1st Amendment only applies to the public square. An employer can tell you what you can and cannot say in a workplace environment.
Why leftist hate free speech when it goes against them, but somehow love to say that free speech applies everywhere, including K-12 public schools and athletes while at work.
Yeah! It's ok for these players to somehow protest by kneeling during the Anthem, which by the way is a violation of the NFL's own code.
But the NFL banned the Dallas Cowboys from putting on a small sticker on the helmet that supports cops who died from a BLM violent protest event. They also banned the use of NFL athletes from wearing 9/11 tribute cleats.
But they support a failed and grumled mix race pumk who think he is a product of police brutality by kneeling or sitting or remaining in the locker room during the national anthem is somehow a way to put a spotlight on police brutality against black criminals?
Policy brutality is wrong. Politicians, Entertainers and Sports Athletes kneeling or ignoring the anthem isn't a protest, it's just them wanting to feel good about themselves and their ego.
A real protest is when the average person takes it to the public square in a peaceful manor.
Go a kneel on a street corner for the protest of police brutality. Would you? I bet not a single leftest, Threedog person is going to do that. Antifa and BLM are for looters and gang bangers. Although Threedog like that, because it is against the "man" and support people like that. But he is too weak to throw a brick at police for sure.
But he is also too weak to protest, even peacefully, for himself against any cause. He want to live it through the celebrities. Then he acts like he is a part of the protest because he supports them.
[This message has been edited by Wichita (edited 09-27-2017).]
But the media says acts of racism can only come from whites. Who am I supposed to believe? Some logical people on forum or liars and socialist propagandists on the idiot box?
Your moronic leftist antics make me gloriously happy.
My outlook for this country is filled with new optimism every time you leftist sh*tbags pull another stunt.
There isn't one single time that you idiots have ever read the conscience of the majority of Americans correctly.
NOT. ONE.
MORE childish antics! Give us a LOT MORE!
I want you to do everything you can to make absolutely certain that you jackwipes never hold political power in this country again, so KEEP AT IT...PLEASE!
Who would have ever thought that conservatives would win the "culture war" because leftists committed political and cultural suicide.
This is WONDERFUL !
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 09-27-2017).]
That's actually pretty typical. Teachers are often left leaning and I'm not really sure why.
Because the education studies departments of many of our universities are filled with drooling, communist / leftist professors and graduate students.
They understand the power of indoctrinating young people as early as possible.
Add to that the fact that young university students learning to be teachers are themselves victims of early indoctrination before they ever got to the university.
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 09-27-2017).]
All these protest, kneeling, locking arms and such are phony displays meant to stroke the player egos. In time they will tire of the protests and go back to standing during the National Anthem because the newness of their woke state will have worn off.
However, Trump’s argument of American pride will not have changed. This enduring approach will be exactly the same a year from now.
Who’s the winner?
Trump.
So, learn a lesson.
When you protest make it stick, don't look like a dick.
The funny part is that they protests that "don't look like a dick" don't stick, because thats not how the national news media works.
Women marched all across this country. What did this forum do? Called them stupid, called them morons, called them disrespectful.... You act like the method matters, but it doesn't. You just don't want to hear about it.
Also, what is this, the Soviet Union? The beauty of the United States is that you don't have to love it. You don't have to appreciate the United States if you live in it, you are free and you should criticize its faults. The only way we get better as a nation is to criticize ourselves and change to adapt to the world. If we blindly show patriotism then we are no different than many of the countries we claim are the "enemies of freedom".
Why protest in a way that alienates your audience?
These athletes and celebrities have vast monetary resources and access to brilliant messaging and organizing people....it would be advantageous to them to spend THEIR time and monies in working toward a positive set of solutions. Advertising, community outreach, educational seminars.....this community of the inner city has many issues that can be cured with knowledge, personal responsibility and opportunity.
Why is it that this community that cries out 'Police Brutality' doesn't police their own as far as teaching them to be law-abiding and respectful of their elders? Why does this community have crime rates, out of wedlock birth rates, death rates far above any community in our Nation?
Why is it always someone else's fault?
Why can't these concerned citizens do something positive and uniting in their communities, rather than just being divisive to the nation at large?
To be honest, any and all arguments defending this disrespectful act is falling on my deaf ears. I really don't care who the protestors are or what their issue is.
No one says they don't have the right to protest but, the method of this protest is not the way to reduce racism. Anyone desiring to start a pissing contest knows how. Too many people have served and given all for that flag and anthem. I don't care what the cause is, to disrespect that flag is disrespecting the folks we honor on Veteran's Day. I find that disgusting.
I don't care if they are black, white, brown, yellow or green. I don't care if they are men or women or something in between. I don't care what their religion is. The whole point is, it's insulting and I will not even consider the reasons behind it. Find a different path. If that is seen as racism, then so be it.
------------------ Ron
Isn't it strange that after a bombing, everyone blames the bomber, his upbringing, his environment, his culture, his mental state but … after a shooting, the problem is the gun.... Open your frigg'n minds, think about all the other tools that can be made into WMDs.
I sincerely hope that life is never discovered on another planet because, sure as hell Progressives and Socialists will want to send them money.
Originally posted by Threedog: The funny part is that they protests that "don't look like a dick" don't stick, because thats not how the national news media works.
