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eBay Fiero Turbo Kit, wish me luck. by JCircs
Started on: 09-09-2012 06:31 PM
Replies: 191 (17156 views)
Last post by: JCircs on 02-10-2014 10:06 AM
JCircs
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Report this Post10-07-2012 03:10 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JCircsClick Here to Email JCircsSend a Private Message to JCircsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Yes, out from the bottom of the wastegate to the side of the turbo. Is that correct?

No clamps on the line, should there be?

[This message has been edited by JCircs (edited 10-07-2012).]

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ConvictedRedneck
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Report this Post10-07-2012 09:32 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ConvictedRedneckClick Here to Email ConvictedRedneckSend a Private Message to ConvictedRedneckEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Ok I figured that's where it was hiding, just wanted to make sure. Clamps...depends if you trust the seal of just pushing them on. Remember these lines will have 7psi of pressure behind them.
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Report this Post10-07-2012 10:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mattwaClick Here to Email mattwaSend a Private Message to mattwaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Looks good, but seriously why would you attempt to drive it with the modified chip and MAP sensor when it runs that badly?
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BV MotorSports
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Report this Post10-07-2012 10:55 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BV MotorSportsClick Here to Email BV MotorSportsSend a Private Message to BV MotorSportsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by JCircs:

Yes, out from the bottom of the wastegate to the side of the turbo. Is that correct?

No clamps on the line, should there be?



Thats not how you connect it! Also, your engine shot.. man that looks great!!!!

[This message has been edited by BV MotorSports (edited 10-07-2012).]

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JCircs
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Report this Post10-08-2012 08:43 AM Click Here to See the Profile for JCircsClick Here to Email JCircsSend a Private Message to JCircsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I'm impatient that's why Mattwa! BV that's the way it came connected outta the box. Thanks for the compliment, I hope to be cleaning it up alot better if I can get it to run, I'd also like to add one of those useless strut tower braces in red or chrome.
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Jncomutt
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Report this Post10-08-2012 09:26 AM Click Here to See the Profile for JncomuttClick Here to Email JncomuttSend a Private Message to JncomuttEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
You have the wrong MAP sensor. The 2-bar will NOT plug in. What are the numbers on your map sensor?

Make sure you use zipties on those wastegate lines. Are you using the manual boost controller, or just running off spring? You can run the turbo to the bottom wastegate like you have now, but you also need to T into the top port with your controller. Also, it looks like you still have your EGR solenoid hooked up, and you're running vac to your BOV from the egr line. I would delete that stuff (since your egr is gone) and run your bov from a different source.

Edit, stole this pic from Gnttype..

[This message has been edited by Jncomutt (edited 10-08-2012).]

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JCircs
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Report this Post10-08-2012 11:40 AM Click Here to See the Profile for JCircsClick Here to Email JCircsSend a Private Message to JCircsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Right now the turbo came set for 5lbs of boost, I have not yet connected my manual controller. I want to get it running and my gauges hooked up before I start messing with added boost. Yes my Egr is gone, blanked off at the manifold and deleted on my chip. The plastic Egr vac line was just put on the bov to get outta the way till I got a plug to cap it and a T to get vac from the manifold. Also I was told by Rick of Boosted Exhaust that I only need to attach the manual boost controller inline with the single vac line from the compressor to the turbo, and I did not need the upper connection from the wastegate ( that I never received ). I looked online and found that it should also work like he said. I have not yet heard from the shop where the car is now, I'm waiting to hear the voltage from the sensor. I'm praying its a 1 bar.
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Report this Post10-08-2012 01:50 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JncomuttClick Here to Email JncomuttSend a Private Message to JncomuttEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Without the top port, you can't run more than spring pressure. Think about whats inside a wastegate. You have exhaust gas trying to push against a diaphragm with a spring on the other side. Once the pressure of the exhaust overcomes the spring pressure, the gate opens, allowing exhaust to be routed around the turbo. Putting 'boost' pressure to the bottom of the spring only helps to 'open' the valve earlier. If you put boost pressure to the top, you have pressure 'helping' the spring keep the valve closed.

(another stolen image)

[This message has been edited by Jncomutt (edited 10-08-2012).]

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JCircs
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Report this Post10-08-2012 04:07 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JCircsClick Here to Email JCircsSend a Private Message to JCircsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Bad news... The map sensor is putting out 2.2V, it is a 2 bar and the car won't run.
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nosrac
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Report this Post10-08-2012 05:18 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nosracSend a Private Message to nosracEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by JCircs:

Bad news... The map sensor is putting out 2.2V, it is a 2 bar and the car won't run.


