I understand hunting and fishing, but I've never understood trophy hunting. It takes no great skill to use a gun to kill a large animal. It seems like people trophy hunt because they believe there's this sense of power... that they were able to "conquer" some big great animal, like a huge lion or something. But that's just it. To trophy hunt, you're hiding out somewhere and picking off (sniping) a large animal when they least expect it. That's not exactly tough... and Rick Moranis and Arnold Schwartznegger would both be equally good or bad at it. I don't know how or why it ever became a thing where people view it as some great challenge.
Real trophy hunting should be done with a spear, and no support from anyone. You want to go kill that lion? Here's a spear... go do it.
Also, I had to look up Buffalo in South Africa... they look more like a yak with large horns. More like a crazed bull. I assumed maybe they looked more like American buffalo.
I understand hunting and fishing, but I've never understood trophy hunting. It takes no great skill to use a gun to kill a large animal. It seems like people trophy hunt because they believe there's this sense of power... that they were able to "conquer" some big great animal, like a huge lion or something. But that's just it. To trophy hunt, you're hiding out somewhere and picking off (sniping) a large animal when they least expect it. That's not exactly tough... and Rick Moranis and Arnold Schwartznegger would both be equally good or bad at it. I don't know how or why it ever became a thing where people view it as some great challenge.
Real trophy hunting should be done with a spear, and no support from anyone. You want to go kill that lion? Here's a spear... go do it.
Also, I had to look up Buffalo in South Africa... they look more like a yak with large horns. More like a crazed bull. I assumed maybe they looked more like American buffalo.
Many times, they allow this/permit this to cull the hurd while getting people to pay to do it. This is the part no one brings up. Just that it is pointless killing.
Many times, they allow this/permit this to cull the hurd while getting people to pay to do it. This is the part no one brings up. Just that it is pointless killing.
Look at the glee on this guy's face. He's so effin pleased with himself that he's killed a living creature... for "sport".
He got what he deserved in South Africa. My compliments to the buffalo.
Look at the glee on this guy's face. He's so effin pleased with himself that he's killed a living creature... for "sport".
He got what he deserved in South Africa. My compliments to the buffalo.
And for what point? He's not going to eat the animal... you won't make a rug with it. He'll cut the head off, hang it above his fire place, and throw the rest away. I completely understand hunting deer... they're everywhere, they breed like rabbits, and those who hunt deer completely clean and make use of the animal... nothing is wasted. And, if they do waste it, the carcass is usually left out in the wild and wolves and bear will eat it.
But this... I think that's a Puma or mountain lion. What is the point of that? This doesn't make that guy more of a man.
I have a friend that has numerous "trophies" mounted on his walls in several rooms. He's an avid hunter. While I don't support trophy hunting in general, my friend always donates his kill(s) to those who want the meat and homeless shelters that will take it. What he doesn't give away goes into his own freezer for him and his family.
I have a friend that has numerous "trophies" mounted on his walls in several rooms. He's an avid hunter. While I don't support trophy hunting in general, my friend always donates his kill(s) to those who want the meat and homeless shelters that will take it. What he doesn't give away goes into his own freezer for him and his family.
Rams
Just curious... are those deer / elk? Or even bears? I think people have less of an issue with that (I certainly don't). But when it's animals that people don't eat (like Pumas), then it's wasteful (in my opinion). Religiously (if I may), I realize that God in the Old Testament / Torah was splitting in half a sheep on every other page. But then in the New Testament, being super nice to lambs, haha. I realize there's an ecosystem here... but God put life into each of these animals, and it just seems callous and cruel to take pleasure in killing something. Hunting is not really my thing, but I can absolutely appreciate hunting deer... like you say, basically everything can get used, and they breed like rabbits. We have laws that protect against killing young deer and focusing on the ones that have already been on the Earth for a long time.
Sorry... just rambling, but I always get really frustrated when I see beautiful huge animals being killed for sport. I realize of course, that mountain lion would kill me if given half a chance, and I'd have no problems blowing it's brains out with a shotgun if it came at me... but I just have a problem with intentionally seeking to do that.
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]: Just curious... are those deer / elk? Or even bears? I think people have less of an issue with that (I certainly don't). But when it's animals that people don't eat (like Pumas), then it's wasteful (in my opinion). Religiously (if I may), I realize that God in the Old Testament / Torah was splitting in half a sheep on every other page. But then in the New Testament, being super nice to lambs, haha. I realize there's an ecosystem here... but God put life into each of these animals, and it just seems callous and cruel to take pleasure in killing something. Hunting is not really my thing, but I can absolutely appreciate hunting deer... like you say, basically everything can get used, and they breed like rabbits. We have laws that protect against killing young deer and focusing on the ones that have already been on the Earth for a long time.
