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Xanth's Audio Build by Xanth
Started on: 01-20-2008 08:05 PM
Replies: 79 (4303 views)
Last post by: 1988holleyformula on 08-26-2009 05:58 PM
Xanth
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Report this Post02-10-2008 09:02 PM Click Here to See the Profile for XanthSend a Private Message to XanthEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Here's the harness that will connect my modified overhead unit to the modified PAC unit:


Quick test fit before finishing installation, to make sure everything is working:
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Xanth
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Report this Post02-10-2008 09:29 PM Click Here to See the Profile for XanthSend a Private Message to XanthEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Testing the unit, have to turn up the volume a bit to be able to hear it, but the unit works perfectly. Smooth volume change from low to high.



Overhead in place, waiting for my new headliner:


PAC unit in its location for now, needs to be tidied up, and RCA cables shortened:

[This message has been edited by Xanth (edited 02-10-2008).]

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craigsfiero2007
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Report this Post02-10-2008 10:01 PM Click Here to See the Profile for craigsfiero2007Click Here to Email craigsfiero2007Send a Private Message to craigsfiero2007Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Very Nice. I hope to do this to my new Fiero, but by the looks of it that will have to wait for now.
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Xanth
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Report this Post02-10-2008 10:49 PM Click Here to See the Profile for XanthSend a Private Message to XanthEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
It is very time consuming, the way I did it. Today alone was about 6 hours, just for the volume control unit. If I didn't care so much about it appearing factory it would be quicker, but I like the fact everything just plugs right in and works. So now I can easily change amps, headunits, subs, etc. and everything will just plug in.

Having the Performance Sound overhead volume control work with an aftermarket amp is great, I can easily adjust the bass to the song without messing around with the stereo equalizer and overdriving the speakers.

I am quite happy with it
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GT Quick
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Report this Post02-10-2008 10:57 PM Click Here to See the Profile for GT QuickSend a Private Message to GT QuickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
What an exhorbatant waste of time. All you had to do was buy a high level to low level adapter and run an A/B switch for the high or low sound systems.

For that matter, why would you ever want to have a high quality sound system and then switch it off anyway ? The factory decks are already preprogrammed to not overload the factory speakers when turned all the way up. Did you not know that ? Wow.....you did all that work for nothing. NIce switch though.

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Xanth
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Report this Post02-10-2008 11:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for XanthSend a Private Message to XanthEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by GT Quick:

What an exhorbatant waste of time. All you had to do was buy a high level to low level adapter and run an A/B switch for the high or low sound systems.

For that matter, why would you ever want to have a high quality sound system and then switch it off anyway ? The factory decks are already preprogrammed to not overload the factory speakers when turned all the way up. Did you not know that ? Wow.....you did all that work for nothing. NIce switch though.


Its not a switch, its a gain control for the amplifier. The slider adjusts the gain of the Subwoofer, not the speakers. It is identical in function to the factory Performance Sound unit, many amplifiers come with a remote volume control knob, are they then pointless?

Part of the advantage is I can counteract that preprogrammed function you mention. As the volume of the stereo is turned up, the stereo reduces the bass. So I slide the slider over to boost the subwoofer.

Edit: In case you didn't notice, that is in fact a High Level to Low Level adapter.

[This message has been edited by Xanth (edited 02-10-2008).]

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Report this Post02-10-2008 11:31 PM Click Here to See the Profile for GT QuickSend a Private Message to GT QuickEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Ahh I get it.

Another approach would be to just use a high level input/output E/Q and run it as the preamp for the sub amplifier but wiire directly to the factory speakers. Then regardless of factory output it could be adjusted by high/mid and low frequencies. A number of audio manufacturers made these in the early 90's to resolve this exact problem. It was an active/passive unit that would have worked perfectly in this scenario.

Then yet ANOTHER aproach would be to hard wire some ohm boards that split the signals to the speakers. We use to call them "bass blockers" and they were a primitive version of the box that the 3 way speakers come with these days. Take those and hard wire them, use the outputs to go high level in/low level out and run it to the amp RCA's input. Adjust the amp volume accordingly and tweak it so that the factory EQ has enough control for good quality sound with acceptable bass.

Or if all else fails drop the dime for an aftermarket head unit and go from there.

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Xanth
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Report this Post02-10-2008 11:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for XanthSend a Private Message to XanthEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Part of my goal is a factory appearing and functioning unit, so an aftermarket deck was not an option. I sold my Pioneer Premier and got the Delco Pontiac unit, bolts in and matches the Fiero interior and lighting.

