I saw this and thought it might be kinda cool, I prefer to use scissor door (VDC) because I think they have a purpose, you can fully open your door even in congested parking lots. But this would be interesting, I'm guessing someone has done this to a Fiero.

Chris

I see lots of posts in your future.

I can only hope they are civil guss.

Chris

I always thought a gull wing was a hung from the window frame. I wouldn't be calling this a gull wing more a koenigsegg style door.

Gull wings hang form the roof section like the doors found on some Mercedes models, and the ever so popular DeLorean.

These are know as butterfly doors and just like the lambo doors the fiero spaceframe was not designed with them in mind .... they sure look nice though.

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My build Thread
http://www.tylerstoy.com

[This message has been edited by Danyel (edited 08-13-2011).]

Neither is an S2000 Danye . Which you are right they are called butterfly doors. The kit comes with a piece that braces that little triangle on the door to hold the entire weight of the door, since that is where you hang the hinge. I am fairly confident that the window frame area (vehicle side) can hold the weight of the door, but I'm sure I saw a video with a Fiero with this kit installed. It was a ruby red Fiero with silver graphics, anyone know what I'm talking about?

Chris

[This message has been edited by Letsbuildanexotic (edited 08-13-2011).]

[This message has been edited by Gokart Mozart (edited 08-13-2011).]

I may catch some heat for saying this, but I am not a fan of the curent scissor doors that are installed on our Fiero's. I do not like the fact you have to open the dorr, then lift it up. I know why it is dun like that, but just think its a bit hokey. If the action could be made to open then move up all in one motion, I think it would be 10x better. If it could be designed in such a way as to just lift up (w/o having to go out first); that would be perfect and I would strongly consider the mod... Again, I already know why the door has to open first, so no need to explain it to me I also understand that designing a straight-up door would prolly cost 3-4 times more then the way its being accomplished now...

Just my .02

EDIT to add:
I also feel our cars would bennifit more from scissor dorrs then a Lambo would. The whole purpose of scissor doors is to make it easier to get in/out when parked next to another car. Now really, how many Lambo's do you see parked in a mall parking lot Point is, Lambo owners "typically" do not leave there cars unattened in buisy public parking lots; where as a Fiero owner "typically" would...

[This message has been edited by ALJR (edited 08-13-2011).]

The scissor door is more a gimick and styling than it is anything else. Lambo has done them for the most part to be different and to mimick the race car look of a prototype racer.

The Sicissor door and the Gull wing door are used mostly on prototype racers cars as they often use a tub frame and in the past many had wide sills for support and some had fuel tanks there. Even the old 300 SL gull wings had to have them as they had wide high sills like a race car to stiffen the chassis.

This is kind of a fad as has many others that will die out like Neon Lights. Often the doors not designed to be this way end up with issues as they age. I suspect in time some will wish they had not made the change years from now.

To me they are cool on the right car and when it is not something you see all the time. But when you see a lot of normal cars with these it makes them a little less special. Often I get more excited about the cars they come on from the factory than just the doors.

quote Originally posted by hyperv6: The scissor door is more a gimick and styling than it is anything else. Lambo has done them for the most part to be different and to mimick the race car look of a prototype racer. The Sicissor door and the Gull wing door are used mostly on prototype racers cars as they often use a tub frame and in the past many had wide sills for support and some had fuel tanks there. Even the old 300 SL gull wings had to have them as they had wide high sills like a race car to stiffen the chassis. This is kind of a fad as has many others that will die out like Neon Lights. Often the doors not designed to be this way end up with issues as they age. I suspect in time some will wish they had not made the change years from now. To me they are cool on the right car and when it is not something you see all the time. But when you see a lot of normal cars with these it makes them a little less special. Often I get more excited about the cars they come on from the factory than just the doors.

I don't know about you, but I'd really like to be able to get out of my Fiero when the azzhole in the parking spot next to me parks too close. I know I need more than 8 inches to get the door on my Fiero open far enough for me to crawl out.

Hell just open the door hard it is plastic. You can clearance his door for the extra room. LOL!

