quote Originally posted by jstricker: No it's not assinine at all. Anyone that believes the claims he's making of his NET INCOME is simply not thinking through the numbers. $15k/mo is $180K per year that he claims is his NET INCOME. You tell me you believe someone with two sunglass kiosks is making $180K/year and I have some frigging beachfront property in Kansas to sell you. You've seen the kiosks, they basically sell junk. Designer knockoffs at cheap prices. at 100% markup on a $25 pair of glasses you figure out how many pairs he has to sell a day. AND pay his help. AND pay his rent to the mall. AND pay his taxes. AND pay his incoming freight. AND AND AND.............. Give me a break. I used to do business analysis for a living. I'm not saying he doesn't have them. I'm not even saying he's not making some money. But if you were making $180K/year, would you be driving used BMW family cars at 23 years old? Not on your life. Good luck to him, and I really mean that, but there's been plenty of BS spread around here for one thread and it's mostly been coming from Trevor. John Stricker Oh, and Trevor, I'll let my WIFE beat your Bimmer in the Riv. John Stricker

I have never even mentioned. my kiosks on this forum before, unless someone asked a business related question, so why would i bullshit about any of it?

my shipping is free from my suppliers. I pay 16-24 dollarsper dozen pair of sunglasses, i sell the sunglasses 12 dollars each or 2 for 20. I normaly always sell the 2-20 to most people.
my avrage cost is 1.67 per pair of sunglasses. all sunglasses returned to me broken or shipped to me broken, after reaching twelve are sent back "i pay postage" and i get sent a new dozen of my choice.

I do not have to pay employee's at one of my kiosks because I work it myself. with my girlfriend.
my rent at one kiosk is 1500. the other the rent is 500.
I pay 40 dollars each a month for insurance.
my business license for washington state was around 25 dollars.

for the oregon one it was 80 somthing. I don't have exact to the cent numbers my papers are in california. I am currently in lousiaiana opening my third kiosk.

on week days I avrage around 600-900 dollars. and my weekends make 1000-1200 my weeknds are considerd "friday and saturday"
during christmas time one mall goes 500 a month rent to 800 for novemember and december. the other goes from 1500 to 4000 each month

during novemember and december the leasind director allows us to change product from sunglasses to somthing else. depending on the year we switch to somthing called disc gear.
or knives and self defense items. cuttlery, martial arts wepons. and collectors swords. holiday seasons. themselves normaly net over 50 thousand.

i have no problem providing any proof asked of me. I am currently in louisiana. but in less then 20 days I will be back in california and can photocopy anything else.
i have no reason to lie about the amount of money i make. how much i make doesn't make me a better or worse person. its just what i do. and i honestly understated what i made. i am not a brager. but I do not appricate being called a lier for somthing

there are also a few people on this forum who know me personaly and can voutch that I am not lying and have no reason too .
amadeus_chavez is one of them. he has worked one of my kiosks for a day for me so i could run some erronds.

So I take it the discussion isn't going back to the Lexus?

This is really a funny thread to read, I totally agree with jstricker on what he is analyzing about Trevors BS. I dont believe one single thing about what he supposedly makes, as I own a business too and know what it cost for everything. I also agree that traction and stability control are nothing but a crutch, yes they can help for the everyday driver however what happens when it fails and the everyday driver is so used to it being there that they cant react without it. They are so used to slamming the brake and it not locking up and then all of the sudden they slam the break, enter into a non-controlled skid and cause a 4 car pile-up all because they were used to that crutch and then it was gone. I am one that loves cars and loves technology, but there is a point where they just shouldn't be merged any more. All of todays cars are just throw aways, after 5-10 years they will be so expensive to fix and junkyards will be riddled with cars that are all having the same problems that no one will be able to afford to fix them. Just think about the new vans with the power sliding doors, now what happens when the motor faults and the door won't close?, or the rear hatch won't come down because the motor wont allow?. Thats where all the problems come into play. I own my own business I also run a salvage yard, Impound yard, and Run tow trucks. I also work on vehicles, so I see all the sides of the spectrum. I see the stuff when its nice, I see it when it breaks, and I see it when it land in the salvage yard. Nine out of ten times the cars that land in the salvage yard are due to technology failure, where some BS sensor breaks and that sensor cost $900.00 and even still just might not be the problem because 3 other sensors could be screwed up, sending false signals causing the other one to seem bad. It doesnt matter how old the technology is I have seen cars that are two months old cause as much trouble as cars that are 10 years old, I have also seen many cars that are 20 years old be able to be fixed in minutes rather cheaply due to the non complexity of them. As I said techology is great, but it is a big crutch for people that need it, for what ever reason, they could be idiots, lazy, no common sense, whatever its still a crutch and still will cause more issues when it breaks then it ever helped.

