so I got somewhere last night. the drivers side axle/brake assembly is out. It is very similar to a ford 9"
IDK why my hosting thing rotates these.
axle tube
axle with bearing, retainer, backing plate, seal and brake spider.
So to get this all apart I have to remove this bearing retaining ring that can be seen against the bearing. One would assume I cut/break it off, then replace it with a new one. EV performance claims they make these in house for a whopping $80 something dollars. I can't see paying that for a $10 part yet, so I'm trying to cross it to some ezgo or cushman part hopefully. I'm not getting very far with that yet.
I always refer to it as a wedding ring. I tried a couple quick google searches and could not come up with a supplier though.
While not recommended for a 9", for what this vehicle is, you could press it off and re-use it
I probably could manage to press it off. But It a risk on a part like that I'd like to avoid. I found an old ezgo number from a similar axle on the same diff... So I ordered one from ebay. I really think it will fit, but who knows till it gets here. it was only 3x what I wanted to pay vs 10, so I bit the bullet.
I took the time to get the one axle naked.
and the pile of stuff that was on it. You can clearly see the missing tab in the middle of the right side of the brake spider.
and the bearing... it came out of the tube as a roller on the shaft, and a race in the axle housing. By the part number,( timkin u199/u160l) this was once a one piece assembly. perhaps that is what took out the brake spider.
So to finish this side i need to get housing seal bearing brake spider shaft seal brake pads probably a backing plate/ dust cover.
I guess the axle is the only good part.
That leads me to an ebay add that has a whole complete drop in assembly for a cushman for $177. But its 5 lug, so It only good for the entire brake assy. I'd have to cut the ring/bearing and throw my axle in it with a new ring/bearing. Not sure if that's the best way or finding piece by piece. I'll be looking out for parts for a minute.
I'm really hoping the rest of the spiders can just hone/reseal.
[This message has been edited by gen2muchwork (edited 12-01-2017).]
well, 1 part has shown up. I took a guess on a cushman retaining ring where the axle set was similar. It turns out to be the same ring. Nice to have a part number for it at least. I paid $27 for it, vs the 80 something ev performance charges. Worth the headache searching.
next up is the inner seal. It's a weird one and the measurements don't really cross to anything out there. I have a couple coming, one with a slightly smaller shaft dia. and one slightly larger. One will have to work, since that is what is out there.
my shaft dia is 1.70" bore is 1.825
sooo, I chose a 1.156 x 1.828 orrr... 1.175x 1.828
Both are smaller in width than the original, by a little but maybe that won't matter.
Originally posted by gen2muchwork: It has non assisted 7" drums at all 4 corners on 12" tires, leaf sprung solid rear axle, no sway bars
My 400 hp Dodge SuperBee had unassisted drum brakes on all corners (10" ?), no sway bars, and leaf springs on a solid rear axle. It did just fine, although it wasnt a good roadracer.
My 400 hp Dodge SuperBee had unassisted drum brakes on all corners (10" ?), no sway bars, and leaf springs on a solid rear axle. It did just fine, although it wasnt a good roadracer.
from now on I'm going to tell people it has a superbee suspension. lol
[This message has been edited by gen2muchwork (edited 12-13-2017).]
It has been so cold it's been hard to motivate myself to work in the garage. I did get some parts in the mail though. Only thing I am short is the bearing for the axle now. I picked up a whole axle loaded for a cushman. The axle is not interchangeable since the length, spline and lug count is incorrect, but all the brake parts fit and It was way cheaper than piece by piece. I just have to put it all on my axle.
Now, I can begin moving on to rebuilding the other 3. I have hopes I can hone and seal all the other torque spiders, which is about $40 a wheel, rather than $140 for the spider.
Had a nice weekend weather wise. Washed 4 cars then, I finally just broke down and bought a press because I'm sort of tired of making tools and or beating things apart or together. It popped the axle pieces together easily and I now have one wheel finished with all new brakes, spider, backing cover, bearing and axle seals.