Women marched all across this country. What did this forum do? Called them stupid, called them morons, called them disrespectful.... You act like the method matters, but it doesn't. You just don't want to hear about it.
...
Slow down with your anger. You are difficult to follow when you post gibberish. Just a learned observation.
Women marched...? You caught a hit of some good CNN bull kaka?
Can white men march for a cause? If so, what is an acceptable cause that would suit you liberals?
Players have been trying for years to get attention for BLM, ever since Ferguson. People just rolled their eyes and kept watching the games.
Wearing a BLM t-shirt during a press conference got little attention too:
No one cared about Beyonce's BLM halftime show either:
Now they crossed the line. They show blatant disrespect for the National Anthem which is disrespecting the sacrifices that soldiers made for this country. These NFL players protesting are using the same tactics as the Westboro Baptist Church. They are deliberately being offensive to the country to get attention since their other tactics failed.
[This message has been edited by Doug85GT (edited 09-27-2017).]
Whats been said many times before, even in here, is that blacks are FARRRRR more racist than almost ANY whites. I just saw a message on my Directv that there is now a black women only channel to show the beauty of black women. Using my American Constitutional right, I think black women are ugly and have big butts. Their hair is nasty and takes a bottle of cologne to make them bearable in the same room. Thats my opinion and my right to say it. Wheres my channel all about only hot blonde scandinavian or Australian women ? I guess the liberals wont allow that because its not politically correct.
These protestors that dont even know what theyre actually protesting are invited to go to another country any time they wish. Ill even give them the plane ticket if they sign a statement they will never return to the US. I think the cops should just automatically shoot any black running from them, because they either committed a crime or will commit one. Im tired of taxpayers having to try them, and feed them when convicted. Just make it open season and be done with it. Im also sick of the riots, looting, crime and having to see or listen to them on the news. Theyre like a resistant virus you cant seem to get rid of.
Originally posted by Threedog: The only way we get better as a nation is to criticize ourselves and change to adapt to the world. If we blindly show patriotism then we are no different than many of the countries we claim are the "enemies of freedom".
What? So the only way we get better is to make up a problem, one that doesn't really exist... Then disrespect an entire group of people... And then adapt to the world... The world that we are better than.... You are an SOB.
I didn't take up arms because I wanted to kill. I didn't take up arms because someone forced me. I took up arms to defend those that can't or won't. I took up arms to protect those I love and the country that gave me the choice to do so. I took up arms because I saw my brothers and sisters selflessly laying down their lives. I respect the flag and anthem for what they stand for. I respect the office of the President even when I couldn't respect the man. I refuse to disrespect my country because a few of you say I should. Want to make a difference you need to protest a different way. Disrespecting the entire country because of a small part of it is wrong. Want change start at home. Take a knee with your family.
President Trump’s numbers in these polls aren’t good – just 35% of Americans believe Trump should have commented on the issue, according to the Reuters/Ipsos poll. But there’s enough evidence here to suggest that both sides will continue to think that they’re winning, even though the public is more unified than polarized.
Now someone knelt at the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier. ...
One group of people showed up to pay respect. Another group showed up to disrupt the other's respect.
I would be obligated to speak up against that well dressed, groomed, and intelligent individual kneeling. And tell him to become a man, not a child. ****ing losers.
This is the last paragraph: [QUOTE]President Trump’s numbers in these polls aren’t good – just 35% of Americans believe Trump should have commented on the issue, according to the Reuters/Ipsos poll. But there’s enough evidence here to suggest that both sides will continue to think that they’re winning, even though the public is more unified than polarized.
[/QUOTE]
Cherry picking again? There were other polling numbers in that article and yet, you only present the one anti-Trump number. Hmmm................. I really don't care much for President Donald J. Trump. So, don't think I support him of everything but, your obvious bias is showing.
------------------ Ron
Isn't it strange that after a bombing, everyone blames the bomber, his upbringing, his environment, his culture, his mental state but … after a shooting, the problem is the gun.... Open your frigg'n minds, think about all the other tools that can be made into WMDs.
I sincerely hope that life is never discovered on another planet because, sure as hell Progressives and Socialists will want to send them money.
It's a very brief report. I emphasized that (the brevity of the report) so as to encourage the participants here to use the link that I provided and go directly to the report.
Cherry picking? I think not.
It's my opinion that the most impressive single number from these polls is that only about 32 out of every 100 Americans think it was a good idea for President Trump to comment on how the NFL players are conducting themselves during the National Anthem. That is a poll result that was obtained by Reuters/IPSOS.
So says the Daily Wire.
But I wanted to make this report from the Daily Wire, as brief as it is, accessible to anyone who would like to evaluate the report for themselves. From the first word about it, in the Daily Wire, to the last word.
(And I did.)
[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 09-28-2017).]
It's a very brief report. I emphasized that (the brevity of the report) so as to encourage the participants here to use the link that I provided and go directly to the report.
Cherry picking? I think not.
It's my opinion that the most impressive single number from these polls is that only about 32 out of every 100 Americans think it was a good idea for President Trump to comment on how the NFL players are conducting themselves during the National Anthem. That is a poll result that was obtained by Reuters/IPSOS.
