quote Originally posted by jaskispyder: Odd way of looking at it. He was using a drug that would increase his strength and endurance artificially, but yet could not be detected by current drug screenings. Sounds like he was cheating and knew it. It isn't like he was eating some fruit and didn't realize it had a positive result. He knew what he was doing was cheating, he denied it in court even. What if someone came up with a substance similar to cork, and put it into their bat. Would this be ok, since it isn't cork? Nope, because the substance mimics the benefits of cork. I guess Lance follows George Constanz's rule.... "is isn't a lie, if you believe it"...

The oddness is in your perception. I'm basically saying if the rules don't cover it, it shouldn't be against the rules.
Yes, he was cheating. If it's a substance the rules don't account for; however, then I don't think it's a big deal.

Now that is separate from the lying about it, libel cases, perjury, etc. Those are all civil and criminal issues that happen outside the actual sport.
Example, if a race team comes up with a type of oil that reduces friction in their engines enough to give them a performance advantage over other racers and it's not covered by the rules - it's legal. Of course, rules are written to ban or regulate it as soon as the tech inspectors find out. Stuff like that rarely gets to the level of legal proceedings. There's a long history in motor racing of having to change the rules to keep up with changing technology. I don't see why changing medical technology would be any different.

Bottom line - cheating at sports isn't, IMO, a "crimminal offense." It's not fair, nor honerable, but it's not an issue of "law."
All the court cases around it, those are issues of law.

I understand you won't agree with anything I post. I'm ok with that.

quote Originally posted by Formula88: Damn, if you're gonna put words in my mouth, wash them first. I specifically mentioned it in relation to sports. Do you equate capital crimes as the same as cheating in sports? Do you want to replace the penalty box in hockey with jail terms? Talk about hyperbole.

Time for you to dismantle the Lance Armstrong shrine in the corner of your room.

Now that Lance Armstrong has admitted that he's a cheat and a liar, more people will be able to reveal what they know about him without being afraid of being sued by Lance Armstrong's big budget legal team.

The only thing world class about Lance Armstrong is his arrogance.

No tears are being shed for this guy.

I have concern for what it says about a persons character, not just concern whether they get caught, or if it somehow hurts anyone else, or technically isnt against a rule, even just in sports.

With roids some people take stance side of, well if everyone is doing it then I dont see it as cheating. But even if you wanted to stretch it that far, they are cheating historical records, and cheating themselves out of knowing what they could accomplish naturally. With their own skill. Cheating fans, and cheating ametuers of the same sport.

[This message has been edited by 2.5 (edited 01-18-2013).]

It becomes a legal issue, when someone signs a contract for money (paid spokesman/professional), yet has intentions of committing "fraud" (if you will) by cheating/bending the rules.

quote Originally posted by Formula88: The oddness is in your perception. I'm basically saying if the rules don't cover it, it shouldn't be against the rules. Yes, he was cheating. If it's a substance the rules don't account for; however, then I don't think it's a big deal. Now that is separate from the lying about it, libel cases, perjury, etc. Those are all civil and criminal issues that happen outside the actual sport. Example, if a race team comes up with a type of oil that reduces friction in their engines enough to give them a performance advantage over other racers and it's not covered by the rules - it's legal. Of course, rules are written to ban or regulate it as soon as the tech inspectors find out. Stuff like that rarely gets to the level of legal proceedings. There's a long history in motor racing of having to change the rules to keep up with changing technology. I don't see why changing medical technology would be any different. Bottom line - cheating at sports isn't, IMO, a "crimminal offense." It's not fair, nor honerable, but it's not an issue of "law." All the court cases around it, those are issues of law. I understand you won't agree with anything I post. I'm ok with that.

quote Originally posted by Patrick: Time for you to dismantle the Lance Armstrong shrine in the corner of your room.

I'd have to build one first. I really don't care one way or the other.
Carry on.

Reminds me of a guy that gets’ a speeding ticket and he is all pissed off that he is the one picket out of the line of cars. He offered 5 mil to the fends to settle and they turned him down. I think his troubles are just beginning.