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Electric Power Steering by animal
Started on: 02-12-2015 11:03 AM
Replies: 116 (4934 views)
Last post by: pmbrunelle on 01-25-2017 07:27 PM
Csjag
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Report this Post02-13-2015 05:24 PM Click Here to See the Profile for CsjagClick Here to Email CsjagSend a Private Message to CsjagEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Have you checked GT automotive service there in Melbourne? Last year they were doing electric power steering conversions on Fiero's
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hnthomps
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Report this Post02-13-2015 07:32 PM Click Here to See the Profile for hnthompsClick Here to Email hnthompsSend a Private Message to hnthompsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by sardonyx247:

Usally P/S is for kit cars with really wide front tires, I personally don't think it is really needed on a Fiero.
If your too old to turn the car without PS then your prob too old to be driving a sports car in the first place.


If you drive a car with 265 x 50 x15 tires on the front you might quickly see where power steering could be useful at low speeds (not required but useful). With a bit of luck, I hope to see if I can get one of the original factory EHPS systems installed and working this year but who knows if the electronics or pump will still function.

Nelson
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Report this Post02-14-2015 08:44 AM Click Here to See the Profile for BloozberrySend a Private Message to BloozberryEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
There's a rather timely discussion of the three distinct types of EPS, along with the models of cars they can be found in and the pros and cons of each type in the March issue of Car & Driver magazine, pages 24 & 25.
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tesmith66
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Report this Post02-14-2015 09:38 AM Click Here to See the Profile for tesmith66Send a Private Message to tesmith66Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Since FWD is the norm now, and they are all rear steer, how about getting a RHD unit and flipping it over?
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Report this Post02-14-2015 11:22 AM Click Here to See the Profile for darbysanClick Here to Email darbysanSend a Private Message to darbysanEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Did some searching around, and found this U-tube of an install of a Saturn Vue electric Steering in a Cobra Replica, for about $100 total invested. Worth watching- The Ebay controller ad is still up- more than 677 sold to date. I may have to go and try to find one of these an see what I can do!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uKzCaEjvJeM
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'87 GT in process!

[This message has been edited by darbysan (edited 02-14-2015).]

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Bloozberry
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Report this Post02-14-2015 11:27 AM Click Here to See the Profile for BloozberrySend a Private Message to BloozberryEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Seajai already posted that link on the first page.
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darbysan
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Report this Post02-14-2015 11:32 AM Click Here to See the Profile for darbysanClick Here to Email darbysanSend a Private Message to darbysanEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Bloozberry:

Seajai already posted that link on the first page.


My bad- I missed it the first time through.

[This message has been edited by darbysan (edited 02-14-2015).]

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fierosound
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Report this Post02-14-2015 12:35 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierosoundClick Here to visit fierosound's HomePageClick Here to Email fierosoundSend a Private Message to fierosoundEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Rodney:

Maybe 15 years ago myself and a couple other guys went to a rack rebuilding place in Chicago and looked at power steering racks. Most racks are rear steer. The rack is mounted behind the steering knuckles and the tie rods connect behind the cross member. Only a small amount are front steer like the Fiero. We did not really find much. Now like 15 years later there may be racks that have potential that did not exist 15+ years ago. One would have to do the same thing again.



Hmmm... here's a hydraulic PS rack on a Miata. Appears to be forward of the front wheels, and the mounting looks similar to the Fiero's.




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fierosound
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Report this Post02-14-2015 12:36 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierosoundClick Here to visit fierosound's HomePageClick Here to Email fierosoundSend a Private Message to fierosoundEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post

fierosound

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Since finding and fitting a suitable rack is a large job, it still makes sense to get an electric unit in the shaft instead.
(ignore circles - borrowed picture from a different thread)



EZ Electric has kits that fit almost anything - so under the dash of a Fiero may be feasible too.
Unfortunately - they are very pricey.

http://www.ezpowersteering..../7/11/Chevrolet.html
http://americanpowertrain.c...-power-steering.html

[This message has been edited by fierosound (edited 02-14-2015).]

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fierosound
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Report this Post02-14-2015 12:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierosoundClick Here to visit fierosound's HomePageClick Here to Email fierosoundSend a Private Message to fierosoundEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
EHPS http://honda-tech.com/road-...ehps-redone-2528249/
Of course you still need a hydraulic rack.

