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3800 Turbo..what trans? by mattwa
Started on: 08-19-2013 01:17 AM
Replies: 20 (785 views)
Last post by: mattwa on 09-11-2013 12:42 AM
mattwa
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Report this Post08-19-2013 01:17 AM Click Here to See the Profile for mattwaClick Here to Email mattwaSend a Private Message to mattwaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I'm in the middle of building my own 3800 turbo right now (I'll make a build thread later when I'm further into the build), problem is I just can't decide what transmission I want to use, 4t65e-HD or F23. They both have their pros and cons of course, but I'm still not sure what route I want to take. I don't have any transmissions in my possession yet, I haven't bought anything for the engine yet that deals with what trans I would pick, so it's pretty neutral right now. My Fiero is currently setup for an Auto, however I have most everything already to change over to a manual and my fiero doesn't have the auto trans lines anymore (just removed them, they leaked).

I understand most of this decision is based on personal preference, however I'm looking to see if anyone has suggestions or experience as to which setup works best.

Thanks
Matt
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Report this Post08-19-2013 01:38 AM Click Here to See the Profile for MstangsBwareClick Here to Email MstangsBwareSend a Private Message to MstangsBwareEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Keep it simple easy and use the auto trans...Nothing special to make it work and its plug/play..
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Report this Post08-19-2013 07:42 AM Click Here to See the Profile for sco77Click Here to Email sco77Send a Private Message to sco77Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
It's just going to depend on your goals and what you prefer.. If it's for drag racing then an auto would probably give you the best results. Manuals are usually funner in the curves.

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Report this Post08-19-2013 11:09 AM Click Here to See the Profile for SteelSend a Private Message to SteelEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I'd say build a 4t65E-HD.. I have both a manual and auto trans 3800 turbo swaps and while the manual puts more down more because of less drivetrain loss, I lose a lot of time shifting and have had constant issues with my clutch/pressure plates.

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Report this Post08-19-2013 11:18 AM Click Here to See the Profile for JustinbartSend a Private Message to JustinbartEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Depends on what you want to do with the car.

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Turbo 3800 E85 F23 5spd spec5
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BV MotorSports
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Report this Post08-19-2013 01:32 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BV MotorSportsClick Here to Email BV MotorSportsSend a Private Message to BV MotorSportsEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Have you seen how the 3800t Fiero DH and Justin built launches? I highly suggest a 4t65hd.
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darkhorizon
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Report this Post08-19-2013 09:55 PM Click Here to See the Profile for darkhorizonSend a Private Message to darkhorizonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
autos work just fine in "curves".
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mattwa
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Report this Post08-20-2013 04:16 AM Click Here to See the Profile for mattwaClick Here to Email mattwaSend a Private Message to mattwaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Yes, one of my concerns about the manual part was having issues with clutches not holding up or ending up with a very harsh engagement. Another important issue was the fact that the gearing is just flat out wrong in the F23 for this power level, It's geared way too low, even if you use the FY1 ratio (3.63 compared to 3.94).

The only thing holding me back on the auto right now is the cost, It's going to be around $3000 or so for a built one from ZZP (including upgrades and their TC), and I certainly do not want to go cheap with a "junkyard" 4T65e-HD, considering how much power it's going to have to take.
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nitroheadz28
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Report this Post08-20-2013 12:16 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nitroheadz28Send a Private Message to nitroheadz28Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by mattwa:

Another important issue was the fact that the gearing is just flat out wrong in the F23 for this power level, It's geared way too low, even if you use the FY1 ratio (3.63 compared to 3.94).



Thats what I was going to say since you mentioned that a while back. Do you really have to go all out with the trans? I mean I don't know what kind of power you're shooting for, but couldn't you get by for a while on a 1" chain and an input shaft?
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mattwa
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Report this Post08-20-2013 01:47 PM Click Here to See the Profile for mattwaClick Here to Email mattwaSend a Private Message to mattwaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by nitroheadz28:


Thats what I was going to say since you mentioned that a while back. Do you really have to go all out with the trans? I mean I don't know what kind of power you're shooting for, but couldn't you get by for a while on a 1" chain and an input shaft?


Actually the price I stated isn't even including a 1" chain, that would be an extra $1000 right there (no thanks). I don't have a trans right now, so even if I buy a used one with low miles, it still would need to be taken apart to have those parts installed, so why not do a full rebuild at the same time and get it over with? I don't exactly want to get this setup going and then have to drop it again soon after and replace the trans if I don't have too.