quote Originally posted by jstricker: No it's not assinine at all. Anyone that believes the claims he's making of his NET INCOME is simply not thinking through the numbers. $15k/mo is $180K per year that he claims is his NET INCOME. You tell me you believe someone with two sunglass kiosks is making $180K/year and I have some frigging beachfront property in Kansas to sell you. You've seen the kiosks, they basically sell junk. Designer knockoffs at cheap prices. at 100% markup on a $25 pair of glasses you figure out how many pairs he has to sell a day. AND pay his help. AND pay his rent to the mall. AND pay his taxes. AND pay his incoming freight. AND AND AND.............. Give me a break. I used to do business analysis for a living. if you did used business analysis for a living. you would see that most kiosks net much more then what I am making. in the good malls. or did you not analize any mall kiosks? I'm not saying he doesn't have them. I'm not even saying he's not making some money. But if you were making $180K/year, would you be driving used BMW family cars at 23 years old? Not on your life. Good luck to him, and I really mean that, but there's been plenty of BS spread around here for one thread and it's mostly been coming from Trevor. John Stricker Oh, and Trevor, I'll let my WIFE beat your Bimmer in the Riv. John Stricker

if you did used business analysis for a living. you would see that most kiosks net much more then what I am making. in the good malls. or did you not analize any mall kiosks?

just because one of my bmw's is a 4 door with a i6. and is a "family car" means what? I got it used. and I wanted the 540 but they didn't have any on the lot. I hate the new bangled style. so i got the 530 i with the bmw m sport suspension. it has a number of things from the bmw m5.

that was bought as my business car. It was somthing I wanted to have for long trips. its why it has navigation. its sporty/serious in one.

my firebird forumla 6 speed wasn't a family car. my srt-4 wasn't a family car. if u look in some previous posts i have made. I am looking for a e36 m3. and looking into getting a e46 m3.

what because I make alot of money I should drive a gallardo? guess what. cars are not my whole life. I am not working just to make money and have the nicest car on the block. i have other goals in my life besides cars.

Im not gonna bullshit.

im done arguing about the thread. you guys don't wanna belive me go for it. i provided proof. and if u want even more its not hard to find on the web.
if u don't wanna belive me go for it. yet calikid provides no proof and he is redily belived in his outrages bullshit storys.


I didn't open these kiosks to become rich or make a ton of money.
i had a goal. and needed money to acompish it. and i am still working at that goal.

some things mean more to me then cars, and money.
and whatever u guys wanna claim i don't make or don't own or didn't do on my own go right ahead. say whatever u want to win your argument.

I laid out every single thing i paid for how much i make. ect. ect. i can't do much else then that.

but this has all sidetracked from what i said originaly. traction systems save lifes. and will continue to do so wether u like it or not. so tinton continue to tell everyone how traction control sucks balls and is a FACT its usless. yet hundreds of cars now come with them standerd. and almost every car has the option to have one. im sure your 21 year old self, with no enngineering background, having never even driven a car with traction control. or atleast a bmw with one. is much smarter then those thousands of rsearchers. all those statistcs and everything else saying the opposite of you.

and j strctier. u just keep saying how ur wifes car will smoke my bmw. good for you. im sure bmw had no idea what they where doing when they built my car. the m suspension thing. psssh, yeah thats just fancy talk for more money. why did i waste my money on a bmw warentee when i could have just bought a fiero and spent all my time at autozone fixing my car thats downtime is longer then its uptime. and argunging with the autozone employee about how great my fiero really is.

man i sure wasted my money on peace of mind. i would much rather spend my days driving ariund in a car with no leather. no individual climate control. no gps system. made by gm. stupid me. i dont know why me. and like every 1 in every 3 cars is a bmw or mercdes in california. if only all of us where wise enough to drive just fieros and reverias huh? ohwell. I guess I will just have to suffer with my decsions. damn. I will get by somehow

quote Originally posted by 84fierotrevor: stop spouting **** like your some bad ass driver. and that bmw can suck your nuts.

I'm 40, and don't claim to be a bad azz driver, but BMW can still "suck my nuts"!

