I have an 87 5 speed iron duke fiero and im putting a 3800sc in it what would be the easiest/best cost efficient transmission to use. 5 speed getrag? the 3800sc auto trans, f23 or what in my case since i have a manual to begin with I have the motor ready to put in just need a trans for it have the 3800sc trans but if its cheaper and easier id rater do a manual swap instead really wanna get this thing done soon any help would be great.
For durability and straight line performance, the 4T65EHD that came with the 3800SC is hard to beat. The Isuzu gearing is good for the 3800, but won't hold up under heavy use. The Getrag and Muncie are stronger, but both will fail if you're hard on them.
For durability and straight line performance, the 4T65EHD that came with the 3800SC is hard to beat. The Isuzu gearing is good for the 3800, but won't hold up under heavy use. The Getrag and Muncie are stronger, but both will fail if you're hard on them.
If you don't care about auto vs manual, go with the 4T65EHD. It has good gearing, is tough enough to handle the engine, and is relatively reliable(although high mileage ones have been known to slip). If you want a manual...
Isuzu - Gearing is good but it is weak as hell Getrag - Stronger, but not "burnout strong"(it can't be abused) AND the engine will sit at like 2700-2800 RPM @ 70mph(the 4T65 has you at like 1700RPM) so it isn't quiet on the highway
F23 is stronger, geared better for modern speeds, but requires a bit more modification to use.
Best option is the F40 if you can get your hands on one(I think someone is selling a few in the mall right now), but it is significantly more expensive than the other options.
Originally posted by Threedog: If you don't care about auto vs manual, go with the 4T65EHD. It has good gearing, is tough enough to handle the engine, and is relatively reliable(although high mileage ones have been known to slip). If you want a manual...
Isuzu - Gearing is good but it is weak as hell Getrag - Stronger, but not "burnout strong"(it can't be abused) AND the engine will sit at like 2700-2800 RPM @ 70mph(the 4T65 has you at like 1700RPM) so it isn't quiet on the highway
F23 is stronger, geared better for modern speeds, but requires a bit more modification to use.
Best option is the F40 if you can get your hands on one(I think someone is selling a few in the mall right now), but it is significantly more expensive than the other options.
So im guessing the 4t65 is my best choice what all do i need to do to put one in my car because mine is a 5 speed manual if I could get a general parts list to convert my manual to an auto please and thankyou
This is a checklist for a swap. It is for a stock fiero, so some of it won't apply to a 3800 swap( wiring, flexplate). Most is still good. Don't need to change the steering column unless you want to. If you want the interlock cable to the shifter installed to the column, you can do that through the ignition switch on the column. Switching columns just gets rid of the funky little lever that you have to hold down to turn the key. Will need an auto shifter and knob, Auto Shift Plate for the console, Auto trans cable ( get the two little clips that hold the trans cable in place, trans bracket for the cable ( will be needed to modify for the 3800), Auto brake pedal if you want the larger brake pedal area. Get the axles with the 4t65e if possible- may need them for parts.
Removing the clutch pedal can be a bear. On mine the bolt ran through both the clutch and the brake, but came out on the side of the heater, so no way to get the bolt out. Removing the whole assembly is extremely hard. Better to cut the bolt, and then replace it with a shorter one for just the brake. The clutch pedal bracket unbolts from the brake bracket once the pedal is out. If you keep the switch from the clutch pedal intact and wired up, then no splicing required. Just use a zip tie to get it out of the way. http://www.thefierofactory.com/qaautoswap.php
Two mods to consider as you do the install. 1) Shorten the shifter handle https://www.fiero.nl/forum/A...110502-2-101931.html 2) Change the internal gear ratio for even more low end performance. Changes the final drive gear ratio from at best 2.93 to 3.69. The 2.93 could even be lower, depending on which trans you are using, so the difference can be like adding 100HP. This is a much more complicated swap, as programming changes need to be made, but it's something to consider while it is out of the car. Mechanically, the swap is not that difficult for a DIY guy. http://www.3800pro.com/foru...ar-ratio-change.html
4T65E-HD[edit] The 4T65E-HD (code MN7) is a heavy duty version of the 4T65-E used with more powerful engines such as the LS4 V8 and L67/L32 supercharged V6.