Stock subwoofer housing, using aftermarket sub and amplifier for flexibility. The amp can easily power a larger sub should I choose to do so and will be completely hidden when I am done.

The amp has a built in crossover, so the sub receives only the low frequency. I do not want to block bass from the speakers, I want to maintain a full range of sound from them.

So I can use the equalizer on the deck to set the speakers to sound how I want, then use the volume control on the overhead to boost or turn down the subwoofer. I set the gain on the amplifier itself to set the high end, and the overhead unit adjusts within that range, using the high level to low level converter.

Keeping a stock appearance is a major part of my goal, I have to use the stock performance sound overhead and a factory stereo.

If I was willing to use an aftermarket deck, I wouldn't have to do any of this. My Excelon decks had all the features built in that I am adding to this unit. I would not be as happy with it, even though it would be greatly easier.

[This message has been edited by Xanth (edited 02-10-2008).]

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craigsfiero2007
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Report this Post02-10-2008 11:55 PM Click Here to See the Profile for craigsfiero2007Click Here to Email craigsfiero2007Send a Private Message to craigsfiero2007Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I like it because it looks original but performs better. Will the Performance Sound still work if I just replace the Head Unit with one out of a Newer Pontiac. I just want a CD Player right now, I will do what you did when I have the money and drive to tackle the job.

------------------
2002 Pontiac Grand Prix GTP- R.I.P.

1986 Pontiac Fiero GT- My Summer Fun. Mildly Modified

1989 Chevy Camaro IROC-Z- , Sold!!!

1986 Ponitac Fiero SE- Daily Driver, 100% Stock

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Report this Post02-11-2008 12:00 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Indyrestoguy_JRClick Here to Email Indyrestoguy_JRSend a Private Message to Indyrestoguy_JREdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Nice test song. Cake is awesome!! Musically and with frosting as well.

BTW: Great looking install!!!

[This message has been edited by Indyrestoguy_JR (edited 02-11-2008).]

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Xanth
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Report this Post02-11-2008 05:56 AM Click Here to See the Profile for XanthSend a Private Message to XanthEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by craigsfiero2007:
I like it because it looks original but performs better. Will the Performance Sound still work if I just replace the Head Unit with one out of a Newer Pontiac. I just want a CD Player right now, I will do what you did when I have the money and drive to tackle the job.


If you have the full performance sound system, I believe all you need to do for it to work with a new headunit is add a relay in to power the amplifier. The stock amplifier is already wired into the speaker harness, so its easy to swap the headunit.

 
quote
Originally posted by Indyrestoguy_JR:

Nice test song. Cake is awesome!! Musically and with frosting as well.

BTW: Great looking install!!!



Thanks for the compliments
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Report this Post02-11-2008 05:56 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Chris HodsonSend a Private Message to Chris HodsonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
HAHA i didnt listen to the video, i just kind of skimmed through this but.. im listening to cake at the moment... haha nice .
One of those bands that never get old.
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Xanth
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Report this Post02-29-2008 12:15 AM Click Here to See the Profile for XanthSend a Private Message to XanthEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Want to keep out of archives, still not done yet
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Report this Post03-10-2008 09:56 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BrasticClick Here to visit Brastic's HomePageClick Here to Email BrasticSend a Private Message to BrasticEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
While you are at it, you might as well add some sound deadening material.
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Xanth
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Report this Post03-12-2008 10:07 PM Click Here to See the Profile for XanthSend a Private Message to XanthEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
That will be included eventually, when I redo more of the interior I'll have sound deadening under the carpet and behind the seats. Planning on doing the headliner next.
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Xanth
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Report this Post04-25-2008 11:02 AM Click Here to See the Profile for XanthSend a Private Message to XanthEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Hope for updates soon, I just grabbed two of these:
http://www.partsexpress.com...241&CFTOKEN=66582162

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Xanth
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Report this Post04-29-2008 06:48 PM Click Here to See the Profile for XanthSend a Private Message to XanthEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Here they are:





Gave em a quick test, these are quite nice. Once I have them hard installed I'll get a better idea of how much power they produce.
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Report this Post04-29-2008 07:30 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MisterSend a Private Message to MisterEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Hey Xanth,

Looks good, I have a couple of these in my Fiero, where are you planning on installing the bass transducers?
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Xanth
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Report this Post04-29-2008 07:42 PM Click Here to See the Profile for XanthSend a Private Message to XanthEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I was thinking directly under each seat, though these are a bit taller than I expected. I would love to install them on the seat backs, but I don't see being able to install them there without chopping up the seat.
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Report this Post04-29-2008 07:55 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MisterSend a Private Message to MisterEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Xanth:
I was thinking directly under each seat, though these are a bit taller than I expected. I would love to install them on the seat backs, but I don't see being able to install them there without chopping up the seat.