So says the Daily Wire.
But I wanted to make this report from the Daily Wire, as brief as it is, accessible to anyone who would like to evaluate the report for themselves. From the first word about it, in the Daily Wire, to the last word.
(And I did.)
No, what you did was pull the one anti-Trump number you found. This thread is about how America feels about disrespecting the anthem.
quote
Americans Hate Kneeling For The Anthem. The polls show that Americans don’t like players kneeling for the anthem. According to the Reuters/Ipsos poll, 69% of Americans say they stand in silence while the national anthem is played. And just 40% of Americans agree with former San Francisco 49ers quarterback Colin Kaepernick’s stance on the issue, compared with 51% who disagree.
But, you chose to go anti-Trump as you always seem to do. I happen to agree with President Trump on this issue, that does not make me a Trump fan.
Your obvious bias is flashing like a neon sign..........
------------------ Ron
Isn't it strange that after a bombing, everyone blames the bomber, his upbringing, his environment, his culture, his mental state but … after a shooting, the problem is the gun.... Open your frigg'n minds, think about all the other tools that can be made into WMDs.
I sincerely hope that life is never discovered on another planet because, sure as hell Progressives and Socialists will want to send them money.
[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 09-28-2017).]
Your question pre-supposes that Kaepernick has done something positive and that what he has done will actually accomplish something. I don't think it will. He could have taken his star power and actually worked with communities to heal the animus between low-income blacks and the police. But, no he decided to try to blow things up. Almost everyone in this country does not want to have blacks or any other race treated improperly, and many of us have fought in the past to bring about the social justice that the loudmouths are claiming to be striving for. So just what has he accomplished?
For brevity, the fact that we are having this conversation at all means that his actions accomplished something. The cause that he is trying to draw attention to didn't spring up in the last two years, it's been something that has been discussed in the black community for ages and there have been numerous attempts over the years to get others to care about that conversation. His actions have broadened the list of people in the conversation in a way that reached a huge portion of the population. I'm not sure if the end result will be positive or negative, but more people are having a conversation now which allows for discussion with more people about his cause.
quote
Originally posted by randye:
The simple FACT is that he DIDN'T do something different.
Neither did a good number of other NFL employees.
Engaging in hypothetical ruminations and conjecture is not productive in any respect when confronted with the REALITY of what has happened.
If we are to go down the path you suggest, we might just as well spend our time hypothesizing about what would have happened if the Japanese had never bombed Pearl Harbor.
It's pointless mental masturbation, but feel free to pleasure yourself.
Thanks for the response. Let's rephrase the question to "What can the next person who wants to call attention to a cause like this do to garner a similar amount of national attention and not receive backlash?"
quote
Originally posted by olejoedad:
All of your pictures show people bringing politics into their workplace, and using that workplace to push their political views upon their paying audience, who actually paid to see something else.
You don't see that as a problem?
To answer your question about what these celebrities could do to further their goals.....
Sponsor gatherings of police and residents of disadvantaged neighborhoods so that both groups can talk about their concerns.
Use their bully pulpit in the media (but outside the workplace) to put out a message that personal responsibility and hard work pay dividends in this country. This could be done by the Players Associations sponsoring media advertising, holding educational workshops with young people, media talk show appearances...
Work with Big Brothers/Big Sisters
Any positive message that fosters communication between the police and the residents of the 'oppressed' segment of the population
And importantly, doing it on their personal time, not the time that others have paid for to watch them perform their career specialty. That time doesn't belong to them, it belongs to the paying ticket holders.
quote
Originally posted by olejoedad:
Why protest in a way that alienates your audience?
These athletes and celebrities have vast monetary resources and access to brilliant messaging and organizing people....it would be advantageous to them to spend THEIR time and monies in working toward a positive set of solutions. Advertising, community outreach, educational seminars.....this community of the inner city has many issues that can be cured with knowledge, personal responsibility and opportunity.
Why is it that this community that cries out 'Police Brutality' doesn't police their own as far as teaching them to be law-abiding and respectful of their elders? Why does this community have crime rates, out of wedlock birth rates, death rates far above any community in our Nation?
Why is it always someone else's fault?
Why can't these concerned citizens do something positive and uniting in their communities, rather than just being divisive to the nation at large?
I agree that they can use their wealth and connections in order to reach out and help others on their own personal time. In fact, many of them have done so for years. Here are a few of the current programs that exist. http://kaepernick7.com/million-dollar-pledge/ Kaepernick pledged (and has been paying out) a million dollars of his own money to programs for community improvement. One such program is designed to teach youth how to properly interact with law enforcement and inform them of their rights https://www.forbes.com/site...school/#55258b314c02 LeBron James created a school program to help students that are falling behind by providing mentoring and other help. They also reward students that fulfill the curriculum with free college tuition. http://rwwhynotfoundation.org/ Russell Westbrook created the WhyNot foundation that teaches kids that they have the ability to shape their future. This is also combined with reading programs where he personally takes time to go and read/teach the importance of reading to young people.
This is just a short list of people. There are hundreds if not thousands of programs that many athletes either create, fund, or become personally involved in to help their communities. This is not a completely new trend, but historically these programs have not garnered the same kind of national attention that the protest has.
quote
Originally posted by Wichita:
But they support a failed and grumled mix race pumk who think he is a product of police brutality by kneeling or sitting or remaining in the locker room during the national anthem is somehow a way to put a spotlight on police brutality against black criminals?