Kevin

quote Originally posted by phreakboy4: This is really a funny thread to read, I totally agree with jstricker on what he is analyzing about Trevors BS. I dont believe one single thing about what he supposedly makes, as I own a business too and know what it cost for everything. I also agree that traction and stability control are nothing but a crutch, yes they can help for the everyday driver however what happens when it fails and the everyday driver is so used to it being there that they cant react without it. They are so used to slamming the brake and it not locking up and then all of the sudden they slam the break, enter into a non-controlled skid and cause a 4 car pile-up all because they were used to that crutch and then it was gone. I am one that loves cars and loves technology, but there is a point where they just shouldn't be merged any more. All of todays cars are just throw aways, after 5-10 years they will be so expensive to fix and junkyards will be riddled with cars that are all having the same problems that no one will be able to afford to fix them. Just think about the new vans with the power sliding doors, now what happens when the motor faults and the door won't close?, or the rear hatch won't come down because the motor wont allow?. Thats where all the problems come into play. I own my own business I also run a salvage yard, Impound yard, and Run tow trucks. I also work on vehicles, so I see all the sides of the spectrum. I see the stuff when its nice, I see it when it breaks, and I see it when it land in the salvage yard. Nine out of ten times the cars that land in the salvage yard are due to technology failure, where some BS sensor breaks and that sensor cost $900.00 and even still just might not be the problem because 3 other sensors could be screwed up, sending false signals causing the other one to seem bad. It doesnt matter how old the technology is I have seen cars that are two months old cause as much trouble as cars that are 10 years old, I have also seen many cars that are 20 years old be able to be fixed in minutes rather cheaply due to the non complexity of them. As I said techology is great, but it is a big crutch for people that need it, for what ever reason, they could be idiots, lazy, no common sense, whatever its still a crutch and still will cause more issues when it breaks then it ever helped.

so please tell me how often a traction control system and abs have failed? causeing the person to crash? please show me those statistcs.

so what your saying is that instead. lets have all the world throw away abs and traction systems. and then have everyone trained on how to react. and then to keep them sharp have them practice what every month? every year? and then whats more likley? the person will react correctly in the panic situation? or the abs system will fail? hmmmm, yes so smart there bud.
and u own a salvage yard so you now can tell me because u own a business. that I don't make the money i do.
yes that makes alot of sense.

a kiosk in a mall. and a salvage yard. have nothing incomen what so ever so good luck with that.


please tell me why every mall has rows and rows of kiosks? all accross america. tons of diffrent things. sunglasses, dead sea spa. ect. ect. anyone with any brains would go lookup kiosk business's and there profits. before they spout of that kiosks don't make as much as. xxx amount of money. YAHOO.COM look it the **** up. 15-30 thousand a month is very little for a kiosk busniess to make!!! LOOK IT UP everyone is in here chimming in that kiosks can't make that much money. yet they know nothing about them. and didn't even take the time to look it up. hell i even just threw out everything i paid for to run my busniess. and if u want in 20 days. when i get back to california where i store all my business records. i will photocopy and post. my sales reports. my credit card batches. my closing reports. my insurance bill. my mall lease. what else would you like? wait forget proof. just keep calling bullshit with out any proof of your own.

Dude- just drop it. Why is it so important to you that people on an internet forum know so much about you and believe how much you make? So what if you think traction control is great and someone else doesn't. It's fine. It's alright for you to think that and it's alright for someone else to think it's gay.

Your on the verge of freaking out about the whole kiosk thing...that is one of the biggest things that is pushing people to call BS. If it's true...fine...say it once and leave it at that.

quote Originally posted by 84fierotrevor: I have never even mentioned. my kiosks on this forum before, unless someone asked a business related question, so why would i bullshit about any of it?

I do know this is not the only thread where you mentioned your kiosk sunglass business. You mentioned earlier that you've never said anything about it before...maybe you just forgot...and that is truly alright...but when you are so defensive, then it makes people dig even further.

https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum6/HTML/044377.html
https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum6/HTML/044908.html
https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum6/HTML/045550.html


Take some advice and just let this thread die out. Congrats on your businesses and best of luck in future endeavors.

Matt

quote Originally posted by 84fierotrevor: so please tell me how often a traction control system and abs have failed? causeing the person to crash? please show me those statistcs. so what your saying is that instead. lets have all the world throw away abs and traction systems. and then have everyone trained on how to react. and then to keep them sharp have them practice what every month? every year? and then whats more likley? the person will react correctly in the panic situation? or the abs system will fail? hmmmm, yes so smart there bud. and u own a salvage yard so you now can tell me because u own a business. that I don't make the money i do. yes that makes alot of sense. a kiosk in a mall. and a salvage yard. have nothing incomen what so ever so good luck with that. please tell me why every mall has rows and rows of kiosks? all accross america. tons of diffrent things. sunglasses, dead sea spa. ect. ect. anyone with any brains would go lookup kiosk business's and there profits. before they spout of that kiosks don't make as much as. xxx amount of money. YAHOO.COM look it the **** up. 15-30 thousand a month is very little for a kiosk busniess to make!!! LOOK IT UP everyone is in here chimming in that kiosks can't make that much money. yet they know nothing about them. and didn't even take the time to look it up. hell i even just threw out everything i paid for to run my busniess. and if u want in 20 days. when i get back to california where i store all my business records. i will photocopy and post. my sales reports. my credit card batches. my closing reports. my insurance bill. my mall lease. what else would you like? wait forget proof. just keep calling bullshit with out any proof of your own.

[This message has been edited by FieroOilAnalyst (edited 12-04-2006).]

quote Originally posted by 84fierotrevor:

You really are a child, just because you have made it past the age of legally being an adult does not make you one. And that is obvious in this post.