In all my years of daily driving I usally park careful enough I have never had an issue with parking too close.

My dads buddy in the 50's won a Benz 300 Gulwing in some kind of contest. He loved it till he took it home and parked in the single garage. He could not open the doors inside nor get out. He traded it in for a new Vette. I bet he wishes he had it today.

The ultimate door is on the BMW Isetta. The whole front opens and the steering wheel with it swings away. They all had sun roof so if you got up against something you could still get out. They had no reverse. My dad said in Germany it was common for many to get drunk and up against a wall and not get out nor drive away. LOL!

I think we are slipping away from the butterfly design in conversation. For the comment about the door moving up and out in one swift motion, this is that door. It does not require you to open it, before you open it. Again, the space needed to open it is closer to a normal swing out door than a vertical door kit.

I have concerns about how easy the access is once the door is open. I'm a tall guy and it would seem as though I would bump my head on the door getting out of the car if I'm not careful enough. The angle on a Fiero for the door hinge is sharper than that of the S2000 picture above, so it would swing more up than out.

As far as people parking too close, well LOL, that is what a sunroof or T-tops is for.

Chris

[This message has been edited by Letsbuildanexotic (edited 08-14-2011).]

I am working on doing the butterfly door on my chop. To do it I will be replacing the triangle in the front of the door with a 3/8 thick chunk of steel that will extend down into the front of the door, then I will be milling a pocket into it at the top to put a industrial hinge in it flush.

The only detail I have to work out at the moment is the pillar were the other half of the hinge will be, I dont like the idea of having to make a trapdoor pocket fo the hinge in the pillar fiberglass but at same time would be no biggie it would work like the door handles of a 70's corvette only in reverse with the rectangle piece of fiberglass swinging up as the hinge makes its rotation thru its travel and then the trap door swings back down on its own w the door via a small wire torsion spring like whats on the backside of the fiero door handle.

Flexing in the corner of the pillar woulnt be really a issue either, that corner can also be guseted with a 1/4 inch triangle plate of steel pretty easy plus in the case of my chop that area has already been beefed up with extra metal and welds anyway, the black trim piece would just simply be body glued to the door hinge triangle hidine the bottom half of the hinge.

Gas struts would be mounted on the pillar were the bottom door hinge used to reside and then mounted half way up the door front for clearence I think two 90 lb struts would be plenty maby even get away with less. the hingle will have to be verry strong it takes alot of load.
At the bottom of the front door id prob add a pin and hole guid lock too to secure the door when its closed kinda like the hood latching mech off a 68 corvette only smaller or another door latch off somthin like a saturn with the wire hoop for the bearclaw latch.

[This message has been edited by jetsnvettes2000 (edited 08-14-2011).]

quote Originally posted by Australian: I always thought a gull wing was a hung from the window frame. I wouldn't be calling this a gull wing more a koenigsegg style door.

Actually, OP's pic is butterfly doors. These are the Koenigsegg style, which just pop out slightly, and rotate 90 degrees veritcally:

Hey dobey; do ya know if the window is all the way up as the door begins to open-then the glass rolls down-in prep for the door to close
so the glass doesn't squeeze the upper seal lip if it were in the full up position,,,as the door is pulled fully closed?? Hard to tell @ the
very instant the guy opens the door. This is the way it looks like it happens to me. It is a cool set up. Rick

quote Originally posted by ALJR: I may catch some heat for saying this, but I am not a fan of the curent scissor doors that are installed on our Fiero's. I do not like the fact you have to open the dorr, then lift it up. I know why it is dun like that, but just think its a bit hokey. If the action could be made to open then move up all in one motion, I think it would be 10x better. If it could be designed in such a way as to just lift up (w/o having to go out first); that would be perfect and I would strongly consider the mod... Again, I already know why the door has to open first, so no need to explain it to me I also understand that designing a straight-up door would prolly cost 3-4 times more then the way its being accomplished now... Just my .02 EDIT to add: I also feel our cars would bennifit more from scissor dorrs then a Lambo would. The whole purpose of scissor doors is to make it easier to get in/out when parked next to another car. Now really, how many Lambo's do you see parked in a mall parking lot Point is, Lambo owners "typically" do not leave there cars unattened in buisy public parking lots; where as a Fiero owner "typically" would...