Sorry... just rambling, but I always get really frustrated when I see beautiful huge animals being killed for sport. I realize of course, that mountain lion would kill me if given half a chance, and I'd have no problems blowing it's brains out with a shotgun if it came at me... but I just have a problem with intentionally seeking to do that.
As I remember, all that I noticed were meat producing species like Elk, Deer and things like that, nothing I remember was a trophy as in Lion, Tiger, Puma, Elephant or Rhino. There was one I'm not sure about, a very large jack rabbit with antlers. Said he got it in Texas, called it a Jack-A-Lope or something like that.
I always get really frustrated when I see beautiful huge animals being killed for sport.
It pisses me off when I see a living creature of any size being killed as some perverse form of "enjoyment". Some people are just wired wrong.
quote
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]:
I realize of course, that mountain lion would kill me if given half a chance...
You might be surprised.
We call them cougars here in BC. For 20 years, I used to go up the coast every summer to a very remote location. Spent lots of time hiking in the backwoods. Saw bears on several occasions. Never ever saw a cougar. They normally try to avoid human interaction.
Mountain lions. Cougars. Panthers. Pumas. No matter what you call them, they’re one animal no hiker wants to find themselves face to face with on the trail. There’s something about those big cat eyes, heavy paws, and silent stalk that strikes fear into the hearts of the bravest hikers.
But the truth is that mountain lion attacks, and even mere sightings, are extremely uncommon. Even in California where the large carnivores roam the hills (and occasionally neighborhoods) around major metropolitan areas, attacks are vanishingly rare. In fact, according to studies, you’re more likely to be bitten by a New Yorker than a mountain lion.
More at the above link.
[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 08-13-2025).]
Originally posted by Patrick: It pisses me off when I see a living creature of any size being killed as some perverse form of "enjoyment". Some people are just wired wrong.
Unless you lead a Vegan life style and diet, something breathing died so you could eat. I also view trophy hunting for the sake of a trophy is sad but, if the meat for that kill goes to feed hungry people then I don't have a problem as long as it's not an endangered species. That's life on earth. Does it really matter if the hunter enjoys the hunt or the kill? If it feeds hungry people and it's not an endangered species, would you deny that hunter the thrill of the hunt?
I've killed and butchered many different animals, most cattle, pigs and goats/sheep. Heck, I've even eaten dog in S Korea, monkey in Central America, rattle snake in Oklahoma and gator in FL to include several other interesting meals. Every bit/morsel of that meat went to feed people. If, you disapprove, so be it. This is a world of eat or be eaten, get used to it.
Rams
[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 08-14-2025).]
Killing is something that exists in the real world- that being said, Trophy hunting is, to me, like the guy who revs the crap out of his HD muttercycle, while looking around, THINKING that everyone is impressed- when in reality, everyone with a brain knows the guy has...a >>tiny<< "toy"
We have an overabundance of deer in the western US- there are not enough predators to cut down the population naturally, so they should open the hunting season.....But definitely, the carcass should go to feed someone or something....
I believe a >>Real man<< is a man who treats people well, is considerate and will help others...But my beliefs are warped by my extremely odd HS years- The coolest kid in my class was a BLACK kid- but he was known to be cool by everyone because he would HELP people- break up fights, etc....I was in the Navy before I realized that this was not what most kids think is cool- also, I thought Racism was over until I was in the Navy- That black kid was actually dating a white girl- in 1977! And no-one ever went after him or complained....
Originally posted by Patrick: Yes... IMO it does. A person's got to be some sort of sick fuk if they enjoy killing.
OK, well it's a bit difficult to feed those hungry folks if someone doesn't kill the prey. I don't hunt because I don't enjoy it but, won't deny anyone else the right to do so. Personally, hunters can take 50% (or more) of the deer population out and it wouldn't bother me a bit. My insurance has had to pay for three different deer impacts.
I can’t speak for all people; our family had Algonquin roots.
Because the animal is giving you a gift, and it’s respectful and humble to show appreciation for gifts.
In the culture in which I grew up, all creatures are under the guidance of Great Spirit. Animals are gifts, but people have responsibilities too- and one of those is to always be grateful for the sacrifices made so we can live a good life. We shouldn’t misuse or abuse the gifts we are given, we don’t “own” the world around us..
