I think I used that paragraph (about the Ferguson convenience store video) because I thought it would draw dennis_6 more attentively into anything else that I was saying at the same time. A "connection".
After reading (and viewing on TV) the accounts of the altercation between Brown and the police officer, and how this very muscular teenager had reached inside the police car and struggled with the officer and tried to take the officer's gun away, I came to a certain mindset about it. I didn't really care one way or the other about whether Brown had any kind of prior criminal record, or whether he was actually trying to steal cigars at the convenience store. I only imagined two possibilities.
The first was that the police officer had been justified (on the ground of self defense) in firing multiple bullets into Brown.
The other possibility was that after this dangerous wrestling match, with Brown reaching into the police car, that Brown was retreating, and no longer an immediate threat to the officer, but that the officer was (obviously) stressed and fired multiple bullets into Brown partly because the officer was so angered, and perhaps also thinking that Brown was a danger to the general public and needed to be immobilized at the scene; that it would be too much of a risk to public safety to allow Brown to leave the scene and try to apprehend Brown after that had transpired.
I never looked very closely or at any length at the convenience store video. Or if I had, it had mostly faded from my memory. So when I said (repeating what I had read so recently) that the video was not conclusive, I was thinking that the video on its own, without corroborating witness testimony, would not have been sufficient to convict Brown of a robbery at that store. When Todd (82-T/A) said that he was offended because it seemed like I was trying to defend a strong-arm style bandit who had intimidated the much smaller store owner--well, I just didn't see that coming. I did not have a clear memory of how the video had ended.
I hope that answers your question here.
I am still not clear as to why such an off topic tangent came about? I guess it does not matter, I am just as guilty as any of derailing the thread.
Thanks for your explanation, it sheds a little light.
There is nothing more tedious than a geriatric Communist revolutionary with senile dementia.
But then the party apparatchik all still cheered even though it's the same sad, song they just heard 60 days ago!
"However, MPs from Mugabe's ruling Zanu-PF party didn't seem to mind and cheered the 91-year-old as he promised to revive the country's struggling economy with a large does of help from China."
While Liberals in the U.S. continue to wring their hands and rant about Cecil the Lion and publically condemn the hunter, Mugabe's Government continues to bring in hard currency the only way it can and Liberal Leftists, predictably, never make a peep about it:
"A ban on lion, leopard and elephant hunting in Zimbabwe—imposed after global outrage following Cecil the lion’s death—has largely been lifted after only nine days, South African news site news24.com reports,..."
"Bulawayo (Zimbabwe) (AFP) - The professional hunter who helped an American dentist kill Zimbabwe's popular lion Cecil has been arrested for his alleged link with an illegal operation to smuggle 29 sable antelope out of the country.
Theo Bronkhorst, 52, was arrested Monday in Zimbabwe's second largest city of Bulawayo, police said on Tuesday. He is facing charges of moving wild animals without a permit" and smuggling of wild animals, police spokeswoman Charity Charamba said in a statement.
Zimbabwean authorities said over the weekend the animals -- which include six calves and are valued at $384,000 (340,000 euros) -- were captured from a private conservancy in the northwestern resort town of Victoria Falls.
A friend of Bronkhorst's claimed the animals had come from Zambia and that the hunter had only helped the South Africans secure an import permit into Zimbabwe."
Hunting in Zimbabwe reinstated after 9 days. Professional hunting guide, Bronkhorst turns out to be a criminal. The ironically named *Honest* Ndlovu*, the "owner" of the confiscated, (formerly white owned ranch), hunting land given to him by Mugabe's Communist Government hasn't been heard from since.
quote
Originally posted by randye:
So Dlovu teams up with a Professional Hunter (the rough equivalent of a big game Outfitter in the US) and they hatch a plan to rid the nation of another symbol of European ascendance - Cecil. They set up the bait and find the patsy (an American dentist) and magically, Cecil is gone, the dentist is responsible, Mugabe (who will shed some crocodile tears for the cameras) is ecstatic. The dentist will be prosecuted. The landowner will be found uninvolved and if the Professional Hunter is part of the Mugabe cabal, he will be pardoned for his minor transgression.
