quote Originally posted by Doug85GT: BTW: Osama was found using water boarding.

The helicopter's engines were damaged from sand stirred up by rotor wash, according to an interview I heard yesterday evening. Pretty much the same thing that doomed Carter's hostage rescue attempt. As to waterboarding, we use it too. A lot. One guy in Guantanimo was waterboarded almost 300 times.

quote Originally posted by JazzMan: and yet you reduce all of Islam to a simple little thing...

I did no such thing. I said that Islam has a history of recruiting amongst dissatisfied Americans whereas the other major religions do not. I did not say All Islam does this everywhere.
You are reading things into my posts based on your inaccurate opinion of me. In other words, you are prejudging.

[This message has been edited by Scottzilla79 (edited 05-03-2011).]

quote Originally posted by Scottzilla79: I did no such thing. I said that Islam has a history of recruiting amongst dissatisfied Americans whereas the other major religions do not. I did not say All Islam does this everywhere. You are reading things into my posts based on your inaccurate opinion of me. In other words, you are prejudging.

So when you say "Islam has a history of recruiting amongst dissatisfied Americans" you're not really referring to all of Islam, right? Sorry, I misunderstood because the way you structured that sentence it seemed to mean all of Islam, not some sects of it. Oh, and might want to mention the no-recruiting thing to the evangelists...

The things I read into your posts are based on dictionary definitions of the words you choose and standard understandings of the way you structure your sentences. If you want to mean something different try writing something different.

As an aside, though my opinion of you may not be reflective of everyone's opinion of you, it is surely based 100% on your actions to me and the behavior I've seen here on the forum. As such, to me it's very accurate. Want me to have a different opinion of your character and actions? Show me something different. I'd be more than happy to see a different side of you than what I've seen here so far.

FINALLY?



(edited for punctuation)
------------------

Drive safely!

[This message has been edited by NEPTUNE (edited 05-03-2011).]

quote Originally posted by JazzMan: So when you say "Islam has a history of recruiting amongst dissatisfied Americans" you're not really referring to all of Islam, right? Sorry, I misunderstood because the way you structured that sentence it seemed to mean all of Islam, not some sects of it. Oh, and might want to mention the no-recruiting thing to the evangelists...

Really? I did not say All Islam, I said Islam. go look up the word all. Nor did I say they are the only ones recruiting, I said there is a history of recruiting Americans who have some anger or resentment to American Government or History.

quote Originally posted by JazzMan: The things I read into your posts are based on dictionary definitions of the words you choose and standard understandings of the way you structure your sentences. If you want to mean something different try writing something different.

You don't 'read into' with standard definitions. To read into is to infer. As in, you are putting some meaning into the words that may or may not be there. And even when I clarify for you, that I'm not speaking of all Islam, you ignore it.
Read this again:

quote While Stan is on one extreme, the other extreme is those that say there are no Muslims in the us who side with the Al Queda cause. It is a religion that has for decades appealed to some Americans who hate their country for various reasons. I don't really see that history with the other major religions. That is not the fault of the peace loving Muslims, but it is a fact.

Do I not explicitly mention peace-loving Muslims? Did the fact I left the hyphen out confuse you? Wouldn't it have been more CIVIL to ask me to clarify rather than try to 'school me' or make me look ignorant?

I don't care what you think about me Jazz, it's obvious you have something personal against me, but I do not want you poisoning the opinions of others.

quote Originally posted by NEPTUNE: FINALLY!

Not quite, Taliban and al quada have been functioning for quite some time without input from bin laden.

quote Originally posted by htexans1: Not quite, Taliban and al quada have been functioning for quite some time without input from bin laden.

Really, Then Why did he have two couriers? Beer Runs?

BIN LADEN IS NOT DEAD, SHOW ME PROOF.

OR, He has been dead for years housed by the usa,

quote Originally posted by Wolfhound: Really, Then Why did he have two couriers? Beer Runs?

Beer (and sneaking in extra wife) runs.

Actually the couriers were probably advising him on what happend. Regional AQ leaders actually do the leadership functions. Also, Bin Laden has no leadership of AQAP, or other African linked AQ chapters.