From what I have seen of your behavior at least in this thread in particular.

You are a typical Spoilt little rich kid.

As I said earlier my signature, the first 2 lines say it all.

We have become so technologically dependant that if something doesn't work we are lost.

God forbid you don’t have a navigation system, turn left here, into the Pacific ocean.

God forbid your Traction control brakes, and you have to pump the brakes to come to a smooth stop on wet or snowy roads.

------------------
Technology is great when it works,
and one big pain in the ass when it doesn't.
Detroit iron rules all the rest are just toys.

quote Originally posted by FieroOilAnalyst: Dude- just drop it. Why is it so important to you that people on an internet forum know so much about you and believe how much you make? So what if you think traction control is great and someone else doesn't. It's fine. It's alright for you to think that and it's alright for someone else to think it's gay. Your on the verge of freaking out about the whole kiosk thing...that is one of the biggest things that is pushing people to call BS. If it's true...fine...say it once and leave it at that.

yes i did forget about those threads. what i was trying to say tho was that I didn't come on here bragging about how much i made. i didn't post that in other threads. just like i didn't make new posts everytime i got a new car. i tried to stay fiero relayted beause this is a fiero forum. the reason im posting so much.
is because someone told me i was lying. which i am not. so i am trying to provide proof that i am not lying and have no reason to lie. this is the first thread i have ever brought up how much i made. i wasn't going around bragging about it. money means very little to me.

of course no matter much proof i provide. it will never be enough. so whatever.

jstrictr I have no reason to lie. I am leaving the thread. if u would like to see photocopys of everything I have for my kiosk business pm me. I have no reason to bullshit

tinton you just like to go around and act like nothing can compare to you. so im done arguing with you. obveisly we disagree on traction systems.
and neither of us are going to change each others minds.


everyone else. I apologize. i see the error of my ways.

I will be selling my bmw and buying like 30, 1000 dollar fieros. I see the error in my ways now

quote Originally posted by 84fierotrevor: so please tell me how often a traction control system and abs have failed? causeing the person to crash? please show me those statistcs. so what your saying is that instead. lets have all the world throw away abs and traction systems. and then have everyone trained on how to react. and then to keep them sharp have them practice what every month? every year? and then whats more likley? the person will react correctly in the panic situation? or the abs system will fail? hmmmm, yes so smart there bud. and u own a salvage yard so you now can tell me because u own a business. that I don't make the money i do. yes that makes alot of sense. a kiosk in a mall. and a salvage yard. have nothing incomen what so ever so good luck with that. please tell me why every mall has rows and rows of kiosks? all accross america. tons of diffrent things. sunglasses, dead sea spa. ect. ect. anyone with any brains would go lookup kiosk business's and there profits. before they spout of that kiosks don't make as much as. xxx amount of money. YAHOO.COM look it the **** up. 15-30 thousand a month is very little for a kiosk busniess to make!!! LOOK IT UP everyone is in here chimming in that kiosks can't make that much money. yet they know nothing about them. and didn't even take the time to look it up. hell i even just threw out everything i paid for to run my busniess. and if u want in 20 days. when i get back to california where i store all my business records. i will photocopy and post. my sales reports. my credit card batches. my closing reports. my insurance bill. my mall lease. what else would you like? wait forget proof. just keep calling bullshit with out any proof of your own.

Well first if and when you learn to read, you will see that I did not say I own a salvage run I said I run a salvage yard, I own a computer business. Second, Just because you read something on the internet does not make it true. I can go find 100 sites that all say I can make money from home working 10 hours a week and bringing home $5000 dollars. Does that make it true?, I think not. So your little "you need to read about kiosks" is a bunch of kaka. If you werent so upset about people not believing you than you would probably be more believable. The fact that one person questioned you made you all upset and pissy like a little baby when caught in a lie, and then the lie just gets bigger and bigger. You act like just because people like a 20 year old car they know nothing about any other cars, and of course they dont own anything else. I myself dont even own a fiero anymore, I will one day buy another if I see what that really catchs my eye however right now I have 16 cars so I really just do not need another car. but I can gauran"dam"tee that I have way more knowledge about cars and driving in general then your little schmuk ass. Your just a close minded little kid, "what I have is the best and nobody's car is better" "Bmw is godly" hahaha christ its like was already said you bought an extended waranty because you knew that the car would break more than you could handle. Because I also know that waranty jobs dont get done any faster than cash jobs, since with waranty jobs the dealership has to wait to be reimbursed. Christ if BMWs were so good they would certainly have a much better resale value. I can think of a lot of cars they have held their value better including 91-95 Mr2's, SUPRAS, 300z, 3000gt vr4.

