Actually here in the US there are several cities that have sodomy on the books... and I’ve read stories of people going to jail for it...
IF you can get the law passed... well then (if I was gay) would have to stick to oral.
Okay...............I give up arguing with someone that obviously fell asleep in most of his basic high school subjects. If you're going to argue, grasp the English language before you post:
sod·om·y (sd-m) n.
Anal copulation of one male with another. Anal or oral copulation with a member of the opposite sex. Copulation with an animal.
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05:01 PM
dezie36 Member
Posts: 2501 From: Moved to Okemos, Mi, USA Registered: Feb 2005
Okay...............I give up arguing with someone that obviously fell asleep in most of his basic high school subjects. If you're going to argue, grasp the English language before you post:
sod·om·y (sd-m) n.
Anal copulation of one male with another. Anal or oral copulation with a member of the opposite sex. Copulation with an animal.
... um you need to read peoples posts not just hunt and peck... FieroFetish wanted to ban anal sex... you can go ahead and remove your foot from your mouth.
Oh well. I guess I cant have oral... and sorry for not knowing off the top of my head that sodomy included oral... I dont really remember them teaching that in HS... ever.
NO wait if I was gay I could have oral... just not anal... and since im straight I cant poke a girl in the butt or in the mouth... wow what an oppressive religion that came up with that.
[This message has been edited by dezie36 (edited 08-03-2005).]
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05:04 PM
Patrick Member
Posts: 38667 From: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada Registered: Apr 99
I just gave you a positive to try to counter-act the negatives.
Thanks Doc.
As much as I disagree with your position in this thread, I appreciate the fact that you at least communicate in an intelligent manner. Some of the posts in this thread have been downright silly. Makes me suspect that some posters have been inhaling a bit too deeply.
I’m sure many people believe that my criticisms of smokers are much too harsh, but after being forced to put up with other people’s disgusting habits for most of my life, I’m just so damn glad that the tide is finally turning.
All through my childhood, I suffered from terrible asthma which kept me home from elementary school for many weeks every year. When afflicted, I’d be in a steam tent in my bedroom gasping and struggling for every breath. Meanwhile my father would be in another room twenty feet away happily smoking his cigarettes. This went on for years. All of a sudden, my health improved. What happened? Could it be the fact that my father quit smoking (for his own health concerns) when I was about 13 years old? No, that’s not possible. Second-hand smoke hasn’t been proven to impair anyone’s health. Yeah, right...
Because of my extensive history with asthma, I know what’s it like not to be able to breathe properly. It’s a horrible way to live (or die!). I wouldn’t wish it upon anyone. I’ll never be able to understand why smokers willingly damage their lungs (among other organs). The least I can do is to try and ensure that they can’t damage anyone else’s. So sure, if I’m such a b*st*rd for believing what I do, keep those negatives a coming.
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Originally posted by Boondawg:
Most times I find myself on the otherside of some of your opinions, but having access to the OTHER side almost always makes me smarter............at least more well informed! Thanx.
Thanks Boondawg, I appreciate your comments.
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05:07 PM
Boondawg Member
Posts: 38235 From: Displaced Alaskan Registered: Jun 2003
Dezie...who even said a religion came up with that..it is a proven medical fact that anal sex spreads fatal, and non-fatal but extremely distressing and debilitating illnesses.We've had this discussion before, yet I see you still ignore the dangers.So how can you preach to somebody about the dangers of smoking?. You still want to indulge in anal?? So who is so crazy? A person who smokes cigarettes, with the possible but unproven result of contracting lung cancer...or a person who indulges in an act which is certainly proven to have dangerous, and fatal consequences? And, having indulged, and contracted a disease, then stands a very high risk of passing that infection on to an innocent person further down the line.Somebody who hates the thought of anal intercourse, but falls in love with somebody who has engaged in it, and potentially carries a disease that will kill them? At least you can see when somebody is smoking and leave their vicinity, thereby reducing the chance of you contracting cancer from his secondhand smoke.: it is not apparent to anybody else whether you indulge in anal intercourse.. And one for Patrick.. I suffered from bronchitis, severely (spending more time in bed ill, than out of it), until I was fourteen, when I started smoking , and have NEVER since suffered from bronchitis. Now, there is a school of thought, that believes the body changes every seven years, and can grow out of health problems all on its' own.....so there is a 50/50 chance that I no longer suffered bronchitis because my system overcame it after the second 7year cycle, or smoking lowered the sensitivity of the surface of my lungs, thereby immunising itself against my bronchial problem. Take your pick..I see you were 13 or more when you got over it....But, I am now in my 8th 7 year cycle, AND I have given up smoking...and have started to feel breathless again..not so bad as before, but it is there. Two coincidences? I may have to find out which is the case. Oh, and Patrick...do you drink? Nick
quote
Originally posted by dezie36:
... um you need to read peoples posts not just hunt and peck... FieroFetish wanted to ban anal sex... you can go ahead and remove your foot from your mouth.
