To a large extent, I think most athiests, and most Christians are really being hurt by a vocal minority within each group. This thread is a prime example. There are plenty of posts already indirectly, or directly blaming athiests or Christians for our country's problems, bigotry, hatred, etc.

The media has their hand in this too. The media likes nothing more than hate-speak from some "group" to broadcast to the world in a five second soundbite.

The vast majority of Americans, Christians, agnostics, athiests, muslims, or other religions, are Americans and love their country and it's ideals. I

quote Originally posted by Fformula88: To a large extent, I think most athiests, and most Christians are really being hurt by a vocal minority within each group. This thread is a prime example. There are plenty of posts already indirectly, or directly blaming athiests or Christians for our country's problems, bigotry, hatred, etc. The media has their hand in this too. The media likes nothing more than hate-speak from some "group" to broadcast to the world in a five second soundbite. The vast majority of Americans, Christians, agnostics, athiests, muslims, or other religions, are Americans and love their country and it's ideals. I

I agree. I have a couple friends on this forum I know in person who are very church-going xtian, but they dont bug me with it. I have had others I have had to physically remove from my life and property because they wouldn't shut up about converting me, and when I say "no" that MEANS "no"

[This message has been edited by MidEngineManiac (edited 05-08-2012).]

quote Originally posted by Gridlock: To ignore it, is to be just as bad as those spewing the hate.

i'm not sure that banning is the solution, even possible. by the time you get a hundred pluses, it takes several hundred to ban (i think it's a 4/1 ratio).

the solution (if there is one) is to confront the specific behavior in a civil manner. stan now knows that some atheists are human beings, people he's met, agrees with on some points, maybe even likes. we're not just paper cutouts to fling $h1t at. one day he may realize that he's not protecting the oppressed, he is the oppressor. but it has to be done carefully, without anger, or we risk becoming stan.

quote Originally posted by MidEngineManiac: Its called "Free Speech"....the Americans have it as their 1st amendment of their constitution, and we have it as 1(d) of the Canadian Bill of Rights. Anybody who doesn't like the concept is free to move to North Korea.

Nope. Wrong answer.

I'm free to stay right here and say this isn't a free speech issue. This is him adding nothing to the discourse of this forum. This exact same thread has been posted over and over again.

He's trolling for a reaction.

And everytime, a few come in and say "this ain't right!" and for some reason, a bunch of people come to his defense.

I think it reflects poorly on us all.

quote Originally posted by Gridlock: Nope. Wrong answer. I'm free to stay right here and say this isn't a free speech issue. This is him adding nothing to the discourse of this forum. This exact same thread has been posted over and over again. He's trolling for a reaction. And everytime, a few come in and say "this ain't right!" and for some reason, a bunch of people come to his defense. I think it reflects poorly on us all.

Yeh, well...when ya start sayin "that aint right" its your right to say so and think so, but when ya start trying to silence somebody because ya dont agree with their ideas, THATS censorship, and censorship aint right......If ya dont like what Stan says (not sayin I do either) then ignore him, it aint that hard...there are a few people on here that I just ignore, but I dont try to shut them up because I dont like what they say.....if ya can only tollerate living someplace where people say things YOU think are right and agree with, then planet earth is probably a bad choice for a home.

quote Originally posted by MidEngineManiac: Yeh, well...when ya start sayin "that aint right" its your right to say so and think so, but when ya start trying to silence somebody because ya dont agree with their ideas, THATS censorship, and censorship aint right......If ya dont like what Stan says (not sayin I do either) then ignore him, it aint that hard...there are a few people on here that I just ignore, but I dont try to shut them up because I dont like what they say.....if ya can only tollerate living someplace where people say things YOU think are right and agree with, then planet earth is probably a bad choice for a home.

IMO the thing is this site does NOT practise free speech, if it did it would be open to all, which it is not.

I agree with lurkers last post in that regard. Sorry Lurker

I have known many men like this.
Good men.
They are just stuck in another time.
It is by choice.
It is a way for them to hold on to a time when they were powerfull, when they controlled things, when they were needed.
They are trying to hold on to a world that has left their somewhat outdated skillset and mindset in the past.
So they see all change as the enemy, and herald the battlecry to save us idiots from evils that seemingly only they can see.
The problem is, they are not trying to save this world, they are trying to save a world that is already long gone.
Becouse the better world you want is always the world you had, and never the one you have.

These guys are not of no value, though.
They have lessons to teach, and skills & steel guts that could come in handy.

