Ok guys I just got a great deal on a 88 gt fiero with a 4.9 swap and it's about 80% completed but I had already bought a 1999 cadillac Seville to do a engine swap anyone who has any info about the wiring and programing of the computer let me know and any pointers will be appreciate it
I'd say finish the 4.9 and enjoy driving it for a while. Buy an extra '88 cradle and set the Northstar up on it while you're enjoying the 4.9. When the Northstar's ready, swap the two, then sell the 4.9 & trans on the cradle as a plug/play swap.
The biggest question about the Northstar swap is transmission: Auto or stick?
The right strut tower on the '88 body and the rear cam cover on the Northstar interfere with each other. You'll have to carve on the strut tower and run coil over rear struts to compensate for the loss of space inside the strut tower.
I've done a Northstar swap on my '87 GT.
[This message has been edited by Will (edited 06-25-2014).]
It's going to be a 5 speed I don't want to put more money to the 4.9 for it to come off in a couple of months plus I already had a 4.9 my friend is going to be doing most of the work the north start is ready to be pulled out
Rodrigo, Your new car looks really nice. I see it has a 4.9 in it. I'd be interested in buying the 4.9 along with it's wiring if you are going to switch to a northstar. I want to build a new engine for mine with a new cam, and I am going to use morthstar pistons, as they are .030 larger and are flat top rather than dished like the stock 4.9 pistons. The northstar pistons have the same wrist pin height and diameter and will raise the compression. I also read that I can use LS3 intake valves and springs. These valves are larger and will fit the 4.9 heads. I'd like to do this work on a different engine than the one that's in my car now so that when I'm done with the engine rebuild I can just pull out the old one and swap in the rebuilt one so I don't have the engine out for a long time and have to try to remember where everything hooks back up. Yours looks like the existing wire harness is done more profesionaly than the one in mine. Let me know what you think. I'm not in a big rush as I am just starting to rebuild a GEO Metro for my grandson who is just getting his drivers license. JERRY Phone 335-7751
Relative to the wiring and the computer, its pretty strait forward. The fabrication part of engine mounts and mods and such is more complicated but doable by you if you have a drill press, welder and cutting capability.
With the wiring, its pretty easy. Save your original N* harness and use it on the engine and attach the appropriate inputs needed to the fiero in the respective locations. With the programming you just need to decide if you are going to go with the original computer or alternative computer (LS1, Holley or other aftermarket, or OBD1 Caddy). The computer you use determines what programing options you have if you don't want to use all the inputs/modules from the Caddy body.
I've used an LS1 computer with Getrag, OBD2 Caddy Computer with 4T80E and now on my third one using an OBD1 Caddy computer with the 4T80E. I'm planning to supercharge both the auto tranny cars with a Vortech style charger.
Additional notes: you should consider with your N*. Do consider drilling out your block and use studs with Cometic gaskets to eliminate any future head sealing failures. If you do this before you install it in your engine bay, you will have a long term service shelf-life N*. If you want serious performance, this motor can handle it. In a fiero, not many have done the performance mods because of the space and limited aftermarket support.
If you want to consider performance, start with Will's upgrades and follow his thread. Its really the best starting base for long term performance before you get to other custom upgrades.
Be prepared to spend a lot of money compared to a typical V8 swap.
Rodrigo, Your new car looks really nice. I see it has a 4.9 in it. I'd be interested in buying the 4.9 along with it's wiring if you are going to switch to a northstar. I want to build a new engine for mine with a new cam, and I am going to use morthstar pistons, as they are .030 larger and are flat top rather than dished like the stock 4.9 pistons. The northstar pistons have the same wrist pin height and diameter and will raise the compression. I also read that I can use LS3 intake valves and springs. These valves are larger and will fit the 4.9 heads. I'd like to do this work on a different engine than the one that's in my car now so that when I'm done with the engine rebuild I can just pull out the old one and swap in the rebuilt one so I don't have the engine out for a long time and have to try to remember where everything hooks back up. Yours looks like the existing wire harness is done more profesionaly than the one in mine. Let me know what you think. I'm not in a big rush as I am just starting to rebuild a GEO Metro for my grandson who is just getting his drivers license. JERRY
Jerry...don't post your phone number. Edit and delete it from your post. Send personal info like that through PM (Private Message). Where do you plan on getting the head bolts for the 4.9? I can't find them anywhere!
It's going to be a 5 speed I don't want to put more money to the 4.9 for it to come off in a couple of months plus I already had a 4.9 my friend is going to be doing most of the work the north start is ready to be pulled out
It looks like you have a nice exhaust on the 4.9. If all the plumbing's done on it and you have clutch, trans, axles, etc. complete, then you don't have much money to spend.
Having fun with a car while you're building up the Northstar cradle will be good motivation. Having the car down while you're doing the swap really sucks. Not being under time pressure also lets you do the Northstar swap right and not cut corners.
Building a stickshift Northstar is about 2/3 the work of building an automatic N*, so you're already ahead 2nd... do you want Getrag 282 (that's the stock gearbox), the F23 5 speed or the F40 6 speed? Obviously keeping the stock trans is the easiest way to do the swap. It's not a bad trans and mine has put up with a good bit of abuse, but the others are more modern.
