Ok, well... everywhere I've worked, if I came back to work and they could tell that I had been drinking, or if they saw me have a beer (even just one) on my lunch break, I can pretty much assure you that I would either be warned, or fired.
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]: Ok, well... everywhere I've worked, if I came back to work and they could tell that I had been drinking, or if they saw me have a beer (even just one) on my lunch break, I can pretty much assure you that I would either be warned, or fired.
And like I said I have worked for a lot of companies where it was the norm.
On your time, your lunch at home, off the job you are allowed.
Steve
------------------ Technology is great when it works, and one big pain in the ass when it doesn't. Detroit iron rules all the rest are just toys.
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09:59 PM
D B Cooper Member
Posts: 3141 From: East Detroit, MI Registered: Jul 2005
I used to work at a place where the company president would go grab a case of brew on Friday afternoon and bring it back so everyone could have one or two in the last couple hours of the day. Of course that was a pretty small operation and we didn't really have any politics to deal with.
People on their lunch brake are allowed to have a beer are they not?
Steve
That line refers to the end of the day for the helo crews. Beer ration, being the lowest of all priorities, is left for last load--and often not at all. When they pass out the beer is up to the unit commander, but usually it was passed out to the off duty guys. If they were a rifle platoon, one squad was off while the other 2 squads were on watch or sweeps. Or, no beer at all. There were no "days off" while in actual combat. They fight awhile--weeks or months--then another unit comes in and relieves them all and the old unit comes off the hill and goes to the rear. That's usually where their accumulated 'unofficial' 2 beer/day ration is handed out. In the rear with beer so the saying goes.
For me, and those like me in aviation, I never saw a 2 beer/day ration issued out. Twice in 13 months, the entire squadron "stood down", meaning we had no flight ops that day--another squadron took our load. We assembled in a set off area, a truck rolled up pulling a little trailer with a tarp in the bottom. They filled it with beer cans and ice, brought out some burgers or even maybe steaks and we went at it. Next day, we resumed flight ops. Days off? I got there in late June 1970. I got 3 days "crew's rest in November, which consisted of 1 day flight to Korat Thailand--one day and night to do as I pleased, and the 3rd day was travel back to Marble Mountain Vietnam. In May, I took 7 days R&R in Taiwan. Took one day to ship my personal belongings back home right before I left Vietnam. Took one day to visit my brother right off our coast on his hospital ship--courtesy of my 1st Sgt taking my place on the door. So, in 13 months, I had 14 days off.
We did have a club, but I didn't go often--it was a frequent target for NVA mortars and rockets, as was our little medical facility with the big red cross on the roof. Besides, I flew almost everyday, and had a regular job to do as well, maintaining our ground support equipment, which I did at night. I usually just slept down at the squadron area on an old cot I drug down there.
I made e5 sgt while there and had a ration card, which entitled me to buy 2 bottles of booze/13 months and of course--cigs. I didn't smoke, but I often bought cigs and tossed them out at the firebases we resupplied, as those guys always needed them and rarely got any. There was never any booze at our little PX, but one day, in the middle of a raging typhoon, I went in there and there was 2 bottles of rotgut vodka. $3 ea and they was mine. Nothing was flying because of the weather, so I gave one to my best buddy, we went to the chowhall, and bummed a bit of ice and some orange bug juice (koolaid). Went back to our tentlike hooch that night, and we and 3 others drank till we passed out. That's the way it was and I had it a LOT easier than most GIs there--and I dang well knew it.
[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 09-23-2010).]
And like I said I have worked for a lot of companies where it was the norm.
On your time, your lunch at home, off the job you are allowed.
Steve
I have as well, and had high level management buying me, and the crew I worked with drinks. Lots of drinks, there were times we all decided to go to the motel, management and all because we would be no good the rest of the day.
I'm not a "drinker", but it didn't effect our job performance, and it was not hidden. Now, if television had got us on camera, and made a big stink about it we would have been fired, I understand that. A company has to protect it's public image.