quote Originally posted by phreakboy4: Well first if and when you learn to read, you will see that I did not say I own a salvage run I said I run a salvage yard, I own a computer business. Second, Just because you read something on the internet does not make it true. I can go find 100 sites that all say I can make money from home working 10 hours a week and bringing home $5000 dollars. Does that make it true?, I think not. So your little "you need to read about kiosks" is a bunch of kaka. If you werent so upset about people not believing you than you would probably be more believable. The fact that one person questioned you made you all upset and pissy like a little baby when caught in a lie, and then the lie just gets bigger and bigger. You act like just because people like a 20 year old car they know nothing about any other cars, and of course they dont own anything else. I myself dont even own a fiero anymore, I will one day buy another if I see what that really catchs my eye however right now I have 16 cars so I really just do not need another car. but I can gauran"dam"tee that I have way more knowledge about cars and driving in general then your little schmuk ass. Your just a close minded little kid, "what I have is the best and nobody's car is better" "Bmw is godly" hahaha christ its like was already said you bought an extended waranty because you knew that the car would break more than you could handle. Because I also know that waranty jobs dont get done any faster than cash jobs, since with waranty jobs the dealership has to wait to be reimbursed. Christ if BMWs were so good they would certainly have a much better resale value. I can think of a lot of cars they have held their value better including 91-95 Mr2's, SUPRAS, 300z, 3000gt vr4.

yes thats why the bmw 330ci holds the highest resale value currently on the market.

where did i claim i new more abouts cars then anyone. i said i liked my bmw. stop putting words in my mouth i never said.

i havnt had to use my wqarentee service yet. but thanks for telling me why i bought it.

where did i say bmw was the best?? stop making stuff up i didn't say and argue with somthing i did say.

yes busted in a lie so i provided proof. yes thats what happends when ur busted in a lie you post proof. proof that a lie wouldn't have.

close minded? i am the one telling people not to talk **** on technology. and i was the one defending techonolgy such as the new lexus. I am the close minded one.

can someone make a post rebuttling somthing I ACCTUALY SAID PLEASE everyone keeps trying to put words in my mouth i didn't say. or just say somthing completly opposite of what i did say.

quote Originally posted by 84fierotrevor: ...when your driving a 80's econo shitbox....

Careful, this forum is full of people who are "driving 80's econo shitboxes", as you so eloquently said.

quote Originally posted by Tinton: You're what? 23? Where is YOUR engineering background? Oh right....you sell sunglasses for a living, STFU. You don't have any more of an engineering background than me, and you haven't done more research than me. If you want to claim my points are invalid, well, so are yours. You're a hypocritical ******* with your double standards. Tell me, where's your "research" that shows that traction control has made a difference? Show me that a an analysis was taken of cars with and without traction control, and show me that the cars with traction control were statistically abnormal, ie, that it was outside the normal variation in the first sample with cars that didn't have traction control. You're completely full of .

putting words in my mouth again. where did i say my rsearch?? . the car compmanys that devloped and implemented abs and tcs systems. how could u even confuse that with me.

no proof like calkid?? did u miss my thread where i said in 20 days when i get back to cali i will post my sales records?? u cant get any better proof then that.

your making fun of my prossesion of owning 2 kiosks. yet you do what for a living??? LOl, u still havn't mentioned it.

[This message has been edited by 84fierotrevor (edited 12-04-2006).]

quote Originally posted by 84fierotrevor: [QUOTE]Originally posted by Tinton: You proved you own a couple of sunglass huts. Really, is that such a respectful profession? QUOTE] whats yuor profession again there bud?? since ur calling mine so shitty.

I thought you quit this thread?

You obviously can’t spell or do anything but brag and rant.

A Fiero is 20+ years old, your BMW is 3 years old, lets see in 20+ years just how much of that fancy tecnocrap still works right.

------------------
Technology is great when it works,
and one big pain in the ass when it doesn't.
Detroit iron rules all the rest are just toys.

quote Originally posted by 84fierotrevor: not my reserach dumb ass, the car compmanys that devloped and implemented abs and tcs systems. how could u even confuse that with me. no proof like calkid?? did u miss my thread where i said in 20 days when i get back to cali i will post my sales records?? u cant get any better proof then that. how would i fakke credit card batch reports??? your making fun of my prossesion of owning 2 kiosks. yet you do what for a living??? LOl, u still havn't mentioned it.

The companies that developed and implemented abs and tcs systems? You don't think they would be a little BIASED? Those are features they can use to distinguish their cars from others on the market, which essentially improves their sales. It doesn't matter if the systems are actually worthwhile, as long as they can make the average consumer think the way they want them to its all good. Using statistics the auto companies put out is like judging how healthy smoking is based on what tobacco companies say. The spin never ends.

As far as I'm concerned there is no proof until you lay it down here on the forum. "wah wah wah, 20 days I'll post sales records", really, like I could trust your word?