Oh well. I guess I cant have oral... and sorry for not knowing off the top of my head that sodomy included oral... I dont really remember them teaching that in HS... ever.
NO wait if I was gay I could have oral... just not anal... and since im straight I cant poke a girl in the butt or in the mouth... wow what an oppressive religion that came up with that.
------------------ fierofetish.PFF'S self-confessed Snowbird!! Responsibility: the solution for our World's Dilemmas..
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06:17 PM
dezie36 Member
Posts: 2501 From: Moved to Okemos, Mi, USA Registered: Feb 2005
Dezie...who even said a religion came up with that..it is a proven medical fact that anal sex spreads fatal, and non-fatal but extremely distressing and debilitating illnesses.We've had this discussion before, yet I see you still ignore the dangers.So how can you preach to somebody about the dangers of smoking?. You still want to indulge in anal?? So who is so crazy? A person who smokes cigarettes, with the possible but unproven result of contracting lung cancer...or a person who indulges in an act which is certainly proven to have dangerous, and fatal consequences? And, having indulged, and contracted a disease, then stands a very high risk of passing that infection on to an innocent person further down the line.Somebody who hates the thought of anal intercourse, but falls in love with somebody who has engaged in it, and potentially carries a disease that will kill them? At least you can see when somebody is smoking and leave their vicinity, thereby reducing the chance of you contracting cancer from his secondhand smoke.: it is not apparent to anybody else whether you indulge in anal intercourse..
You showed a detestation for anal sex... the laws that prohibit it in the US are under sodomy... and sodomy is a religious word... hence where the religion part came into it.
So IF I Dezie (who has had std tests done and am free and clear) has anal sex with the future Mrs. Dezie (also has had std tests and is free and clear) Dezie is gonna give her diseases? Like what sorebuttanemia? We are not getting into this discussion again... we both know neither one will bend... But yes I will preach because if anal sex is practiced safely, there are no diseases 2 std free people could give each other! Not one! BUT a person smoking can and will give them self’s cancer, I don’t have one family member who smoked live past 70 (which is why I’m still worried about my mom and dad). Grandma Grandpa, my moms sisters (all of them) have died of lung cancer... don’t tell me smoking only might have caused it... it did cause it.
[This message has been edited by dezie36 (edited 08-03-2005).]
In my case, I had asthma which kept me from participating in most sports when I was a kid. I had to carry the inhaler around all the time. Then got a series of steroid shots (very painful) when I was about 9 or 10. Did no good.
It seemed to let up in severity about the time I reached puberty, but I would get an occasional attack. I started smoking at about 18, and never had any asthma problems after that.
Then at about 32 years, I quit smoking. I started running and weight lifting with regularity and got myself into good shape. Then, crazy as it seems, I started getting problems with asthma again.
After four years of being "healthy", I started smoking again, and guess what. Never an asthma attack again. Coincidental causality? Maybe.
In other news, my great-grandmother, who smoked one to two packs of unfiltered a day, and drank whiskey straight everyday, died at the age of 95. It was kidney failure.
I keep thinking of the book "1984", except where ever it says "Eurasia", insert the word "smokers".
You showed a detestation for anal sex... the laws that prohibit it in the US are under sodomy... and sodomy is a religious word... hence where the religion part came into it.
wrong , sodomy (sodomite) = an actual place and people with referance to a sexual act that was permited in their culture. not a religous word, historical fact. despite the fact it is mentioned in the bible/biblical record....
[This message has been edited by JRM-2M6 (edited 08-03-2005).]