[This message has been edited by htexans1 (edited 05-03-2011).]

We're getting so many stories about what happened, we don't know what to believe. I'm starting to wonder if the Seals shot up a brothel and UBL wasn't even there.

To Kill A Mockingturd

quote Originally posted by 84fiero123: I just saw this on this mornings news and all I saw was a cartoon of the op. all those special forces guys wear cameras. I want video conformation. Not cartoons. I want that MF hanging from the monument we have at the twin towers. If they don’t show us pictures, video it didn’t happen. I want the ass holes body here in America were we can cut off his fkn head, then have horse pull his body apart. And hang that from the highest building in America. Sorry if I pissed in anyone’s cheerios but I want proof, not a cartoon. I want the video of the special ops. If and I say if he really is dead I want to see his dead fkn body. Steve

Steve,

Why don't you tell us how you feel?

I dont know whos idea it was but im rollin with it - ill give you the credit for inspiring me though


OSMA BIN FISHFOOD bumper stickers! Special pennocks price to be established, whos in?

quote Originally posted by weloveour86se: Million dollar idea.............. I KILLED OSAMA Bumper-Stickers! Remember the old school, I KILLED JR. stickers? lol

Or, "Who shot Bin Ladin?" Taken from the Dallas TV series-"Who shot JR?"

I actually find it hard to believe they'd just kill him, if it wasn't necessary (such as he was armed and firing back). They could, as Glenn Beck put it, "ghost" him - capture him and not tell anyone. Hide him somewhere. Pump him for info. Hell, I say use sodium pentathol or whatever they have these days and interrogate him until he sings like a canary.

So, here we are several days after, and the dust is settling. What is to see? Right wingers pissed that Osama Bin Laden is killed on Obama's watch by Obama's order. What's wrong with you people? Are you now praying for massive retaliation to make Obama look bad? How many conspiracy theories can you juggle at one time anyway? How dead does Bin Laden need to be? Get a grip and try being patriotic Americans in fact instead of just in your heads. Jeeezz.

quote Originally posted by weaselbeak: Get a grip and try being patriotic Americans in fact instead of just in your heads. Jeeezz.

After the way folks like you treated President Bush, Republicans, and US...you gotta be f***ing kidding.

Welcome to payback. It's a b****, ain't it?

Again, the only way Id say Obama was responsible IF the mission failed and he got away, was if the military was waiting so long to get his authorization (unneeded as far as Im concerned). During VN, the only rule we had that needed presidential approval was targets in North Vietnam. 'Unfortunately' for VN we had lot of accidental bombings of unauthorized targets. For example, we were not supposed to attack an AA gun in a park or on the roof of a office bldg. We regarded them as targets of opportunity and attacked them anyway. OOPs.... my bomb release malfunctioned.

Might not have been Obama's decision. From an unnamed source, so treat with all due skepticism...

White House Insider: Obama Hesitated – Panetta Issued Order to Kill Osama Bin Laden
http://socyberty.com/issues...ill-osama-bin-laden/

Other "Insider" reports:
http://www.triond.com/users/Ulsterman

quote Originally posted by weaselbeak: Right wingers pissed that Osama Bin Laden is killed on Obama's watch by Obama's order. What's wrong with you people?

[PERSONAL OPINION]

It's frickin' awesome Bin Laden has finally been caught and killed but it sucks big time it's going to increase Obama's chance on a second term. People are going to vote for him because "he caught Bin Laden" and not because of what he's doing (or not doing) for the US. Personally I think he's destroying your country and in my opinion the sooner he's out of Office the better.

So yeah, I'm not ashamed to admit I'm pissed this is drawing away attention from other things. It's like the guy who constantly beats up his wife and kids but is suddenly a hero because he happened to be at the right place and at the right time to save some old lady from being run over by a car or something.

[/PERSONAL OPINION]

Edit: notice all the disclaimers and such? This is my personal opinion. So please don't send me emails you no longer wish to participate on PFF because the opinion of its moderator is so different than yours.

quote Originally posted by fierobear: I actually find it hard to believe they'd just kill him, if it wasn't necessary (such as he was armed and firing back). They could, as Glenn Beck put it, "ghost" him - capture him and not tell anyone. Hide him somewhere. Pump him for info. Hell, I say use sodium pentathol or whatever they have these days and interrogate him until he sings like a canary.

