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3800 Turbo Build by nosrac
Started on: 05-09-2012 10:45 PM
Replies: 787 (25415 views)
Last post by: MstangsBware on 08-27-2014 03:08 AM
nosrac
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Report this Post03-12-2013 07:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nosracSend a Private Message to nosracEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
SPRING


REBOOT


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BV MotorSports
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Report this Post03-12-2013 10:14 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BV MotorSportsClick Here to Email BV MotorSportsSend a Private Message to BV MotorSportsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I like those wheels! TSW by chance?
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Report this Post03-12-2013 11:01 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TXOPIEClick Here to visit TXOPIE's HomePageClick Here to Email TXOPIESend a Private Message to TXOPIEEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Nosrac,

So here is your build...very nice

TXOPIE

OPIES FIREO GTX BUILD
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Report this Post03-13-2013 06:27 AM Click Here to See the Profile for FormulaSend a Private Message to FormulaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
here we go!
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nosrac
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Report this Post03-16-2013 03:05 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nosracSend a Private Message to nosracEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Well just as I figured. The old heads were totally trashed. The head porting was a first class hack job. It was so utterly terrible that it robbed the car of ALL its low end power and started leaking as soon it saw any real boost.

I told them to leave the heads alone but they insisted and told me he would send them to a head porting shop.
Well they stayed in his shop and got butchered. I knew they were trash when I eyeballed them but my mechanic insured me they would be fine.....NOT I though they were still working them over and NOT a finished product because Stevie Wonder could have seen those were pure garbage.

The cosmetic gaskets did seal and my tune was fine.

Anyhoo the new shop is working away but I can't understand why he is doing extra work.
Like removing rear brakes and draining IC coolant. Getting air out the lebarron brakes and the IC pump to prime was brutal.
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BV MotorSports
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Report this Post03-16-2013 07:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BV MotorSportsClick Here to Email BV MotorSportsSend a Private Message to BV MotorSportsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Man you and I have no luck.. sorry for ya man. Hey, didnt you have some nice CNC w-body store heads?
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nosrac
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Report this Post03-17-2013 07:56 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nosracSend a Private Message to nosracEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by BV MotorSports:

I like those wheels! TSW by chance?


Ebay, VSR Victory 18x8

 
quote
Originally posted by BV MotorSports:

Man you and I have no luck.. sorry for ya man. Hey, didnt you have some nice CNC w-body store heads?


Yep, I bought the heads because I suspected I had a very bad porting job.

After eyeballing the hacking of heads and then troubleshooting my lack of power symptoms.I knew that I had to get replacement or upgraded heads.

I will redo the wastegate exhaust routing also as that is NOT optimal and may cause me some issues.
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Report this Post03-17-2013 08:05 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JustinbartSend a Private Message to JustinbartEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Should have shipped it up here.

------------------
Turbo 3800 E85 F23 5spd spec5
11.17@132.6

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nosrac
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Report this Post03-17-2013 08:24 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nosracSend a Private Message to nosracEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Justinbart:

Should have shipped it up here.



I sure would have as you guys Rock!

However, I didn't know you offered the service.

I had the best Fiero Mechanic in Texas but he is still working on that v8...LOL so I gotta roll the dice on a local shop.

The guy doing the install now said he performed a 3800SC swap in a Fiero before...yay..

Then he said it run's a 10 with the Gen III M90 and reworked GNX heads.
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Report this Post03-17-2013 08:30 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JustinbartSend a Private Message to JustinbartEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
...and then he lost all credibility.

------------------
Turbo 3800 E85 F23 5spd spec5
11.17@132.6

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nosrac
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Report this Post03-17-2013 08:58 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nosracSend a Private Message to nosracEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Justinbart:

...and then he lost all credibility.



Exactly...he has me very nervous but optimistic as there are some credible things he says. Like you can't effectively port head without a flowbench and whoever butchered your heads needs to be hog tied and pistol whipped.

Good things come out of bad situations all the time so if this shop screws it up then I hope to get a pity re-install from Mstangs or I'm sending it up there.
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nosrac
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Report this Post03-20-2013 03:41 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nosracSend a Private Message to nosracEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
How loose 70WHP/100TQ



Just One Exhaust Port is Hogged out.


Intake ports rounded at corners and needed to be sealed with gasket maker.




And the Kicker ....
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Report this Post03-20-2013 04:02 PM Click Here to See the Profile for LFiero67Click Here to Email LFiero67Send a Private Message to LFiero67Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Wow, just wow.

------------------
10.263 @ 134.44MPH - 1.49 60'
Billet 6262 Precision turbo, PT1001 intercooler, ST1 cam, 130lb springs, comp pushrods, HV3, ARP Rod bolts, otherwise stock L36.