They just need to be put under glass with a sign: Break In Case Of War.

After all, no one NEEDS one of these anymore.

That is, untill someone NEEDS one of those!

[This message has been edited by Boondawg (edited 05-08-2012).]

quote Originally posted by newf: I agree with lurkers last post in that regard. Sorry Lurker

darn well better be. i'll get you for that.

quote Originally posted by Boondawg: They have lessons to teach

excellent.

quote Originally posted by Gridlock: And again, here we go. Get ready! fingers on the button? I'm going to say something in regards to this guy ranting about homosexuality again and I'm sure there are a few uhlanstan bandwagon jumpers that are going to want to come to this guys defense and rate me again. I have asked before, and I ask again, do we need to find it acceptable to have this guy go off and use the most offensive term for gay people? Do we? It's not like he's even linking an article and saying "look at those queers go!" he's just ranting for the ****ing attention. Can we not do something about this? And before you type your replies: no, I won't just ignore it no, I won't just hit the back button yes, I'll fight to have a forum that has as a minimum level of decorum that using this type of language is not acceptable. To ignore it, is to be just as bad as those spewing the hate.

I guess that makes me worse as i would fight for his right to say something i disagree with.

I could say more, but it wouldn't be polite, and i try not to be like that. Everyone gets to say their thing around me.

quote Originally posted by MidEngineManiac: Yeh, well...when ya start sayin "that aint right" its your right to say so and think so, but when ya start trying to silence somebody because ya dont agree with their ideas, THATS censorship, and censorship aint right......If ya dont like what Stan says (not sayin I do either) then ignore him, it aint that hard...there are a few people on here that I just ignore, but I dont try to shut them up because I dont like what they say.....if ya can only tollerate living someplace where people say things YOU think are right and agree with, then planet earth is probably a bad choice for a home.

Oh, I get it.

Here's my thing here. There is "opinions I disagree with" and there are things said purely for the sake of saying them.

He is the latter and I have no problem with the former. Trust me, I execute the former every time I log into this forum because there are a lot of people that say some **** that I totally disagree with.

My problem, and something I will NOT back down on is he isn't saying this stuff for any legitimate reason. It's him ranting for the sake of ranting. He's a troll. There are things that are not acceptable to say in normal conversation, and guess what? He says them.

I don't see that as something to celebrate.

If someone logs into PFF that is 1)muslim, 2) gay, or 3) atheist or really 4) a combo platter of the above I, as a member of this site would like to be one of the people that shows that this hateful, hurtful ranting is not the standard by which the membership here is defined.

And I get crap for doing so.

If there was a legit purpose to any of it, I'd almost be willing to say, its a a simple of his opinion(in my mind narrow opinion) but then I can live with it. But its not. Hey, I'd settle for using gay instead of "queers" in caps as a simple way of trying to take the edge off.

I know for a fact that there WERE gay members on this forum(well, one that came out that I can remember) and I haven't seen him post here in a long time. You want to make this a 'rights' issue(which it is not) then what of him? What of others like him?

quote Originally posted by Boondawg: The problem is, they are not trying to save this world, they are trying to save a world that is already long gone.

... or, more often, a idealized, egocentric world that never really existed except in their imagination.

quote Originally posted by newf: IMO the thing is this site does NOT practise free speech, if it did it would be open to all, which it is not.

While true in concept as this is a 'private' forum run from a different country and are ultimately at Cliffs mercy, is it still proper for one of us to ask to restrict someone just because you don't like their message? We should all follow the spirit of freedom, unless we are just hypocrites at our core.

quote Originally posted by Gridlock: I know for a fact that there WERE gay members on this forum(well, one that came out that I can remember) and I haven't seen him post here in a long time. You want to make this a 'rights' issue(which it is not) then what of him? What of others like him?

Interesting that you should say that.

I was thinking about my latest "crusade" for what I think is "right".
I was compared to Jazzman.
When he left, I stated that "I could see myself leaving for/in much the same way HE did".
Then I would be gone.
And maybe, someone LIKE us would eventually be gone too.
And then someone else that made a kind of sense that didn't fit the mold of the majority.

It dawned on me that eventually, all that would be left was those that agreed with each other and thought along the same linbes as each other.
What then would this place be like?
Who would they be talking to?
No one would have anything to say to each other becouse they would already know it and agree with it.
Would they just "one up" each other?
Or fade away, without others to "better".