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fierosound
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Report this Post02-14-2015 12:57 PM Click Here to See the Profile for fierosoundClick Here to visit fierosound's HomePageClick Here to Email fierosoundSend a Private Message to fierosoundEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Maybe EZ-Steer universal for Mini Sprints, Buggys, Rock Crawlers etc. Priced at $520

http://www.superatv.com/Uni...ering-Kit-P5150.aspx

[This message has been edited by fierosound (edited 02-14-2015).]

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Report this Post02-14-2015 03:19 PM Click Here to See the Profile for E.FurgalSend a Private Message to E.FurgalEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
how much wider is the fiero front end over a chevette, as they came with p/s
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Report this Post02-14-2015 11:31 PM Click Here to See the Profile for dobeySend a Private Message to dobeyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by E.Furgal:

how much wider is the fiero front end over a chevette, as they came with p/s


The Fiero is quite a bit wider than the Chevette, but a Chevette rack could be used with appropriate length inner tie rods and adjustment of mounting position, such that the pivot points remain correct for the outer tie rods. The Chevette rack gear is about 5-6" shorter than the Fiero rack gear.

http://www.fiero.nl/forum/A...10-2-044334.html#p19
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AL68
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Report this Post02-15-2015 01:32 AM Click Here to See the Profile for AL68Click Here to Email AL68Send a Private Message to AL68Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The Saturn Vue motor will fit, just finished mounting one to the column tonight.






Still have to mount the control box, connect the column to the rack & waiting for the Ebay controller,
was supposed to arrive Friday. I should have this running next weekend if everything goes ok.
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Report this Post02-15-2015 01:41 AM Click Here to See the Profile for jmbishopClick Here to Email jmbishopSend a Private Message to jmbishopEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Please let us know if you loose the connected feedback feel.
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Report this Post02-15-2015 01:09 PM Click Here to See the Profile for hnthompsClick Here to Email hnthompsSend a Private Message to hnthompsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Here is a photo of the factory EHPS rack that was designed for the 88 Fiero.



Nelson
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Report this Post02-15-2015 04:29 PM Click Here to See the Profile for darbysanClick Here to Email darbysanSend a Private Message to darbysanEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
AL68, would love to see / hear more details on how you mounted the drive to the bottom of the steering column. Did you use a coupler? Cut the stock shaft? ...... Create a mount of any shape? Did you use the stock VUE intermediate shaft for anything ( need to know whether to try and get that too when I go for the parts).

Thanks

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'87 GT in process!

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AL68
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Report this Post02-15-2015 10:41 PM Click Here to See the Profile for AL68Click Here to Email AL68Send a Private Message to AL68Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by darbysan:

AL68, would love to see / hear more details on how you mounted the drive to the bottom of the steering column. Did you use a coupler? Cut the stock shaft? ...... Create a mount of any shape? Did you use the stock VUE intermediate shaft for anything ( need to know whether to try and get that too when I go for the parts).



I got the column w/o the wheel, switches and lock. Get the shaft to the steering gear (will need the u-joint at the column and upper shaft)

It's been a lot of grinding/cutting and modifying parts, more than I thought but it's working so far.

The mount at the bottom of the column is just a flat plate welded on. I used the lower part of the Vue column tube & a spacer sleeve I made to
slide the motor into the column bottom to check clearances and find the best clock position for the motor.

Still working on the intermediate shaft, looks like I'll have to use the Fiero u-joint at the rack & the 3/4 DD solid shaft and a 3/4 DD connector.
The Vue shaft at the column is .8xx diameter, will have to machine down to 3/4 and machine the flats to make a 3/4 DD shaft.

I've been taking pictures to document everything, will make a post once it's up & running ok.
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Report this Post02-17-2015 09:15 AM Click Here to See the Profile for BloozberrySend a Private Message to BloozberryEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
When someone gets one of these column-mounted ones working, it would be nice to know what kind of noise the motor generates while in the highest load situations (car stopped and cranking lock to lock). I suspect there'll be a fair bit of whining noise especially for the ones mounted inside the car under the dash.
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Report this Post02-17-2015 09:30 AM Click Here to See the Profile for jmbishopClick Here to Email jmbishopSend a Private Message to jmbishopEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
From the videos I've seen of the Vue PS and the aftermarket kits, they don't seem to be noisy at all.

[This message has been edited by jmbishop (edited 02-17-2015).]