I also got all 3 remaining wheels brake cylinder seals shipped and ready for me to get to work on.
this whole torque spider thing is sort of annoying. I can't see why there isnt an open bottom on these to slip off without pressing everything apart. They also could have used a backing plate and a normal wheel cylinder. The cheapest seal kit I could get was about $30 per wheel, which is $20 more than just about any complete with seals cast wheel cylinder. The whole spider would hav cost around $130 complete, but that is $$ for me on this project. Gotta save where I can.
I did also buy a new master cylinder which was cheap and crosses to a 74 amc ambassador/ gremlin/ etc with 4 drums . At least something could be bought at an auto parts store rather than golf cart supply.
Perhaps I'll have the brakes ready this week?
On a side note I got yet another car this weekend. 09 Ford Edge 2wd for the wife. Was an absolute steal for 1K, even with some trans sensor issues. Must have used some good karma for that one. Running out of driveway space now. Good thing my corner lot has 2 driveways. According to the kids, one is moms and one is dads driveway.
[This message has been edited by gen2muchwork (edited 01-22-2018).]
pass. rear. My hone would not fit in the wheel well with any reasonable control. So out came that axle. I honed it up, and I think it cleaned up ok in the seal area. The pistons move smoothly, but I guess I'll know how well that worked when I step on the brakes (which will be a little while). I should mention, this must have been apart before, as the axle front seal was beat up from a screwdriver, and the bearing grease is something other than factory.
It's all assembled it the rear now, but I need to focus on the parking brake for a minute. My understanding is that even when new, they don't work well. Mine has some binding somewhere along the line and is not releasing quite right, but applies itself sort of ok, which might be normal.
I flushed out the rear diff, No drain plug, No cover. So I had to pump it out which is super slow in the cold weather. The dif does seperate into halves, the back half has the axle tubes and pumpkin, the front mounts the motor, so It would not be very easy to seperate.
[This message has been edited by gen2muchwork (edited 01-25-2018).]
Lucas. The prince of darkness. If you've ever had an older British vehicle, you'll know exactly what I'm talking about.
Comparing it to an american car of a similar year, the electronics are terrible. even the turn signal switch uses open contacts. Nothing at all protecting any of the assembly besides the steering column cover. If it had a contact, its out in the open and corroded. It's a process of cleaning I will be repeating throughout the life of this vehicle. Sooner or later I'll want to replace that darn turn signal stalk because it does not return after a turn like it should. For some reason those poorly designed stalks are not an inexpensive part, no matter how cheap they make it. There is not an insulated spade connector anywhere, although some of the lighting uses insulated bullet connectors that make a bad connection, and while prevent direct shorts, have no weatherproofing at all. Would I buy a british car after this experience? you bet! But I'd assume wiring updates and engine swaps.
Now, I'm working on the Parking brake. Another interesting design. It uses a pull handle under the wheel, similar to some other vintage cars. the cables are a little sticky, but again with the poor design. Every cable pulls at a funny angle. not one pulls straight. The only springs that retract the cable are the shoe springs. essentially, when brakes are adjusted the cable has to pull less than an inch to engage the brake. with no return springs, that leaves my cable all floppy. When I pull the lever, It's all like 2" of nothing then 1/2" of yank as hard as you can. I could see how the handle could brake on this system. Maybe I'm missing something somewhere spring wise. Sometimes I wish I had worked in the maintenance shed at the golf course instead of caddying as a kid. I'd have a better grasp of golf cart brakes. From what I can tell this is very similar to a cushman truckster front brake system on all 4 wheels.
The important thing to consider with the parking brake, is that I have reverse drive and neutral. No park. Without it when the wind blows the car moves. There is no leaving it in gear, no engine compression. So it is more important than any parking brake I have ever had. Also, a dragging brake is worse in this than normal, I have 6hp and limited power. Dragging brake might make me lose top speed, or range, or worse overheat my motor. Not so big a deal on a more powerful gas powered car, but a big deal here. There must have been a spring somewhere along the line. The smart place would be at the end of the line at the brake actuator lever on the drum. It has two holes, one for the cable, one for? So maybe I can rig something, I have a big box of odd brake springs I saved throughout the years. I see many of the golf cart brake cables have an integrated spring along the cable. I can't add that, but maybe the whole rear cables could be substituted. 2 options to consider there. I'll figure something out.