Brad
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10:05 PM
84fiero123 Member
Posts: 29950 From: farmington, maine usa Registered: Oct 2004
I used to work at a place where the company president would go grab a case of brew on Friday afternoon and bring it back so everyone could have one or two in the last couple hours of the day. Of course that was a pretty small operation and we didn't really have any politics to deal with.
I had one that always bought everyone breakfast when we had to work Saturdays and at the end of the day there was a beer in the fridge for each of us. Never more than one each but it was always there.
quote
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]: Ok, well... everywhere I've worked, if I came back to work and they could tell that I had been drinking, or if they saw me have a beer (even just one) on my lunch break, I can pretty much assure you that I would either be warned, or fired.
Just guess don’t try to write a resume but just how many jobs have you had with different companies?
See I know I have been at, at least 30 how about you?
Steve
------------------ Technology is great when it works, and one big pain in the ass when it doesn't. Detroit iron rules all the rest are just toys.
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10:07 PM
D B Cooper Member
Posts: 3141 From: East Detroit, MI Registered: Jul 2005
And like I said I have worked for a lot of companies where it was the norm.
On your time, your lunch at home, off the job you are allowed.
Steve
Must have been union. Every employer I've ever worked for had a standing policy that you're history if you drink on the job or show up to work under the influence (including just beer on your breath). That means no alcohol at lunch, even though it's your own time.
People who broke the rules and got caught were canned.
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10:20 PM
PFF
System Bot
82-T/A [At Work] Member
Posts: 22893 From: Florida USA Registered: Aug 2002
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]: Well, if you include Mc.Donalds, probably about 8. But you're also a gazillion years older than me... and that was "back in the day."
Not that I wouldn't love a beer in the middle of the work day... but I just don't think that's very common anymore.
I can see it being acceptable in a small business... but any company with an HR department probably wouldn't allow that.
Well, I'm older than Steve, and I've had 11--thirteen if ya count USMC-USN. full time only: Brown & Root one summer before I left home. The Anchor Bar & Lounge Pernie Bailey drilling Co. Waters Oilfield services. WWW-a Kamatsu dealer Empire land and gas drilling. Francis Drilling Fluids. J&K Machine Universal Fixtures Allied tractor and equipment Jane's slavedriving INC
Had a few part time jobs when the kids were still at home and I needed extra $.
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10:41 PM
84fiero123 Member
Posts: 29950 From: farmington, maine usa Registered: Oct 2004
Must have been union. Every employer I've ever worked for had a standing policy that you're history if you drink on the job or show up to work under the influence (including just beer on your breath). That means no alcohol at lunch, even though it's your own time.
People who broke the rules and got caught were canned.
No it was non union, smal fab shop in TN.
steve
------------------ Technology is great when it works, and one big pain in the ass when it doesn't. Detroit iron rules all the rest are just toys.
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10:42 PM
Wichita Member
Posts: 20658 From: Wichita, Kansas Registered: Jun 2002
Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]: Well, if you include Mc.Donalds, probably about 8. But you're also a gazillion years older than me... and that was "back in the day."
Not that I wouldn't love a beer in the middle of the work day... but I just don't think that's very common anymore.
I can see it being acceptable in a small business... but any company with an HR department probably wouldn't allow that.
It's a different and more professional world now. Union slobs can't get themselves out of the trailer parks and the 1960's. I can't believe anybody would support anybody having a beer for lunch when working....oops,sorry, forgot union slobs....sitting on the job next to machinery and assembled a car that can carry a family to their deaths from shody union slobiness.
Sure, do I remember a time when people smoked everywhere? Sure, I remember they had ash trays at the end of every aisle at grocery stores. That doesn't exist anymore. The world has changed and no smoking dope period and no drinking on the job (lunch/breaks included).
[This message has been edited by Wichita (edited 09-23-2010).]
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10:46 PM
84fiero123 Member
Posts: 29950 From: farmington, maine usa Registered: Oct 2004
Well, I'm older than Steve, and I've had 11--thirteen if ya count USMC-USN. full time only: Brown & Root one summer before I left home. The Anchor Bar & Lounge Pernie Bailey drilling Co. Waters Oilfield services. WWW-a Kamatsu dealer Empire land and gas drilling. Francis Drilling Fluids. J&K Machine Universal Fixtures Allied tractor and equipment Jane's slavedriving INC
Had a few part time jobs when the kids were still at home and I needed extra $.