Would it only be a matter of time before they turned on each other?
Find and pick apart any little chink in one of their owns armor, that they deemed could posably be slightly "out of the pack"?
Like the way Hitlers "Master Race" were always looking for any little genetic imperfection in one of their OWNS past bloodline when they wanted to remove that person for other reasons?

Is it the nature of us when formed in a GROUP to find a difference, an outsider, an enemy within that group?

Do the majority need the minority?
Do the strong need the weak?
Do the rich need the poor?
Do blacks need whites, and vise versa?

Does love need hate?

Okay. I may as well put my .02 in this as well....since guys seem to be clearing the air on this subject.

It's no secret to some (if not most) of the regulars on here that I'm Muslim. I've read so many anti-Muslim threads on PFF that I'm almost immune to them now. There are most certainly members here who feel the same way Stan does but are either more reserved or "politic" in saying so...and do so often enough to be identifiable. I try not to post anything in those kinds of threads anymore because offering a contrary POV simply shakes the nuts from the trees. I've even gotten a couple of PMs from members who have said in no uncertain terms that if I don't like the way people talk about Muslims and others here to join another forum.

I can only imagine how a gay or non-Christian member of this forum feels when they read some of the things posted here. I've read extremely negative posts about gay rights, AIDS, child molestation (as if straights are immune to such abhorrent behaviors), same-sex marriage, gay parenting...you name it. Not all of them have been made by Stan either.

Personally, I see "uhlanstan" as the poster child for those who hold pretty similar views but would rather someone else take the heat for expressing them. Look at his ratings bar. It's obvious he strikes a positive chord with enough members to keep him here. It isn't even a matter of being "politically correct" or having to bite one's tongue.

It's a simple matter of respect for others.

[This message has been edited by Doni Hagan (edited 05-08-2012).]

quote Originally posted by Boondawg: Would it only be a matter of time before they turned on each other?

yes.
examine the history of spain. former tributary to carthage then rome, invaded by the goths and vandals, then in 711 the muslims came. the christians, jews and spanish muslims united to drive out the african muslims. when that was done, the jews and christians united to drive out the spanish muslims. when that was done, the christians united to drive out the jews. when that was done, the christians began driving out the "heretical christians". it's called the inquisition.

as we drive out dissent and diversity, we redefine the "enemy", until eventually there's only one left. this is why we only unite against a common enemy. the enemy of our enemy is our friend. when that enemy is done, we look for enemies among ourselves.

quote Originally posted by User00013170: While true in concept as this is a 'private' forum run from a different country and are ultimately at Cliffs mercy, is it still proper for one of us to ask to restrict someone just because you don't like their message? We should all follow the spirit of freedom, unless we are just hypocrites at our core.

Exactly my point, Cliff can and should do as he pleases, it's his site..... but claiming this is a place for free speech and that's why certain members get away with hate speech is wrong IMO. Like I've said I've seen plenty banned here for what many would consider "Free Speech". I'm not in disagreement with letting everyone speak their minds no matter how offensive OR regulating people that disobey the rules of the forum. I just wish there was more consistancy.

I'm a catholic, but my faith is mine, everyone can believe what they feel is correct.. I'm not to judge..
but I got gto tell ya, when I meet my maker,(hopefully many many moons from now) I have quite a few questions.. but that another topic
some groups want anything that relates to a church, of any kind removed from America, they want to errase it from history..
why they can't just look the other, way.. or "let it be" is something I'll never understand, but.
AMERICA is being killed by the gimmie gimmie gimmie, I got my hand out now fill it.. mantra that is todays sign of the times..
WE the PEOPLE are killing AMERICA , but allowing,willlingly to be controlled by the government, and by taking the hand outs, instead of standing on our own..
political correctness is the other thing killing america..
we where founded on religous freedom,, if someone doesn't believe in god, thats their right.. thats the base that this COUNTRY WAS FORMED..
both sides need to remember this, the god fearing people and the non believers.. both fail in this reguard.. don't tread on my beliefs and I'll not tread on yours..

remember,kids. IN GOD WE TRUST, ALL OTHERS MUST PAY CASH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

------------------
Is there anybody listening?
Is there anyone that sees what's going on?
Read between the lines,
criticize the words they're selling.
Think for yourself and feel the walls
become sand beneath your feet

I just wish that in MY OWN (and JUST MY OWN) threads, I could delete ANY post in there (in MY thread) that I wanted to.

Think of this forum as a world.
And each thread that someone builds is their house in that world.

It would be just me keeping MY house clean.
I wouldn't be changing or hurting the world that house resides in, in any way.
Or stiffling free speech in that world.

Act how you want in your house, but not in mine.
A mans house should be his sanctuary from the world.

EDIT: Or maybe a checkbox beside every members name in the "Memberlist".
Check the box beside a members name, and when they tried to post in your threads, they would get a message "Your Bullsh!t Is Not Welcome In This Thread."

[This message has been edited by Boondawg (edited 05-08-2012).]

The **** am I reading?

quote Originally posted by Boondawg: I just wish that in MY OWN (and JUST MY OWN) threads, I could delete ANY post in there (in MY thread) that I wanted to.

I have a lot of respect for you so please don’t take this as an attack. You have no threads and own no threads. When you start a thread you are simply putting a topic up for discussion and are considered the original poster. Nobody has any control over what is posted or what direction the thread may take.. Yes it can be annoying but internet forums are not for the thin skinned.

Stan, is unto his own, kinda like South Park, you watch long enough and they will get around to offending you too. His rant about atheist queers is pathetic and short sited though I would not be surprised if many agree with him. The premise is so absurd it is laughable. I think he just wants to get people going.

I believe that most atheists really have a live and let live attitude but the perceived underlying message to the religious types is you’re a fool and an idiot. Overall the believers seam to have a much harder time with the non believers than vice versa.

United states is not just freedom of religion but freedom from it too. Always keep an eye open to the conquer and divide tactics, no matter who is playing at it.

quote Originally posted by Red88FF: I have a lot of respect for you so please don’t take this as an attack. You have no threads and own no threads. When you start a thread you are simply putting a topic up for discussion and are considered the original poster. Nobody has any control over what is posted or what direction the thread may take.. Yes it can be annoying but internet forums are not for the thin skinned. Stan, is unto his own, kinda like South Park, you watch long enough and they will get around to offending you too. His rant about atheist queers is pathetic and short sited though I would not be surprised if many agree with him. The premise is so absurd it is laughable. I think he just wants to get people going. I believe that most atheists really have a live and let live attitude but the perceived underlying message to the religious types is you’re a fool and an idiot. Overall the believers seam to have a much harder time with the non believers than vice versa. United states is not just freedom of religion but freedom from it too. Always keep an eye open to the conquer and divide tactics, no matter who is playing at it.

Well said.
On all counts.

quote Originally posted by Doni Hagan: I can only imagine how a gay or non-Christian member of this forum feels when they read some of the things posted here.

Ya know, Donni....I am one of those non-xtian types Stan targeted, and it dont bother me at all. I've got a pretty thick skin when it comes to stuff like that, and for the few that do bug me (usually in person) my answer is invariably "go frack yerself", followed by a certain finger, and if needed (only if needed) removal of the offending party....and thats the end of it. I cant be bothered dwelling on it, as someone else's approval or acceptance of what I am simply isnt that important to me. I'm pretty happy with my beliefs, thoughts, philosophies, ect--and in the end my own opinion is really the only one that matters to me.

I've always said opinions are like a-holes. Everybody has one, but the only one I am gonna scratch is my own.

quote Originally posted by Boondawg: I just wish that in MY OWN (and JUST MY OWN) threads, I could delete ANY post in there (in MY thread) that I wanted to. Think of this forum as a world. And each thread that someone builds is their house in that world. It would be just me keeping MY house clean. I wouldn't be changing or hurting the world that house resides in, in any way. Or stiffling free speech in that world. Act how you want in your house, but not in mine. A mans house should be his sanctuary from the world. EDIT: Or maybe a checkbox beside every members name in the "Memberlist". Check the box beside a members name, and when they tried to post in your threads, they would get a message "Your Bullsh!t Is Not Welcome In This Thread."

while i agree that we should all be civil and respectful of others, we come here and post to engage in public discourse. no one except maybe cliff actually "owns" a thread here, and the purpose of starting a thread, in theory at least, is to solicit the views and opinions of others. there are a lot of opinions i don't like, and would prefer the posters either kept to themselves or were more careful about how they stated their case. not everyone (sometimes no one) is going to validate my view. it's just the price of doing business, and ultimately, it justifies my right to throw out an unpopular opinion now and then. so it's not a great bargain, but worth a little aggravation.

quote Originally posted by Doni Hagan: Okay. I may as well put my .02 in this as well....since guys seem to be clearing the air on this subject. It's no secret to some (if not most) of the regulars on here that I'm Muslim. I've read so many anti-Muslim threads on PFF that I'm almost immune to them now. There are most certainly members here who feel the same way Stan does but are either more reserved or "politic" in saying so...and do so often enough to be identifiable. I try not to post anything in those kinds of threads anymore because offering a contrary POV simply shakes the nuts from the trees. I've even gotten a couple of PMs from members who have said in no uncertain terms that if I don't like the way people talk about Muslims and others here to join another forum. I can only imagine how a gay or non-Christian member of this forum feels when they read some of the things posted here. I've read extremely negative posts about gay rights, AIDS, child molestation (as if straights are immune to such abhorrent behaviors), same-sex marriage, gay parenting...you name it. Not all of them have been made by Stan either. Personally, I see "uhlanstan" as the poster child for those who hold pretty similar views but would rather someone else take the heat for expressing them. Look at his ratings bar. It's obvious he strikes a positive chord with enough members to keep him here. It isn't even a matter of being "politically correct" or having to bite one's tongue. It's a simple matter of respect for others.

Thank you for sharing.

quote Originally posted by Doni Hagan: Okay. I may as well put my .02 in this as well....since guys seem to be clearing the air on this subject. It's no secret to some (if not most) of the regulars on here that I'm Muslim. I've read so many anti-Muslim threads on PFF that I'm almost immune to them now. There are most certainly members here who feel the same way Stan does but are either more reserved or "politic" in saying so...and do so often enough to be identifiable. I try not to post anything in those kinds of threads anymore because offering a contrary POV simply shakes the nuts from the trees. I've even gotten a couple of PMs from members who have said in no uncertain terms that if I don't like the way people talk about Muslims and others here to join another forum. I can only imagine how a gay or non-Christian member of this forum feels when they read some of the things posted here. I've read extremely negative posts about gay rights, AIDS, child molestation (as if straights are immune to such abhorrent behaviors), same-sex marriage, gay parenting...you name it. Not all of them have been made by Stan either. Personally, I see "uhlanstan" as the poster child for those who hold pretty similar views but would rather someone else take the heat for expressing them. Look at his ratings bar. It's obvious he strikes a positive chord with enough members to keep him here. It isn't even a matter of being "politically correct" or having to bite one's tongue. It's a simple matter of respect for others.

like any group, it only takes a few to wreck it for everyone else.. most in the U.S.A. didn't know what muslim was untill 9/11 , and unfairly or not, a label gets put with it..
same with priest, last few years, the few bad ones have wrecked the "outlook" of all of them..
is it fair, nope, is it right, nope, will it change, nope.. the hope is that it doesn't change the person, no matter what anyone else thinks..

I just wanted to take a count here:

People and members (potentially) offended by this post are:

atheist-check.
muslim-check
gay?-well, no one has come out in this thread, but I do know some are here so let's go...check.

Great! all that in the name of free speech.

Ain't it one great big happy family.

quote Originally posted by Boondawg: ... And the country IS being ruined from within, but it's big money & political intrests that's selling the country out, not it's people.

That said it is people that run that stuff, and people that buy what politics sell, and alot of them are Americans, and all have beliefs.

As for the opening post, I don't like labels as most are not even correct, I don't like blanket statements or dropping people in large groups.
People will believe ewhat they want to believe. Some people go with the no right-no wrong I'm ok-you're ok stance, some don't, and all in between.
An Athiest is sure there is no diety. There are actually suprisingly few people who believe this way when under dire circumstances.

quote Originally posted by Doni Hagan: It's a simple matter of respect for others.

This is why I love you as a human Doni.

I have refused to give negatives out, unless necessary for some time now. EVERYONE is entitled to an opinion. We are not entitled to preach racism or hate.

I have found that bypassing threads is easy. But, the hate as of late is deafening. It makes me sad.

And BTW, I am one who HAS started a hate thread about Muslims. Through Mr. Hagans tutelage, I have found a certain peace. Remember this next time that we choose hate over love.

Tony

quote Originally posted by Doni Hagan: Personally, I see "uhlanstan" as the poster child for those who hold pretty similar views but would rather someone else take the heat for expressing them. Look at his ratings bar. It's obvious he strikes a positive chord with enough members to keep him here.