I highlighted here to ask you to think of them as people first. The responsibility of police officers is not to hand out the judgements or punishments, but to apprehend those suspected of crimes to present them so that the rest of the system can do its job.
quote
Originally posted by Wichita: Policy brutality is wrong. Politicians, Entertainers and Sports Athletes kneeling or ignoring the anthem isn't a protest, it's just them wanting to feel good about themselves and their ego.
A real protest is when the average person takes it to the public square in a peaceful manor.
Go a kneel on a street corner for the protest of police brutality. Would you? I bet not a single leftest, Threedog person is going to do that. Antifa and BLM are for looters and gang bangers. Although Threedog like that, because it is against the "man" and support people like that. But he is too weak to throw a brick at police for sure.
But he is also too weak to protest, even peacefully, for himself against any cause. He want to live it through the celebrities. Then he acts like he is a part of the protest because he supports them.
I'd like to challenge the thought process of eliminating those that are wealthy/celebrities from having the ability to protest. If ever there comes a time needed for massive protest on Gun Rights I fully expect Ted Nugent to be leading the charge and I'd be against anyone suggesting that he can't have a say because of his wealth or celebrity status. Regular people have also been organizing protests and supporting someone who has a larger voice than you is typically a way to increase the impact of that protest.
It's my opinion that the most impressive single number from these polls is that only about 32 out of every 100 Americans think it was a good idea for President Trump to comment on how the NFL players are conducting themselves during the National Anthem. That is a poll result that was obtained by Reuters/IPSOS.
Because Reuters / Ipsos has a such a solid reputation for accuracy.
You aren't "cherry picking" Shadeball, you're turd grabbing.
It's astonishing that you leftie simpletons keep referring to these media polls like they are gospel.
After the last general election, and even several state elections since then, we would think that you might have learned a lesson about polls, but then you're leftists which explains a lot.
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 09-28-2017).]
Players have been trying for years to get attention for BLM, ever since Ferguson. People just rolled their eyes and kept watching the games.
Wearing a BLM t-shirt during a press conference got little attention too:
No one cared about Beyonce's BLM halftime show either:
Now they crossed the line. They show blatant disrespect for the National Anthem which is disrespecting the sacrifices that soldiers made for this country. These NFL players protesting are using the same tactics as the Westboro Baptist Church. They are deliberately being offensive to the country to get attention since their other tactics failed.
Pretty sure Westboro Baptist Church got the nations attention, much like this latest show of disrespect. Very similar reactions in my mind. My thoughts are, if you want to gain my support, you don't insult me and what I believe in. The end result will not be or go in your favor.
I won't suggest that there is racial harmony in this nation or on the rock we call home. But, MLK made many look into their hearts and found things they didn't like and attempted to adjust their mindset and attitudes. President Obama's actions and words during his tenure in the Oval Office caused many to reconsider many things. This protest started off as a way to protest police brutality against minorities. The manner or method of protest has resulted in significantly more than that. So, I'll say it again, if you want my support on any issue, the way to get it, is not to insult me, my flag, country or anthem.
I will not apologize for the way I feel about this. Find another path.
------------------ Ron
Isn't it strange that after a bombing, everyone blames the bomber, his upbringing, his environment, his culture, his mental state but … after a shooting, the problem is the gun.... Open your frigg'n minds, think about all the other tools that can be made into WMDs.
I sincerely hope that life is never discovered on another planet because, sure as hell Progressives and Socialists will want to send them money.
Originally posted by Tony Kania: One group of people showed up to pay respect. Another group showed up to disrupt the other's respect.
I would be obligated to speak up against that well dressed, groomed, and intelligent individual kneeling. And tell him to become a man, not a child. ****ing losers.
I will not be moved. I am the 95%.
Id be highly tempted to take a running start to kick that azz in the butt, hopefully breaking something.
VFW halls in Ohio are taking a vote on whether to turn on NFL games on their tvs...some voted NO. If the teams stop the nonsense, they will revote. So now its golf or Nascar.
[This message has been edited by rogergarrison (edited 09-29-2017).]
Because having to hear our national anthem once a week is just SO much of an imposition on you.
You're a real piece of work Skippy.
My point is not that it would be an imposition, but that it would provide an opportunity for a protest that makes sense. Without the anthem playing at work, it doesn't make sense to kneel in a meeting. What would the message be? Your inability to understand context is throwing a wrench in any conversation you have on this issue.
quote
Originally posted by Fats:
That's weird... When I heard them on the radio talking about this it was because the anthem was racist... Now it's about the Police? Wasn't it about oppression at one point? Perhaps it's because tampons are taxed....
Can we just pick a damned thing to be mad about?
Brad
What protestor said the anthem was racist? Did Kaepernick? I stated what it's been about from the original protestor. I am not picking sources from the radio, or anything else.
quote
Originally posted by E.Furgal:
**** you that's why, go to hell, maybe Africa is a better country for you.. no one is holding you here, there is the door..
YOUR POST SHOWS YOUR DISRESPECT FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR YOUR WAY OF LIFE.. I will not respect anyone that lives off the fruit of those that gave it all and then can't be bothered to show the respect for that.. No wonder the Country is going down the crapper, People think like this..
I don't want to leave, and I haven't displayed any disrespect for this country or servicemen. The day I display any hint of disrespect for any veteran or military member, you can punch me in the face. Find one quote of mine where I'm disrespecting them. Or one action. Then tell me how it's disrespectful.
For Pittsburgh Steelers head coach Mike Tomlin, being “respectful of our football team” trumped the right of Steelers offensive tackle Alejandro Villanueva to show respect for the national anthem.
A former Army Ranger, Villanueva was the only Steeler to break from the team's orders and come out of the tunnel Sunday in Chicago to stand for "The Star-Spangled Banner."
Speaking after his team's 23-17 loss to the Bears, Tomlin appeared to take a swipe at the Bronze Star recipient's decision.
“Like I said, I was looking for 100 percent participation, we were gonna be respectful of our football team,” Tomlin said. Tomlin told the media that, prior to kickoff Sunday, the Steelers held a team meeting and decided, though not unanimously, to not come out of the locker room for the national anthem. Tomlin added the intent was to have his team focus on the game and not President Trump’s comments blasting players who chose to protest during the playing of "The Star-Spangled Banner."
"I was looking for 100 percent participation." - Mike Tomlin
“Many of them felt like something needed to be done. I asked those guys to discuss it and whatever they discussed that we have 100 percent participation or we do nothing,” Tomlin said after the game. “They discussed it for an appropriate length of time and they couldn’t come to an understanding, so they chose to remove themselves from it. They were not going to be disrespectful in the anthem so they chose not to participate, but at the same time many of them were not going to accept the words of the president.”
“We’re not politicians. We’re coaches and professional athletes," Tomlin said Sunday. "If those of us or individuals choose to participate in politics in some way I’m going to be supportive of that. But when we come out of locker rooms, we come out of locker rooms to play football games." There appeared to be some confusion in the Steelers locker room after Villanueva came out of the tunnel for the anthem. Offensive tackle Chris Hubbard told Penn Live that the players, by a slim majority, voted in favor of staying off the field instead of standing on the sideline holding hands.
Villanueva, who served three tours in Afghanistan, decided to stand his ground instead and placed his hand over his heart while the anthem played.
"We thought we were all in attention with the same agreement, obviously," linebacker James Harrison told the website. "But, I guess we weren't." Hubbard, however, said everyone in the locker room accepted that Villanueva would be exempt from the team's decision. "Al was cool with it, with whatever we went through. He was on board. That's Al, man," Hubbard said. "He's a good guy." Villanueva has previously spoken out about former San Francisco 49ers quarterback Colin Kaepernick’s decision to sit and kneel during the national anthem, saying his actions may “send the wrong message.”
“I don’t know if the most effective way is to sit down during the national anthem with a country that’s providing you freedom, providing you $16 million a year...when there are black minorities that are dying in Iraq and Afghanistan for less than $20,000 a year," Villanueva told ESPN in 2016.
He added: “I will be the first one to hold hands with Colin Kaepernick and do something about the way minorities are being treated in the United States, the injustice that is happening with police brutality, the justice system, inequalities in pay. You can’t do it by looking away from the people that are trying to protect our freedom and our country.”
Broncos defensive end Derek Wolfe also told ESPN he would be standing during the national anthem Sunday because he wanted to be "paying tribute to the men and women who have given their lives for our freedom."
"I stand because I respect the men who died in real battle so I have the freedom to battle on the field...but everyone these days likes to find a reason to protest and that’s their right," Wolfe told ESPN, according to The Washington Post.
Apparently the Dub and Tomlin that something in common. Neither one of them get it.
I've said the whole time that the NFL has every right to fire their employees over kneeling. So far, the coaches haven't done anything. The owners haven't. But I've still said they have the right.
I also believe they have the right to fire this person for not being with the team, for going out and standing. Why? Because I believe employment is not a right. It's an agreement between employer and employee.
I am consistent with this belief. What is your opinion on this person going against their employer's wishes? Do you believe his employer has the right to fire him over this?
I know you've said those defending the kneelers fall on deaf ears for you. I can understand that. But I can't respect it. I am always open to other ideas and ways of thinking. It's how I can understand how people are motivated and be an effective leader. You might never change your mind, but you should never have closed ears to any idea, else you will never fully understand your own beliefs.
quote
Originally posted by RayOtton:
BTW, recall the OUTRAGE back in 2010 when Tim Tebow took a knee to say a prayer?
I wonder what's different now?
Exactly! What's different now?
I supported Tebow's right to kneel then, as well. Did you? If you did, what's different now?
To all of you that are mad about this, but stood up for Tebow, what is different now?
quote
Originally posted by randye:
It hasn't just been wedding cake bakers.
Any individual or any private business that dares to uphold traditional morals or values instantly comes under attack by leftist sh*tbags.
The only "free speech" they are concerned with is their own. They want any and all other ideas silenced.
NOT ONE of the leftist jackasses on this forum now whining about *free speech* had a damn thing to say in support of that same right of the examples above.
Lol. I have stood up for private businesses making their own decisions on this forum. Specifically, I stood up for Chik-Fil-A. You're wrong.
quote
Originally posted by RayOtton:
How about taking a knee on one of the streets on the south side of Chicago?
How many people would see the message?
The reason this protest is so effective is because of the large audience.
quote
Originally posted by randye:
The simple FACT is that he DIDN'T do something different.
Neither did a good number of other NFL employees.
Engaging in hypothetical ruminations and conjecture is not productive in any respect when confronted with the REALITY of what has happened.
If we are to go down the path you suggest, we might just as well spend our time hypothesizing about what would have happened if the Japanese had never bombed Pearl Harbor.
It's pointless mental masturbation, but feel free to pleasure yourself.
All of your pictures show people bringing politics into their workplace, and using that workplace to push their political views upon their paying audience, who actually paid to see something else.
You don't see that as a problem?
To answer your question about what these celebrities could do to further their goals.....
Sponsor gatherings of police and residents of disadvantaged neighborhoods so that both groups can talk about their concerns.
Use their bully pulpit in the media (but outside the workplace) to put out a message that personal responsibility and hard work pay dividends in this country. This could be done by the Players Associations sponsoring media advertising, holding educational workshops with young people, media talk show appearances...
Work with Big Brothers/Big Sisters
Any positive message that fosters communication between the police and the residents of the 'oppressed' segment of the population
And importantly, doing it on their personal time, not the time that others have paid for to watch them perform their career specialty. That time doesn't belong to them, it belongs to the paying ticket holders.
Politics was brought into their workplace by having the national anthem played and the flag displayed. It wasn't brought in with a kneel.
And many of these players have worked with other communities and organizations to further those goals!
quote
Originally posted by Tony Kania: This is evil incarnate.
I find no happiness in another's demise. Heck, I find no happiness in the supposed demise of another's even.
I am happy that you post.
Edit: Could you please fix your pictures?
NSFW
@ Threedog...
What do you think about black racism?
There are thousands of hours on Youtube that has black racism. It is everywhere, allowed, and even promoted. I am NOT asking for equal time. I want all idiots to stop being idiots.
Tony, why do you not speak out against the hateful posts of randye? Why do you single out others?
To answer my own beliefs on Black racism: It exists, and is just as abhorrent as any other racism. I speak out against it equally.
[This message has been edited by theBDub (edited 10-02-2017).]
Tony, why do you not speak out against the hateful posts of randye? Why do you single out others?
...
Him and I have expressed our views over conversation. I regard the man in extremely high regards. He has never pushed another down to gain advantage, and quite the opposite is true. He wishes no ill will upon others. He and I are tired to the core with CRIMINALS.
From my personal experience, folks that are offended by name calling and such are usually not too well tuned in the head. If name calling does it for ya, then perhaps the rest of the day is not going to go so well for you, now is it? *a generalization, not a directed sentence*
I hate no person of color, only those that wish harm upon you or I. I will make fun of Kaperturd and anyone else that shows disrespect to that in which I hold quite dear. Their disrespect demand my attention. Well, here it is...
The internet is a double edged sword. It is information, and it is information. We all take it in differently. I still respect those on this forum. I do have issue with how Threedog feels the need to have his way of life over my learned and earned way of life? Those folks give me the creeps. He could not imagine what I have seen, been through, and continue to have happen in MY life. His kind have no understanding, only thoughts and feelings.
Good luck. We all need it. We are going to wipe each other out, or stand together. I see a lot of kneeling...
Regardless of whether you support Kaepernick or Tebow, it's pretty misleading to compare society's reaction to either player without noting they kneeled in completely different contexts. If Tebow had taken to kneeling during the national anthem as a form of political protest and especially as a form of protest against police officers, it's not a stretch at all to say people would have been upset with him as well.
As to my comment about kneeling in the streets of Chicago, I think CK would have gotten plenty of coverage if he had done so AND he might actually have done some good by drawing attention to the slaughter going on there. But no, instead he started a protest movement that has done nothing for the "cause" he is touting and done everything to show the country what utter jerks these players are.
And the coaches.
And the owners.
And the Democrats.
Lastly, take a look at the charities CK has given his money to. Many are left leaning outfits with an emphasis on things like protecting women's right to chose ( they never say what that right is, BTW ) , global warming initiatives and a bunch of other social justice issues. There are some neutral organizations like Meals On Wheels but there isn't a single right leaning group listed. What would be so bad about dropping $10K on Toys For Tots? Unless it's because of the Marines.
Originally posted by Tony Kania: Him and I have expressed our views over conversation. I regard the man in extremely high regards. He has never pushed another down to gain advantage, and quite the opposite is true. He wishes no ill will upon others. He and I are tired to the core with CRIMINALS.
From my personal experience, folks that are offended by name calling and such are usually not too well tuned in the head. If name calling does it for ya, then perhaps the rest of the day is not going to go so well for you, now is it? *a generalization, not a directed sentence*
I hate no person of color, only those that wish harm upon you or I. I will make fun of Kaperturd and anyone else that shows disrespect to that in which I hold quite dear. Their disrespect demand my attention. Well, here it is...
The internet is a double edged sword. It is information, and it is information. We all take it in differently. I still respect those on this forum. I do have issue with how Threedog feels the need to have his way of life over my learned and earned way of life? Those folks give me the creeps. He could not imagine what I have seen, been through, and continue to have happen in MY life. His kind have no understanding, only thoughts and feelings.
Good luck. We all need it. We are going to wipe each other out, or stand together. I see a lot of kneeling...
From my perspective, Threedog has been far more polite, reasonable, and understanding than randye. I understand you've spoken to Rand yourself, so you hold a level of respect for him from that. That is fair.
quote
Originally posted by RayOtton:
Comparing Tim with Coiln is a false equivalency.
Regardless of whether you support Kaepernick or Tebow, it's pretty misleading to compare society's reaction to either player without noting they kneeled in completely different contexts. If Tebow had taken to kneeling during the national anthem as a form of political protest and especially as a form of protest against police officers, it's not a stretch at all to say people would have been upset with him as well.
As to my comment about kneeling in the streets of Chicago, I think CK would have gotten plenty of coverage if he had done so AND he might actually have done some good by drawing attention to the slaughter going on there. But no, instead he started a protest movement that has done nothing for the "cause" he is touting and done everything to show the country what utter jerks these players are.
And the coaches.
And the owners.
And the Democrats.
Lastly, take a look at the charities CK has given his money to. Many are left leaning outfits with an emphasis on things like protecting women's right to chose ( they never say what that right is, BTW ) , global warming initiatives and a bunch of other social justice issues. There are some neutral organizations like Meals On Wheels but there isn't a single right leaning group listed. What would be so bad about dropping $10K on Toys For Tots? Unless it's because of the Marines.
You are the one that brought in Tebow to the picture. You compared them. I just kept it going. So if it isn't fair to compare them, it isn't fair to compare them. Don't bring him up, then.
I will admit that I didn't think of Kaepernick being recognized on the streets. That would have probably been noticed by someone, you're right. I was thinking of just a normal guy kneeling.
As far as his choice of charities... come on! He choice his charities based on where he felt they would do the most difference. Are you really going to harp on his choices because they aren't right-leaning enough for you? If you were to donate $1 million, would you include some left-leaning charities?
Its not even worth it, if you don't understand by now you never will. Side with a bunch of pampered thugs. Persecute people that just want to do nothing but live their life and have religious freedom
Cant have a moment of prayer but these thugs can take a knee and be held up as a hero? **** that take a knee, just don't ask me to lay my life down for your punk ass again. Its too much to you to respect our flag and country then you go ****ing stand on the wall and protect those that wont then tell me how you feel. Put on a uniform and swear an oath that you will lay your life down if you are asked.
**** you take a ****ing knee, you are exactly what is wrong with this country. Lets burn the entire country down because that's what these heros do. Don't try to make it better. **** you that's why.
I'm done here, you know how I feel. You should hope that you are never in a situation where you need the help of those you would piss on.
Originally posted by theBDub: I know you've said those defending the kneelers fall on deaf ears for you. I can understand that. But I can't respect it. I am always open to other ideas and ways of thinking. It's how I can understand how people are motivated and be an effective leader. You might never change your mind, but you should never have closed ears to any idea, else you will never fully understand your own beliefs.
I'm not asking you to respect my opinion. You obviously have you own. We don't see this from the same perspective. I've served this country, I've lost friends in the defense of this country. I honor those who have gone before me. You have a right to believe whatever you wish but, don't expect me to respect that belief or, go along with it. You haven't earned that.
------------------ Ron
Isn't it strange that after a bombing, everyone blames the bomber, his upbringing, his environment, his culture, his mental state but … after a shooting, the problem is the gun.... Open your frigg'n minds, think about all the other tools that can be made into WMDs.
I sincerely hope that life is never discovered on another planet because, sure as hell Progressives and Socialists will want to send them money.
1 - My point was that TT was excoriated by the left fro kneeling for a prayer. Bunch a crap about it not being the venue for displaying his faith. However, when CK took a knee is was OK because it was for something the left believes. Hope that clears up what I was trying to say.
2 - To the charity selection. I brought up the list to demonstrate that once again Liberal ideology has no core. On his website he has a list of rights, not the Bill of Rights mind you, but a list that I surmise he made up. For the most part they're pretty innocuous, mostly leftist tripe like "You have the right to be loved" and "You have the right to be courageous". He then uses this list of made up rights to determine what charities fit his world view. Problem is, Right #7 Says "You have the right to be alive" and then he donates money to an abortion rights group. Right #8 says "You have the right to be trusted" and then he donates to a group that wants to do away with the criminal justice system. There are other inconsistencies but you get my point, at least i hope you do.
Its not even worth it, if you don't understand by now you never will. Side with a bunch of pampered thugs. Persecute people that just want to do nothing but live their life and have religious freedom
Cant have a moment of prayer but these thugs can take a knee and be held up as a hero? **** that take a knee, just don't ask me to lay my life down for your punk ass again. Its too much to you to respect our flag and country then you go ****ing stand on the wall and protect those that wont then tell me how you feel. Put on a uniform and swear an oath that you will lay your life down if you are asked.
**** you take a ****ing knee, you are exactly what is wrong with this country. Lets burn the entire country down because that's what these heros do. Don't try to make it better. **** you that's why.