Another thing to note. If you have good eyes you may notice that my rear pass. leaf spring has 2 leaves, but the drivers has only one. Not sure what happened there, but I doubt it was intended to be that way. For fun, there is no bump stop so if one was to break... the wheelwell/tire is the bump stop. not the best.
[This message has been edited by gen2muchwork (edited 01-26-2018).]
Not sure I would announce that to the world, especially if you ever plan on another date.
lol
So, I got side tracked repairing a valve body on my wifes new edge which was successful, but I didnt get far on citicar.
Here is the pass. front brake assembly.
I need to order shoes. these ones are no good for front brakes.
You might notice the brake spider up front comes off easy compared to the back, but... It is slightly different! The bore in the center is larger. This part is not available so If I cant hone them, I have to replace with a rear, then machine it. Yikes. This side looks pretty good, the boots are still there.
On a side note... The Edge, On the paperwork in the glove box. Look at this guys name!
My wife texted me yesterday to let me know my brake feet came in. lol.
So, now I have new SHOES on the front, and have rebuilt the wheel cylinders. The drivers side was pitted up kinda bad. I'll find out soon if I had to hone it too much... It cleaned up, but took more honing than I would have liked.
Next.... master cylinder and bleed.
After that? Idk I think it should be ready to roll at that point. I cant do any body work until it warms up a little, and I have a few cracks to continue fixing but should be ok to drive in the dry weather. Electric car plus water leaks could present a problem.
At this point in the build, I'm doing the sad thing. It happens an all my stuff as I near completion, I get sort of sad-happy when the project nears completion and I realize I don't have much longer to spend all night messing around. I'll get over it when I start driving it, and bbq, beer, car show season starts.
Batteries are expensive. I'm plated and insured now. Had to replace the brake light switch
It fits some 50's Chryslers and Fords. Hydraulic pressure brake light switch. I can step on the pedal standing next to the car and see the brake lights it's so short lol
I could be called a teacher of many things, but I'm an operating engineer at my job. Boilers, air handlers, taking pictures of citicar when retrieving footballs on the roof.
Well, nearly 100 miles of citicar. Now I have an idea of the things that just need to be better. My charger takes too much attention. Its a simple lester with a timer and its time consuming to ensure its not over or undercharging. Enter the Delta Q Quiq charger. Not a cheap charger, built for onboard use, fully programmable hi frequency charger. It should arrive today, I'm excited. Should provide a plug it in and walk away type deal for me.
Next on the list is a modern speed control. I really think the contactors are cool, but terrible. No matter what I'm going to destroy the contacts. The micro switches for the gas pedal have proven to be somewhat unreliable, and having only 3 positions of throttle are kind of a pain, and inefficient. I'm going to order a ching chang copy of a curtis 500a, and a pb-6 throttle to provide the go. My service manual states that all the contactors should be replaced with a solid state controller. Turns out that is solid advice. My F/R contactor should still handle the job with that.
Aux battery. Once I mount the charger, I have room for a 12v aux battery to run the lights/controls. I'm getting an imbalance in cells from running a 12v tap of my battery pack. to me, it makes more sense than running a buck convertor off the traction pack. As is, at full throttle accelerating, I don't have much for lighting or stereo until I'm up to speed. Those headlights dim right out.
Heat. No heat. I might hack up a 12v electric heater somehow. Not having a defroster is not all that great. Don't breathe out of your mouth when its cold or rainy or you can't see. Technically, there is a duct from the motor to the cabin and windshield, but the motor has to be hot to get anything useful out, and my ducting is not so great either.
Everywhere I park I return to a group of people surrounding it waiting to find out what it is. It seems to make people happy when they see it, and that's been fun.
I know right!? I really thought I'd be able to live with the contactors, but jeez are they stupid. If middle speed would just be 25 instead of 20, It wouldn't be so annoying. Its like a constant faster-slower-faster-slower. With the lights on, its like dim-bright-dim-bright. Good news is the future has cheap solid state speed control. It hurts the nostalgia effect, but enjoying the ride helps keep it alive.