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Report this Post02-17-2015 09:47 AM Click Here to See the Profile for seajaiSend a Private Message to seajaiEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Our 05 Equinox is silent. In fact I didn't even know that it had eps until I tried to find the power steering pump reservoir and couldn't.
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Report this Post02-17-2015 10:07 AM Click Here to See the Profile for BloozberrySend a Private Message to BloozberryEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by jmbishop:
From the videos I've seen of the Vue PS and the aftermarket kits they don't seem to be noisy at all.


Interesting!
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Report this Post02-17-2015 10:47 AM Click Here to See the Profile for jmbishopClick Here to Email jmbishopSend a Private Message to jmbishopEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
My concern is loss of feedback and the controllers that aren't changing the amount of assistance based on speed.
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Report this Post02-17-2015 09:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for hnthompsClick Here to Email hnthompsSend a Private Message to hnthompsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by jmbishop:

My concern is loss of feedback and the controllers that aren't changing the amount of assistance based on speed.


That is something that the original EHPS had and I think that I would be much more comfortable at higher speeds with this feature. I do not want to twitch the wheel at high speeds and have the steering change 10 or 15 degrees.

Nelson
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Report this Post02-18-2015 12:21 PM Click Here to See the Profile for jmbishopClick Here to Email jmbishopSend a Private Message to jmbishopEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The Fiero is much more responsive to twitching of the wheel at higher speeds than any power steering car I've ever driven. I am starting to think that because of the lower steering effort of the Fiero that the controller currently available is probably adequate because it the unit works when it senses that the there is torque on the input side and helps once it gets to a certain threshold. If I'm coreect and that is how it works the steering effort should only decrease to whatever you've calibrated it for making it so it's not active at speed because the torque it reduced.
Can anyone confirm these systems actually work off a vss signal in the vue?
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qwikgta
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Report this Post02-18-2015 12:42 PM Click Here to See the Profile for qwikgtaClick Here to Email qwikgtaSend a Private Message to qwikgtaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Have not read this whole thread, so I'm not sure if this link has been passed. I found this on another site while reading about a guy who installed a LSX in a 914. He was looking for EPAS for his car. My first thought was PFF and then I see this thread on top. Here is the link: http://www.pacificcustoms.com/ac498700.html

Rob

------------------


88 Coupe, CJB T-TOP, LS376 and a GT clip
88 GT, SIII 3800NA/Auto swap underway
LS Build Thread: http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/083204.html
LS on Youtube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QAH9yjw6XR0
3800 build thread: http://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/089035.html

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Report this Post02-23-2015 01:39 AM Click Here to See the Profile for AL68Click Here to Email AL68Send a Private Message to AL68Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I finished the Vue eps install & drove around a little tonight - feels great so far.
No noise fron gear, at full assist a little twitchy at highway speeds, just a 1/2 turn on the controller adjuster feels good.
Really nice parking/low speed turning. They should have build them like this from the factory.
Going to drive more this week if the weather is good, will make an install thread soon if all is ok.
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Report this Post02-23-2015 12:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for jediperkSend a Private Message to jediperkEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by jmbishop:

The Fiero is much more responsive to twitching of the wheel at higher speeds than any power steering car I've ever driven.?


I always thought the "twitchy" sensation is caused by the hot air lift up front. I've noticed that Fieros' that do not have some sort of vent up front (hood or side) for the hot air behind the radiator have "twitchy" steering at highway speeds. Once I got my hood vented that went away on my 87 GT. It's solid at speeds up to ( and maybe a little over ;o) 70 mph now.
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Report this Post02-23-2015 12:55 PM Click Here to See the Profile for jmbishopClick Here to Email jmbishopSend a Private Message to jmbishopEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Even when vented up front you feel a response when you move the wheel 1/4" back and forth unlike the PS vehicles I drive(one of the a 2012 sentra) that you can barely feel anything. I like the feedback and responsiveness from the fiero and would rather not lose that but still gain power steering.
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Report this Post02-23-2015 02:04 PM Click Here to See the Profile for dobeySend a Private Message to dobeyEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by jediperk:
I always thought the "twitchy" sensation is caused by the hot air lift up front. I've noticed that Fieros' that do not have some sort of vent up front (hood or side) for the hot air behind the radiator have "twitchy" steering at highway speeds. Once I got my hood vented that went away on my 87 GT. It's solid at speeds up to ( and maybe a little over ;o) 70 mph now.