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08:48 PM
dezie36 Member
Posts: 2501 From: Moved to Okemos, Mi, USA Registered: Feb 2005
Sodomy is a term of religious origin to characterise certain sexual acts. Most commonly used to describe the specific act of anal sex both between heterosexuals and homosexuals, the term "sodomy" also may include non-coital sexual acts such as oral sex and other paraphilia. Laws forbidding certain types of sex acts have been found in some pre-modern cultures... The term sodomy derives from the name of the ancient city of Sodom, which according to the Bible was destroyed by God for its misdeeds (see Sodom and Gomorrah). In today's common language it identifies the practice of anal intercourse, even if Sodom in the Bible was not primarily or exclusively condemned for homosexual acts.
Yes and this is kind of what you said... but in either case... its a religious story... there’s no physical proof Sodom and Gomorrah ever existed.
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The term sodomy derives from the name of the ancient city of Sodom, which according to the Bible was destroyed by God for its misdeeds (see Sodom and Gomorrah). In today's common language it identifies the practice of anal intercourse, even if Sodom in the Bible was not primarily or exclusively condemned for homosexual acts.
Originally posted by Patrick: Ah Dezie, I think maybe you’ve stumbled upon something quite relevant! This is what the real problem is - Smokers have a desperate desire to be seen and noticed. As in, “Hey, look at me, I’m so damn friggen cool.” Not being able to smoke in public places would severely cramp their style. Gone would be the many opportunities to impress pre-pubescent teens and the mentally deficient.
I smoke in some public places. I also have a cig hanging in my hand out my fieros window allot. Does that put me into that classification?
You want a smoke Patrick??? Yo do know, that only cool people smoke
Dezie, I owe you an apology...you are quite right saying 2 people who are std free cannot catch an STD by anal sex...and if you two are still together in ten years, and have never ever strayed, I would be the first to stand up and shake your hand...but we will have to wait and see!! Even 3 years, at a young age,as yours is, is a prediction pretty much against the odds chance...but I honestly, and truly, wish you happiness and success. I don't care, as long as you keep your practices to yourselves..why should I? It won't affect me. Secondly, not "can and WILL give you cancer..." there are millions of lifelong smokers, who live to a very ripe old age, and never ever contract cancer in any form. And thirdly, although you and I never will bend...somebody will have to if you keep practices going!!! You are showing a lot more control in your replies...hope you don't mind if I say "well done.." I am not being patronising sorebuttanemia !! Very funny!! But make sure you don't give her that!!!!!
quote
Originally posted by dezie36:
You showed a detestation for anal sex... the laws that prohibit it in the US are under sodomy... and sodomy is a religious word... hence where the religion part came into it.
So IF I Dezie (who has had std tests done and am free and clear) has anal sex with the future Mrs. Dezie (also has had std tests and is free and clear) Dezie is gonna give her diseases? Like what sorebuttanemia? We are not getting into this discussion again... we both know neither one will bend... But yes I will preach because if anal sex is practiced safely, there are no diseases 2 std free people could give each other! Not one! BUT a person smoking can and will give them self’s cancer, I don’t have one family member who smoked live past 70 (which is why I’m still worried about my mom and dad). Grandma Grandpa, my moms sisters (all of them) have died of lung cancer... don’t tell me smoking only might have caused it... it did cause it.
------------------ fierofetish.PFF'S self-confessed Snowbird!! Responsibility: the solution for our World's Dilemmas..
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09:10 PM
dezie36 Member
Posts: 2501 From: Moved to Okemos, Mi, USA Registered: Feb 2005
Dezie, I owe you an apology...you are quite right saying 2 people who are std free cannot catch an STD by anal sex...and if you two are still together in ten years, and have never ever strayed, I would be the first to stand up and shake your hand...but we will have to wait and see!! Even 3 years, at a young age,as yours is, is a prediction pretty much against the odds chance...but I honestly, and truly, wish you happiness and success. I don't care, as long as you keep your practices to yourselves..why should I? It won't affect me. Secondly, not "can and WILL give you cancer..." there are millions of lifelong smokers, who live to a very ripe old age, and never ever contract cancer in any form. And thirdly, although you and I never will bend...somebody will have to if you keep practices going!!! You are showing a lot more control in your replies...hope you don't mind if I say "well done.." I am not being patronising sorebuttanemia !! Very funny!! But make sure you don't give her that!!!!!
I appreciate the complement... I feel i have matured.
If two partners are loyal, and get tested regularly... and tested before the engage in the act.... in any sexual act actually they are much more safe. I will admit that anal sex is much more unsafe a sexual act as any other there is... especially if its unprotected... but it truly doesn’t matter of partners are clean... and it’s the job of the partners to make sure their partner is clean.