Working independent construction like I did Don I worked for a lot of companies. Shutdown in paper mills for 3 or 4 different companies was not out of the ordinary. One job was done I would drag out and only have to go as far as the next company on the same site on a different project and keep working.
The point is not every company is so against you having a drink at lunch or the end of a shift while still on the clock.
You who think it is so taboo are not that wrong but you are not right ether.
A lot of small companies and some of the larger ones it was not an automatic fire. Especially if you were at lunch with the managers or owners.
Steve
------------------ Technology is great when it works, and one big pain in the ass when it doesn't. Detroit iron rules all the rest are just toys.
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10:53 PM
MidEngineManiac Member
Posts: 29566 From: Some unacceptable view Registered: Feb 2007
I've worked for about 10 (including part-time stuff just for fun) and around aircraft..then NO, it was absoloutley off limits (as was morning hangovers)...but that is just saftey and common sense.
Since switching to the tech field, seriously, every company it has been no-big-deal. Not sayin go have a 6-drink lunch and come back to work, but nobody thinks twice about a beer with a burger or glass of wine with a steak, and those companies that did the "friday meeting" it was invariably over a pint or 2 outside the office.
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10:59 PM
84fiero123 Member
Posts: 29950 From: farmington, maine usa Registered: Oct 2004
It's a different and more professional world now. Union slobs can't get themselves out of the trailer parks and the 1960's. I can't believe anybody would support anybody having a beer for lunch when working....oops,sorry, forgot union slobs....sitting on the job next to machinery and assembled a car that can carry a family to their deaths from shody union slobiness.
Sure, do I remember a time when people smoked everywhere? Sure, I remember they had ash trays at the end of every aisle at grocery stores. That doesn't exist anymore. The world has changed and no smoking dope period and no drinking on the job (lunch/breaks included).
You know not every union worker is what you portray them as and I for one am getting tired of you calling them slobs. that’s like saying every Fiero owner is a racer.
As I have said what you do on your own time off the clock and off company property is your business.
Tell me you have never had a beer at lunch or on the way home at a bar?
Yet you still made it home without killing a family with your car didn’t you? Or did you?
Steve
------------------ Technology is great when it works, and one big pain in the ass when it doesn't. Detroit iron rules all the rest are just toys.
[This message has been edited by 84fiero123 (edited 09-23-2010).]
Whether any of us is right or wrong is irelevant. Only thing that matters is the company policy where those in the video worked. They pay the wages, so it's their way or the highway.
[This message has been edited by maryjane (edited 09-23-2010).]
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11:01 PM
aceman Member
Posts: 4899 From: Brooklyn Center, MN Registered: Feb 2003
Lets see one beer is out of your system in under an hour and you have a half hour lunch. You yourself said you could have a beer an hour on the job. A joint is about the same as far as how long it will affect you maybe less.
Now getting sh!t faced and staggering into work is a no no. this was a few people out of thousands. And you have no idea what their jobs were or how important they were to safety.
For all we know they could be installing carpets. Or maintenance workers or any number of the thousand different jobs in that plant.
Steve
------------------ Technology is great when it works, and one big pain in the ass when it doesn't. Detroit iron rules all the rest are just toys.
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11:21 PM
PFF
System Bot
aceman Member
Posts: 4899 From: Brooklyn Center, MN Registered: Feb 2003
Steve, I was managing a bar and restaurant! My job was to get the guests to spend money in the bar. My job was not to operate heavy machinery. Those UAW Union Monkeys weren't drinking a 12ounce wine cooler. They were drinking a 40 ounce malt liquor (or 2). That's 3-6+ beers over a half hour. They were drinking hard liquor. They were getting high off of weed. And then they went back to work on heavy machinery.
It is against company policy.
WHAT PART DON'T YOU GET??????????????????????????
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11:37 PM
Marvin McInnis Member
Posts: 11599 From: ~ Kansas City, USA Registered: Apr 2002
... just how many jobs have you had with different companies?