I plan to start out slower, get used to handling my car safely, and work my way up to at least 500WHP (simply by cranking up the boost. )

[This message has been edited by mattwa (edited 08-20-2013).]

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darkhorizon
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Report this Post08-20-2013 03:04 PM Click Here to See the Profile for darkhorizonSend a Private Message to darkhorizonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
My junkyard trans held up in the VERY low 11 second range for basicaly eternity.
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Report this Post08-20-2013 06:12 PM Click Here to See the Profile for FormulaSend a Private Message to FormulaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by mattwa:


Actually the price I stated isn't even including a 1" chain, that would be an extra $1000 right there (no thanks). I don't have a trans right now, so even if I buy a used one with low miles, it still would need to be taken apart to have those parts installed, so why not do a full rebuild at the same time and get it over with? I don't exactly want to get this setup going and then have to drop it again soon after and replace the trans if I don't have too.

I plan to start out slower, get used to handling my car safely, and work my way up to at least 500WHP (simply by cranking up the boost. )


I thought the same thing. Then I turned it up and I'm not going back
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nosrac
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Report this Post08-20-2013 06:41 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nosracSend a Private Message to nosracEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by mattwa:

I plan to start out slower, get used to handling my car safely, and work my way up to at least 500WHP (simply by cranking up the boost. )



LOL...that will last a week.

Also, I have a stock 3800 trans on my turdbo and it hasn't broke yet.
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Report this Post08-20-2013 08:25 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JncomuttClick Here to Email JncomuttSend a Private Message to JncomuttEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
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Report this Post08-20-2013 09:10 PM Click Here to See the Profile for 86soon3.4Send a Private Message to 86soon3.4Edit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Call here: http://www.strykertransmission.com/


He's building a 4t65e-hd for a 383 chevy swap for a fellow club member.
He is offering to warranty it also.

The 383 is around 500 HP. (I'm told)


Steve
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mattwa
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Report this Post08-21-2013 03:13 AM Click Here to See the Profile for mattwaClick Here to Email mattwaSend a Private Message to mattwaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by darkhorizon:

My junkyard trans held up in the VERY low 11 second range for basicaly eternity.


Wasn't that with some extreme torque management during shifts?

Yea, a week sounds about right once I get it going. Haha.

The 4T80 is a big heavy monster I'd rather not use, but has anyone figured out how to make it work with the 3800 PCM? And what about axles?
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Report this Post08-21-2013 09:30 AM Click Here to See the Profile for RallasterSend a Private Message to RallasterEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
What about looking at the 6T-series? I hear there's been some pretty serious work done on compatibility with those transmissions and they're built pretty solid as well.

Edit to add link to construction zone thread: //www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum3/HTML/000136.html

[This message has been edited by Rallaster (edited 08-21-2013).]

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darkhorizon
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Report this Post08-21-2013 10:14 AM Click Here to See the Profile for darkhorizonSend a Private Message to darkhorizonEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by mattwa:


Wasn't that with some extreme torque management during shifts?

Yea, a week sounds about right once I get it going. Haha.

The 4T80 is a big heavy monster I'd rather not use, but has anyone figured out how to make it work with the 3800 PCM? And what about axles?


Quite a bit, but it was functional. Im not suggesting it really, just saying it is an option to get a taste of things while you save up... Reality is if you spend even $1500 on a trans, its going to double the investment into the car vs having a running driving stock transmission turbo fiero.
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mattwa
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Report this Post08-22-2013 04:56 AM Click Here to See the Profile for mattwaClick Here to Email mattwaSend a Private Message to mattwaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
I just looked into the 6T7x series, and that is something I just don't want to get into at this time. I'm happy with the 4-speed, as it has a better overdrive and it doesn't have that insane 4.484 1st gear ratio..that's just nuts.

What about the 4T80e? It seems like a decent idea, my only issue with it is compatibility with the 3800 PCM. Other then that, it's super-beefy and already has a 1" chain. And I'm sure a hell of a lot cheaper then building a 4T65e-HD like I stated.

[This message has been edited by mattwa (edited 08-22-2013).]

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Report this Post08-22-2013 09:17 PM Click Here to See the Profile for JncomuttClick Here to Email JncomuttSend a Private Message to JncomuttEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Just need to change 1 solenoid.
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mattwa
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Report this Post09-11-2013 12:42 AM Click Here to See the Profile for mattwaClick Here to Email mattwaSend a Private Message to mattwaEdit/Delete MessageReply w/QuoteDirect Link to This Post
Just for the record, I decided to go ahead and use a 4T80e with my swap.
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