This has everything to do with symbolism and nothing to do with poaching or illegal hunting. Mugabe got rid of Cecil the Lion, pizzed on Cecil Rhodes' grave and bagged an American. All in a day's work. 'Course the only cash flow that Zimbabwe has right now is sport hunting, so Mugabe will again kill the goose, but he's far too ignorant and mentally impaired to notice [/i]
All going as planned and the Liberal sheep fall for the propaganda every time.
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 09-16-2015).]
The liberal media pulled the dentist through the pizz trough, but nary a wink in the direction of the REAL problem. One hunter is not the issue. The animalistic reproach by those in power is. But why take on the hard story. Make the "feels" pour out for a lion.
I am trying to understand what Randy E (uh, I guess that would be randye, eh?) has been saying here about the gi-normous societal fiasco that is Zimbabwe and how "Liberals" (Liberals in the U.S., Liberal sheep) are especially responsible for this deadly canker in the international body politic, or complicit in it, or silent about it. "See No Evil, Hear No Evil, Speak No Evil."
This sounds like it could be the work of many a solid 40-hour week, and I have only just now dipped my toe into the water, so please bear with me.
Zimbabwe
The government of President Robert Mugabe continues to violate human rights without regard to protections in the country’s new constitution. An expected legislative framework and new or amended laws to improve human rights in line with the constitution has yet to materialize. Police violate basic rights, such as freedom of expression and assembly, using old laws that are inconsistent with the new constitution. Activists and human rights defenders, including lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender (LGBT) people, face police harassment. There has been no progress toward securing justice for human rights abuses and past political violence, including violence after the 2008 election.
That paragraph is prominently displayed on the website of Human Rights Watch, on the Africa/Zimbabwe page; to wit: http://www.hrw.org/africa/zimbabwe
Looks, of course, can be deceiving; but at face value, it seems that this HRW (Human Rights Watch) organization and its staff are not enthused about the way things have been in Zimbabwe under the leadership of its longtime national president, Robert Mugabe.
Below that some online video material, and below that, but still on the same page, a list for online access of Zimbabwe-related news reports, commentaries and other communications. This list is presented in reverse chronological order. The first entry, from July 29, 2015, is "Zimbabwe: Violent Crackdown on Street Vendors". July 9, 2015 "Dispatches: A Desperate Plea to Mugabe". April 10, 2015 "Dispatches: Where Is Leading Zimbabwean Rights Activist?". The list goes on for 13 more pages, and at the very end, August 6, 1997 "Human Rights Watch Raises Serious Concerns About Zimbabwe Deputy Attorney-General's Participation in the Human Rights Investigation".
It looks as if whoever these HRW people are, they have not been "silent" (in the written media sense) about the dark side of much of what has been going on in Zimbabwe; from as recently as just two months ago, all the way back to 3Q 1997.
Can we zoom in on that please. I see the "Open Society Institute & Soros Foundations Network". Soros. George Soros. The insanely wealthy old guy who funds some of the ideologically progressive projects and Democratic Party candidates that are so roundly despised by conservatives and Tea Party activists. That seems pretty liberal, just for starters.
I also see the Ford Foundation. John D. and Catherine T. MacArthur Foundation. Atlantic Philanthropies. Arcadia. And some other ones.
Let's glom onto one of these HRW Partners and see what's inside. I'll pick the MacArthur Foundation. Check this out:
Climate Solutions: New Climate Commitment Aimed at Reducing Emission, Encouraging International Leadership and Cooperation. The MacArthur Foundation announced (August 18, 2015) $50 million in grants, a down payment on a major new commitment to help curb global climate disruption by significantly reducing greenhouse gas emissions. . . . https://www.macfound.org/pr...hip-and-cooporation/
Climate activism--that certainly has a progressive or liberal sounding cachet about it.
How about the top level staff of HRW.org? Here are their "mug shots". Wow, there's more than fifty. Fifty Shades of "Blue". Lot of females. A number of younger women. Some older ones. Lot of youthful and early middle-aged men with that generally academic or professorial look about them. I don't see even a single necktie. Banker's pinstripes? Forget about it.