My gay friends all get tested... I know they do as I’ve driven them several times to the clinic to get the test. And as long as they do that, then I have to assume they are being careful.
But I have to touch on something that I believe you said... about the pill for women... I really don’t think I understand that... you think that because women take the pill and some of the hormones in the pill get in the water and turn some men gay? I can see that... but that would mean that in areas where lots of women take the pill you’ll have lots of gay people... and I think the effect would be even more gays then there are... i think the reason there are more gays in recent years is that more are coming out of the closet...
The historical existence of Sodom and Gomorrah is still in dispute by archaeologists, with some believing they never existed, some believing they are now under the Dead Sea, and others claiming that they have been found (under other names) in the region to the southeast of the Dead Sea.
Some archaeologists think the cities sank from liquefaction of the sand the city was built on.... look I know all about this... but there is still no physical evidence that the place ever existed... if we were talking about Rome, Greece, or even Sumeria.
Until there’s evidence of its existence, its still just a biblical story, and my statement stands.
The argument that the government can't tell privately owned restaurants/bars/etc what to do is strategically flawed. Since we can't vote to tell bar owners what to do, I guess they should be able to serve alcohol to people under 21? Or maybe no laws should apply on a PRIVATELY owned business property? Enter at your own risk eh? That'll be real fun, I'll be down at your local applebees smokin a blunt with a crowbar waiting for you to cross over the property line. It was your fault for walking in here and getting beaten half to death by me because the owner allowed it and the government can't step in. The government is there to provide ORDER, damn straight they can tell people what to do. Without it, there would be ANARCHY! Not to mention with these new ideas of yours with "private ownership", segregation could be brought back because any business owner could post his own rules and not let minorities in. Frontal lobe, JRM and others your views are skewed, it doesn't matter how much you whine the voters can and will decide what goes on inside your little privately run establishment.
Smoking and 2nd hand smoke has been linked to causing cancer. You can ***** and whine all you want about it not being harmful and scream till your lungs bleed but the fact remains SMOKING IS HARMFUL! Saying smoking isn't harmful is the same ASININE idiotic statement like saying that Evolution is only a theory, WELL GRAVITY IS ONLY A THEORY TOO! Nothing can be completely proven, things can only be proven up to 99% true, because there is always a slim chance that somewhere out in the infinite universe there is no gravity. You can stick with the whole "its not proven!" idea but you are siding with the 1%, with what is improbable instead of with what is more likely.
It is smart for them to say that Smoking is only likely to cause cancer because of what I just said. So many people die of lung cancer or coronary heart disease that have smoked much of their lives, or lived around 2nd hand smoke, but there is ALWAYS that 100 year old woman out there who has been smoking 4 packs a day since she was 8 years old and could run the mile in under 10 minutes, but she is the exception, NOT THE RULE! But that doesn't keep the assholes who smoke from looking at her and saying that smoking is healthy, even when there are so many examples to the contrary.
You're all against illegalizing cigarettes but how do you stand on the marijuana issue? Or maybe lowering the drinking age? I am pro legalizing marijuana and other substances because really I don't care about what someone does in their own house or property. I don't believe the government should be out to protect people from themselves, but I believe that it should protect me from other people just like how it protects me from getting my ass kicked or getting killed. If you want to go slowly kill yourself with cigarettes/marijuana/cocaine/lsd/etc go do it on your own property where it won't effect me, PLEASE. Drinking is a different issue altogether, when I'm in a bar it does not harm me when someone else is drinking, its not like the vapors travel through the air and get me drunk too. I won't pick a fight with him and he won't kick my ass, I'll make sure to avoid him on the roads so he doesn't kill me driving drunk, even though he should have a designated driver or ride a taxi.
/Another long post, don't ignore this one?
[This message has been edited by Tinton (edited 08-04-2005).]
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12:59 AM
PFF
System Bot
ryan.hess Member
Posts: 20784 From: Orlando, FL Registered: Dec 2002
Did you miss the rest of my post? If you want to not allow the voters and the government to regulate privately-owned businesses, then you're going to allow minors to get alcohol if the owner doesn't agree with the whole age 21 thing. I'm all for that if you are. I'm 19 right now I would love to go down to my local bar and get served since the government can't tell the business owner what to do, at least according to you . And next time I go out into the country I'll be disgusted to see a restaurant with a sign "No Colored allowed" just because of what the business owner wants. And since my property is my property and the government can't tell me what to do next time you step foot on it you'll be shot, and I won't be held accountable, since it wasn't against my rules, it was my property my rules right? Right? I kinda like that idea, it'd help keep the Mormons or whatever from visiting my doorstep and trying to convert me.