Just curious how many of the people making these comments have any experience with vertical doors?

I have decah vertical doors and let me say that yes I put them on for show, HOWEVER:

1) I find them more practical than the regular Fiero doors in tight spaces

2) the gas strut actually makes it easier to open than regular door which has no strut

3) Yes I do park my car unattended in busy parking lots (I agree on this one)

4) having to open it horizontal first makes it MORE practical because when I just want to get in and out without attracting too much attention I use it like a regular door

5) It might be hokey to some that it has to open horizontal first, but in my humble opinion that adds to the interest. I can't tell you how many people's jaw drops when after having opened and closed the doors themselves horizontally, you casually flip the door vertical.

6) ANY type hinge, (Butterfly, lambo, gullwing, koenigsegg) is better than stock. That 10,000 year old technology hinge has to go.

[This message has been edited by jscott1 (edited 08-14-2011).]

quote Originally posted by Rick Morehouse: Hey dobey; do ya know if the window is all the way up as the door begins to open-then the glass rolls down-in prep for the door to close so the glass doesn't squeeze the upper seal lip if it were in the full up position,,,as the door is pulled fully closed?? Hard to tell @ the very instant the guy opens the door. This is the way it looks like it happens to me. It is a cool set up. Rick

Yeah, the windows roll down/up automatically, as there is a little area they go into. The new Vettes do this also. It's not anything to do with the upper seal being squeezed so much. The window actually goes up into the body at that point, to create a better seal, so you can't pull the windows out while locked up, like you can on a Fiero. A lot of newer model cars without full framed door glass do this.

ok you guys think some of those ideas are questionable.....ive had this on my mind for a while but the wiring aspect is throwing me off...... have sliding doors like minivans have.... that come out and straight back. now that would be awesome sleek and no worries about people next to you. :-P

quote Originally posted by Niterrorz: ok you guys think some of those ideas are questionable.....ive had this on my mind for a while but the wiring aspect is throwing me off...... have sliding doors like minivans have.... that come out and straight back. now that would be awesome sleek and no worries about people next to you. :-P

speechless.......wait i feeling somethign coming on..... OMFG THAT WAS TOTALLY EPIC!!! i sooo want one now.... can i win the lotto PALLLLLLEEAASE! if only for this door....

quote Originally posted by dobey:

I want one!

Holy smokes that is the coolest door I have EVER seen.... How the hell does it do that and where the hell does it go? It looks like it freakin' disappears.... Is that a photochop or is that real? It happens so damn fast it is almost hard to tell. It does APPEAR to be a real door going underneath tho.... Anyone? Peace

Pete

quote Originally posted by jscott1: 6) ANY type hinge, (Butterfly, lambo, gullwing, koenigsegg) is better than stock. That 10,000 year old technology hinge has to go.

At least in a Fiero, I can pretty much guarantee that any hinge besides stock is going to add weight over stock.

You call that progress?

quote Originally posted by Pete Matos: Holy smokes that is the coolest door I have EVER seen.... How the hell does it do that and where the hell does it go? It looks like it freakin' disappears.... Is that a photochop or is that real? It happens so damn fast it is almost hard to tell. It does APPEAR to be a real door going underneath tho.... Anyone? Peace Pete

It's real. The car in the video was pretty heavily modified to do it. It goes down under the car. Would be pretty hard to do on a Fiero that sits so close to the ground though.

quote Originally posted by pmbrunelle: At least in a Fiero, I can pretty much guarantee that any hinge besides stock is going to add weight over stock. You call that progress?

the bugatti weighs in like a cow and some people would say thats progressive

quote Originally posted by pmbrunelle: At least in a Fiero, I can pretty much guarantee that any hinge besides stock is going to add weight over stock. You call that progress?

Not everybody is obsessed with weight. Besides we have invented new metals other than steel. Make the hinges out of titanium. That would lighten it up.

That disappearing door is awesome!