Old M90 XP Cam time -
11.425 @115.60
1.543 60'

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nosrac
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Report this Post03-20-2013 04:15 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nosracSend a Private Message to nosracEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
And the Kicker ....
So I purchased ZZP stainless steel Larger turbo valves.....

 
quote
Sometimes larger valves can be installed in an engine to increase flow. However, the addition of larger valves should be checked on the flowbench when doing head R&D because larger valves can sometimes show a lesser flow due to an increase in valve shrouding. Heads with valves close to the periphery of the cylinder or engines with deep combustion chambers and small bores are prone to situation. This is because a larger valve can put the edge of the valve in close proximity to the combustion chamber wall, blocking the flow of air from the port or exhaust flow out of the port.

Airflow at low-valve lift is critical in making lots of horsepower because the valves spend more dwell time at low lifts and near their opening and closing points than at full lift. In simple terms, the valve is only fully open once per intake or exhaust cycle, but is near its seat twice, since the valve has to both open and close. That is the primary reason why a simple valve job can make so much of a difference in flow and horsepower.


Soooo....!!!

Wait for it....Pic to come !

[This message has been edited by nosrac (edited 03-20-2013).]

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nosrac
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Report this Post03-20-2013 04:38 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nosracSend a Private Message to nosracEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Correctly ported valves which are seated valves borrowed from member FieroAddicted.



 
quote
Another trick is to reduce the diameter of the valve stem directly under the head of the valve. The valve's stem is turned down a few millimeters, effectively shrinking the stem so it blocks less of the port


Now look at mine !




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BV MotorSports
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Report this Post03-20-2013 07:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BV MotorSportsClick Here to Email BV MotorSportsSend a Private Message to BV MotorSportsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
And I thought my Whodumbass heads were bad!
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nosrac
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Report this Post03-20-2013 07:59 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nosracSend a Private Message to nosracEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by BV MotorSports:

And I thought my Whodumbass heads were bad!


Yeah, my heads were so bad... That I thought my turbo 3800 suxed major azz.

I had 0 low end power, nada, zilch, outta there. I was very disappointed to say the least !

I put a very aggressive tune on and it bumped up from the Iron puke power to an 2.8 auto.

The mods I HAD (Stock TC & .81AR housing) probably would have worked much better if the heads weren't trashed.

Gee, I hope the cam was put in right.
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Report this Post03-20-2013 08:04 PM Click Here to See the Profile for doublec4Click Here to Email doublec4Send a Private Message to doublec4Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Who built it?
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Report this Post03-20-2013 09:15 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BV MotorSportsClick Here to Email BV MotorSportsSend a Private Message to BV MotorSportsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by nosrac:

Gee, I hope the cam was put in right.


If I didnt do it, I assume nothing was done correctly anymore! So, check everything.
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nosrac
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Report this Post03-20-2013 09:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nosracSend a Private Message to nosracEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by doublec4:

Who built it?


The hired help at my old mechanic's shop.

He could install/assemble complete kits well but the specialized skills such welding not so great and porting the heads he failed miserably at it.

They were trying to go all out but really didn't know what the hell they were doing. Building a high performance engine is a lot different than diagnosing and replacing stock parts.

I let them do their thing instead of dictate how, what, and why but that only works for people who know what they are doing and have done it before.

I tried to buy ALL bolt on stuff or take it to specialty shops, like a muffler shop to weld on the waste gate but they told me they could do a lot of it. (Doing it and Doing it well are NOT the same thing)

The few items I did take to specialty shops such as the BOV welded onto the intake were top notch jobs.

The not so great custom parts (low mount alt "kit)" and custom jobs (wastegate dump into the exhaust) will get redone.

If I ever do it from scratch again, I know the formula to make it very easy on the installer. A shop would basically bolt on the turbo "kit" with NO issues. Everything would fit perfectly and work as expected.


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nosrac
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Report this Post03-20-2013 10:18 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nosracSend a Private Message to nosracEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Member this...on 7-20 I fixed a vac line and turned up the boost to 11 psi and for the first and last time the Turbo put a smile on my face.

 
quote
Originally posted by nosrac:

The new turbo setup is NOT fast off the line or fast period off boost as it feels like a 2.8 with a TH125C auto.
However, when the boost comes in very smooth, the acceleration increases which is totally different than a SC.
The SC acceleration was constant until middle of second and then it fell off.
With the Turbo, the acceleration rate increases and I haven't felt it fall off, which keeps you planted in the seat.
This effect is even more pronounced when you turn up the boost, as it keeps pulling harder.

from a start 10 to 100 it's wicked insane velocity. A Hayabusa ain't Got $h!t on me.



Then the intake started leaking coolant like Niagara falls and I was back to Iron puke power.

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Report this Post03-20-2013 10:37 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FormulaSend a Private Message to FormulaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by nosrac:


If I ever do it from scratch again, I know the formula to make it very easy on the installer. A shop would basically bolt on the turbo "kit" with NO issues. Everything would fit perfectly and work as expected.



Send it to the motor city.

I'm glad to see your back on track!
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Report this Post03-22-2013 05:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mptigheSend a Private Message to mptigheEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Come down anytime, and I'll take you for a ride in mine now that it's here.
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nosrac
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Report this Post03-22-2013 09:21 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nosracSend a Private Message to nosracEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by mptighe:

Come down anytime, and I'll take you for a ride in mine now that it's here.