I've got new charger installed. Its great! I think I gained a mph from the weight savings, and more room for passenger feet. I now have room to mount an aux battery to separate the 12v side from the traction pack.
I'll be ordering that speed control shortly.
[This message has been edited by gen2muchwork (edited 03-12-2018).]
Next on the list is a modern speed control. The micro switches for the gas pedal have proven to be somewhat unreliable, and having only 3 positions of throttle are kind of a pain, and inefficient.
I really thought I'd be able to live with the contactors, but jeez are they stupid. If middle speed would just be 25 instead of 20, It wouldn't be so annoying. Its like a constant faster-slower-faster-slower.
This reminds me of the "gas" pedal on an at least 50 year old electric forklift I used at a job I had long ago. i didn't like the fact that there was a relatively sudden jump in speed when the pedal was pushed a bit further. It was not something that you wanted to happen if you had a heavy load on the forklift that was raised high overhead.
This reminds me of the "gas" pedal on an at least 50 year old electric forklift I used at a job I had long ago. i didn't like the fact that there was a relatively sudden jump in speed when the pedal was pushed a bit further. It was not something that you wanted to happen if you had a heavy load on the forklift that was raised high overhead.
The contactors used on the citicar are the same as a raymond forklift (and probably others). I can't imagine having a high heavy load switching between speeds. The speed control I will use is also used on modern forklifts as well as golf carts.
I mounted the 9th battery last night. Its a smaller 12v agm deep cycle to run all of the accessories. It resides way up front, and being agm won't spill on anyone's feet. It has a separate 12v 3 stage on board charger that runs alongside the delta-q. It has it's own volt gauge in the dash, as well as an amp gauge. I'll come up with some pictures of it tonight maybe.
I still have a few little things to address The steering box seems to have a plug for fluid. I wonder what goes in there? Turn signals stink. the stalk does not cancel, and worse occasionally just turns on one randomly. It's a lucas model and can be replaced for a price. I'm not looking forward to getting the wheel off to find out what's the deal. Along with the turns, the horn doesn't work. It too is part of the turn signal stalk. Over the years the horn was changed from the 18v to 12v circuit and back to the 18v circuit, and from the floor to the stalk. placement does not necessarily dictate voltage. I have not even figured out what mine is wired to yet. Maybe nothing? The reverse light only works with the pedal pressed. It's designed that way. I don't like that. My buddy from the big audio company has something coming my way for speakers. I don't know what yet, but he always sends me something cool! He did not like my suggestion to mount speakers facing forward under the seat, or speaker seats like the fiero. Currently it has one 4.25 pointed down under the dash at the passenger feet. Curtis controller and pot box upgrade. It's nearing temps I can start to work on the body again. I keep looking at manual sliding ragtops. I need to redo the landau style top it has, and I keep thinking why shouldn't this be a convertible. something compact pickup size fits just right...
I have not used gas in a week. I'm not sure I've done that since I was 15.
I did watch my window fly away yesterday. It was cut from plexi, too short not an original part. It was pretty foggy, it fit poorly, almost lost it a few times, and knew I needed to replace it anyways so I'm not terribly upset about it. But jeez its cold with no heat and no window.
I've cut plex before, but not without a few tries. I always end up cracking it, till I get lucky. Any tips on cutting plexi?
Originally posted by Tony Kania: Tape up the cut. Draw your lines on the tape. Circular saw with a fine blade. Light propane torch to seal the edges.
Youtube it and you will see.
I think I used a jigsaw last time that was giving me problems. This has nice straight cuts, so I'll try the circular saw. I'll have to get a nice fine blade and see how it goes. The last time I cut any I was in high school, circa 1993, with an 86 mustang. Those GTS tinted head light covers were all the rage, and I was broke so I made some with the tinted plexi, and vacuum hose cut for the edges. Turned out nice after a couple tries, really took the eyes away from the large rust holes.
Welcome back Tony.
[This message has been edited by gen2muchwork (edited 03-22-2018).]
I want the name and address of the engineer that designed that wiring. 
