Over the past few months, I've been thinking of possible engine swaps. I would ideally want 400hp from the engine. My question is, what engine swap would be the cheapest to get 400hp from, and how would I go about modding the engine to get 400hp?
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07:13 PM
PFF
System Bot
ryan.hess Member
Posts: 20784 From: Orlando, FL Registered: Dec 2002
Really? Cams on the North* cheaper than building a SBC? I don't know, I don't have any experience with the Caddies, but you can also visit www.v8archie.com
First ??? should be how Cheap are you shooting for. Also read my Sig that kind of sums up alot.
------------------ "If you want your car to be cheap and fast it won't be reliable... If you want your car to be reliable and cheap it won't be fast... If you want your car to be fast and reliable it won't be cheap...
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07:43 PM
CentralFloridaFieros Member
Posts: 363 From: Orlando, Florida, USA Registered: Mar 2004
I've been mosty looking into building up a tpi engine and stroking it out, but after doing a little search on Northstar cam changes, it looks pretty promising, I'm thinking about spending around $1500-$3000 depending on engine type.
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07:56 PM
GT86 Member
Posts: 5203 From: Glendale, AZ Registered: Mar 2003
I think the small block chevy would be the cheap way out due to you can pick one up cheap to build to 400 HP and the northstar i think would be $1000 dollars just to buy it then you still have to get another 100 HP to get to 400 HP I would put together A 400 SBC due to it will be easyer to the HP out of it due to it's big inches a decent set of heads a good cam and intake 9.5 to 1 compression and you are there and it should idle pretty smoth and you will not need to do all the computer stuff
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07:58 PM
darkhorizon Member
Posts: 12279 From: Flint Michigan Registered: Jan 2006
Ryan does the computer stuff extremely reasonable and I have a guy now who is going to build me a harness out of a N* harness and a Fiero harness. Again very reasonable. I think that the days of being scared of a N* may be coming to an end. Think of it, 350 sbc iron pushrod or 4.6 all aluminum dohc. The 350 sbc has been great but it's pretty old technology.
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08:15 PM
ryan.hess Member
Posts: 20784 From: Orlando, FL Registered: Dec 2002
But why not just buy an LS2 (400hp from the factory) and use Archie's LS kit and install it? Not sure what the cost difference would be between the N* and the LS2
Buy it and you can probably strike a deal with Archie for the 6-speed. Archie could always use the above 6-speed for a Solstice V-8 swap and trade you a G6 6-speed for your Fiero.
Yes you can find older, higher mileage N*'s for less but then you would need to pull it apart and install the new cams and check out the engine carefully to verify condition.
------------------ Happiness isn't around the corner... Happiness IS the corner. ZZ4 Powered !!
[This message has been edited by Oreif (edited 06-28-2006).]
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08:47 PM
MclarenF1 Member
Posts: 639 From: Kingston, WA Registered: May 2006
Originally posted by Oreif: But why not just buy an LS2 (400hp from the factory) and use Archie's LS kit and install it?
Because.... you have to buy a kit to install it? What do I win?
The RWD northstar in your link won't work in a fiero. If you absolutely must have a 0-mile N*, there are rebuilt ones for about $3k, and crate engines from GM for about $4k
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09:00 PM
ryan.hess Member
Posts: 20784 From: Orlando, FL Registered: Dec 2002
Just slap in a 3800 supercharged motor there will be all the horses you need. Not 400 but plenty of horsepower. I think the supercharged 3800 is the way to go but that is just my opinion.
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09:12 PM
MclarenF1 Member
Posts: 639 From: Kingston, WA Registered: May 2006
Well theres always the option of installing a random SBC and painting it up all nice, tell a few lies and pretend you have 400 hp, it seems to work for some people.
But seriously, setting a number like that will definetly cost you some serious bucks. Buying a nice looking car with 140 hp and expecting to sink a few grand into it and get it to 400 hp might be pushing it. You may want to lower your projected hp, or maybe increase your budget. I am sure you will figure it out, there are enough people on here with the experience and knowledge to help you with just about anything.