I used to come to Houston every monthly for a week for work but don't have that job anymore.

I hope to see you at some shows though and I WILL accept that offer to drive.
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Report this Post04-03-2013 11:02 AM Click Here to See the Profile for NoMoreRicersClick Here to Email NoMoreRicersSend a Private Message to NoMoreRicersEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Bump!
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nosrac
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Report this Post04-03-2013 11:40 AM Click Here to See the Profile for nosracSend a Private Message to nosracEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
It is "ALIVE" but I need to do some minor work before I turn up the boost, hit the track, and make more zr1 kill videos.
(fix oil leaks, add 88 tank, swap to S10 brake booster, Tune, etc).

Mstangs is coming over to help a brother out...

Since the CNC head change and correct plugs installed AL 103's I have gained about 100hp off boost.

PT 6266 spools very quickly and can finally spin those 18" shoes when the turbo hitz.

Can't wait until I turn it up the boost to 18psi+ cause the butt dyno says I can run 11.3 on the current setting of 11psi.
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Report this Post04-03-2013 12:36 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BV MotorSportsClick Here to Email BV MotorSportsSend a Private Message to BV MotorSportsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Good on ya... maybe sometime soon mine will be running as well. RIght now I am in heat-wrap hell...so itchy!
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Report this Post04-04-2013 07:34 AM Click Here to See the Profile for FormulaSend a Private Message to FormulaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
sweet! I can't wait to see video.

Are you running 93?
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nosrac
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Report this Post04-04-2013 11:34 AM Click Here to See the Profile for nosracSend a Private Message to nosracEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Formula:

sweet! I can't wait to see video.

Are you running 93?


Yep, it runs very well.

Just the seemingly little things ie. spark plugs (type, gap, heat range) make a hella difference.

The stock plugs and gap worked great for cruising as I had absolutely great fuel trims. In WOT they also broke the rear loose as soon as the turbo hit ~1.2 sec.
However, spark blowout was horrible at anything close to 4K rpm and it did not let the car shift properly.

The AL103 don't hit as hard but I don't have spark blowout either. The trims are NOT spot on anymore but I will fix that when I tune it.
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Report this Post04-04-2013 03:48 PM Click Here to See the Profile for darkhorizonSend a Private Message to darkhorizonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
You have another problem if changing your plugs made something "not hit as hard"
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Report this Post04-04-2013 05:56 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JustinbartSend a Private Message to JustinbartEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I hear the platinum 8 prong plugs hit extra hard

------------------
Turbo 3800 E85 F23 5spd spec5
11.17@132.6

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Report this Post04-04-2013 05:58 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nosracSend a Private Message to nosracEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by darkhorizon:

You have another problem if changing your plugs made something "not hit as hard"


You may b right. My testing results were definitely skewed before because of something was terribly wrong with the build.

It's NO telling what may be wrong as I get one issue fixed I find another. It could have been the colder weather or low trans fluid made it hit harder, I really dunno?

What I do know is that it did hit harder as I would break the rear loose every time. After, I got the plugs changed along with filling the trans fluid and a alignment.

It still Hitz just not as hard....lol

I don't have any scan data to back up my butt dyno claims. But it definitely hit harder.

Hell, I'm just glad my turbo hitz at all. It sure as hell didn't do that before.
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Report this Post04-04-2013 06:00 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nosracSend a Private Message to nosracEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

nosrac

3500 posts
Member since Jan 2005
 
quote
Originally posted by Justinbart:

I hear the platinum 8 prong plugs hit extra hard



Tru Dat..

Hell the wrong gap can keep the car from hitting higher RPM. Why can't that same wrong gap help it in lower RPM's. Sounds reasonable to me.
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Report this Post04-04-2013 08:26 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JustinbartSend a Private Message to JustinbartEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
.
------------------
Turbo 3800 E85 F23 5spd spec5
11.17@132.6

[This message has been edited by Justinbart (edited 04-05-2013).]

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Report this Post04-05-2013 12:56 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JustinbartSend a Private Message to JustinbartEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
.

------------------
Turbo 3800 E85 F23 5spd spec5
11.17@132.6

[This message has been edited by Justinbart (edited 04-05-2013).]

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Report this Post04-05-2013 01:16 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mattwaClick Here to Email mattwaSend a Private Message to mattwaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Justinbart:

I hear the platinum 8 prong plugs hit extra hard



They hit that hard eh? So hard that you had to post it 3 times?
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Report this Post04-05-2013 01:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FormulaSend a Private Message to FormulaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I think cell phones like to repost things, I know mine does.
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Report this Post04-05-2013 01:21 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JustinbartSend a Private Message to JustinbartEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Ooops
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Report this Post04-05-2013 02:12 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mattwaClick Here to Email mattwaSend a Private Message to mattwaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I posted on my Android phone countless times here and never had a problem...jinx.
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Report this Post04-05-2013 02:42 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mptigheSend a Private Message to mptigheEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by mattwa:

I posted on my Android phone countless times here and never had a problem...jinx.


Looks like he needs anti-lag for his phone.
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