Why would I feel the need to post what I do for a living? I'm not going insane trying to prove myself to people on this forum, you are. I could care less if you know what I do. But, to get you off my ass, I work in web development and computer hardware. I've probably posted about it before, but I work for $12-$25 an hour ($25 an hour is on-site work, instead of getting paid for mileage I get paid double my normal wage). That's above average for someone my age, sorry if I'm not an overachiever like you, going for the latest get-rich-quick scheme. I've been working in that same job since I turned 15 and learned HTML, of course back then I only got min wage.

just out of curiousty. i am a member on many diffrent forums. including rft. whats this deal about you said you where going to kick jeff stillwell's ass? "stimpy"
then saying your going to kick shuans ass. because stimpy is to big? when is this going down so I can watch? or are you just talking more trash. since your on the internet. stop Ethugging. seriously tho, you can pm me if u want. im curouse why you are angry enought that you acctualy want to pysicaly fight those two, and try and cause physical harm.

in a previous thread u stated you where bullied in school, and almost brought a gun to school. and if u had, that they would not have been calling it the columbine high school shottings but the "insert your school name here shottings"

im not friends with them. im not friends with you, just curious why. u can pm it to me if u want, and are afraid to say it here.

where they bulling you or somthing enough to make you want to phsycaly attack them? are you a member on rft? or how is it that you are arguing with them?

quote Originally posted by 84fiero123: I thought you quit this thread? You obviously can’t spell or do anything but brag and rant. A Fiero is 20+ years old, your BMW is 3 years old, lets see in 20+ years just how much of that fancy tecnocrap still works right.

I guarantee none. Expensive, complicated electronics fail. The more complex something is, the more ways it can break. Not only that, but in 20 years I doubt BMW will have any support for all of its expensive gadgetry. In 20 years you'd have just as much, if not more trouble keeping that BMW on the road.

quote Originally posted by 84fierotrevor: just out of curiousty. i am a member on many diffrent forums. including rft. whats this deal about you said you where going to kick jeff stillwell's ass? "stimpy" then saying your going to kick shuans ass. because stimpy is to big? when is this going down so I can watch? or are you just talking more trash. since your on the internet. stop Ethugging. seriously tho, you can pm me if u want. im curouse why you are angry enought that you acctualy want to pysicaly fight those two, and try and cause physical harm. in a previous thread u stated you where bullied in school, and almost brought a gun to school. and if u had, that they would not have been calling it the columbine high school shottings but the "insert your school name here shottings" im not friends with them. im not friends with you, just curious why. u can pm it to me if u want, and are afraid to say it here. where they bulling you or somthing enough to make you want to phsycaly attack them? are you a member on rft? or how is it that you are arguing with them?

You really don’t have a life do you?

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Technology is great when it works,
and one big pain in the ass when it doesn't.
Detroit iron rules all the rest are just toys.

quote Originally posted by Tinton: The companies that developed and implemented abs and tcs systems? You don't think they would be a little BIASED? Those are features they can use to distinguish their cars from others on the market, which essentially improves their sales. It doesn't matter if the systems are actually worthwhile, as long as they can make the average consumer think the way they want them to its all good. Using statistics the auto companies put out is like judging how healthy smoking is based on what tobacco companies say. The spin never ends. As far as I'm concerned there is no proof until you lay it down here on the forum. "wah wah wah, 20 days I'll post sales records", really, like I could trust your word? Why would I feel the need to post what I do for a living? I'm not going insane trying to prove myself to people on this forum, you are. I could care less if you know what I do. But, to get you off my ass, I work in web development and computer hardware. I've probably posted about it before, but I work for $12-$25 an hour ($25 an hour is on-site work, instead of getting paid for mileage I get paid double my normal wage). That's above average for someone my age, sorry if I'm not an overachiever like you, going for the latest get-rich-quick scheme. I've been working in that same job since I turned 15 and learned HTML, of course back then I only got min wage.

so owning your own busines are now get rich quick schemes just because I make more money then you?
what is it you have against my profession so much? so now everyone that owns a kiosk is a get rich quick scemeer eh??
yeah your being logical. face it. u don't like me so your just trying to insult my proffesion.

Have to chime in here for a second. I own a 2001 BMW 525i and love it. It is one of the best cars I have owned. Never leaves me stranded or gives me any problems. Well, I take that back. I had to replace the rear ball joints last week. I dont think thats too bad tho considering they only cost me $33 a piece (for fatory BMW parts) and the origionals lasted 161K miles.