I suspect he been dead for years, they just now dumped the body.........

quote Originally posted by Cliff Pennock: ...but it sucks big time it's going to increase Obama's chance on a second term.

The timing there IS interesting, isn't it? I'm actually surprised the Democrats haven't asked Obama to not seek a second term. Hopefully the excitement doesn't last THAT long.

quote Originally posted by Cliff Pennock: [PERSONAL OPINION] he happened to be at the right place and at the right time to save some old lady from being run over by a car or something. [/PERSONAL OPINION] Edit: notice all the disclaimers and such? This is my personal opinion. So please don't send me emails you no longer wish to participate on PFF because the opinion of its moderator is so different than yours.

Cliff, Something you may find interesting is that Bush dissolved the CIA department that was actively hunting Bin Laden in 2006.
This was done "coincidentally" with in a month of bin Laden moving into his new built abode. I'm curious about that I'm not real big on coincidence. Maybe the computers , documents and portable hard drives will shed some lite on that.
Obama re-formed that unit immediately upon taking office as he stated in his campaign he would do. He stated the mission was not complete in Afghanistan until Osama was brought to justice.
Successfully done I might add.
I realize the republican spin is that he was sitting at the White House when someone told him what happen. That's Bull. They have known his location since August and used and refined the information to make the mission successful.
I think a lot of people are panicking that there will be retaliation. Those people have surrendered to terrorism.
As for as Obama not being in harms way? Again bull. Seal team six did their job well, but now they are protected by anonymity. They and their families are safe from retaliation. That's a luxury not afforded their Commander in Chief. Don't you think he had to take that into consideration?
Of course he did. Was it a gutsy move. Damn right it was.

Informed opinions are more of more importance than personal opinions. PFF is not politically informative in the real world, It's extreamly partisan and the right wing hate has taken on an elementry school flavor. There are other forums where political discusion actually takes place in civil manner.
You may have better information, if you are privy to Ulanstans " Paki intel "(that may be three Words?). but most likley, that involves a petting zoo and something he heard while sharing a pet goat.

quote Originally posted by fierobear: Might not have been Obama's decision. From an unnamed source, so treat with all due skepticism... White House Insider: Obama Hesitated – Panetta Issued Order to Kill Osama Bin Laden http://socyberty.com/issues...ill-osama-bin-laden/ Other "Insider" reports: http://www.triond.com/users/Ulsterman

It's either well written fiction or plausible.

quote Originally posted by carnut122: It's either well written fiction or plausible.

Yeah, we can't know if it's real. The only indication is that the older info from the Insider seemed to come true. But skepticism is in order.

Anyone else hear reports of the Helicopters used being "stealth" choppers?

[This message has been edited by newf (edited 05-04-2011).]

I assume that the Democrats among us simply *trust* Obama that Bin Laden was just killed? No photos released, body dumped in the ocean immediately...how many of you would have trusted Bush, if that was the story given?

quote Originally posted by fierobear: I assume that the Democrats among us simply *trust* Obama that Bin Laden was just killed? No photos released, body dumped in the ocean immediately...how many of you would have trusted Bush, if that was the story given?

I'm not really sure I believe anything I hear from our government.
i just say, "Ok for now, untill something else comes out or changes."
The truth has become whatever each person wants to believe.
Truth used to be a brick, but now it is playdoh, shaped to fit whatever situation it needs to be inserted into.
And then it evolves as more and more information is manipulated to fit the program, untill it is accepted by most out of shear exhuastion from trying to get it to all make sence.

So Laden is dead?
Ok.
How, when, & where, will keep evolving until they get a story to congeal that will seemingly fit and be accepted.

Can a person become a willing sheeple simply out of shear exhaustion from being told so many lies for so long that he just don't care what the truth is anymore?