See I know I have been at, at least 30 how about you?
Holy red flag, Batman!!! I wouldn't touch someone with a job history like that no matter how good the rest of his resume was. Most HR departments wouldn't either.
[This message has been edited by Marvin McInnis (edited 09-24-2010).]
Steve, I was managing a bar and restaurant! My job was to get the guests to spend money in the bar. My job was not to operate heavy machinery. Those UAW Union Monkeys weren't drinking a 12ounce wine cooler. They were drinking a 40 ounce malt liquor (or 2). That's 3-6+ beers over a half hour. They were drinking hard liquor. They were getting high off of weed. And then they went back to work on heavy machinery.
It is against company policy.
WHAT PART DON'T YOU GET??????????????????????????
Not trying to speak for anyone but I think we can all agree what the people in the OP did was wrong. We seem to have gotten off on a "is it acceptable to have A beer at lunch"
[This message has been edited by newf (edited 09-24-2010).]
Well, AFAIK, that IS the issue Newf. If they were on lunch break, those employees will likely claim exactly what Steve is claiming--that they should be able to keep their jobs because they were at lunch.
If that's not what happened, then it happend while they were on the clock?
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03:21 AM
Wichita Member
Posts: 20658 From: Wichita, Kansas Registered: Jun 2002
Originally posted by 84fiero123: You know not every union worker is what you portray them as and I for one am getting tired of you calling them slobs. that’s like saying every Fiero owner is a racer.
As I have said what you do on your own time off the clock and off company property is your business.
Tell me you have never had a beer at lunch or on the way home at a bar?
Yet you still made it home without killing a family with your car didn’t you? Or did you?
Steve
To answer your questions, Yes not all union workers. And about drinking? No!
Obviously those that think this is ok have never had a pallet of loose sheet metal moved over your head. Poor judgment starts when the liquid lunch stops. (Or pot depending on who it is)
**400 pounds of sliding knives is not the way to end the work day. Lucky for me there was a post in the way. Nothing was said but you bet your ass I said something to him after work.
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05:32 AM
82-T/A [At Work] Member
Posts: 22893 From: Florida USA Registered: Aug 2002
Sure, do I remember a time when people smoked everywhere? Sure, I remember they had ash trays at the end of every aisle at grocery stores. That doesn't exist anymore. The world has changed and no smoking dope period and no drinking on the job (lunch/breaks included).
I remember when I was a kid, my grandfather's 1989 Crown Victoria had an ash tray for EVERY SINGLE SEAT!!!
There was a MASSIVE one for the front bench seat, you could fit an entire wallet in it.
And then there was a seperate ash tray AND cigarette lighter in BOTH DOORS of the back seat. Can you believe that... a cigarette lighter in each door!!! hahah...
Now that I think about it... my 2002 Crown Victoria has an ash tray in each of the rear doors too... but no cigarette lighter.
Our Fieros have two massive ash trays in the center console so two people can chain-smoke together.
Like I and others have said, what you do on your own time is your business not the company you work for. Unless you are impaired at the job.
quote
Originally posted by Marvin McInnis: Holy red flag, Batman!!! I wouldn't touch someone with a job history like that no matter how good the rest of his resume was. Most HR departments wouldn't either.
Oh ya what is an HR department? I'm a welder, not a paper pusher.
Marvin working construction as I did it is not unusual to have 3 or 4 different jobs at 3 or 4 different companies in one season. Or like I said at one jobsite. Remember I said at a paper mill shutdown. There are lots of companies, it is never just one company. For various reasons. One company may have underbid another for one job but lost the bid for another.
Or one company does not have the trained employees to blow the inside coating off of a smoke stack. And when they do it then they find they need other tradesmen for what ever reason.
In the construction field it was not unusual to talk to one guy who was dragging out in the morning after working a while and he would say, “Hey the Bourne Bridge on the Cape needs welders and they are paying $33 an hour plus perdeum (SP) of $50 a day“.
They give you the number to the head hunter and give them a call. He says fax me your resume and certs. Next day I am dragging my box out. Because $33 an hour + and a six month job is better than $16 an hour and just a 2 week job. Isn’t it?