Every car should have something other than the 19th century Benz hinge which probably dates back to the dark ages.

[This message has been edited by jscott1 (edited 08-15-2011).]

Wow! That door takes me back to the family truckster we used to drive around in when I was a kid! Don't think that it's new technology....Here's a video from the Tube of the rear door function on a 1972 Kingswood stationwagon; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ll-OsKw0mDQ

speaking of wieght what do the doors weigh in at for the stock fiero say with power windows and such? cus they feel like they are at least 80 pounds to me. id wieght them but dont have a scale to put them on :-( does anyone make lighter doors that are as strong for side inpact?

Well, I suppose if you put in a roll cage with a side impact bar you could get away with just using the Fiero door skin as the door, should be about the same in safety.

Chris

humm well what do the kit cars use? it doesnt look like they use stock fiero doors.... i could definatly be wrong there tho. it just seems 26 years later youd think someone would have tube framed and fiberglassed a light door or something.

quote Originally posted by jscott1: That 10,000 year old technology hinge has to go.

True, but the wheel has been around longer and it seems to be working out pretty well so far

Well, I suppose in a crash, the door may not function as first built, real similar to the standard doors we mostly have now. So in a crash
the jaws of live may come into play as they sometimes do nowadays. They are cool, no doubt, just not my cup of beer!!! For lighter door
construction-Whodeanie, from Woodstock, Ga. uses tubing-some square/round & foam w/gussets as needed for some of his custom work. His workmanship is superb.

quote Originally posted by ALJR: True, but the wheel has been around longer and it seems to be working out pretty well so far

True again, but there have been some advances along the way

An accident huh, what about an external roll cage



Chris

quote Originally posted by pmbrunelle: At least in a Fiero, I can pretty much guarantee that any hinge besides stock is going to add weight over stock. You call that progress?

Have you seen the waist line of most Fiero owners at a show? Most if not many have at least 30-pounds of fat hanging over their belt. You can't call that "progress" if the owner of a two seater car takes twice the amount of time getting out of a tiny commuter car, right? A Decah or VDI kit weight is 30-pounds a set.

I remember back in the day when many mocked the idea of having VDC doors (it's a fad, it's play'd and Lamborghini doesn't make add them on their cars). True. A SUV or truck with them is some what stupid. However, with the right car and the right car with limited showings the VDC kits might have a longer standing than what most might think. Currently, all of my Fieros have them and I doubt likely I will opt out in having them on a Fiero. Currently, I have five sets (2-Decah and 3-VDI).

I remember back when most companies in early 2000 didn't want to take on the task at building a set for Fiero owners (not enough volumes to make a profit). I personally had to travel 3200 miles to largo FL for a company to install a prototype for the Fiero. Nearly 12 years later we seen several companies produce them (some good, some bad). I'm guessing, but I think VDC on Fieros will be around for some time-just like the layers of fat that currently around the waist of Fiero owners.

Personally, I welcome the idea of a someone here having Gullwings or even an electrical VDC on a Fiero. Super cool would be a reverse VDC, but right now nobody is venturing these unchartered areas. In any case, most will continue the stock door set-up.

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"Friends don't let their friends drive stock."

Curly, are you suggesting using Jenny Craig as a weight reduction for our cars LOL! I think if I lost any weight, I would disappear!

These cars are not Lotus's or U2's, why is everyone so obsessed with weight? Could someone please do this for me, I'd like to see it tested, run your car on the quarter mile, then add 30 pounds and run it again, I'd like to see how much of a performance "loss" 30 pounds would make. I did something like this, I ran my car alone, 16.3 seconds, then I put a 180 lb passenger in it, and ran it again, 16.4. I don't think 30 lbs would make that much a difference.

Chris

quote Originally posted by Letsbuildanexotic: Curly, are you suggesting using Jenny Craig as a weight reduction for our cars LOL! I think if I lost any weight, I would disappear! Chris

Yeah, just the owners. Jenny Craig could be a show sponsor. I could stand to loose 30-40 pound right now. As for the car's weight that's really silly when adding sub woofers and big brakes/wheels/tires.