I never had any "twitch" sensation when driving on the highway in my stock GT as a result of no vent up front. When one of the ball joints was going bad and the suspension was worn out, there was a little bit. Or in very windy conditions. But in normal conditions, no such twitch.
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Report this Post02-23-2015 02:49 PM Click Here to See the Profile for jediperkSend a Private Message to jediperkEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by jmbishop:

Even when vented up front you feel a response when you move the wheel 1/4" back and forth unlike the PS vehicles I drive(one of the a 2012 sentra) that you can barely feel anything. I like the feedback and responsiveness from the fiero and would rather not lose that but still gain power steering.


Ok, that is different. When I think of twitchy I think of the steering wheel moving slightly back in forth when tracking a straight line. I have the WCF power steering kit running off my N*'s p/s pump and I did not notice any reduction in feedback through the steering wheel. My turning radius is tighter and faster though. I've let several other Fiero owners drive my car and all of them were "wowed" and impressed with the p/s. Have not driven a Fiero with Electric steering though. Would like to so I could compare the two...
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Report this Post02-23-2015 10:37 PM Click Here to See the Profile for AL68Click Here to Email AL68Send a Private Message to AL68Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The "twitchy" feeling I had wasn't a loose or wandering feeling (my entire front end was rebuilt less than a year ago), it's more like the steering feeling is amplified.
If you rock the steering wheel side to side a little at 60mph the car normally darts side to side a little (a little more than most other cars)
With the assist on full it darts to the side a little too fast. You can change lanes REALLY easy. If adjusted 1/2 way down it feels good, responsive but does not take off to the side too fast.

On one of the Mustang boards they are doing the EPS/VUE mod & someone named Slow-Poke has designed a speed controlled controller that works
but due to legal / liability issues it looks like he's not going to sell them - this would probably work better than the manual controller. Don't need a lot
of assist at higher speeds.

One thing I think remember from the one drive so far - driving on rough roads would make the car "bumpsteer" a little but I didn't notice it with
the knob set at 1/2 way.

Want to drive more but have a problem came out this morning & the battery was dead. Traced it down to the alternator, charges a little
low & has a 4.5 amp drain with the key off. I thought I heard a whine I didn't have before but it's been a few weeks since I drove it.

Looks like I'll be changing alternators this weekend & now they're talking snow here for Wed, Sat and Sun
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fireboss
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Report this Post02-24-2015 05:15 AM Click Here to See the Profile for firebossClick Here to Email firebossSend a Private Message to firebossEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
just wondering does anyone on here have the wcf electric steering installed and running it...?
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Report this Post02-24-2015 05:54 AM Click Here to See the Profile for seajaiSend a Private Message to seajaiEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by AL68:

On one of the Mustang boards they are doing the EPS/VUE mod & someone named Slow-Poke has designed a speed controlled controller that works
but due to legal / liability issues it looks like he's not going to sell them


Could you post a link to thread?

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AL68
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Report this Post02-25-2015 12:31 AM Click Here to See the Profile for AL68Click Here to Email AL68Send a Private Message to AL68Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by seajai:


Could you post a link to thread?


Someone posted it in another EPS thread, its on the Vintage Mustang Forums, you have to join to view posts.
He talks about the controller legal info on page 40

Best $200 mod ever (EPS).
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Rickady88GT
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Report this Post02-25-2015 01:03 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Rickady88GTClick Here to Email Rickady88GTSend a Private Message to Rickady88GTEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Electric power assist steering has made huge improvements over the years. I would like to do the new electric steering rack on my next project. I drive a 2015 Fusion hybrid with an electric rack and it is better feeling than my F body rack swap. Amazing advancements.
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AL68
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Report this Post03-01-2015 03:50 AM Click Here to See the Profile for AL68Click Here to Email AL68Send a Private Message to AL68Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I had a Chevy Cruze on a rack yesterday - it had a EPS rack. Was wondering if a RHD Cruze unit flipped around for LHD for the front steer Fiero would work?
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tesmith66
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Report this Post03-01-2015 09:34 AM Click Here to See the Profile for tesmith66Send a Private Message to tesmith66Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Is the power unit in the rack or the column?
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AL68
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Report this Post03-01-2015 01:39 PM Click Here to See the Profile for AL68Click Here to Email AL68Send a Private Message to AL68Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
on the rack - right side on top for the LHD car
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