[This message has been edited by Boondawg (edited 05-05-2011).]

quote Originally posted by fierobear: I actually find it hard to believe they'd just kill him, if it wasn't necessary (such as he was armed and firing back). They could, as Glenn Beck put it, "ghost" him - capture him and not tell anyone. Hide him somewhere. Pump him for info. Hell, I say use sodium pentathol or whatever they have these days and interrogate him until he sings like a canary.

They couldn't bring him back alive. Due process in this regard would have made it that we would have never gotten the justification needed. OBL was on dialysis and his days were limited to begin with. he would have surely died in prison before any kind of execution could have been done on him. this being if al quida dident pull some bold move to break him out.

That being said. Do i think hes dead. ...yes Do I think there are things the government is not telling us.... Yes. do i think obahma is trying to cover something up by not releasing any death photos.... you better believe it. The timing of this whole event it just to spot on. Hes up for reelection next year. He knows hes in trouble. whos to say they havent had OBL body for a while now and are now saying hes dead to boost moral in the presidents favor. I wont get into a political debate with anyone but i do have questions.

[This message has been edited by pontiackid86 (edited 05-05-2011).]

quote Originally posted by fierobear: I assume that the Democrats among us simply *trust* Obama that Bin Laden was just killed? No photos released, body dumped in the ocean immediately...how many of you would have trusted Bush, if that was the story given?

So, like the religious nut job that loves to burn the Quran-you have no problem with putting your suspensions to rest while placing OUR troops in harms way?


Maybe that's something the last Administration might have done, but I even I seriously doubt that. I know it must pain you deeply that the Obama Administration got the #1 guy, and not Bush, but that's something you're going to have to deal with. Hey, who knows. maybe the next administration might capture the #2 guy. However, while you're waiting. Take two Aleve for all day relief.

[This message has been edited by madcurl (edited 05-05-2011).]

If Obama were pulling a fast one for political reasons, he'd have waited until the election is closer. Since the GOP has nobody threatening him in the polls much, he had no reason at all to pull such a big stunt. He said while debating McCain that he'd go get Bin Laden in Pakistan if that's where he was found. McCain and the GOP ridiculed the very thought. This could have gone very wrong with ease and ruined him politically. It was a gutsy call, doing what he said he would do to bring down America's #1 enemy. I don't care how it went, firefight or simple execution mob style. It was done and deservedly so. The mass murderer is dead. Save the conspiracy theories for the nutjobs who grind on pure hatred. If this had happened exactly the same under Bush, all the right wing radicals in denial would be hailing the conquering hero.

I don't really care how the killing was carried out or by whom just glad that he's extinct from this Earth.

What shocks me the most is why did they go through the dignified trouble of cleansing the body, wrapping it in a white sheet, and having some sort of funeral before dropping the corpse into the ocean? Why bother? What did he do to deserve this type of dignified service when he instantly slaughtered thousands of lives in America and abroad?

As far as I'm concerned his corpse deserved to be put into a wood chipper mixed in with pork bellies. Can someone explain to me how a matter of fact assassination is then followed by some bizarre ritual to wish him well on his way? What kind of superstitious BS is that?

quote Originally posted by fierobear: Yeah, we can't know if it's real. The only indication is that the older info from the Insider seemed to come true. But skepticism is in order.

Fierobear. Pennock's doubting Thomas. Dude, quit trying to spike the ball.

"We don't need to spike the football"

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/...n_re_us/us_bin_laden

quote Originally posted by newf: Anyone else hear reports of the Helicopters used being "stealth" choppers?

Yes, somewhat. The stealth I heard about was super efficient mufflers. I also heard that the element of surprise was helped, because in that the area had Pakistani military training and bases, helicopters were sort of an every day sound.

[This message has been edited by cliffw (edited 05-05-2011).]

quote Originally posted by madcurl: Fierobear. Pennock's doubting Thomas. Dude, quit trying to spike the ball. "We don't need to spike the football" http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/...n_re_us/us_bin_laden

What, Curl, ANOTHER screw up today?

I wasn't talking about the picture, or whether Bin Laden is dead, or if it happened a couple of days ago. Read what I wrote again. It is about this website, and whether it is really a "White House Insider" giving real information:

http://www.triond.com/users/Ulsterman