As far as the Lexus parking system, I'm sure they use distance sensors similar to what Ford and GM use for their park aid. I'll bet if one of those sensors has a fault the system will not allow you to use the auto park feature. It's also probably not too expensive to fix until you get into the modules. I've replaced plenty of park aid sensor in Navigators at work. They are easy to do so labor is cheap and the sensor itself is only about $60. The Lexus still makes me nervous about parking my car anywhere.

quote Originally posted by Tinton: I guarantee none. Expensive, complicated electronics fail. The more complex something is, the more ways it can break. Not only that, but in 20 years I doubt BMW will have any support for all of its expensive gadgetry. In 20 years you'd have just as much, if not more trouble keeping that BMW on the road.

in 20 years i won't have the car. so what would it matter to me? when it hits 100 thousand miles I won't have the car. and its above 35 thousand now.

not everyone keeps there cars for 20 years. alot keep them tell they start having issues. or are between 100+130 thousand miles. and they trade them in for somthing new. if everyone still had there 20 year old cars. u wouldn't see new cars on the road.

atleast thats how we do it where we live in california. i do tend to see more older cars the farther i get from the city. and the more i get into the boondocks

quote Originally posted by 84fierotrevor: just out of curiousty. i am a member on many diffrent forums. including rft. whats this deal about you said you where going to kick jeff stillwell's ass? "stimpy" then saying your going to kick shuans ass. because stimpy is to big? when is this going down so I can watch? or are you just talking more trash. since your on the internet. stop Ethugging. seriously tho, you can pm me if u want. im curouse why you are angry enought that you acctualy want to pysicaly fight those two, and try and cause physical harm. in a previous thread u stated you where bullied in school, and almost brought a gun to school. and if u had, that they would not have been calling it the columbine high school shottings but the "insert your school name here shottings" im not friends with them. im not friends with you, just curious why. u can pm it to me if u want, and are afraid to say it here. where they bulling you or somthing enough to make you want to phsycaly attack them? are you a member on rft? or how is it that you are arguing with them?

Jeffrey Stillwell (known as stimpy here on PFF) was going to pay someone to slap me in the face/kick my ass here in Georgia, I was merely returning the threat. He wants to threaten physical violence, he should expect the same response back.

Frankly, Shaun Hammit needs to be put in his place. If anyone is the master internet e-thug, its him. He makes insults online that would have gotten him put into the hospital in real life. He asked Steve Kelly's son to sign his balls, among other things related to child pornography. The average troll still left here on Pennocks pale in comparison to Shaun. If you want to talk about backing out of a fight, he was the first to do so, my first challenge was to him, he did not directly reject it, but he did not accept either. Where are the people on RFT calling him out for the weak ***** he is?

Yes, I was bullied in school, I won't deny it. There's just so much a person can take, and grade-school kids can be mean. Its called "acting childish". I gave my share of bullying back then, and I'm sorry for those who I may have hurt. I also forgive the people who bullied me back in the day, they didn't really know any better.

quote Originally posted by 84fierotrevor: in 20 years i won't have the car. so what would it matter to me? when it hits 100 thousand miles I won't have the car. and its above 35 thousand now. not everyone keeps there cars for 20 years. alot keep them tell they start having issues. or are between 100+130 thousand miles. and they trade them in for somthing new. if everyone still had there 20 year old cars. u wouldn't see new cars on the road. atleast thats how we do it where we live in california. i do tend to see more older cars the farther i get from the city. and the more i get into the boondocks

Funny you have a 20 year old Fiero, why wouldn't you want a 20 year old BMW?

------------------
Technology is great when it works,
and one big pain in the ass when it doesn't.
Detroit iron rules all the rest are just toys.

quote Originally posted by 84fiero123: Funny you have a 20 year old Fiero, why wouldn't you want a 20 year old BMW?

i hd a 20 year old bmw. well close. i had a 1988 for a little while. some crazy reason it still ran. but tinton garenteed me bmws wont be running that are 20 years old. hmm must have been lucky i guess.
i own a 20 year old fiero because I enjoy taking the fiero out every once in a while. its one of the cars i enjoy. however i dont obesses over just the fiero. i also enjoy my bmw, my srt-4 my miata. my firebird. and a few other cars i owned. there was a few i didn't enjoy ether. and sold them pretty promptly.

quote Originally posted by 84fierotrevor: in 20 years i won't have the car. so what would it matter to me? when it hits 100 thousand miles I won't have the car. and its above 35 thousand now. not everyone keeps there cars for 20 years. alot keep them tell they start having issues. or are between 100+130 thousand miles. and they trade them in for somthing new. if everyone still had there 20 year old cars. u wouldn't see new cars on the road. atleast thats how we do it where we live in california. i do tend to see more older cars the farther i get from the city. and the more i get into the boondocks

Doesn't matter if you have the car in 20 years or not, that doesn't have anything to do with my point. My point is that you seem to consider BMW's as being superior to most other cars on the road, including Fieros. Comparing an almost-new BMW to a 20 year old car isn't a valid comparison. Compare a 1984-1988 BMW ANYTHING next to a Fiero of equal age. My Grandfather had a 1983 BMW 3-series (don't remember what, this was in the mid-late 90's) that spent almost all of its time in the shop. It left us stranded several times. Your new BMW will be the same way in 20 years, and old easily-broken car with complicated hard-to-fix electronics. Insurance companies will be totalling the cars left and right because it'd cost more to fix the damned gadgets than the car will be worth.

