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The dreaded 3800 LIM gasket leak. by Dennis LaGrua
Started on: 09-21-2013 10:59 AM
Replies: 14 (1048 views)
Last post by: lateFormula on 10-02-2013 04:43 PM
Dennis LaGrua
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Report this Post09-21-2013 10:59 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Dennis LaGruaClick Here to Email Dennis LaGruaSend a Private Message to Dennis LaGruaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Was getting ready to leave for a car show this morning and spotted a trail of coolant drops on the driveway. The 3800SC engine was dripping coolant steadily when cold and as it heated up, the leak went away. Put the car on the lift, did a visual inspection and even used the remote camera and could not find the leak. I believe the leak is being caused by seepage at the LIM gasket. I've read that this is common on 3800Sc engines but why the leak is temperature dependent is the real puzzler. .
Anyone ever experience a coolant leak that stops as the engine heats up? Any recommendations on LIM gaskets to use?

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" THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Powerlog manifold, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Flotech Afterburner Exhaust, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite.
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Report this Post09-21-2013 11:56 AM Click Here to See the Profile for JustinbartSend a Private Message to JustinbartEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Get the aluminum ones.

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Turbo 3800 E85 F23 5spd spec5
11.17@132.6

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Dennis LaGrua
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Report this Post09-21-2013 01:10 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Dennis LaGruaClick Here to Email Dennis LaGruaSend a Private Message to Dennis LaGruaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Justinbart:

Get the aluminum ones.



The only 3800SC aluminum gaskets that we know of is the OEM Supercharger gen V gasket. I do not believe that they will work with the ZZ SSIC but the leak is probably coming from the LIM to intake port gaskets.
The leak would have to be there as we tapped the holes and inserted pipe plugs in the water feed to the supercharger.
Fel-Pro offers a set of LIM "perma-dry" gaskets -2nd design. Part number MS 94014, about $50 on Rock Auto. There are good reports on them. I assume that these are the gaskets that will do the job. I don't look forward to this PITA job. .In addition to the LIM gaskets you also get hit for about about $30 for the set of two ZZP Gorlock gaskets.

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" THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Powerlog manifold, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Flotech Afterburner Exhaust, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite.
"THE COLUSSUS"
87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H
" ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "

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Justinbart
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Report this Post09-21-2013 01:18 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JustinbartSend a Private Message to JustinbartEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
You want these.
http://www.amazon.com/ACDel...Gasket/dp/B0049Z0PLQ

Also do at least two oil changes. One after you button everything up, before engine start. One after 2 minutes of run time.

It's a very easy job and shouldn't take more than an hour. Most of the time is going to involve cleaning all the gasket surfaces before it goes back together.

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Turbo 3800 E85 F23 5spd spec5
11.17@132.6

[This message has been edited by Justinbart (edited 09-21-2013).]

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Dennis LaGrua
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Report this Post09-21-2013 01:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Dennis LaGruaClick Here to Email Dennis LaGruaSend a Private Message to Dennis LaGruaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Thanks for the info bro. Just hope that the gasket fits the Gen V LIM. There might not be any difference but not sure. I guess the job isn't too bad of a job. I just don't like removing the supercharger if I can help it. The torqueing procedure on these during re-installation is very critical as to prevent rotor binding. It takes a gentle and precise sequential touch with the torque wrench.
Yup its an oil change for sure right after the gasket replacement and again after that.

------------------
" THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Powerlog manifold, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Flotech Afterburner Exhaust, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite.
"THE COLUSSUS"
87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H
" ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "

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Justinbart
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Report this Post09-21-2013 01:56 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JustinbartSend a Private Message to JustinbartEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
It would be a very good time to to slide a different cam in if you ever thought about it.

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Turbo 3800 E85 F23 5spd spec5
11.17@132.6

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Report this Post09-21-2013 02:59 PM Click Here to See the Profile for MstangsBwareClick Here to Email MstangsBwareSend a Private Message to MstangsBwareEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Dennis LaGrua:

Thanks for the info bro. Just hope that the gasket fits the Gen V LIM. There might not be any difference but not sure. I guess the job isn't too bad of a job. I just don't like removing the supercharger if I can help it. The torqueing procedure on these during re-installation is very critical as to prevent rotor binding. It takes a gentle and precise sequential touch with the torque wrench.
Yup its an oil change for sure right after the gasket replacement and again after that.



The LIMs are the same on the bottom side on both the 3/5 LIM. The gasket set Justin posted is what u need and do as he said on the oil changes. Easy job and if use the aliminuim gaskets set will be the last time u will have to do it.
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Dennis LaGrua
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Report this Post09-21-2013 06:26 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Dennis LaGruaClick Here to Email Dennis LaGruaSend a Private Message to Dennis LaGruaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Justinbart:

It would be a very good time to to slide a different cam in if you ever thought about it.