Try 1 bar map the modded tune. Maybe the new tune doesn't have the 2 bar map programmed in.
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JCircs
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Report this Post10-08-2012 05:34 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JCircsClick Here to Email JCircsSend a Private Message to JCircsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
That combo I did not try, I tried the stock chip with both the 1 and 2 bar amd the new chip with only the 2 bar. I thought the turbo needed the 2 bar?
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Report this Post10-08-2012 05:37 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TheRealShadowXClick Here to Email TheRealShadowXSend a Private Message to TheRealShadowXEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Isnt 2 bar a nessecity for car running more than 14.7 lbs of boost?

------------------

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nosrac
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Report this Post10-08-2012 06:14 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nosracSend a Private Message to nosracEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by TheRealShadowX:

Isnt 2 bar a nessecity for car running more than 14.7 lbs of boost?



That is a 3 bar.
1 BAR is for a normally aspirated engine
2 BAR will handle a forced induction up to 14.5 psi of boost
3 BAR will handle a forced induction up to 29.0 psi of boost

[This message has been edited by nosrac (edited 10-08-2012).]

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Report this Post10-08-2012 06:26 PM Click Here to See the Profile for TheRealShadowXClick Here to Email TheRealShadowXSend a Private Message to TheRealShadowXEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by nosrac:


That is a 3 bar.
1 BAR is for a normally aspirated engine
2 BAR will handle a forced induction up to 14.5 psi of boost
3 BAR will handle a forced induction up to 29.0 psi of boost



I considered that.

Thanks! It's nice to be corrected gracefully once in a while.
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nosrac
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Report this Post10-08-2012 06:33 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nosracSend a Private Message to nosracEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by TheRealShadowX:


I considered that.

Thanks! It's nice to be corrected gracefully once in a while.


However, most 3800 Turbo guys do run more than 14.7 psi using a 2 bar map.

The PCM only sees 14.7 psi but the AFR are being controlled by the MAF readings rather than the MAP.
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Dennis LaGrua
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Report this Post10-08-2012 07:13 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Dennis LaGruaClick Here to Email Dennis LaGruaSend a Private Message to Dennis LaGruaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by JCircs:

Bad news... The map sensor is putting out 2.2V, it is a 2 bar and the car won't run.


Then it must be the chip program. Make sure that you did not bend any pins upon insertion in the ECM. Does the detent in the chip line up with the detent in the prom holder? Then re-confirm that darth programmed it for a 2 BAR MAP. You use a different definition code to program for a 2 BAR MAP. If worse comes to worse I can get my programmer up and running again and run off a copy of my 3.4L turbo chip but I'll need some time to do it. I just purchased a new computer that doesn't have serial ports for my pocket programmer and a new programmer is required I just purchased the new eprom programmer and it should be here soon. If it were myself I would still replace the MAP with an AC Delco 2 BAR unit. The voltage test isn't absolute. It doesn't check on the across the board operation. BTW are you sure that the MAP is connected to manifold vacuum? There is a rubber elbow underneath it where tha hose elbow attaches. BTW, do not drive the car unless the engine is running correctly. To do so invites damage.
------------------
" THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Powerlog manifold, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Flotech Afterburner Exhaust, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite.
"THE COLUSSUS"
87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H
" ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "

[This message has been edited by Dennis LaGrua (edited 10-08-2012).]

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JCircs
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Report this Post10-08-2012 07:42 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JCircsClick Here to Email JCircsSend a Private Message to JCircsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Well I think Dennis LaGrua just figured out my issue. Can anyone please confirm? When I had the O2 sensor bung installed the downpipe was not on the car, when I installed it I found the bung was to low and the wire couldn't reach so I tied it up and finished the install. After the install was complete I attempted to drive to the shop without the O2 sensor connected and the car wouldn't run. Would this be the cause? Man I hope so.......
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Report this Post10-08-2012 10:45 PM Click Here to See the Profile for HudiniClick Here to Email HudiniSend a Private Message to HudiniEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The lack of a working O2 would mean the car stays in Open Loop. The car should drive like any other cold engine. You have something else going on. Are you running a distributor or DIS? When I had Darth first program my chip with $8F he used the distributor config and the car wouldn't run as I had DIS running. He fixed it quick and it ran ok as we started the tuning process.
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JCircs
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Report this Post10-08-2012 10:48 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JCircsClick Here to Email JCircsSend a Private Message to JCircsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Yes it was just brought to my attention that there is also a issue with my tune that will be corrected and I should have a new chip on Wednesday.
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Report this Post10-09-2012 11:46 PM Click Here to See the Profile for SCCA FIEROSend a Private Message to SCCA FIEROEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Not sure if it was mentioned, but did you reverse the wires to the MAP sensor? I did my turbo so long ago I can't be 100% certain, but I am pretty sure I had to swap a couple of the wires at the plug for the MAP sensor when I went to the 2 Bar MAP.