You'll need: -Flywheel and clutch -Modify the trans case for the Northstar starter and waterpump -Exhaust -Engine management -Lots of other straight forward stuff
[This message has been edited by Will (edited 06-30-2014).]
I'd keep that 4.9L in the car. The Northstar cost's so much money to swap and the engine itself blows head gaskets. Im a Cadillac Enthusiast and I can say the Northstar was the WORST engine Cadillac made. The HP is great, the torque is amazing but the reliability is just awful. If you rebuild the engine than Yes! I would swap it in, but the rebuilt, plus swapping it in the fiero is gonna cost a lot more than a 3800SC swap would be, or even just finishing the 4.9L swap.
That 4.9L V8 is one of the better engines cadillac designed. The swap is a little less costly than the 3800SC and you get that awesome V8 rumble.
I'd keep that 4.9L in the car. The Northstar cost's so much money to swap and the engine itself blows head gaskets. Im a Cadillac Enthusiast and I can say the Northstar was the WORST engine Cadillac made. The HP is great, the torque is amazing but the reliability is just awful.
LOL.
There are only two major reliability problems with the Northstar, one of which can be fixed with nothing more involved that the right driving style. Those two problems are:
1. Stress corrosion cracking in head bolt threads. This causes loss of head bolt clamp load and loss of head gasket seal. The repair/prevention is to install steel inserts in the head bolt holes. While the kit is ~$400, and the engine needs ~$200 in gaskets when the heads are removed, the procedure can be done to an engine on the stand in a day and is a permanent repair (assuming that your block isn't so corroded that the time-serts don't bite).
2. Carbon deposits on piston rings. The Northstar bore hone pattern is fairly aggressive and holes a good bit of oil to lubricate the pistons and rigs during sustained high RPM operation. As many Cadillac owners never use more than 30% throttle, there's seldom enough heat and pressure in the chambers to keep the rings clean, so they gradually accumulate carbon deposits, then allow oil into the chambers which causes the engine to smoke. Once the engine starts to smoke, it needs a cleaning process which involves dumping sea foam into the chambers, letting it soak and then changing the oil. However, if the engine hasn't started to smoke, existing carbon deposits can be reduced and new ones prevented by simply driving it like you stole it.
[This message has been edited by Will (edited 07-04-2014).]
Ok guys the engine swap is officially starting next week I'm looking for some one that has a flywheel that will work with the northstar engine and the 5 getrag were going to do the wiring from the original cadillac harness and we're going to use the stock cadillac computer I'm also going to need information of anyone who can reprogramme the computer....I was going to finish the 4.9 while the northstar was been done bUT I've already had a 4.9 swap one so I'll manage to wait for my N* swap to be finished instead so any help full info will be appreciated I'll also be taking offers for all the parts that go with the 4.9 swap that is already installed and exoust you will have to pick up parts at the shop wear the swap is been done PM me
[This message has been edited by rodrigo (edited 07-06-2014).]
Ok guys the swap is on it's way so now to tear the engine apart and put new gaskets and everything that needs to be done the engine was running really smooth before it as removed I also include a picture of the computer does anyone know how to reprogram for it to run smooth with a 5 speed transmission let me know I'm also going I need a flywheel at reasonable price if possible
Needs gaskets plus I want to do the head gaskets and he bolts on the heads since it's out already everyone knows northstars are notorious on the head gaskets
You can get a steel flywheel from Cadillac Hot rod fabricators as well. But do your homework to make sure it fits the fiero specs if your using the 5 speed.
Having said that, you can also use other computers like a LS1 computer or aftermarket computers.
Since the engine is out, replace the head gaskets with cometic gaskets, install studs and be done with it long term. You will be glad you did. It will be an incredibly reliable engine with future power potential if you want to go there.
Also, consider resealing the case halfs and your oil pan along with installing a rear main seal with the new design.
[This message has been edited by IXSLR8 (edited 07-26-2014).]
Except for the front and rear main seals, there are no reusable seals on the engine. Every cover you take off needs a new seal when it goes back on.
If it's not leaking, don't mess with it.
However, you DO need to install inserts in the head bolt holes, as you plan to do. Stock bolts and head gaskets are fine for naturally aspirated used with stock compression. They're probably fine for N/A use with any compression ratio, but the stock gaskets are fairly thick, so optimizing quench clearance and crevice volume with them is difficult.
[This message has been edited by Will (edited 07-28-2014).]
1999 Camaro LS1 Computer will work. You will need a tuner to setup the shelby program for you. You will need to tell the tuner what engine specs you have and what your desired inputs are.
1999 Camaro LS1 Computer will work. You will need a tuner to setup the shelby program for you. You will need to tell the tuner what engine specs you have and what your desired inputs are.
I just contacted Westers garage they have a ECM that they use on North stars buggies and they gave me a price of $600 does anybody know if that's a good deal
I just contacted Westers garage they have a ECM that they use on North stars buggies and they gave me a price of $600 does anybody know if that's a good deal
an 0411 LS1 computer is probably way cheaper.
Edit; inexpensive, cheap implies that it's junk.
[This message has been edited by ericjon262 (edited 07-29-2014).]
I also live in Tucson Arizona and no one here has any idea on programming computers to work with a northstar when I talk to anyone about it they look at me like A deer caught in the headlights
Ok guys after some time finally getting around to finishing the fiero with the northstar engine will be adding some pictures we will be starting this Sunday