quote Originally posted by Tinton: Jeffrey Stillwell (known as stimpy here on PFF) was going to pay someone to slap me in the face/kick my ass here in Georgia, I was merely returning the threat. He wants to threaten physical violence, he should expect the same response back. Frankly, Shaun Hammit needs to be put in his place. If anyone is the master internet e-thug, its him. He makes insults online that would have gotten him put into the hospital in real life. He asked Steve Kelly's son to sign his balls, among other things related to child pornography. The average troll still left here on Pennocks pale in comparison to Shaun. If you want to talk about backing out of a fight, he was the first to do so, my first challenge was to him, he did not directly reject it, but he did not accept either. Where are the people on RFT calling him out for the weak ***** he is? Yes, I was bullied in school, I won't deny it. There's just so much a person can take, and grade-school kids can be mean. Its called "acting childish". I gave my share of bullying back then, and I'm sorry for those who I may have hurt. I also forgive the people who bullied me back in the day, they didn't really know any better.

i wont denyee anything u said about shuan. what u say about jeff doesn't sound like him. if he did say it it was prolly a joke. but it could be true too. i don't know.
but thanks for clearing that up for me. i was really curious.

quote Originally posted by 84fierotrevor: i hd a 20 year old bmw. well close. i had a 1988 for a little while. some crazy reason it still ran. but tinton garenteed me bmws wont be running that are 20 years old. hmm must have been lucky i guess. i own a 20 year old fiero because I enjoy taking the fiero out every once in a while. its one of the cars i enjoy. however i dont obesses over just the fiero. i also enjoy my bmw, my srt-4 my miata. my firebird. and a few other cars i owned. there was a few i didn't enjoy ether. and sold them pretty promptly.

CONTEXT. Re-read what I said and what 84fiero123 said. I did not say that the BMW's wouldn't run, I said that the technological crap wouldn't work.

quote Originally posted by Tinton: Doesn't matter if you have the car in 20 years or not, that doesn't have anything to do with my point. My point is that you seem to consider BMW's as being superior to most other cars on the road, including Fieros. Comparing an almost-new BMW to a 20 year old car isn't a valid comparison. Compare a 1984-1988 BMW ANYTHING next to a Fiero of equal age. My Grandfather had a 1983 BMW 3-series (don't remember what, this was in the mid-late 90's) that spent almost all of its time in the shop. It left us stranded several times. Your new BMW will be the same way in 20 years, and old easily-broken car with complicated hard-to-fix electronics. Insurance companies will be totalling the cars left and right because it'd cost more to fix the damned gadgets than the car will be worth.

dude, u have to be reading my posts wrong. i never compared the bmw to the fiero. any year for any year.

my whole argument was that a bmw with tcs could save lives. and you all started trashing my bmw. so i defended it.

then you start telling me it will be trash in 20 years. so i hd to point out i won't own my bmw that long. because I won't. except maybea e36 m3. and i do want a e30 m3 as well.

quote Originally posted by 84fierotrevor: i wont denyee anything u said about shuan. what u say about jeff doesn't sound like him. if he did say it it was prolly a joke. but it could be true too. i don't know. but thanks for clearing that up for me. i was really curious.

Really, other than the times Jeffrey is off his meds, I think he's a cool and funny guy. But I wouldn't get without several miles of him, he's batshit insane. He went overboard for the tiniest little thing and skipped straight to real life threats.

quote Originally posted by Tinton: CONTEXT. Re-read what I said and what 84fiero123 said. I did not say that the BMW's wouldn't run, I said that the technological crap wouldn't work.

my 1988 bmw's on board computer worked. it told me my little things like what light was out. if one was on the car. my gas milage avrage. and how many gallons tell i was out.

CONTEXT I don't need to reread it.

quote Originally posted by 84fierotrevor: dude, u have to be reading my posts wrong. i never compared the bmw to the fiero. any year for any year. my whole argument was that a bmw with tcs could save lives. and you all started trashing my bmw. so i defended it. then you start telling me it will be trash in 20 years. so i hd to point out i won't own my bmw that long. because I won't. except maybea e36 m3. and i do want a e30 m3 as well.

Ok, ok, fine I'll agree that ABS can save lives. TCS....possibly, in the right circumstances. But in my experience, if you know what to do in extreme circumstances you can actually do just as good or better without them. They are crutches that people lean on, everyone should first learn how to threshold brake and how to control an oversteering/understeering car when they go in for a driver's license. They should be treated the same way as automatic transmissions are treated in Germany. Supposedly over there to pass your driver's test you have to do it in a car equipped with a standard transmission. Better to have overkill in your abilities than the bare minimum, so you don't have to rely on your crutches to help you walk.