A new cam is definitely in order but the task right now is to get up and running as soon as possible. Parts are on the way. I have a spare 3800SC sitting on a cradle and will change the cam in that engine. I always agonize over a cam change as the resulting shift in the power band can create top end power with a sacrifice in low end horsepower. Large duration cams can also kill gas mileage big time. It would be nice if a performance cam could give all three but for the time being 11 psi of intercooled Gen V boost gets me into the 12's.

------------------
" THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Powerlog manifold, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Flotech Afterburner Exhaust, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite.
"THE COLUSSUS"
87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H
" ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "

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BV MotorSports
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Report this Post09-21-2013 09:34 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BV MotorSportsClick Here to Email BV MotorSportsSend a Private Message to BV MotorSportsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
+2 on the AC Delco gaskets. Also, I have read nothing but bad reviews on those Gorlock gaskets.

Edit, why not add higher ratio rockers Dennis? I just sold a set of HS 1.9's. They were pretty sweet. Granted you have to use shorter pushrods as well. Cam is best, but if you dont want to go that route, its an option.

[This message has been edited by BV MotorSports (edited 09-21-2013).]

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smartaxel
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Report this Post09-21-2013 10:30 PM Click Here to See the Profile for smartaxelClick Here to visit smartaxel's HomePageClick Here to Email smartaxelSend a Private Message to smartaxelEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Pressurize the coolant system cold and check it. On my wife's Bonneville it was the same. leaking cold, great warm. It ended up being those little "L" shaped coolant brackets. They only sealed when the car was hot. If you still have those, take a look. Dorman makes new aluminum ones. That was the fix for her.
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Report this Post09-22-2013 03:57 AM Click Here to See the Profile for darkhorizonSend a Private Message to darkhorizonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
resulting shift in the power band can create top end power with a sacrifice in low end horsepower


Because that's actually readily noticable a thing on boosted cars...
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Report this Post09-22-2013 11:34 AM Click Here to See the Profile for sco77Click Here to Email sco77Send a Private Message to sco77Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Dennis LaGrua:
I always agonize over a cam change as the resulting shift in the power band can create top end power with a sacrifice in low end horsepower. Large duration cams can also kill gas mileage big time. It would be nice if a performance cam could give all three but for the time being 11 psi of intercooled Gen V boost gets me into the 12's.


I don't think you would notice much if any low end loss with a smaller cam like an S1X.

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86 Fiero GT 4spd - L67 swap: VS cam, GenV Build Progress
98 GTP - Some mods

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Dennis LaGrua
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Report this Post09-22-2013 07:24 PM Click Here to See the Profile for Dennis LaGruaClick Here to Email Dennis LaGruaSend a Private Message to Dennis LaGruaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by BV MotorSports:

+2 on the AC Delco gaskets. Also, I have read nothing but bad reviews on those Gorlock gaskets.

Edit, why not add higher ratio rockers Dennis? I just sold a set of HS 1.9's. They were pretty sweet. Granted you have to use shorter pushrods as well. Cam is best, but if you dont want to go that route, its an option.



The Gorlock supercharger gaskets work but also need sealant. The problem with the Gorlocks is that they compress and as you sequentially torque the supercharger down; if you are not careful and precise, the supercharger case will twist and rotor bind is the result. The aluminum GM gaskets are muco better for this application BUT they are not cut for use with the SSIC. That's the issue. If I am not mistaken, the Gorlocks and the paper gaskets are the only ones that can be made to work with the SSIC.

------------------
" THE BLACK PARALYZER" -87GT 3800SC Series III engine, custom ZZP /Frozen Boost Intercooler setup, 3.4" Pulley, Powerlog manifold, Northstar TB, LS1 MAF, 3" Flotech Afterburner Exhaust, Autolite 104's, MSD wires, Custom CAI, 4T65eHD w. custom axles, HP Tuners VCM Suite.
"THE COLUSSUS"
87GT - ALL OUT 3.4L Turbocharged engine, Garrett Hybrid Turbo, MSD ign., modified TH125H
" ON THE LOOSE WITHOUT THE JUICE "

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ChuckLS1
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Report this Post10-02-2013 03:51 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ChuckLS1Send a Private Message to ChuckLS1Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I am having a coolant leak also, I was told at the intake. What is the LIM?

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Chuck
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lateFormula
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Report this Post10-02-2013 04:43 PM Click Here to See the Profile for lateFormulaSend a Private Message to lateFormulaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
LIM = Lower Intake Manifold
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