Good luck
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12:15 AM
Erik Member
Posts: 5625 From: Des Moines, Iowa Registered: Jul 2002
nitrous or turbo ..and a small block chevy ..It possible to get an archie kit for a thousand, a good running small block (at least 350 cubic inches and 300 hp) for that amount and a turbo or nitrous setup for several hundred dollars ..the rest would be time and labor
if your adept at wiring, custom fab (welding and cutting metal and good at measurement) and understand fuel injection, you could get a a N* for less than thousand with wiring harness and PCM ..buy the cam kit Ryan suggests, have him or yourself tune the PCM and have 400 hp for a few thousand or less if you do most of the work yourself
[This message has been edited by Erik (edited 06-29-2006).]
How many people have actually dyno'd their 350's to prove they have 400 hp? Theres only one way to tell. I would go LT-1, LS-1, LS-2 etc or bust. Go with the newer, more powerful engines with better proven aftermarkets. If Fbodies can get 11.639@116.92. with...long tubes, converter, cam, sticky tires. Imagine what it would do in a fiero if you had the tranny done right.
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01:10 AM
MclarenF1 Member
Posts: 639 From: Kingston, WA Registered: May 2006
I'm kinda leanin' towards the Northstar because it's high revving, doesn't take to much to get 400hp (or at least it seems so), bolts up to the Fiero transmission, and it looks nice.
The only downsides are that it's a wiring nightmare, got to make your own mounts, requires engine bay modification, and it'll cost a little bit more than an LTX or LSX engine
NorthStars are definatley a nice conversion/transplant. Correct me someone if I`m mistaken, I think the cradle alone requires around 39-40 modifacations. I think I found this out a few years back when looking at doing one, from Chris Moore or Jr www.kitcarman.com , can`t remember. In either case, take a ride in one , see how it feels. I usually suggest for anyone doing any conversion to drive one first... As they can get costly....
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02:13 AM
MclarenF1 Member
Posts: 639 From: Kingston, WA Registered: May 2006
None in your area huh? Any Fiero shows coming up out your way ? I ran into the same problem before building mine, seemed like there where none in sight---then of course --after I`m done--their all over the place...The reason I mention this, (about driving one) is I have seen to many guys disappointed when they where done & want another type conversion, then have to sell theirs for 2/3 thirds or less of what they have in it---plus you don`t get labor back.....
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02:33 AM
Capt Fiero Member
Posts: 7657 From: British Columbia, Canada Registered: Feb 2000
Beware I have enough **** flowing through my blood stream this is going going to fry a few brain cells before everyone has a chance to realize what they are reading.
**** this debate is going ng to go in shitter faster than **** down a greasy pole.
Best Power to go fast in a Fiero is a medium sized V8 run a racer cam. It is going to cost you bottom end torque that that you wont need anyway give you more high end power Th you want to play and feel with. You can then pump pump compression to 10.5 - 1 and get a good power to parts ratio.
This can be built on any Chevy 305 -454sbc Just remember size - Money. most people choose 383 to get rip and tear torque with decent top end power for track.
Others choose 350's that have so much torque they will rip your head off.
The V8 is such a wide vary or parts, up the compression lower the cam specs and you can a nice stable sweet idle motor that will just go and go and give decent power.
Now go the other way, raise the fudge out of the compression get it dialed in to retard the timing as the cylinders buid pressures you can really get the best of the 2 worlds.
I have beeb doing this for a few years now.
My mext motor will be a boosted daily driver motor, probably a 3800SC car. Just to get it on the road and then change the pully for what ever driving style I want.
After that, I want BOOST on BOOST Nitrous. Go **** FAST. 454 Small Blocl with a 14-71 blower blown on alchole in the back of a cry treated 3.32 4sp Muncie. If I can get it to hook and plant the rear tires with some stickey stuff. You wheelie bears if you need. This car would blow the doors off just about anything. If a driver dumb enough to sit in the seat it would make world history. A Fiero would dip into the 9s easy.
