the pump assy is properly seated in the tank and then remove being careful not to bump the nail. On my tank the pump is within about 1/4" of the bottom and that is close enough for me.


The next step is to get the fuel sender reading correctly... reading E when the tank is within a gallon of being empty, not with 2-3 gallons of fuel left.

[This message has been edited by fieroguru (edited 03-09-2008).]

No pics for today, but I got the new CPI fuel pump installed, verified/adjusted the fuel sender, reinstalled the tank and completed the installation of the new fuel filter and fuel lines.

With the upper intake off, I pressurized the fuel lines to check for any leaks. When the pump was running it would reach almost 60 psi, but then fall off quickly once the pump stopped. Crimped off the return and the pressure would hold - bad pressure regulator. I swaped over the CPI injector (and regulator) from one of my spares and it was worse - pumped fuel out the regulator.

So I need to see if I can buy a rebuild kit for the regulator.

The rest of the day was spent cleaning up the garage... wiring crap all over the place.

My new 87-88 4 cylinder throttle cable came in last week and I was able to do some mocking up today.

It fits into the 4.3 bracket and had the needed barrel end, but the cable part is a little short:



I will have to cut up the 4.3 bracket and rework it for this cable...

Is the 4.3 going to Pontiac? Sounds like you did well. Congrats.

Ron

quote Originally posted by blackrams: Is the 4.3 going to Pontiac? Sounds like you did well. Congrats. Ron

I have not decided yet... Once I get the 4.3 running, it might be chosen to make the trip. The 4.3 would be more unique then the SBC, cost less for fuel on the trip and would have A/C! But the SBC car is just soo much fun to drive... It will be a tough decision.

quote Originally posted by fieroguru: I have not decided yet... Once I get the 4.3 running, it might be chosen to make the trip. The 4.3 would be more unique then the SBC, cost less for fuel on the trip and would have A/C! But the SBC car is just soo much fun to drive... It will be a tough decision.

Well, you know, there is a way for both to go.

Ron

Fixed the throttle/TV bracket today. I separated the TV portion from the throttle portion. Then cut the last 1/2" of the throttle end, moved it forward the needed distance, welded it in place, and cleaned up the edges. For the TV bracket, I just added a small gusset to the inside edge since it no longer connects to the throttle bracket.

Before:


After:

[This message has been edited by fieroguru (edited 03-29-2008).]

Got a bunch of loose ends cleaned up today:

Fuel system - complete and leak free.
Upper intake installed with new gasket.
All upper intake sensors plugged back in.
PCV tube bent from 3/8" aluminum and installed.
Throttle cable installed.
TV cable installed and adjusted the case length - still needs final adjustment to fine tune shift points.
Vac line to brake booster connected.
Vac line to tranny connected.
Plugged the heater return on the top of the waterpump
Connected the heater supply hose.
Installed the oil fill


Here it is with the Vortec cover:




I need to finish installing the coolant hoses and clamps.
Then I need to swap out the front exhaust manifold... I used the 3 bolt flanges for the exhaust pipes from my Bravada. They are the same size, but they will only fit the rear manifold (the new one). The front manifold must have come from a non-vortec engine since it is smaller. So the Bravada will lose yet another part (the driver side manifold). Then it will be time to start on the exhaust.

I realize this is exhausting work but, several of us would really like to see this project on the road.

Ron

I had to pick up some more welding wire today... but still was able to get a little more mocking up done. The muffler placement side to side was determined as well as the spacing and angle of the tips then they were tacked together:



Then the rest of the evening was spent mocking up the "rests" to hold the muffler/tail pipes in the proper location. I used some 1x1 coming off the bottom of the cradle with some shims between them and the pipes. Then shims on the side between the pipes and the back of the cradle. Last some jack stands to control the angle of the tips.

The rear down tube will be a 2 dayer....It started with the muffler in the proper place, then the front pipe in the right place, then the rear down pipe was roughed into shape and installed. Then multiple supports were tacked between the two exhaust pipes to keep the overall placement. Then out everything came again, more supports added and then the cutting began.

The front pipe was opened up to allow the rear pipe to enter it. The outline of the front tube was traced on the rear tube and then it will be cut open. Both tubes are 2 1/2" but at the muffler end it will be enlarged to 3" once it is all welded together.

This morning I finished cutting and tacking the rear down tube and tacked the muffler to the tube. I need to make 1 last "L" bend and fabrication of the exhaust will be complete and time to weld it up.

Very Nice Work there Paul!

Ron

thats pretty much how i did mine when it was N/A
looking good !

The exhaust is welded up and painted...




Here is a pic of the new wheels;

Coming along nicely, that exhaust looks great.

Now, if we could just hear it.

Ron

The exhaust is complete and installed. Here are the universal hangers supporting the tips:









Now back to other loose ends (I really want to here this thing startup this week).

Well the good news is that I started the 4.3 up for the 1st time today! The engine was a lot quieter that I would have thought, but then again I was focusing on something else. The motor has what appears to be a rough spot. The starter struggles to turn the motor past it, and while running the motor knocks... so much for the $200 motor that has been sitting for 2+ years. It ran fine when I pulled it, but something is not right with it anymore. I guess I will just pull the 4.3 from the Bravada.

I also figured out that you can use the stock 2.8 fiero plug wires on the 4.3... it is a snug fit, but they work (reused the ones from the old 2.8 vs. buying new ones right now... but eventually I would like to have red plug wires and route them off the valve covers)

Here is what it looks like ready to run (except for an air filter and PVC filter):

[This message has been edited by fieroguru (edited 05-04-2008).]

quote Originally posted by fieroguru: Well the good news is that I started the 4.3 up for the 1st time today! The engine was a lot quieter that I would have thought, but then again I was focusing on something else. The motor has what appears to be a rough spot. The starter struggles to turn the motor past it, and while running the motor knocks... so much for the $200 motor that has been sitting for 2+ years. It ran fine when I pulled it, but something is not right with it anymore. I guess I will just pull the 4.3 from the Bravada.

The "rough spot" could be carbon buildup on the combustion chamber/piston top. I've seen engines that have sat for a couple years get moisture in the carbon deposits, which swells it up enough to cause the simptoms you discrbe. if you know it ran good before, then I would strongly sugest you try a de-carbon before you go yanking it out and all.

cute kid you got there BTW. I'll bet she's a big help. if only they didn't grow up....................................

Russ544