Applications: 2.93:1 MN7 Oldsmobile 88 LSS L67 Pontiac Bonneville SSEi L67 Chevrolet Impala L67 Chevrolet Monte Carlo L67 Pontiac Grand Prix GTP/GXP Buick Regal GS Buick Riviera L67 (97-99) Buick Park Avenue Ultra
3.06:1 MN7 Chevrolet Impala SS Chevrolet Monte Carlo SS (2006-2007) 3.29:1 MN7 Buick LaCrosse Super Pontiac Grand Prix GTP Comp G
I fully agree with going with the powertrain that GM designed to work together. In this case its the 3800SC/4T65eHD. Using the 3800SC with the light duty Getrag is OK but if you get on it hard it won't last long. I know two guys that that blew them up, split the cases in pieces.
------------------ " THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Spintech/Hedman Exhaust, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite. "THE COLUSSUS" 87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H " ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
Sorry I was referring to the effective final drive when I said most have 2.93. There were a few that had another ratio but the large majority of them did have the gears that gave you the effective 2.93.
I have a set of 3.69 from ZZP I will be swapping into my HD transmission, should make quite the difference when I do.
That should help initial off the line grunt if you can hook up. 3800SC with stock gearing seem slow of the line if they don't break traction, or they just spin the tires.
I use a 4T60E (35/35 chain, 3.33 diff) in my 4.9 Formula. Really takes advantage of the torque from the Caddy. It's a rocket in the 1/8 mile with no traction issues.
I had a manual 84 and decided to do the hybrid 4-speed Muncie. The MY8 and M17 combo that is in the FAQ and How to section. It has been a joy to drive and I do 70mph @ 2300 rpm. The MY8 is a bit of a challenge to find but they are out there. 3rd gear in like normal high gear. The SC loves a manual and so do I. The Muncie is tough and I don't abuse my car. It is a regular driver now for 2 years with 12K on the swap and I drive it anywhere.
I had a manual 84 and decided to do the hybrid 4-speed Muncie. The MY8 and M17 combo that is in the FAQ and How to section. It has been a joy to drive and I do 70mph @ 2300 rpm. The MY8 is a bit of a challenge to find but they are out there. 3rd gear in like normal high gear. The SC loves a manual and so do I. The Muncie is tough and I don't abuse my car. It is a regular driver now for 2 years with 12K on the swap and I drive it anywhere.
This is the best solution for a manual 3800 Fiero. 1st gear on a Getrag is a waste of time when you have all that power. Make sure to use the M17 case.
The F40 isn't a cheap conversion, but i have over 46K miles with mine along side a 382 whp/335wtq LS4. There is a Europe version with a 3.09 final drive (I swapped the 3.09 in to a G6 3.55 F40 last year), it gives all the gears longer legs and now I can cruise the interstate at 80 mph at 2050ish rpm. It is a very good match for a high hp/tq engine when you insist on a manual transmission.
IMO since it's already a manual car, keep it a manual car with the described options. Why give yourself more work and cost by obtaining parts for a conversion? If you are set on using the auto with the engine (like I am) Then just get an automatic car to start with. Plus I have a feeling that you enjoy cruising around with the duke/5speed and will feel there is a hole in your life if you no longer have the gears to go through
IMO since it's already a manual car, keep it a manual car with the described options. Why give yourself more work and cost by obtaining parts for a conversion? If you are set on using the auto with the engine (like I am) Then just get an automatic car to start with. Plus I have a feeling that you enjoy cruising around with the duke/5speed and will feel there is a hole in your life if you no longer have the gears to go through
I've done a couple of manual to auto conversions. The extra parts needed are a trans cooler, some 3/8" line/hose to reach the front, and the Fiero auto shifter. Not hard to do. IMO the F23 or F40 options are much harder to do.
------------------ " THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Spintech/Hedman Exhaust, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite. "THE COLUSSUS" 87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H " ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "
