Planning ahead, here... I would like to use two dog-bones just for peace of mind. I figure I'll use Westcoast's dog-bone kit for the side by the EGR (driver side), and I have seen people relocate the factory aluminum mount to the front head (passenger side). This would give me 2 dog-bones, and it looks great.
My question is; where will the heater hoses go after I've removed the alternator bracket? It looks like people just put freeze plugs in the ports (1 on water pump & 1 on intake manifold). I would try to figure out how to post a picture, but I'll bet most of you guys already know what I am describing. Can the modified thermostat housing from Westcoast solve this? What about the hose connecting to the intake manifold (pulley side)?
Please help. I have worked on cars plenty, but have never actually swapped an engine like this. I'm sure I'll have more questions like this throughout the process.
I have put a 3800SC in an 85 and a 87. The 87 has a tee for a heater hose off the right water pump hose tube. The 85 had a tube that ran to the back than to a tube coming off the 2.8 engine. I had tapped the lower intake manifold and installed a hose bib like many do the for heater hose that is common to all. The other inlet many tap the timing cover or install a freeze plug. Taping the timing cover can be tricky because it is thin there. And the right tap size is hard to find cheaply. What I had did was I took one of the stock hose bibs out of the top of the 3800 alternator bracket. If you take off about 3/64 off the diameter off the bib, it will fit into the timing cover port. You can use the oring that comes with it. I did mine carefully with a grinder, then a file, then sanded. Since there are 2 at the top of the alternator bracket, that leaves you an extra in case of a mishap. Then you can bend the tab to bolt to one of the water pump bolts. You can connect a hose to it of you want, but I tapped the inside of the bib to except a standard brass plumbing elbow, then a hose bib. If you decide to remove the engine, just remove the bib. Ready for the next Series II. I also raided a junk yard for an expansion bottle from a 2.2 Ecotec Saturn Ion. Same one that is in Cobalts. These are pressure bottles. I also got the fitting off the head of the Ecotec that connects to the smaller hose on the bottle. I drilled a hole in thestock 3800 thermostat housing and tapped it to fit that smaller hose fitting. On the 85 I Tee'd a heater hose from the large fitting at the bottom of the bottle, on a hose to the heater hose tube and the other to the hose bib and fitting I installed on the timing cover. This way I was able to take care of the heater hose issue, have a self bleeding cooling system, and have a easy place to fill coolant in the rear of the car. Instead of having to have a special thermostat housing. On the 87, I just ran the hose from the bottle to the fitting I had in the timing cover. When I fill an empty cooling system. I take off the radiator cap. Fill at the rear bottle till the radiator fills. Reinstall the radiator cap. Start car and fill the bottle to the full line. Wait for thermostat to open and top off. I'll have to look if I have pics. I don't have one of the bottle but I have a good view of the timing cover fitting That shows the fitting in the thermostat housing drilled and tapped where the bleeder was.
[This message has been edited by cmechmann (edited 11-02-2015).]
Thanks, cmechmann, for the info. I should have mentioned - My donor was a '97 Buick Regal GS, and my Fiero is an '87 GT 2.8 5-sp. I have a couple more questions, though. I hope you have a few more minutes to help me out.
First, I need to reinstall the Buick's factory dog-bone mount to the rear head (passenger side) along with my alternator with a low mount bracket (haven't bought one, yet... don't know which one to buy). I wish I could just buy Purple Reign's bracket. It has the dog-bone mount built into it, and it looks friggin sweet! Anyway, once that is all mounted, I will have a clearer idea of exactly where I want to run both hoses... So... without having my alternator mounted, I don't yet know if your described hose path will clear my bracket and alternator. Your setup looks like it clears everything just fine. What low-mount bracket did you buy, or did you build one yourself? I think I want to retain the 3800 alternator if I can. It just makes sense.
I want to keep the original coolant path through the LIM. I figure GM spent a good bit of time and money designing it, and I feel like it would be irresponsible to just block it off. If I did block it, wouldn't a small "pool" of uncirculated coolant form at the passenger side of the LIM (hot spot)? Also, what would feed the heater core? You, and others, have described tapping a fitting into the LIM. Is that the simple, black & white solution to keeping everything flowing within "factory" specs?
Also, Has anybody put a freeze plug in timing cover, and then tapped a fitting into the rounded end? Tapping the end, I could redirect the hose at any rearward angle I want. And, I have a friend who says he could weld a fitting onto that rounded end (hard, but do-able). Anybody do anything like this?
That in mind, I think I understood (in another thread) that the '87 Fiero's heater core returns the coolant directly back to a radiator hose near the front of the car, eliminating the necessity to return coolant into the timing cover. If this is true, could I really just put a freeze plug in the timing cover, and call it good? I keep trying to filter through threads, but my old-a$$ computer is SOOOO slow! Dude, I got a dell It is so much easier to just ask.
Originally posted by FieroMax: Also, Has anybody put a freeze plug in timing cover, and then tapped a fitting into the rounded end? Tapping the end, I could redirect the hose at any rearward angle I want. And, I have a friend who says he could weld a fitting onto that rounded end (hard, but do-able). Anybody do anything like this?
Yes, I did exactly that.
quote
Originally posted by FieroMax: That in mind, I think I understood (in another thread) that the '87 Fiero's heater core returns the coolant directly back to a radiator hose near the front of the car, eliminating the necessity to return coolant into the timing cover. If this is true, could I really just put a freeze plug in the timing cover, and call it good?
This is 100% true. The 87 and 88 heater core dumps back into the passenger coolant line.
This is what I did on my 3800na in my 87GT: 1. I tapped the lower intake manifold. I threaded in a nipple that I clamped a short hose. On that hose I clamped a 90 elbow that then clamped to heater hose. If I had tapped the lower intake manifold when when I was doing the lower intake gasket, I could have just threaded a 90 elbow in there. 2. I put a rubber freeze plug in the water pump.
EDIT for an FYI. There was a large bracket on my motor that was around the water pump. It was for the motor mount. That bolt hole there goes into the coolant passage. If you have to remove a bracket and have that hole, plug it with a bolt and some sealer. ------------------ -Brian
I have heard that there is a Buick 3300 mount that fits a A-body (Century, Cierra) that will bolt up to the rear head. The Fiero bracket would need to be moved to the driver's side a few inches by reinforcing the back trunk firewall. Yes the LIM outlet is needed. The one on the timing cover is an inlet. Not needed. All my brackets are self made. I'm using a 4 point motor mount set up instead of a dogbone. Aslo with a single belt on a SC engine. A had sent Darbysan a good deal of pics of the brackets. He may be able to send you some. If not, when I make the other swap, I may take pics. This was originally set up for a Series 1 SC then went to Series II. I only had to mod the alternator bracket. I'm using a CS130d alternator (2.2 Cavalier). Gives me plenty of room and are cheap. I will be soon be going to a NA engine and will be modding the alternator bracket again. The SC engine is showing it's age(very light knock, cold, under heavy load, not audible when not under load, even at 3500 rpm and good oil pressure). I had got a good deal on a confirmed 15,000 mile 2005 K engine. Don't need the extra ponies. Tired of having to use 92 octane. I was able to get 27-28 MPG highway. I'm going to try to push over 30 MPG with the NA.
I'm gonna freeze-plug the timing cover (water-pump)'s unnecessary inlet, and tap an elbow into the LIM, to feed the heater core (and keep coolant properly flowing through the LIM).
Does this sound right?
As far as the dog-bone goes, I think it will be simplest to remount the 3800's mount onto the rear head (pass side). I already have it, and it mounts exactly where I need it. I just need to find an adjustable dog-bone that will fit. For the driver side, I will just buy Westcoast's dog-bone kit. Lastly, I'll add a long steel plate behind the trunk-side firewall to reinforce it, and I'm good.
I need to buy a low-mount alternator bracket (no means to weld), but I don't know which one I need. Again (if it matters), my 3800 came out of a '97 Regal GS, and is going into an '87 GT 5-sp. Maybe I should mention that I am considering scrapping the entire A/C system. I prefer fresh air anyway, and I can stand the heat. I have seen some people relocate the alternator where the A/C used to be. What is easier / cheaper? (not sure if I should start a new thread for this)
Originally posted by FieroMax: I need to buy a low-mount alternator bracket (no means to weld), but I don't know which one I need. Again (if it matters), my 3800 came out of a '97 Regal GS, and is going into an '87 GT 5-sp. Maybe I should mention that I am considering scrapping the entire A/C system. I prefer fresh air anyway, and I can stand the heat. I have seen some people relocate the alternator where the A/C used to be. What is easier / cheaper? (not sure if I should start a new thread for this)
Exactly what you said. Relocate it to where the A/C was if you aren't going to use it...
It is so much easier to just ask. 