I'm done here, you know how I feel. You should hope that you are never in a situation where you need the help of those you would piss on.
This protest has nothing to do with veterans. Nothing to do with the military.
In fact, the reason he's kneeling instead of sitting is because he spoke to a marine that told him that would be acceptable over sitting. He purposely kneeled instead of sitting to show his respect towards servicemen. You have every right to take offense by it, but do it knowing it isn't logical for you to be offended.
And again, when Tebow knelt, I stood up for that too. I'm no hypocrite. I have a very clear standard here, and my standard would never allow for the disrespect of our military. My best friend died in our military. You can twist and turn my message all you want, but I know my line, I know my standard. And I know I am not disrespecting you or any veteran or active duty by my stance. Any offense taken is not my problem to deal with. That's on you. Because nothing about my belief on this subject has anything to do with veterans or military.
quote
Originally posted by blackrams:
I'm not asking you to respect my opinion. You obviously have you own. We don't see this from the same perspective. I've served this country, I've lost friends in the defense of this country. I honor those who have gone before me. You have a right to believe whatever you wish but, don't expect me to respect that belief or, go along with it. You haven't earned that.
I also honor those that have died in defense of this country and its values. I honor those that have died for me.
I understand we think differently on this, just know I respect you and others for what you and they did. This, to me, has nothing to do with that. You think differently, and that's just where we will have to leave that.
quote
Originally posted by RayOtton:
1 - My point was that TT was excoriated by the left fro kneeling for a prayer. Bunch a crap about it not being the venue for displaying his faith. However, when CK took a knee is was OK because it was for something the left believes. Hope that clears up what I was trying to say.
2 - To the charity selection. I brought up the list to demonstrate that once again Liberal ideology has no core. On his website he has a list of rights, not the Bill of Rights mind you, but a list that I surmise he made up. For the most part they're pretty innocuous, mostly leftist tripe like "You have the right to be loved" and "You have the right to be courageous". He then uses this list of made up rights to determine what charities fit his world view. Problem is, Right #7 Says "You have the right to be alive" and then he donates money to an abortion rights group. Right #8 says "You have the right to be trusted" and then he donates to a group that wants to do away with the criminal justice system. There are other inconsistencies but you get my point, at least i hope you do.
Well, he wasn't raked over any coals by me. I respected Tebow then and I respect Kaepernick now. I'm no hypocrite.
And I agree that liberal ideology has no core. I also believe conservative ideology (as typically understood) has no core. The only belief systems with a foundation that answers all of their beliefs is libertarianism and socialism, in my opinion. And the only moral system of those two is libertarianism. Liberal ideology is inconsistent in that it takes from producers to give to others, but never defines how much is the right amount to take. They support increased rights for some, but want to take away rights in other cases (like gun rights). At least socialism is very clear about basically no individual owning anything. It's ****ed up, but at least it's consistent. Conservatism is also inconsistent. Small government? Please, they'd never decrease military spending if the whole world was at peace. And they like their guns, but don't mind taking away rights from others when it suits them. Abortions, drugs, gay marriage, conservatives don't want rights.
We can go through this all day. But at the end of the day, he made contributions that he thinks matter. He put his money where his mouth (knee) was. We can't say he should have done more than kneel, because he did.
Bullshit disrespecting the flag has everything to do with veterans who the **** do you think is standing up for that flag who do you think's ****ing defending it who the **** do you think is Defending Your Right to stand here and ****ing say it doesn't have anything to do with veterans kiss my ass
Consider that my free speech
[This message has been edited by Jake_Dragon (edited 10-03-2017).]
Originally posted by theBDub: I also honor those that have died in defense of this country and its values. I honor those that have died for me.
This is one place we disagree. You enjoy and languish in what others have earned for you. But, your perspective does not honor those you mentioned.
------------------ Ron
Isn't it strange that after a bombing, everyone blames the bomber, his upbringing, his environment, his culture, his mental state but … after a shooting, the problem is the gun.... Open your frigg'n minds, think about all the other tools that can be made into WMDs.
I sincerely hope that life is never discovered on another planet because, sure as hell Progressives and Socialists will want to send them money.
[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 10-02-2017).]
My point is not that it would be an imposition, but that it would provide an opportunity for a protest that makes sense. Without the anthem playing at work, it doesn't make sense to kneel in a meeting. What would the message be? Your inability to understand context is throwing a wrench in any conversation you have on this issue.
So you are claiming if they stopped playing the national anthem these players would not kneel.. Please, please stop, you think we are dumb, They just start kneeling every huddle.. They are entitled over paid brats that still think some are held down,?? yet they got a free ride since high school, and make more in one season than most families will in their life time.. The protest isn't about blacks and police, it is to divide this country and destroy it.. Nothing more, 1st it was a rebel flag, then carved stones, now the anthem, Sorry the **** stops here.. Fools have their wrist in the hornets nest and they are about to really see what being oppressed truly means, if they keep poking that nest.. Blacks might be 13% of the population, but that is all blacks, the race baiting, I'm owed everything % is much smaller, and the hard working,law abiding blacks will not stand in the way as they respect and love this country.. Keep poking.. go ahead..
You caught a hit of some good CNN bull kaka? 