I believe in following the constitution and the Bill of Rights but even those documents need some updates. If we were to follow them as directly as you my paragraph above would probably be what we're living in today. The civil rights movement would have been weakened considerably and we would still have segregation in restaurants and other privately-owned public establishments.
[This message has been edited by Tinton (edited 08-04-2005).]
Did you miss the rest of my post? If you want to not allow the voters and the government to regulate privately-owned businesses, then you're going to allow minors to get alcohol if the owner doesn't agree with the whole age 21 thing. I'm all for that if you are. I'm 19 right now I would love to go down to my local bar and get served since the government can't tell the business owner what to do, at least according to you . And next time I go out into the country I'll be disgusted to see a restaurant with a sign "No Colored allowed" just because of what the business owner wants. And since my property is my property and the government can't tell me what to do next time you step foot on it you'll be shot, and I won't be held accountable, since it wasn't against my rules, it was my property my rules right? Right? I kinda like that idea, it'd help keep the Mormons or whatever from visiting my doorstep and trying to convert me.
I believe in following the constitution and the Bill of Rights but even those documents need some updates. If we were to follow them as directly as you my paragraph above would probably be what we're living in today. The civil rights movement would have been weakened considerably and we would still have segregation in restaurants and other privately-owned public establishments.
1. if there are no property rights - then there are no rights whatsoever. 2. I would support a drinking age that says if you can vote, serve in the militry, or be tried as an adult "you obviously old enough to be held accountable therefore you should be allowed to drink" 3. the entire premise of civil rights is based in the ownership of property - prior to the end of slavery black counld not own property and with out ownership you could not vote. "no rights or representation" 4. there is no such thing is a privately owned public establishment - that is a contrdiction in terms . by saying public establishment you are implying that the public owns it "they do not - its privately own." 5. and under your way of thinking there is no such things a civil rights "unless you concider people telling you what to do , how to do, and when to do it. civil rights" 6. as far as me stepping foot on your property , how long would i have, from the time you ask me to leave til you call police. before you have me arrested for trespassing? 7. hey we have homeless people all over the place , are you gonna kick them off of your property if they set up camp there "you have no property rights, so how would you be able to" 8. how about your car, can we just walk up an take it with out asking - sure because you have no property rights 9. how about the kkk (as flawed as their thinking is) as a non-organization . do blacks and other non-whites have the right to join? no - obviously they wouldn't want to 10. if the kkk can descriminate on the basis of color and still be allow "non-profit status" are you telling me that wal mart, joe's crabs'n'beer ,and quiki-mart , have no right to establish what etiquette they will permit on there property?
if you think its perfectly find to make legal actions, illegal, just to suit your convenience, then obviously fascism isn't a problem for you.
[This message has been edited by JRM-2M6 (edited 08-04-2005).]
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01:56 AM
Patrick Member
Posts: 38667 From: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada Registered: Apr 99
And one for Patrick.. I suffered from bronchitis, severely (spending more time in bed ill, than out of it), until I was fourteen, when I started smoking , and have NEVER since suffered from bronchitis. Now, there is a school of thought, that believes the body changes every seven years, and can grow out of health problems all on its' own.....so there is a 50/50 chance that I no longer suffered bronchitis because my system overcame it after the second 7year cycle, or smoking lowered the sensitivity of the surface of my lungs, thereby immunising itself against my bronchial problem. Take your pick..I see you were 13 or more when you got over it....But, I am now in my 8th 7 year cycle, AND I have given up smoking...and have started to feel breathless again..not so bad as before, but it is there. Two coincidences? I may have to find out which is the case.
Nick, so you’re starting to feel “breathless again” after giving up smoking. And you’re suggesting it’s because you’ve quit that you’re now having these problems? Oh, for sure. It would be silly to believe that maybe your body’s packing it in after abusing it for the last 42 years or so.
quote
Originally posted by fierofetish:
Oh, and Patrick...do you drink?
No, I take all my fluids intravenously.