Good thinking, At first I had them on the firewall just behind the lower section of the seat back - It didn't do much.
Then I've relocated them to the metal part of the seat back (same lower back area) - It works MUCH better
No chopping needed but it leaves a "bump" in the rear seat cover (no one sees it anyway.

I would be curious to know what it would do below the seat but I would recommend installing then like I did. We usually "feel" bass in our chest and that's as close as you can get to that feeling.

One more thing, consider installing a push switch under the passenger seat that makes it work ONLY when someone seats on it, in my Fiero the passenger seat rattles a bit when I blast it, and no one is there to absorb it LOL.
I admit the seat vibrating does create a bit more bass effect, but might get annoying.

[This message has been edited by Mister (edited 04-29-2008).]

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Xanth
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Report this Post04-29-2008 08:06 PM Click Here to See the Profile for XanthSend a Private Message to XanthEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I'll probably stick them like you did then, didn't realize I could get them on the seat without harming it.

I'm hoping they help create the sensation of a much larger system, the Tang sub provides excellent bass, but is much too small to make you feel it most of the time. With these I'd like to get a great bass experience even at a low volume. My amp should be able to drive both shakers and the sub at the same time.

Interesting idea on the switch, no reason to rattle the seats apart if no one is sitting in them. Might PO my amp though

[This message has been edited by Xanth (edited 04-29-2008).]

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Report this Post04-30-2008 12:11 AM Click Here to See the Profile for MisterSend a Private Message to MisterEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Xanth:Might PO my amp though


Agreed, I don't think adding/removing the load of another transducer will "help" the amp or the fine tunning you'll make, I'm not big on the amp Ω calculations but it would probably effect it. I decided to keep it connected and as mentioned the additional vibrations add more to that bass feeling
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Report this Post04-30-2008 12:27 AM Click Here to See the Profile for MisterSend a Private Message to MisterEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Found the pics from 2005

Location 1 - Firewall


Location 2 - Seat back


Here you can see the slight bump in the lower section of the seat (best picture angle I have for now)
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Xanth
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Report this Post05-03-2008 08:20 PM Click Here to See the Profile for XanthSend a Private Message to XanthEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I stuck mine in the same location and let me say, holy crap! I practically rattled my eyes out testing the things. They have way more oomph than I even need.

Did you do anything to secure them in place or just zip the seats back up? That's all I've done for now, still have to route the wires and get plugs for them. They don't seem to produce any real heat either, so I'm not too worried about leaving them in there.

While I was at it I finished off my PAC unit so it all snaps together:


My amp looks a mess right now, have to pull the interior back apart to re-route these new wires. I have a left and right bass shaker, and the subwoofer is bridged:
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Report this Post05-03-2008 09:32 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MisterSend a Private Message to MisterEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Xanth: holy crap! I practically rattled my eyes out testing the things.


LMAO...Fun Eh?

 
quote
Originally posted by Xanth: Did you do anything to secure them in place or just zip the seats back up?[/URL]


Sure thing, to get the best effect (Thai massage feature) they must be hard mounted. I used short self tapping screws on all 4 corners. (I don't think the zipper will close)

[This message has been edited by Mister (edited 05-03-2008).]

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Xanth
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Report this Post05-04-2008 03:25 PM Click Here to See the Profile for XanthSend a Private Message to XanthEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Adding connectors onto the bass shakers:


Sizing out wires for the car:


Here's the harness from the amp to the seats:


Bass shaker in the seat, wiring harness out the bottom:


Wiring harness all in place:


Have to re-organize the amp some more, a few wires are visible now:
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Report this Post05-04-2008 03:39 PM Click Here to See the Profile for DeLorean00Click Here to Email DeLorean00Send a Private Message to DeLorean00Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Your seat has a tumor. LoL! Looking great!
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Report this Post05-04-2008 04:17 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MisterSend a Private Message to MisterEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Very nice and clean, I'm not crazy about the Amp cover thing but that's yours to design
I'd say....TEST DRIVE TIME
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Xanth
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Report this Post05-04-2008 04:25 PM Click Here to See the Profile for XanthSend a Private Message to XanthEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I'm test-driving alright, this gets me exactly the effect I was going for. You'd never guess I've just got a 5 inch sub. Excellent too because it doesn't alert everyone outside the car to the fact there is a sound system installed.