One of the classic symptoms of traumatic brain injury, with which, by his own admission, uhlanstan is afflicted, is loss of normal judgment and self control ... and specifically difficulty with impulse control. If that's correct, then we can charitably view uhlanstan's rants as simply pathological, uncontrolled expression of his internal world view, thoughts and attitudes that others may indeed share with him but choose not to express publicly. That does not excuse his semi-coherent, bigoted rants, but it does partially explain them.

I've said it before: I'm less concerned about uhlanstan than I am about some of the people here who cheer him on.

[This message has been edited by Marvin McInnis (edited 05-09-2012).]

quote Originally posted by Boondawg: Is it the nature of us when formed in a GROUP to find a difference, an outsider, an enemy within that group? Do the majority need the minority? Do the strong need the weak? Do the rich need the poor? Do blacks need whites, and vise versa? Does love need hate?

The nature is protect that group, fear other groups. Sometimes legitimate, sometimes not.
I don't need a group, I choose to be here.

Gang up on me guys, I won't leave.
I find it stupid that Doni has recieved PMs saying if you don't agree with us then leave.
That stuff is weak and pathetic. A kind of junior high bullying.
People who do that garbage need to stop, and if names were named they would lose any respect (if they have any).

quote Originally posted by 2.5: *snip* I find it stupid that Doni has recieved PMs saying if you don't agree with us then leave. That stuff is weak and pathetic. A kind of junior high bullying. People who do that garbage need to stop, and if names were named they would lose any respect (if they have any).

its more than pathetic, its totally uncalled for.

quote Originally posted by Gridlock: Ain't it one great big happy family.

Weeeellll.....I'd rather have that kind of big happy family than some sort of politically-correct special-ed class where everybody is afraid to speak because they might hurt somebody's feels, and everybody has a tissue in their hand because they are gonna cry if they hear something they dont like......but then there is a reason I ran away from the left coast 20 years ago.

Gee, and the funny thing is, even the courts and human rights commissions agree with me since they have put chapter 13 in limbo.

(for the US guys that dont know, Chapter 13 of the Criminal Code of Canada was (keyword WAS) our thought-control law that made it a crime to hurt anybody's feelings by saying something they didnt like. It WAS enforced and adjudicated by quasi-judicial kangaroo-court "human rights commissions")

Score one for free speach

[This message has been edited by MidEngineManiac (edited 05-08-2012).]

quote Originally posted by User00013170: I guess that makes me worse as i would fight for his right to say something i disagree with.

Would you fight for mine?

I seriously doubt it.
If I had ever ranted the way Stan does, using the language he uses, I would have been banned by the administrator a long time ago.

Yet the xenophobes remain.

Duh.
------------------

Drive safely!

[This message has been edited by NEPTUNE (edited 05-08-2012).]

quote Originally posted by ls3mach: I think Christianity has helped destroy this country long enough. I say do away with all religions.

I find amusing the amount of angst going on in this thread.

NOT that there is angst. But the AMOUNT.


Yes, a forum member said offensive things about you. I'm sorry that happened to you. But I would ask you to consider a couple things.

1. Did you see a stream of SUPPORT for his viewpoint? No. You didn't get piled on.

So what was the NEXT step, since people didn't support his view. "...well, there probably ARE a LOT of people on the forum who agree..."


Really? Nicely done. You get YOUR feelings hurt, so in response, you ACCUSE a bunch of other forum members.


2. Did you consider the source? I hesitate to bring this up, because I appreciate uhlanstan for his military service to his country. Does that give him carte blanche to say absolutely ANYthing? No.

"...well, then, why wasn't there an outcry of christians, non-atheists, etc. in support of us????"

Because it was uhlanstan. Come on. You all know him by now. You know his background. There is no need for anyone to stand up and say they don't agree with many things he says.


3. It is humorous to see the blindness relating to being criticized, considering the amount of insults, criticisms, and attacks on christians in this forum. To read the comments about the hurtful comments, and how it could drive someone atheist, gay, or muslim off the forum--you might want to re-read some threads or watch some threads in the future and watch the comments by many about christians.
So while I am sorry for those of you that were offended, considering the points above...wow.

BUT, I sincerely hope it has been therapeutic for you.

quote Originally posted by Boondawg: I love the concepts & "spirit" of freedom, but that does NOT mean I will allow someone to insult, falsely accuse, or besmirch my name simply becouse they claim "Freedom Of Speech"

"Falsely accuse" could be considered slander depending on the situation, which is a different situation.

That said, myself id still defend a person's right to insult me.

[This message has been edited by User00013170 (edited 05-08-2012).]