Of course I drink. I even have the occasional beer or glass of wine. I can also tell you that not once, NOT ONCE in my entire life has my consumption of alcohol ever had an effect on anybody else’s physical health or comfort. The same cannot be said for the hundreds of thousands of stinkin’ cigarettes you’ve smoked in your lifetime.
Nick, I admire your love of animals and for that reason I think you’re a good guy. However, your arguments regarding smoking are rather lame to say the least. (My gawd, read over your posts in this thread!) No offence, but perhaps you should stick to looking after our furry/feathered/scaly friends.
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02:31 AM
Patrick Member
Posts: 38667 From: Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada Registered: Apr 99
Smokers have a desperate desire to be seen and noticed. As in, “Hey, look at me, I’m so damn friggen cool.” Not being able to smoke in public places would severely cramp their style. Gone would be the many opportunities to impress pre-pubescent teens and the mentally deficient.
quote
Originally posted by zMacK:
I smoke in some public places. I also have a cig hanging in my hand out my fieros window allot. Does that put me into that classification?
Depends. Is your Fiero parked in the garage while you’re doing this, or are you driving it down the street?
99% of smokers (my rough estimate) start smoking because they think it's “cool” to do so at the time. (Why the hell else would anyone start?) Smokers who never grow up continue to think it’s cool. Smokers who eventually mature are simply stuck with an expensive filthy habit.
[This message has been edited by Patrick (edited 08-04-2005).]
Of course I drink. I even have the occasional beer or glass of wine. I can also tell you that not once, NOT ONCE in my entire life has my consumption of alcohol ever had an effect on anybody else’s physical health or comfort. The same cannot be said for the hundreds of thousands of stinkin’ cigarettes you’ve smoked in your lifetime.
Nick, I admire your love of animals and for that reason I think you’re a good guy. However, your arguments regarding smoking are rather lame to say the least. (My gawd, read over your posts in this thread!) No offence, but perhaps you should stick to looking after our furry/feathered/scaly friends.
Hi Patrick!! I know you saw the smiley at the end of my quip about "Do you drink"!!! I admire your restraint, which I characterise in the same way as I characterise JohnStricker's enjoyment of a fine cigar..controlled and savoured at leisure...and I can't stand the smell of most cigars!!! But, unfortunately, there are many many thousands who are unable to excercise that same strength of character.And they are the ones who cause enormous amounts of the mayhem and destruction in our Society.And so, the whole Society of users of alcohol should suffer the same fate Smokers are being threatened with...do it at home, and stay there until the effects of alcohol have worn off.That won't protect the Families of the drinkers more than before..but they have the choice of doing something positive about it, if they accept their responsibility for themselves and their offspring. In much the same way as non-smokers perceive that damage is being done, I too can see that the boast of so many drinkers that they do not change after one drink, let alone 5 or 10,is ridiculous.They cannot judge that for themselves.They have been drinking!! They have no norm to assess their condition by.They all are convinced that alcohol does not impair their judgement... from my observations, as a teetotaler, they are all wrong.As the evening goes on, and more alcohol is imbibed, their personae changes...yes I do know, because I am still stone-cold sober at midnight, and have a legitimate reference point to back it up...I see them when they haven't started to drink, and I see the changes, although imperceptible to them, quite plainly. And if people don't drink alcohol because it enhances, or changes their inner feelings, why don't they drink non-alcoholic drinks Instead? I am sure that if milk became of alcoholic content overnight, many heavy users of alcohol, who never drink milk, for example, would start to use it. Especially if it was cheaper. So you see, I dislike alcohol as much as you dislike smoking. Why? I will repeat my argument stated earlier which I believe is equally, if not more, legitimate as any put forward by the anti-smoking brigade!! I have never been attacked, insulted or molested by somebody because they had been smoking. I have never seen anybody attack a nurse or doctor in an ER because they had smoked a whole pack of Marlboro. I have never experienced an automobile accident caused by somebody who has been smoking all night. I have never heard of an instance where a man came home at night, and beat his wife and/or children because he had been smoking all day at a football match.I have never heard of young ladies getting themselves in such a position that they are vulnerable to being raped, through smoking cigarettes But I HAVE seen ALL of these sort of incidents caused by alcohol use. They happen every minute of the day, the whole World over.Do you want to discount these facts, Patrick? I don't believe you can, in all honesty. ER rooms the World over, are filled to brimming by people who have been drinking, or people unfortunate enough to come into contact, and suffered the consequences thereby, with somebody who had been drinking. And so, I feel I have a right to complain, justifiably, that alcohol use is a far more dangerous pastime to not only the users thereby, but to far more of the general public than are adversely affected by people who smoke tobacco. I truly hate people who use substances, and then sue the Manufacturers for the sustained damage caused BY the liberal use of those substances. But... I would love to see some of the Alcoholic drinks manufacturers being sued in the same way as Tobacco goods manufacturers are currently, for injuries and losses caused to innocent people by alcohol-fuelled "accidents" and attacks. I would like to hear your thoughtful answers to these points. I trust you to be realistic and honest in your replies!!