Don't these top level Human Rights Watch staffers look kind of--well--liberal?
So, if it is a fact that it is the Liberals Among Us that are so decidedly slacking off about Zimbabwe, is this HRW organization just an outlier? A single, isolated and very muchly (if not mostly) liberal group that "didn't get the memo"..?
That's as far as I want to go with this, for the moment. I hope that the way that this post has been worded is reminiscent of the way that John Stossel talks when he does his episodic TV segments from his well known Libertarian perspective. And I hope it's been another crowd-pleaser.
"If you see me acting truly, then follow me. If you see me acting falsely, then advise and guide me…. If I disobey God, then do not obey me." Attributed to the First Caliph, Abu Bakr (successor to Mohammed) ~ 10 AH (632 CE).
[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 02-24-2016).]
What's your solution to the situation in Zimbabwe?
Let them take care of themselves. I am sure that there are at least a dozen or so adults that live in Zimbabwe, and just like here, they need to take care of their own.
Fair enough. So exactly why did you even bring it up in this thread?
It was brought up, because Mr.rinselberg stated that the liberal media didn't cover the crimes against humanity in Zimbabwe because it was not a local matter. Brown vs Hammond was introduced to show the difference in the media.
I agree. I hope they get their act together and have that dentist extradited to face criminal charges.
What charges would they seek? Or are these charges that you "feel" need to be brought upon to feed the desire to care about the latest little thing the media sends our way?
Why all the hate for dentist boy? But little to none for those in charge of these hunts? I see a media that picks easy targets, but lets those contriving ill upon Earth's populace repeatedly given a pass. I am no fan boy of hunting, but I am for legal culling. I see this as a sport hunt, and find it sickening. Revolting even. But I do not make the laws here, or in Zimbabwe.
I agree. I hope they get their act together and have that dentist extradited to face criminal charges.
Keep on dreaming Loopy Leftist Liberal dreams.
NO American Citizen is going to be extradited to Zimbabwe !
"In 2001, the United States began imposing targeted sanctions on the Government of Zimbabwe, including restrictions on U.S. support for multilateral financing, financial sanctions against selected individuals and entities, travel sanctions against selected individuals, a ban on transfers of defense items and services, and a suspension of non-humanitarian government-to-government assistance. Despite strained political relations, the United States is a leading provider of humanitarian assistance to the people of Zimbabwe, providing more than $150 million in humanitarian assistance, much of which was food aid, in 2012.
During the period between 2000 and 2008, the United States took a leading role in condemning the Zimbabwean Government's increasing assault on human rights and the rule of law, and joined much of the world community in calling for the Government of Zimbabwe to embrace a peaceful democratic evolution."
Knowing how a Leftist contrarian like you loves to dispute facts that are glaringly obvious to rational people, feel free to contact the appropriate authorities yourself and see how THEY respond to your "hopes" for the extradition of Dr. Palmer.
For your convenience:
The U.S. Ambassador to Zimbabwe is David Bruce Wharton; other principal embassy officials are listed in the Department's Key Officers List.
Zimbabwe maintains an embassy in the United States at 1608 New Hampshire Ave., NW, Washington, DC 20009 (tel. 202-332-7100).
More information about Zimbabwe is available from the Department of State and other sources, some of which are listed here:
NO American Citizen is going to be extradited to Zimbabwe !
So it seems then that simply not being able to extradite an American to Zimbabwe makes doing illegal activities there perfectly acceptable in your eyes? Nice. Maybe you could add your enlightened views on morality to the current thread in O/T running HERE.
So it seems then that simply not being able to extradite an American to Zimbabwe makes doing illegal activities there perfectly acceptable in your eyes?
If *conclusion jumping* was an Olympic sport you might be a gold medal contender. Perhaps even a silver medal in the "deflection decathlon".
In typical Leftist fashion, when you don't like the message you go after the messenger. Pathetic try, but I'm not playing *your* game.
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 09-17-2015).]
What charges would they seek? Or are these charges that you "feel" need to be brought upon to feed the desire to care about the latest little thing the media sends our way?