That's the reason for the amp cover, which isn't actually finished. I've already had my cars broken into twice for audio equipment, I'm doing my best to make everything appear stock and hidden away. The amp has to be secured and the whole rear panel will be redone, so its not even a flap anymore.

I'm thinking of getting studs tack-welded in for the amp mounting tray.

[This message has been edited by Xanth (edited 05-04-2008).]

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Report this Post05-04-2008 06:49 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MisterSend a Private Message to MisterEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Xanth:I'm thinking of getting studs tack-welded in for the amp mounting tray.


OMG You are taking it to the extreme EH? please take pics
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Xanth
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Report this Post05-11-2008 07:05 PM Click Here to See the Profile for XanthSend a Private Message to XanthEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I thought I was going to have more to post here, but for an error on my part

Anyone need some Hi-Performance 6 X 9s or 6 1/2 speakers? //www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum6/HTML/056517.html

Because of that small error, everything is still sitting as-is. I meant to have new speakers in place, but that will have to wait for now. I got another idea to distract me, putting touch-sensitive radio controls into the stock steering wheel. I don't want to loose the stock wheel, but would like to use the steering wheel controls that are available for my Cd-player.

Will post more info/fabrication as it develops

[This message has been edited by Xanth (edited 05-11-2008).]

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Report this Post05-14-2008 10:27 AM Click Here to See the Profile for XanthSend a Private Message to XanthEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Putting these in right now:



Have Kenwood 4X6s to put in the rear as well. I was originally going to do something a bit more fancy with plate speakers, but decided against it. I need more mid-low range sound, which the plates I had were incapable of providing. I'm selling the pair of Infinity 6412cfp speakers in the mall.

My current rear speakers have also started rattling like crazy, got them for free though so I got my money's worth out of them
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Report this Post05-30-2008 08:08 PM Click Here to See the Profile for XanthSend a Private Message to XanthEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Working on these right now:



I snapped out the grill material, made a noticeable difference in sound quality. The grill material I'm using is from PartsExpress.com , supposedly almost completely acoustically transparent.



[This message has been edited by Xanth (edited 05-30-2008).]

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Xanth
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Report this Post05-30-2008 08:39 PM Click Here to See the Profile for XanthSend a Private Message to XanthEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Here's how I'm doing the covers:



Starting at one side I used a razor blade to press the cover in place and tap it quickly with a soldering iron. I did this only along the sides, this makes it easy to get the cover tight on the frame. I'll be using adhesive to finish the corners.

[This message has been edited by Xanth (edited 05-30-2008).]

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Report this Post06-10-2008 10:40 AM Click Here to See the Profile for savejonasSend a Private Message to savejonasEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Great write-up so far. I really appreciate you adding the video because now I can hear what to expect with my subwoofer upgrade. Good looking speaker recovering too.
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Xanth
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Report this Post06-10-2008 06:09 PM Click Here to See the Profile for XanthSend a Private Message to XanthEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
The video really doesn't do the subwoofer justice, especially now that I have the Aura Bass Shakers installed. The sound is very impressive for such small components.

Here's how the speaker grills turned out:

[This message has been edited by Xanth (edited 06-10-2008).]

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Idaho_Fiero
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Report this Post06-29-2008 12:23 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Idaho_FieroClick Here to Email Idaho_FieroSend a Private Message to Idaho_FieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
That did sound real good. Do you have any more sound bytes or videos? I was thinking I would have to get a pretty big setup, but I like how this worked out, so I' might do this instead. Free bump too . Awesome job
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Report this Post08-27-2008 04:38 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 86stealthfieroClick Here to Email 86stealthfieroSend a Private Message to 86stealthfieroEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
HEY! sweet i got the same seat covers glad someone else has them too sorry couldent resist as soon as i saw them i knew what they were

------------------

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Report this Post01-05-2009 06:19 PM Click Here to See the Profile for hinesb1890Click Here to visit hinesb1890's HomePageClick Here to Email hinesb1890Send a Private Message to hinesb1890Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Hey just wondering what you did to mount the amp behind the seat
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Report this Post08-26-2009 05:58 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 1988holleyformulaSend a Private Message to 1988holleyformulaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post


Just wondering what you thought about the sound quality of these speakers. These are the 4x10's in the dash correct?
Do you hear any distortion at higher volume levels at all?

I ended up replacing my Kenwood 4x10's with some Alpine 4x6's which seem to play clearer, though not as low at the 4x10's.

I am planning on a subwoofer to help out on the lows and just wanted someone else's opinion on the 4x10s...

[This message has been edited by 1988holleyformula (edited 08-26-2009).]

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