This is a verse I learned as a child…
“Great Spirit, help me always remember I do not own but am owned by the Earth; Remind me to be grateful for your kindness, teach me your ways so I may walk amongst your creation with wisdom. Let me learn the lessons of my brothers and sisters in the world. Let me enjoy your abundance, and safeguard it for the future. Teach me to walk in the path set for me.”
When we took any animal (wild or farm) we let its blood go back into the earth… (so it would feed the earth) and we said
“Brother, thank you for your life, for helping me grow strong, and may you rise again from the earth. I celebrate your life.”
When we picked crops, or foraged, we said
“Great Spirit, we thank you for these gifts, for life, and for the Earth who sustains us.”
It's more than just words. We *always* shared what we caught, or picked, or found, with those less fortunate. Just as we asked animals or the earth to give things to us, we had to give things to others because it is in trusting that there will be enough that you really show faith, and it’s in sharing that you show you are really grateful. On a deer, one of the best bits are the loins, so part of the loin was always given away, one shin, and a haunch. It’s not right to give away the worst parts and keep the best- you should share the best bits. When we picked crops, we brought a portion of each crops to share. Even flowers were shared. We also had farm animals… they had good lives, and when time came, they were dealt with quickly and painlessly, and with gratitude.
People that took what we shared were expected not to feel lucky or grateful to *us* but to feel that they were fulfilling their role, as if people didn’t accept what we shared, we couldn’t share it- so we were equal partners in receiving the gift. They too would thank Great Spirit for the gifts of the Earth and give thanks for the life given for theirs.
Another part of showing gratitude is not wasting things- we used every bit of any animal we took. Nothing is thrown away, because to take an animal and then throw it away mocks its gift. Everything is used somehow. Same is true of crops- what we couldn’t eat, or animals couldn’t eat, was turned to compost. You don’t waste things, or take more than you need just because you can.
It’s not just *saying* thanks. it’s *demonstrating* gratitude through your actions.
I doubt very much that trophy hunters demonstrate any gratitude whatsoever towards their kill by humbly and respectfully thanking the animal for its head.
[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 08-15-2025).]
I doubt very much that trophy hunters demonstrate any gratitude whatsoever towards their kill by humbly and respectfully thanking the animal for its head.
Possibly, can't say for sure. I'm not a hunter.
But, have you thanked the guy that killed the animal you ate last or thanked the person who stripped the hide off of that animal so you could have a leather wallet, jacket, hat, shoes, ,have leather seats in your vehicle, etc.? Those folks and the person who mounts those trophies are obviously part of that killing and profiting from it. How about the Guides who help the hunters find their prey?
Doesn't matter to me, as I stated previously, I always hope the "hunters, trophy hunters" included get all the deer they can. And, I don't care if they mount their kill(s) or not.
Rams
[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 08-15-2025).]
Something seems to matter to you a great deal... as you continue to bring up all sorts of things that have nothing to do with the topic of this thread... namely a trophy hunter getting his just deserts.
You're in the wrong place if you're here to convert vegans.
In case you missed it earlier...
quote
Originally posted by Patrick:
A person's got to be some sort of sick fuk if they enjoy killing.
[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 08-16-2025).]
Originally posted by Patrick: Something seems to matter to you a great deal... as you continue to bring up all sorts of things that have nothing to do with the topic of this thread... namely a trophy hunter getting his just deserts.
You're in the wrong place if you're here to convert vegans.
In case you missed it earlier...
Oh, I'm not trying to convert anyone. Implying that lends absolutely no credibility to your posts. Didn't miss what you posted to include when you stated that arguing was half the fun of being here a while back. It's obvious that you enjoy trying to prove your self perceived superiority to those here. Just not buying it. I honestly don't care if a hunter enjoys the success of his hunt. It, that success culminates in he or she being able to put a trophy on his wall and feeds some hungry folks, no problem with that at all.
I'm curious, how do you view snake meat? I've killed several rattlesnakes in my life, have been to Oklahoma and Texas to participate in Rattle Snake Round Ups. Back then I enjoyed the hunt and the kill, gave the snake to the folks that killed them and then cooked them.
With that, feel free to move on without me. Obviously, I don't deal well with "Holier than Thou" folks and your attempts at One Upmanship. Admittedly, I have my own imperfections.
------------------ Rams Learning most of life's lessons the hard way. . You are only young once but, you can be immature indefinitely.