[edit]
It looks like I did not switch the location of the wires. I only had to remove the wires from the green plug and put them in the orange plug to fit the 2 Bar MAP.

Also, you might want to support the weight of the turbo. Mine has a bracket that bolts to the transaxle and is pretty beefy. Does that crossover have a flexible bellow in it?

[This message has been edited by SCCA FIERO (edited 10-09-2012).]

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Report this Post10-12-2012 10:36 AM Click Here to See the Profile for justinchristieClick Here to visit justinchristie's HomePageSend a Private Message to justinchristieEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Any updates?

------------------
1986 Fiero SE 3.4L pushrod build up | Blog | My Portfolio site
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JCircs
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Report this Post10-12-2012 12:55 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JCircsClick Here to Email JCircsSend a Private Message to JCircsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Car went into the shop to have the pipes welded and o2 installed. On the lift they noticed the manifolds had separation where they met the turbo header pipe. In order to lower it for a proper seal I need to customize the kickdown/TV cable on top of my auto transmission. Also the downpipe was very tight against the firewall putting to much pressure on the A/C lines behind the heat shield. Rick at boosted offered to correct those issues and ship out the tweaked pipes but I'm impatient and just had the shop correct everything. The problem I was having with the car not running was a glitch in Sinisters chip that he fixed, the car now runs very smooth. I should be taking it home tonight. We were waiting for the stainless braided oil lines lines for the turbo to come in. My lack of patients was almost disastrous, before adding the stainless lines I used a set of good hose clamps (not the Cheap ones) on the supplied rubber oil feed line and took a short drive nice and easy just to feel it out. Yup you guessed it, I blew the hose right off the turbo shot oil onto the header and that's when the flames started. Yes these things do catch fire. It was quick and really caused no damage except the paint under the deck lid and a mild heart attack, the paint will be fixed the heart, 2 shots of Patron and a Grey Goose and 7 and I was good to go. For two days now they have been cleaning the soot and chemical from the fire extinguisher off the entire engine bay.
Man this has been an experience I must say, And its becoming an expensive one at that. All in all I gotta laugh it coulda been worse. Man I love this F^*ÔéČing car.... Stay tuned
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Report this Post10-12-2012 01:34 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nitroheadz28Send a Private Message to nitroheadz28Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Wow I'm glad that it wasn't any worse than that!! I'd have a heart attack too, good thing you had an extinguisher with you

Happy to see the kinks getting worked out, I look forward to seeing you and the car at the next cruise- that is if both our cars are ready . You seem to be having better luck than me haha.
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Report this Post10-12-2012 09:18 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Dennis LaGruaClick Here to Email Dennis LaGruaSend a Private Message to Dennis LaGruaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Many of you can thank JCIRCS for his pioneering efforts in getting this new turbo kit installed. I've been in contact with him and as you can see from his posts its been a rough road. The kit looks great and I expect that the end result will be excellent but for those considering a purchase of this kit; it appears that several tweaks to the kit will be needed before it can be considered a true bolt on installation. It sounds as though the engine is now ready for the final tuning.

------------------
" THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Powerlog manifold, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Flotech Afterburner Exhaust, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite.
"THE COLUSSUS"
87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H
" ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "

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JCircs
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Report this Post10-14-2012 02:54 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JCircsClick Here to Email JCircsSend a Private Message to JCircsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Im in the home stretch , I hooked up the stealth wideband A/F and boost combo gauge.

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eljibaro127
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Report this Post10-14-2012 04:18 PM Click Here to See the Profile for eljibaro127Click Here to Email eljibaro127Send a Private Message to eljibaro127Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
How is it power wise?
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Report this Post10-16-2012 10:26 AM Click Here to See the Profile for oldbikeracerClick Here to visit oldbikeracer's HomePageClick Here to Email oldbikeracerSend a Private Message to oldbikeracerEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I still wonder why the oil return line from the turbo can not just be put in a valve cover, instead of pulling the oil pan?
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JCircs
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Report this Post10-16-2012 10:35 AM Click Here to See the Profile for JCircsClick Here to Email JCircsSend a Private Message to JCircsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
My guess is gravity, it needs to drain down hill. And to answer the other question, the tune is not correct yet so I'm not sure of the added power.
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Report this Post10-16-2012 05:36 PM Click Here to See the Profile for boostedexhaustClick Here to visit boostedexhaust's HomePageClick Here to Email boostedexhaustSend a Private Message to boostedexhaustEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
hey hopfully everything is going good now as for the oil you can do the oil to the valve cover but you need to run a scavenge pump but on the fiero it is very easy to weld on a bung without removeing it.
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Report this Post10-16-2012 05:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BV MotorSportsClick Here to Email BV MotorSportsSend a Private Message to BV MotorSportsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
If you want to drop $250 on a good pump... if not, gravity drain.
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Report this Post10-20-2012 09:32 AM Click Here to See the Profile for oldbikeracerClick Here to visit oldbikeracer's HomePageClick Here to Email oldbikeracerSend a Private Message to oldbikeracerEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I am still confused about the oil return line ? Isn't the oil from the engine under pressure to the turbo? Seems to me that if is under pressure to the turbo it would also have positive pressure from the turbo, so return line would have engine oil pressure also. This would not require a scavange pump to return the oil to the vavle cover as it would be under pressure. Looks like everyone is saying that all oil pressure is lost in the turbo? I do not know much about a turbo, just wondering.
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Report this Post10-20-2012 09:43 AM Click Here to See the Profile for fieroguruSend a Private Message to fieroguruEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by oldbikeracer:

I am still confused about the oil return line ? Isn't the oil from the engine under pressure to the turbo? Seems to me that if is under pressure to the turbo it would also have positive pressure from the turbo, so return line would have engine oil pressure also. This would not require a scavange pump to return the oil to the vavle cover as it would be under pressure. Looks like everyone is saying that all oil pressure is lost in the turbo? I do not know much about a turbo, just wondering.


The seals in the turbo are not designed to hold back any significant amount of oil pressure, so you want as little restriction in the return side as possible. If you have positive pressure on the return side you will likely pump oil past the seals and have a smoke monster.

[This message has been edited by fieroguru (edited 10-20-2012).]

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Joseph Upson
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Report this Post10-22-2012 12:11 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Joseph UpsonClick Here to Email Joseph UpsonSend a Private Message to Joseph UpsonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by BV MotorSports:

If you want to drop $250 on a good pump... if not, gravity drain.


The all metal red, blue and black series Holley fuel pumps work very well in this application also with the pump screen removed for much less than half the price and are much easier to come by in the event of a failure. I still have mine on the car although it's not being used at the moment as an alternative.
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Report this Post10-29-2012 02:51 PM Click Here to See the Profile for eljibaro127Click Here to Email eljibaro127Send a Private Message to eljibaro127Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Any updates on power?
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nosrac
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Report this Post10-29-2012 03:16 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nosracSend a Private Message to nosracEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by JCircs:

Im in the home stretch , I hooked up the stealth wideband A/F and boost combo gauge.



Why is the AFR 11.7 on IDLE??? Shouldn't it be 14.7...
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JCircs
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Report this Post10-29-2012 03:17 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JCircsClick Here to Email JCircsSend a Private Message to JCircsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Well, I had a faulty wastegate that kinda held up the process, Rick from boosted sent me a new one and I installed it yesterday. I took it for a quick drive keeping the RPM's under 3k just to make sure this wastegate was OK. I definitely feel the the added power already, and the turbo sounds real cool. Now that all is ok I can continue the tuning process. Stay tuned
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Report this Post10-29-2012 03:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nosracSend a Private Message to nosracEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by JCircs:

Well, I had a faulty wastegate that kinda held up the process, Rick from boosted sent me a new one and I installed it yesterday. I took it for a quick drive keeping the RPM's under 3k just to make sure this wastegate was OK. I definitely feel the the added power already, and the turbo sounds real cool. Now that all is ok I can continue the tuning process. Stay tuned


Really I was just getting into boost @ 3K with my 3800 and 6266 .81AR.

What are your turbo specs?
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JCircs
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Report this Post10-29-2012 03:30 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JCircsClick Here to Email JCircsSend a Private Message to JCircsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
@nosrac not sure why 11 on the wideband, it usaully idles around 14-15 but like I said the tune needs to be completed, it is running rich tho. As far as the spec's not really sure but I may have been over 3k when I heard the turbo. I just needed to see if the new wastegate held boost, the original dumped as soon as boost was present.
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lou_dias
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Report this Post10-29-2012 08:31 PM Click Here to See the Profile for lou_diasClick Here to Email lou_diasSend a Private Message to lou_diasEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by nosrac:
Why is the AFR 11.7 on IDLE??? Shouldn't it be 14.7...

Ryan tends to tune pig rich in the name of safety...
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85red2m6
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Report this Post11-08-2012 08:45 AM Click Here to See the Profile for 85red2m6Click Here to Email 85red2m6Send a Private Message to 85red2m6Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Bump for updates?

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1986 Fiero SE 2.8 Auto - Blackie
1985 Fiero GT 2.8 4-spd - Goldie II - To be driveable this season
1985 Fiero SE Targa - 3.8SC - long term project
1987 Cavalier Z24 2.8 5-spd - daily beaten driver
1993 Bonneville SSEi - 3800SC donor for 85 Targa

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