Biden to Americans in Ukraine: Leave, We Can’t Help You
This sounds familiar. From the story: “American citizens should leave now,” Biden said in an interview with NBC News’ anchor Lester Holt. “It’s not like we’re dealing with a terrorist organization. We’re dealing with one of the largest armies in the world. It’s a very different situation and things could go crazy quickly.” Holt asked Biden what scenario could prompt him to send troops to rescue Americans fleeing the country. Biden replied: “There’s not. That’s a world war when Americans and Russia start shooting at one another.”
NBC News Personal thoughts, forget for a moment that Biden could have resolved this back in March when Putin first started bringing soldiers (just a few) to the border. He could have immediately engaged NATO, pleaded with them to get involved and move soldiers to where they've moved now. He could then have also moved US soldiers into Ukraine (if they are in fact an ally of ours), and this would have put an end to it. He is right about one thing... Russia does not want a war with the United States, so if there were US soldiers in Ukraine, he likely would have let it go. But Biden is a coward, and a horrible statesman. Biden is basically doing what he's done his entire life in international politics. What's more, Biden is making decisions based on poll-testing, which was the same thing that Obama got into which started to cause problems for him.
Some youtube bubbas are trying to make a big deal of the new purchases, but Taiwan has had Patriot missiles for quite some time now. For years. This, at best is "old news".
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The US, which switched diplomatic recognition to Beijing from Taipei in 1979, has sold at least 400 Patriot missiles to Taiwan since 1997 when the island first obtained three Patriot Advanced Capability-2 systems.
All the anti-CCP media/news establishments were shut down, and you are no longer allowed to run as a candidate unless you are picked by the CCP. The CCP from the mainland passed a law which stated only the CCP can pick candidates. Which means, there's no more reporting (internally from HK) on CCP influence, and their democracy was eliminated literally overnight. Didn't really make the nightly news. Sure... there's articles about it, here's one: https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/fr...hong-kong-elections/
... but 99% of the US, maybe 99.99% has no idea this happened, since it likely wasn't covered at all on any of the talk shows, or nightly news casts outside of OAN.
I expect this is also the long-term strategy that China will attempt with Taiwan as well. They have no legislative authority over them, but you can be sure that the CCP will ramp-up propaganda and do whatever they can to infiltrate the legislative process.
Here's a scoop... Ben Cohen and Jerry Greenfield, the founders of Ben & Jerry's Ice Cream, used Twitter to implore President Biden to freeze Ukraine-related U.S. troop deployments to Europe.
Their Twitter message was on February 3, so 11 days ago.
"Ice cream moguls Ben & Jerry have a rocky road to hew on Ukraine as they soft pedal the wisdom of responding with U.S. troop deployments to Europe" Sebastien Roblin for NBC News "THINK"; February 9, 2022. https://www.nbcnews.com/thi...s-blames-ncna1288911
[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 02-14-2022).]
Word from Russia is that the majority of Russians believe the buildup at the border is simply posturing, and nothing will happen because Putin doesn't have the support of the people for it, and it's just has something to do with Putin manipulating the UN somehow.
It's about 50/50 in Ukraine with half thinking nothing will happen, and the other half proclaiming FAFO.
This info is third or fourth hand from a first gen Ukrainian-American co-worker who was initially a lot worried about things, but now is just saying that Putin is just being a dog again and barking for no reason.
That's not what I've hearing Fats. Putin has a lot of support back home (perhaps because the Russians hear a much different story than what is coming out of NATO countries) He's transitioned the Russian military over the last decade, replacing lackards with an officer corps that lean as he does. Militaries the world wide often complain about having to actually go into combat, but once the first shots are fired and the wheels and tracks start rolling, everything changes.
Some pundits say the Russian conscrips won't fight, but I heard the same thing said about both the US draftees and the NVA (which was made of 'draftees' once N Vietnam instituted a conscriion law for all able bodied men 18-24 for 2 years service. The Chinese divisions that came across the 38th parallel in the early 50s were also conscripts and we came very close to being defeated by them. What do soldiers hate most of all? Garrison duty.
"People would be seriously hurt, and seriously killed . . ." Defense Department spokesman John Kirby in today's press briefing on Ukraine.
I think he was very deliberate in wording it that way. Not wanting to eschew an opportunity at that moment in his spoken remarks to express himself with a small informality and colloquialism. I do not intend to impute any significance by singling this out in a forum post. I call it only a "Kirby-ism" and am already moving past it. Click to show
[This message has been edited by rinselberg (edited 02-14-2022).]