In the construction industry that is normal.
Again having a beer on your own time is your business, not the companies, unless it impairs you at the job. Most people can handle a beer an hour without any noticeable impairment. Others can handle 2 or 3 without any impairment. And even still pass breathalyzer tests for driving. Me now I can’t hand one without getting a buzz, haven’t drunk in 20+ years. But when I was drinking 2 or 3 wouldn’t even faze me. Hell I could and had passed roadside sobriety tests after a six pack.
So different people handle alcohol differently.
A alcoholic generally can handle more than a tea totaler. Just as a junky builds up a tolerance to his drug of choice so does a drinker.
Steve
------------------ Technology is great when it works, and one big pain in the ass when it doesn't. Detroit iron rules all the rest are just toys.
[This message has been edited by 84fiero123 (edited 09-24-2010).]
.....The union's Corporation's PRIMARY goal is to make money. The SECOND goal is to take care of their own employees Board of Directors/Management/shareholders. The THIRD goal is to take care of the workers who pay them dues create the product which funds their salaries/the income to investors by way of interest on investments/shares.
I mean... this is all fact. You can argue whether it works or not, but these are facts.
??? No matter HOW much you tend the pretty flowers on a plant, and lavish love, affection and attention...ignore the roots at your peril. TWO valid sides to every coin, I am sure we all agree. Ignore the OPPOSITE side, and it WILL be used against your argument, with the SAME validity as YOUR side There needs to be equal control exerted on BOTH sides Todd...and fairly executed. The control being exerted currently is 99% against one side, and 1% the other DO I need to say how that distribution of control is being administered at the moment ?
[This message has been edited by fierofetish (edited 09-24-2010).]
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09:29 AM
aceman Member
Posts: 4899 From: Brooklyn Center, MN Registered: Feb 2003
In the video, the company stated it was against thier policy/rules AND the union stated it was against thier policy and rules. NO DRINKING. So, what they did on thier "own time" carried over to violating the company rules that they union agreed to abide by. NO DRINKING.
Now if you want to debate the "tolerance levels" and all that bullshit... ONE drink will impair ANYONE. I've debated and won this arguement with many drunks and alcoholics in my 15 years as an Alcohol and Drug Abuse Program Coordinator.
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09:34 AM
PFF
System Bot
partfiero Member
Posts: 6923 From: Tucson, Arizona Registered: Jan 2002
It's about time! The problem has been well known by both the companies and the UAW for decades.
I had a 77 El Camino built in the Fremont CA plant. Went to the yard and found a nice set of swivel bucket seats from the same car to replace the ones it came with. Threw the old ones in the dumpster at work. Went to put the passenger side in and discovered they had installed one stud in the floor about 1" from where it should have been. Went dumpster diving to recover that custom built seat track, sure the dealer wouldn't be able to locate another one for me. Sometime later was renting an apartment to a guy and he said he had worked the 3rd shift there during the time my car was built. He said virtually everyone on that shift, including the supers would smoke pot all night long. This crap has been going on for at least 35 years. As CA blows, so blows the nation!
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10:04 AM
Pyrthian Member
Posts: 29569 From: Detroit, MI Registered: Jul 2002
lol - go to ANY Applesbees, TGIF, Chili's, etc., during lunchtime, and you WILL see people from ALL types & occupations drinking during their lunch hour, and returning to work. and, for even more fun - you'll find a few at the strip club drinking & more, during their lunch hour.
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10:15 AM
partfiero Member
Posts: 6923 From: Tucson, Arizona Registered: Jan 2002
lol - go to ANY Applesbees, TGIF, Chili's, etc., during lunchtime, and you WILL see people from ALL types & occupations drinking during their lunch hour, and returning to work. and, for even more fun - you'll find a few at the strip club drinking & more, during their lunch hour.
I used to do that once in a while! But that was when I owned a company, not working for one. So every one is raping and robbing sure makes it OK for the rest of us to do it?