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03:02 AM
PBJ Member
Posts: 4167 From: London, On., Canada Registered: Jan 2001
.. I would go LT-1, LS-1, LS-2 etc or bust. Go with the newer, more powerful engines with better proven aftermarkets. ....
Better aftermarket than the regular SBCs? Go and read a Jegs catalog and count the pages for each.
If you can afford it I would go LSx. Easier to make power but very expensive. Go and check the price for an LS cam kit, $450+. LS heads, $2000+. But they respond very good and are FI. LT1s was a limited production (compared to the others) and there is limited parts compared to the others. Go and look for Edelbrock LT1 heads or intake For a cheap 400HP you can get a cheap SBC, put a good cam, port the heads to hell, a carb, may need a nitrous kit an Archie's basic kit and seek the rest as cheap as you can. Another option is to get a cheap 3800 or 3400 and add a home grown turbo and tune to hell. All these will require a lot of skills to do it your self.
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08:38 AM
engine man Member
Posts: 5309 From: Morriston FL Registered: Mar 2006
Wow 7500 for a Northstar I could build one heck of a SBC for that more than 400 HP you should be able to get a 400 SBC that needs a rebuild for $300 to $500 and put another $2500 in it and get 400 HP that is not much to ask for now you will need a set of real vortec heads and about comp cams magnum 280 edelbrocks airgap intake . This is how i would go about it a 400 SBC $500 then a kit from Eagle $1286 the kit comes with rings and bearings then bore and hone clean and new cam bearings freez plugs about $350 cam and lifters $200 a set of good heads $600 intake $200 oil pump timing chain and a set of roller rockers $300 a set of nice vave covers $100 oh ya gasket kit $125 total $3786 if you put it together your self and will be a brand new engine that is much cheaper than a Northstar
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09:03 AM
Pyrthian Member
Posts: 29569 From: Detroit, MI Registered: Jul 2002
Over the past few months, I've been thinking of possible engine swaps. I would ideally want 400hp from the engine. My question is, what engine swap would be the cheapest to get 400hp from, and how would I go about modding the engine to get 400hp?
how's about a 4.9 with a 200 shot of NO2? I dont think you can do it much cheaper than that. oh, realiability? that you'll have to pay some $$$ for. how many poeple busted trans's, axles, etc once they got over 300hp? heck people break things at 200 hp FieroX is making the fastest Fiero ever - do what he's doing. there is a reason fast cars are expensive.
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09:20 AM
86GT3.4DOHC Member
Posts: 10007 From: Marion Ohio Registered: Apr 2004
I often wonder where people come up with their desired HP numbers? No offense, I mean do what you want, but Im just cracking 300 hp with my turbo DOHC and everytime I nail it I cringe, its basicaly hold on tight and try to keep the pointy end foward (and god forbid the rubber side down) and thats at 5-6psi, I ran it at 12psi once, (probably near 350) I clutched too soon under load (5k, 2nd gear) and the front of the car dropped like 6" and there was a very loud thud as the engine dropped back into the mounts. Heck, at even at 6psi I snapped a driveshaft going into second gear, and not at the joint, I broke the solid shaft itself, twisted it off like play-dough. You're going to have tranny and shaft problems at that kind of power, granted there are 2 options, dump a TON of money into them, or take your chances stock. The latter works pretty well but there is always the possiblility something might go wrong, but thats the way I, and most, go, just keep it in mind.
But you know what, I say this as im making a boost controler so I can crank it up higher... lol. I guess my advice would be to try to find someone near by to take you for a ride in their swapped car and see what you think, dont build the engine to get xxxhp, build it to the fun level and drivability you want.
------------------ If its not broke, you're not driving it hard enough. GO OR BLOW.
My car seems to prefer the latter, 6 engines, 2 trannys, 1 driveshaft and a whole lotta fun :D
Like me.