Trophy hunting is how countries manage the wildlife and raises money for conservation efforts. It plays a major role in African wildlife management. The wildlife managers remove problem animals through hunting. They identify an animal to remove, identify it to the hunting guide and the hunting guide takes the hunter to the animal. The meat is donated to the local village and the hunter takes the trophy home. Half the money brought in from trophy hunting is used in anti-poaching efforts. If trophy hunting is ended, then there will be a lot more poaching.
Trophy hunting is how countries manage the wildlife and raises money for conservation efforts. It plays a major role in African wildlife management. The wildlife managers remove problem animals through hunting. They identify an animal to remove, identify it to the hunting guide and the hunting guide takes the hunter to the animal. The meat is donated to the local village and the hunter takes the trophy home. Half the money brought in from trophy hunting is used in anti-poaching efforts. If trophy hunting is ended, then there will be a lot more poaching.
I appreciate you posting this. I'll read it a bit later, but if true... I suppose in the end it's helping things. I know one of the biggest issues that Africa has is the loss of elephants (since people want the ivory). Thanks...
Hallelujah! You couldn't stick to the topic anyway.
My comment (copied below) has nothing to do with people eating meat or wildlife being "managed". Whether it's due to ignorance or avoidance, a few people here seem to have trouble comprehending/understanding/acknowledging this simple basic truth...
quote
Originally posted by Patrick:
A person's got to be some sort of sick fuk if they enjoy killing.
[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 08-16-2025).]
For over 20 years now, I've made lots of posts and started lots of threads, with a huge variety of subject matter. Almost from the beginning of me getting on the internet, I've stated and firmly believed my text belongs to me only until I click 'submit reply' or 'Post Thread' upon which time, the thread belongs to the community at large and is free to go where it may, and most often, it does. I'm simply 'not all that' to the point I want to control what other people say in a thread I started. It's never really 'about me' or what I want. My interest is what others have to say...about anything. (after all, I already KNOW what I think about it or anything else). I have zero interest in telling people "You need to talk about WHAT I WANT!"
People of all ages, collect trophies for a variety of reasons and in just as many ways. The world is full of millions people that net moths, butterflies and all kinds of insects to be stabbed thru the body and mounted on a poster board along with dozens of different ones just to show "Look what I have". (there are some laws prohibiting the collection of endangered species of insects). Anglers catch a great fish, wrap it, throw it in ice and freeze it 'good side up' and send it off to the taxidermist to be mounted and in neither the bug or fish category, do they ever take a single bite of them. Not many out of the billions of inhabitants on Earth ever complain about it. It's seemingly only when it's a "beautiful mammal' that it raises some control instinct to make people whine about it. I suppose if that big largemouth bass jumps out of the water and clamps down on the fisherman's gonads, he deserves it.
Regarding the 'puma' (we call them cougars or mountain lions here), I don't know the story behind the hunt. They are not a regulated species here, meaning the Texas Fish and Wildlife department (or whatever they call themselves nowadays) list them as 'unregulated' meaning there is no open or closed season, no size limit, no quantity limit or anything else. If you see one, you can freely shoot it (provided it's legal to use a firearm where it takes place and you 'may' need a regular hunting license too. I haven't looked in to it that much). People have killed them in their front yard of a subdivision,and only got a citation for discharging a firearm in public.
I do find it rather odd, that you can actually pay to go on a 'cow hunt'. You pay, to go sit in a pasture and when a longhorn or beefmaster or brahma comes sauntering up, you shoot it, and can opt to get the meat (or not) and get the head or just the horns, for mounting. Different strokes..
I haven't actually 'gone hunting' for meat or enjoyment since June 1971.
I have, killed predators and nuisance animals any time I saw them and have never taken a bite of them or mounted their heads like scalps or ears on a pole in a wigwam.
[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 08-17-2025).]
I've got something tunneling in my yard and a very large burrow I recently found between the two gooseneck trailers i still have. Whatever it is, it's gonna die and it won't get eaten. Don't need a trophy on the wall either. Some things just need killing. Thinking I'll try to gas it to death and let its stinking corpse rot in that burrow.
Rams
[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 08-17-2025).]
I haven't actually 'gone hunting' for meat or enjoyment since June 1971.
That's a very specific date. Don, most long-term members here know what you were involved with during that period of your life. So, a serious question asked with all due respect. Is there a connection between your tour in Vietnam and you no longer hunting "for meat or enjoyment"? I am not looking for anything you might be uncomfortable discussing.