A common refrain in regards to Russia and Ukraine:
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Putin's goal is to put the USSR back together a little at a time. Putin will see how well the Ukraine goes and if it goes well......game on! Just my opinion.
I guess them Germans, French, Spaniards and other EU countries with all the big talk about how badass they are better get their A team together eh?
French farmers are now hiding their Charolais cattle in the barns and the few that are selling are getting higher prices for their hides than they are for their beef.
INVESTMENT TIP! The US stock market is already closed for today but tomorrow morning, any company making white cloth for export to Western Europe is a BUY!
[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 02-14-2022).]
INVESTMENT TIP! The US stock market is already closed for today but tomorrow morning, any company making white cloth for export to Western Europe is a BUY!
That would be funny if there weren't some truth behind it.
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]: Hong Kong was taken, and no one noticed.
All the anti-CCP media/news establishments were shut down, and you are no longer allowed to run as a candidate unless you are picked by the CCP. The CCP from the mainland passed a law which stated only the CCP can pick candidates. Which means, there's no more reporting (internally from HK) on CCP influence, and their democracy was eliminated literally overnight. Didn't really make the nightly news. Sure... there's articles about it, here's one: https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/fr...hong-kong-elections/
... but 99% of the US, maybe 99.99% has no idea this happened, since it likely wasn't covered at all on any of the talk shows, or nightly news casts outside of OAN.
I expect this is also the long-term strategy that China will attempt with Taiwan as well. They have no legislative authority over them, but you can be sure that the CCP will ramp-up propaganda and do whatever they can to infiltrate the legislative process.
Hong Kong was not taken. They were always part of China, same as Macao. HK was rented out to the UK for 99 years and when the lease expired it went back to being run by China.
Hong Kong was not taken. They were always part of China, same as Macao. HK was rented out to the UK for 99 years and when the lease expired it went back to being run by China.
Taiwan is a totally different issue.
Now that I'm reminded, I remember that bit of factual history. Thanks for the reminder.
Rams
[This message has been edited by blackrams (edited 02-14-2022).]
It's similar to our lease on Guantanmo Bay that began in 1898, except that the Cuban/US lease doesn't specify an end date. Cuba's current revolutionary govt validated the lease agreement when they cashed the first lease payment check in 1959. (that was also the last one they cashed).
Most people don't know that the same lease agreement includes another parcel of property on the Northwestern end of Cuba called Bahi'a Honda but the US simply abandoned that base decades ago. (1912)
Signed at Habana, July 2, 1903; Approved by the President, October 2, 1903; Ratified by the President of Cuba, August 17,1903; Ratifications exchanged at Washington, October 6,1903 The United States of America and the Republic of Cuba, being desirous to conclude the conditions of the lease of areas of land and water for the establishment of naval or coaling stations in Guantanamo and Bahia Honda the Republic of Cuba made to the United States by the Agreement of February 16/23,1903, in fulfillment of the provisions of Article Seven of the Constitutional Appendix of the Republic of Cuba, have appointed their Plenipotentiaries to that end.-
The President of the United States of America, Herbert G. Squiers, Envoy Extraordinary and Minister Plenipotentiary in Havana.
And the President of the Republic of Cuba, Jose M. Garcia Montes, Secretary of Finance, and acting Secretary of State and Justice, who, after communicating to each other their respective full powers, found to be in due form, have agreed upon the following Articles;-
[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 02-14-2022).]
French foreign minister reports 'Russia has all the parts in place and moving up to final positions'...
It's heavy stuff. [url=https://twitter.com/GirkinGirkin/status/1492743074228981761?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1492757060886282242%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es3_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.cnn.com%2F2022%2F02%2F14%2Feurope%2Frussia-ukraine-troops-social-med ia-video-intl%2Findex.html]rus-ukr social media vids[/url]
Hong Kong was not taken. They were always part of China, same as Macao. HK was rented out to the UK for 99 years and when the lease expired it went back to being run by China.
Taiwan is a totally different issue.
I know HK was a Chinese territory, but before the UK handed it back, they negotiated with China to allow HK to maintain some independence while still being a Chinese territory (economically and politically). This was done because the UK (at the time) had a significant amount of industry in HK that they supported (watch making, etc.). I was simply stating that any hopes of HK remaining an independently operated territory, or actually gaining it's independence, is now totally gone. What they did recently is close and shut, they can no longer elect pro-Democracy candidates, or for that matter, anyone who isn't a CCP selected candidate.