Why all the hate for dentist boy? But little to none for those in charge of these hunts? I see a media that picks easy targets, but lets those contriving ill upon Earth's populace repeatedly given a pass. I am no fan boy of hunting, but I am for legal culling. I see this as a sport hunt, and find it sickening. Revolting even. But I do not make the laws here, or in Zimbabwe.
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 09-17-2015).]
Lovely. Do you find those images somewhat arousing or what?
So it's "STILL LEGAL" to entice a lion out of a national park and then kill it, eh? Sounds more like poaching to me, but that's just a minor detail, right?
[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 09-17-2015).]
Lovely. Do you find those images somewhat arousing or what?
So it's "STILL LEGAL" to entice a lion out of a national parkand then kill it, eh? Sounds more like poaching to me, but that's just a minor detail, right?
Nice website link.
"The charity Lion Aid says on its website that it will be difficult to prosecute the person who paid for the hunt, because the client did what the professional hunter tells him to do.
“A client usually has no idea about the laws and regulations of the country he is hunting in – he just buys a safari and then places himself in the hands of his professional hunter guide. Finding the client could be interesting to let him tell his side of the story, but in terms of legal prosecution this person is hardly important,” Lion Aid says."
The professional hunter, Theo Bronkhorst told his client to shoot the lion, and then the hunt became illegal,” Lion Aid says. “The professional hunter, (Bronkhorst), then allegedly attempted to destroy the radiocollar to hide the evidence.
The concession owner, (Honest Ndlovu), is allegedly related to the Zimbabwe Minister of Transport and will therefore be immune from prosecution.”
PRECISELY like the contact in Zimbabwe described how this went down.
(Theo Bronkhorst has been arrested again, but then he's a *white* South African in Mugabe's black Communist "playground".)
quote
Originally posted by randye:
As the famous commentator Paul Harvey was fond of saying; "And now for the rest of the story."
Recent commentary from someone living in Zimbabwe:
"Zimbabwe, which up until 1980 was the biggest exporter of agricultural products in Africa and one of the richest nations on the continent, is now utterly impoverished. It produces barely enough food to support its pitifully poor citizenry while its formerly beautiful farms and ranches sit empty, idle, rotting away and covered in weeds. Its ruler, Robert Mugabe, installed in 1979 after a communist backed insurgency, renamed the nation Zimbabwe and still rules the former nation of Rhodesia just as ruthlessly and stupidly as he has always done.
Mugabe hates Europeans and anything that might suggest that Europeans contributed in any way to the betterment of black African lives. He particularly hates Cecil Rhodes, the founder of Rhodesia and the man for whom Cecil the Lion was named. Honest Dlovu is a crony of Mugabe, and the recipient of a very large parcel of agricultural property which was taken without compensation from a European owner in 2001. He knows nothing about farming or ranching, but he does know how to do what makes his boss happy."
So Dlovu teams up with a Professional Hunter (the rough equivalent of a big game Outfitter in the US) and they hatch a plan to rid the nation of another symbol of European ascendance - Cecil. They set up the bait and find the patsy (an American dentist) and magically, Cecil is gone, the dentist is responsible, Mugabe (who will shed some crocodile tears for the cameras) is ecstatic. The dentist will be prosecuted. The landowner will be found uninvolved and if the Professional Hunter is part of the Mugabe cabal, he will be pardoned for his minor transgression.
This has everything to do with symbolism and nothing to do with poaching or illegal hunting. Mugabe got rid of Cecil the Lion, pizzed on Cecil Rhodes' grave and bagged an American. All in a day's work. 'Course the only cash flow that Zimbabwe has right now is sport hunting, so Mugabe will again kill the goose, but he's far too ignorant and mentally impaired to notice
Loopy Lefties, always falling for the propaganda.....
"The charity Lion Aid says on its website that it will be difficult to prosecute the person who paid for the hunt, because the client did what the professional hunter tells him to do."
Where have we heard that type of defense BS before?
And your hero couldn't see the tracking device around the Lion's neck while looking through his scope? Sure.
I could be wrong, but I thought he shot it with bow and arrow? Never saw a scope on a bow?