You didn't make any comment about the coincidence of the 7 year cycle...It does seem a little more than a coincidence, but I am prepared to accept it might be.But, I also know, due to the many tests I had to go through as a youngster, that my bronchitis was caused by sensitivity to pollen, and other types of irritants. The Doctor who treated me duriing all my health problems in my early years, was not surprised to learn that I stopped suffering from bronchitis as soon as I started smoking...because the smoke de-sensitised my lung linings sufficiently to negate the adverse effect of other irritants that had previously caused my illness...He even recommended, prescribed herbal cigarettes as a cure!! Might be misguided in today's Medical research, or even downright irresponsible..but it did work...and for 44 years. Thanks for the compliment, by the way!! I regard you in the same light, even though I do find some of your posts totally preposterous!!! (I always bear in mind your informative comment of many months ago, as to why you are deliberately contraversial in some of your posts!! ) Nick Edit, to reply to Tinton...how do you avoid a drunken driver on the road?How can you tell they are drunk, before it is too late to avoid them? If you have a previously undisclosed method or equipment to do this...MARKET IT!! You will become enormously rich overnight!! If not, please withdraw that remark..it is not possible to do that, without having been present to see that person drinking themselves into an over-the-limit condition!!
------------------ fierofetish.PFF'S self-confessed Snowbird!! Responsibility: the solution for our World's Dilemmas..
[This message has been edited by fierofetish (edited 08-04-2005).]
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04:32 AM
frontal lobe Member
Posts: 9042 From: brookfield,wisconsin Registered: Dec 1999
I posted a lot of replies on this thread so you must have missed the part where I said that if a private owner was going to open to the public, then he would have to accept that the government could impose certain requirements.
I stated that they should relate to safety (fire codes, occupancy limits, drinking ages, etc.) and that it should be open to THE PUBLIC then (no discrimination). So where does your "enter at your own risk" comment come from? Where does your segregation comment come from regarding to what I said?
So I addressed your concerns on that issue specifically. I have no problem if you have a differing view point than I do, but how about at least looking at what my clearly stated viewpoint is? Also, I never whined about what voters can do. And the "little privately run establishment" wording makes it clear that you are being snide. On the other hand, dezie, Patrick, jrm and I just had an interesting discussion without any of that.
I also never said smoking wasn't harmful. Again, what I SAID was that, as with ANYTHING potentially harmful, it is the amount of exposure over time. I specifically stated that a bartender would get highly concentrated exposure over a long period of time, whereas a waitress in a typical restaurant, due to the volume of the room and dilutional effect, would not likely get harmful exposure.
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10:06 AM
dezie36 Member
Posts: 2501 From: Moved to Okemos, Mi, USA Registered: Feb 2005
Originally posted by fierofetish: Edit, to reply to Tinton...how do you avoid a drunken driver on the road?How can you tell they are drunk, before it is too late to avoid them? If you have a previously undisclosed method or equipment to do this...MARKET IT!! You will become enormously rich overnight!! If not, please withdraw that remark..it is not possible to do that, without having been present to see that person drinking themselves into an over-the-limit condition!!
I cant speak for Tinton... but police officers especially ones in the AEU (alcohol enforcement unit) are specialty trained to spot drunk drivers... they all do very typical things while driving that alert you to them.
Now one cant always avoid drunks... but standard defensive driving its a good start... if you see your light just turned green look both ways to ensure cars on either side of you have stopped.
if you see a vehicle swerving back and forth, perhaps skipping stop signs.. or even can see them yelling a lot at other motorists (not always a sign but sometimes... especially when added to the first 2 signs). These are just a few signs... during my time as an explorer drunk driver spotting was part of our standard training, along with personal defense, and building searches.