I worked at Ford Motor Company some 15 or so years ago. We worked from 11pm til 7am pulling parts and loading them on the trailers so they would go out first thing in the morning. We had a quota of how many orders/parts needed to be done an hour. Since it was Union, that number was very low and very easy to do. A lot of people would run for an hour and do 4 hours worth of work (quota wise) then go hide for 3 hours or sleep somewhere. If you actually decided to work the whole time and therefore go way over quota you could cause problems with the others because your messing up the numbers.
Lunch usually was around 3-4am. There were so many workers that drank alcohol on their lunch hour that the store owner came to the store and opened up the back entrance solely for them.
You could get drunk and pass out in a box up on a top shelf somewhere out of sight. You would have met your quota hours before so you had nothing really to worry about. (except for a forklift driver coming and moving the box you were passed out in and not knowing you were there)
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10:57 AM
84fiero123 Member
Posts: 29950 From: farmington, maine usa Registered: Oct 2004
I used to do that once in a while! But that was when I owned a company, not working for one.
Not everyone the article says it was a dozen that they followed.
quote
Originally posted by jaskispyder:
Garberding told the station a few workers were suspended indefinitely without pay pending further investigation. He did not say how many.
"For us, this behavior is totally unacceptable and will be dealt with swiftly," he said. "What's difficult about this is these few people who exhibited bad behavior have painted a bad picture of what's an outstanding assembly plant filled with outstanding and committed Chrysler employees."
WJBK said it received a tip from a plant worker and followed about a dozen men for 10 days this month during their late morning, half-hour lunch break. It filmed them going to a convenience store to buy alcohol and taking it to a nearby park to drink and smoke.
The United Auto Workers said in a statement to the station that it strongly opposes the use of alcohol or controlled substances on the job.
"The employees involved in this situation do not represent the vast majority of workers at Chrysler who do a great job making high quality vehicles in some of the most productive manufacturing facilities in the United States," the union said.
I like the holeyer than tho here who say no one should ever have a drink unless they own the company. One drink does not affect everyone the same way Ace. Tolerances are built up, heavier people have higher tolerances. Like I said when I drank heavily a six pack had little if any affect on me and I had passed many a field sobriety test. Now if that six pack was drunk in 5 minutes it had a different affect than if it had been drunk in 2 hours. Can we at least agree on that Ace? Steve
------------------ Technology is great when it works, and one big pain in the ass when it doesn't. Detroit iron rules all the rest are just toys.
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11:01 AM
aceman Member
Posts: 4899 From: Brooklyn Center, MN Registered: Feb 2003
I like the holeyer than tho here who say no one should ever have a drink unless they own the company. One drink does not affect everyone the same way Ace. Tolerances are built up, heavier people have higher tolerances. Like I said when I drank heavily a six pack had little if any affect on me and I had passed many a field sobriety test. Now if that six pack was drunk in 5 minutes it had a different affect than if it had been drunk in 2 hours. Can we at least agree on that Ace? Steve
I'd show you scientifically based facts to show you that you were wrong, but, it'd do no good.
I have a high tolerance to percocet. I may think that I am not impaired, but if you run tests to show my reaction time, it'd show that I'm impaired.
Keep arguing, Steve. Every time you present your arguement, this thought from another thread keeps popping into my mind:
Whenever someone says “I’m not book smart, but I’m street smart“, all I hear is “I’m not real smart, but I’m imaginary smart“.
[This message has been edited by aceman (edited 09-24-2010).]
Your company is responsible for your safety during working hours, that includes lunch. If you do something that will cause you to be injured on the job and involves worker's compensation, they usually will be paying for this. We had a work policy that said a drug test would be required immediately if someone was hurt on the job, before any workman's compensation claims would be honored. If you were injured and failed the drug test, you were fired and couldn't collect workman's comp. We also required that the employees did not leave the premises during work hours, to avoid them getting in accidents, robbed, etc. during work hours.
[This message has been edited by avengador1 (edited 09-24-2010).]
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11:10 AM
partfiero Member
Posts: 6923 From: Tucson, Arizona Registered: Jan 2002
I like the holeyer than tho here who say no one should ever have a drink unless they own the company.
Steve
Well I guess that something is against company policy for safety reasons, and you will get fired for doing it, so you choose not to is a holy than though attitude. What are you smoking?