Why are you bringing FACTS into the *fantasy*?
Next you'll be having to explain in kindergarten terms that they can understand why adult, fully grown *Boy Lions* have a thick hairy "mane" around their head and neck and "Girl Lions* don't.
(and why the thick mane of a male lion might hide a GPS tracking collar from view at a distance)
Never let FACTS, experience or knowledge get in the way of a good Loopy Leftie fantasy. It just makes them angry.
[This message has been edited by randye (edited 09-18-2015).]
Originally posted by randye: Why are you bringing FACTS into the *fantasy*?
Next you'll be having to explain in kindergarten terms that they can understand why adult, fully grown *Boy Lions* have a thick hairy "mane" around their head and neck and "Girl Lions* don't.
(and why the thick mane of a male lion might hide a GPS tracking collar from view at a distance)
Never let FACTS, experience or knowledge get in the way of a good Loopy Leftie fantasy. It just makes them angry.
Cecil was shot with a bow and arrow and then tracked for more than 40 hours in agony before Palmer eventually caught up with him and finished him off with a rifle.
And besides, Randy knows full well there are Archery Scopes. It's interesting how certain facts conveniently just sort of slip his mind.
And besides, Randy knows full well there are Archery Scopes. It's interesting how certain facts conveniently just sort of slip his mind.
Patrick I know you were not implying that the bow might as well be a rifle, I am adding the following for those who have never bow hunted. Archery scopes do not change the nature of a bow. The arrow still has limited distance, easy deflection and far more difficult to make a clean kill than a rifle. I could see a archery scope making the kills quicker, IE better chance of a vital hit. It will not turn the bow into a rifle, or even a smooth bore shotgun with a slug for that matter.
Patrick I know you were not implying that the bow might as well be a rifle... Archery scopes do not change the nature of a bow.
Correct Dennis, I was implying nothing of the sort. My point was that a scope could indeed be used by a bowhunter. A scope obviously allows better sighting of the target, and/or of the tracking device around the animal's neck.
Correct Dennis, I was implying nothing of the sort. My point was that a scope could indeed be used by a bowhunter. A scope obviously allows better sighting of the target, and/or of the tracking device around the animal's neck.
A scope would indeed magnify the image, the question is if the collar was visible... The following is a picture of Cecil with the collar.
Correct Dennis, I was implying nothing of the sort. My point was that a scope could indeed be used by a bowhunter. A scope obviously allows better sighting of the target, and/or of the tracking device around the animal's neck.
Please tell everyone what *scope* Dr. Palmer was using when he shot "Cecil". In fact show us ANY photo of Palmer with a *scope* on his bow(s). You made the claim.....Now back it up!
quote
Originally posted by Patrick:
And your hero couldn't see the tracking device around the Lion's neck while looking through his scope? Sure.
A scope would indeed magnify the image, the question is if the collar was visible... The following is a picture of Cecil with the collar.
quote
Originally posted by randye: Why are you bringing FACTS into the *fantasy*?
Next you'll be having to explain in kindergarten terms that they can understand why adult, fully grown *Boy Lions* have a thick hairy "mane" around their head and neck and "Girl Lions* don't.
(and why the thick mane of a male lion might hide a GPS tracking collar from view at a distance)
Never let FACTS, experience or knowledge get in the way of a good Loopy Leftie fantasy. It just makes them angry.
A scope would indeed magnify the image, the question is if the collar was visible... The following is a picture of Cecil with the collar.
A picture gives us a quick glimpse (1/60th of a second or faster) from one angle of the subject. I could take a picture from a certain angle of someone holding a strut from their Fiero without the strut being readily visible. Doesn't mean the strut wouldn't be apparent if the person was being viewed live... even from a distance.
quote
Originally posted by randye:
Please tell everyone what *scope* Dr. Palmer was using when he shot "Cecil". In fact show us ANY photo of Palmer with a *scope* on his bow(s). You made the claim.....Now back it up!
So you're suggesting that a scope was never used while tracking/hunting/shooting this lion?
Yeah, right... Got some swampland you're trying to peddle as well?
[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 09-19-2015).]