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Originally posted by maryjane:
Most people don't know that the same lease agreement includes another parcel of property on the Northwestern end of Cuba called Bahi'a Honda but the US simply abandoned that base decades ago. (1912)
I'd not heard about this, that's pretty cool. I wonder if there are any pictures (going to look) of then and any now (if any of the structures are still being used)?
A lot of people are saying that all of this (Ukraine) is staged, and that somehow the Biden administration is in kahoots and faking all of this so that they show him as some kind of political mastermind and it saves his polling (or some nonsense). Lots of comments by Pelosi that if there's no war, it's because Biden is such a great negotiator (or some nonsense). Her comments directly make me think there's something shady, but I don't know if Democrats are actually intelligent enough to pull something like this off without everyone finding out about it.
What I am suspecting though, is that Russia perhaps is doing this to get all sanctions lifted, and get favorability in negotiations. Think of it as similar to what North Korea has been doing. I don't know, just hypothesizing here, but I suspect Biden will agree to lift whatever sanctions Russia is currently under, and maybe even funnel some of that sweet US Taxpayer money to them. If this is true though, there would need to be an economic feasibility between the expense of 100k of troop and artillery movement, and the possible gains from not going to war? I'm just not seeing it, but a lot of people are saying this now?
A lot of people are saying that all of this (Ukraine) is staged, and that somehow the Biden administration is in kahoots and faking all of this so that they show him as some kind of political mastermind and it saves his polling (or some nonsense). Lots of comments by Pelosi that if there's no war, it's because Biden is such a great negotiator (or some nonsense). Her comments directly make me think there's something shady, but I don't know if Democrats are actually intelligent enough to pull something like this off without everyone finding out about it.
What I am suspecting though, is that Russia perhaps is doing this to get all sanctions lifted, and get favorability in negotiations. Think of it as similar to what North Korea has been doing. I don't know, just hypothesizing here, but I suspect Biden will agree to lift whatever sanctions Russia is currently under, and maybe even funnel some of that sweet US Taxpayer money to them. If this is true though, there would need to be an economic feasibility between the expense of 100k of troop and artillery movement, and the possible gains from not going to war? I'm just not seeing it, but a lot of people are saying this now?
Thoughts???
I obviously have no insider info. All I can really say is, I don't trust the Biden administration any farther than I could throw him, Harris, Pelosi or Schummer. We may never know for sure but, I suspect we gave something up in trade negotiations or something. Biden has already proven he lacks the ability to lead a military operation. Putting it as simple as I can, he doesn't have the balls or brains to do anything but concede.
He wants to see how much power and influence he has on the current world stage. Witness how he can toy with the US stock market just by moving some troops towards or back from a border. He also views this as an opportunistic time period with Biden as the U.S. President.
I don't think he'll invade Ukraine. If he does, it'll just be in the largely ethnic Russian Donbass region of eastern Ukraine where he will get minimal pushback militarily. They (Russia) already funnel billions annually into this pro-Russian region..... Putin likely believes that Russia already provides more support to that region than the Ukraine does, so why not just take it if no one blinks. It could be a "buffer zone" politically on a map.
If there was talk of the Ukraine joining the CSTO (the Russian-led Collective Security Treaty Organization of former Soviet states) instead of NATO, I doubt a lot of this would be occurring.
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]: Hong Kong was taken, and no one noticed.
All the anti-CCP media/news establishments were shut down, and you are no longer allowed to run as a candidate unless you are picked by the CCP. The CCP from the mainland passed a law which stated only the CCP can pick candidates. Which means, there's no more reporting (internally from HK) on CCP influence, and their democracy was eliminated literally overnight. Didn't really make the nightly news. Sure... there's articles about it, here's one: https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/fr...hong-kong-elections/
... but 99% of the US, maybe 99.99% has no idea this happened, since it likely wasn't covered at all on any of the talk shows, or nightly news casts outside of OAN.
I expect this is also the long-term strategy that China will attempt with Taiwan as well. They have no legislative authority over them, but you can be sure that the CCP will ramp-up propaganda and do whatever they can to infiltrate the legislative process.
No one noticed? This was a huge deal and was absolutely covered in multiple places for months. Almost everyone I know is very familiar with what happened.
I think the lack of action (or even strong opinion) is due to a thought of “well, what can we do?” far more than ignorance. Maybe I’m too optimistic about my fellow Americans.
All the anti-CCP media/news establishments were shut down, and you are no longer allowed to run as a candidate unless you are picked by the CCP. The CCP from the mainland passed a law which stated only the CCP can pick candidates. Which means, there's no more reporting (internally from HK) on CCP influence, and their democracy was eliminated literally overnight. Didn't really make the nightly news. Sure... there's articles about it, here's one: https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/fr...hong-kong-elections/
... but 99% of the US, maybe 99.99% has no idea this happened, since it likely wasn't covered at all on any of the talk shows, or nightly news casts outside of OAN.
I expect this is also the long-term strategy that China will attempt with Taiwan as well. They have no legislative authority over them, but you can be sure that the CCP will ramp-up propaganda and do whatever they can to infiltrate the legislative process.
Is that what they said on OAN? That "99% of the US... has no idea this happened, since it likely wasn't covered at all on any of the talk shows, or nightly news casts outside of OAN."
I remember some of the coverage on MSNBC. Like the shutdown of the Apple Daily newspaper, which had been "big" in Hong Kong.
I'd not heard about this, that's pretty cool. I wonder if there are any pictures (going to look) of then and any now (if any of the structures are still being used)?
There were a couple of pictures of Bahia Hond´a when I was at Guantanamo. It was my understanding, that it was a rough coaling station for US ships that were going to enter the Gulf of Mexico from down off the Mexican coast and there was very little developed. The US kept it only about 10-15 years. By the 60s, it was again of interest to the US Navy but for a different reason. Bahia Honda was the location of one of the Soviet SAM sites.
It would have also been one of the planned invasion points if the US had to invade Cuba to get rid of the Soviet missiles.
An interesting time and I remember it well. Hawks and Nikes stood guard openly, in the Everglades and on Fla beaches.
Is that what they said on OAN? That "99% of the US... has no idea this happened, since it likely wasn't covered at all on any of the talk shows, or nightly news casts outside of OAN."
I remember some of the coverage on MSNBC. Like the shutdown of the Apple Daily newspaper, which had been "big" in Hong Kong.
I wouldn't quote me for statistical accuracy... but the majority of the country does not know who the Vice President of the United States is...
So, that all future elections in Hong Kong will only be CCP candidates, I would posture that definitely fewer than 10% of America knows this. It saw little time on the nightly news. We can all link to articles of course, but that doesn't mean that everyone knows about it. For me, I think it's a pretty catastrophic situation for Hong Kong... it effectively means absorption back into Chinese rule is complete. A point of no-return, for that matter... in my opinion.
I think it was likely not talked about much because:
1 - It might make Biden look bad since he didn't do anything about it (but again, what would WE do? and... Trump didn't do much about it either) 2 - No one cares.
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Originally posted by maryjane:
There were a couple of pictures of Bahia Hond´a when I was at Guantanamo. It was my understanding, that it was a rough coaling station for US ships that were going to enter the Gulf of Mexico from down off the Mexican coast and there was very little developed. The US kept it only about 10-15 years. By the 60s, it was again of interest to the US Navy but for a different reason. Bahia Honda was the location of one of the Soviet SAM sites.
It would have also been one of the planned invasion points if the US had to invade Cuba to get rid of the Soviet missiles.
An interesting time and I remember it well. Hawks and Nikes stood guard openly, in the Everglades and on Fla beaches.
That is pretty cool. It makes sense that Russia would use that same site (after we abandoned it) simply because it likely had strategic advantage... probably was already "prepped" by our ARMY CoEs, etc. I look at a site like Bagram Air Base... originally built by the Untied States in the 70s for the Afghan Army, then owned by the Russians, then owned by the Mujahideen, then by the Northern Alliance, then the Taliban, then the United States, and then... the Taliban again. I just really get a kick out of the history of military bases.
You'd probably know what this is since you spent time in Florida back in the day.
In Fort Lauderdale, specifically the area around Davie and Plantation, there's an old ARMY? Air Field (from what I understand). It's now the site of NOVA South Eastern University and the Miami Dolphins Training Camp (though I think they gave it back). The old runway has been completely removed, and there's tons of buildings now in place of it. HOWEVER... there's part of it that is still Broward-county owned, and it's the location of the local "Extension Office" (which I'm sure you know what that is). They own maybe 10 acres of land behind it, and a huge area of the land is paved / concrete... it's basically remnants of the old air field that's still in use there... it's pretty cool. There's even some old military hardware (scrap metal) that was there about a decade ago before the area got a little overgrown. Don't know if it's still there.
Here it is... you can just make out what's left of the runway, and it's basically just a parking lot now:
