I don't know anything about you Ramses, including your approximate age. I am assuming you're a little on the younger side from the fact that you posted this here, and didn't fully realize that you were asking for permission to steal from someone.

The other day, one of my students got a call at the school. She was not able to take a call, so I took a message. I told her that her boyfriend had called, and she then called him back on a break. Well, he tells her that her mom just found out she has skin cancer. Understandably, my student has a melt-down. When I go to find out what happened, she tells me about the message. I then ask her how old her boyfriend is, and she replies 22. She then asks why, so I explain that it was a really immature decision to call her while at school and throw her into turmoil, especially considering she still has to drive home in that condition. I then spend about 30 minutes calming her down. Experience and maturity would have influenced him to wait until she was safe at home to drop something like that on her. I see this as a similar situation.

You are parting out someone else's property, seeing as how you did not pay for it, and you are going to make a profit off of it from the looks of it. You "complained" about the condition of the engine, and made it look like Driver went back on his word, but offer no real apology for going back on your word to pay. Do you need our permission to steal? No. Will you get our permission to steal? No. Have you pretty much gauranteed that no one on this forum will ever take your word as credit? Yes. Posting this was a mistake, and probably hurt you more than it could ever possibly help. Learn from this, and if there is ever a next time, don't handle it in the same way.

[This message has been edited by mptighe (edited 11-26-2010).]

Hmm, well, my take on this, is even if the engine needs rebuilt, a rebuild kit isnt that expensive nor is the machine work to resurface everything, turn the crank etc, so for i would say about $400-500 including the price of the bad engine you have a brand spanking new ready to rock engine built, not to mention another cradle and possibly another tranny. If all else fails its still a spare block, valve covers, set of heads, intake, cradle, brackets, you name it. so even if the engine is bad the $75 is still a heck of a deal, .. pay it.


--Tim---

I've seen many other posts from the OP... did you pay for the engine yet, or are you just hoping this will go away? I've even seen posts in the mall started by you.

[This message has been edited by mptighe (edited 12-28-2010).]

pay him.
the manifolds, the alt bracket, and the HMB will make your money 4 fold.

Still posting in numerous threads.... are you planning to even respond to this one that you started?

It sounds like Driven5 has lied to you, and / or doesn't understand what it means to have a low mileage engine / rebuilt. I sold a 73 Oldsmobile Cutlass with an engine that had 80k original miles on it to a guy in New Hampshire. It really did drive exceptionally well. I gave it a tune-up and rebuilt the carburetor and it just purred. It never hesitated either after rebuilding and tuning that carb. Downshifts were immediate and smooth. This guy had it for a year, but eventually had to change the transmission pump in the Th-350. So he pulled the motor and transmission to do it (easy thing to do in a 70s car). While it was out, he painted the engine, and simply replaced the pump on the transmission. Other than new valve cover seals and an intake manifold seal, the engine was exactly the same motor.

He then sold it to a kid who coincidentally lives 5 miles from my house, so it went to NH from FL, and then back to FL again. The kid bought it from the guy and he had advertised it as having been rebuilt (which I know it wasn't because the guy told me it wasn't).

You just have to be careful... either people have different interpretations about what a low mileage engine is, or what it means for a motor to be rebuilt... or he was flat-out cheating you and knew it.

That said, you should pay the $75 bucks. He agreed to it... it's a buyer beware kind of thing. The only honest thing to do is to abide by your end of the bargain.

------------------
Todd,
2008 Jeep Patriot Limited 4x2
2002 Ford Explorer Sport 2dr 4x2
2002 Ford Crown Victoria LX
1987 Pontiac Fiero SE / V6
1973 Volkswagen Type-2 Transporter

quote Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]: It sounds like Driven5 has lied to you, and / or doesn't understand what it means to have a low mileage engine / rebuilt.

I don't know I would jump to that conclusion. It's one person's word against another, and it doesn't look like you read the other side (excerpt from page 1).

quote Originally posted by Driven5: The other side of the story: There were no promises, pretenses, or implications of condition given to me by the previous seller beyond starting it, especially considering its time spent being completely neglected. As a seller, I too made none other than when we did run it briefly, it sounded "surprisingly good" with the exception of what sounded like the alternator squealing...And that was 100% the truth, as old forum member nocones could easily attest.

I would read his entire response, as it seems more credible than Ramses', especially considering how Ramses has been making a profit off of the motor already and has fully admitted he did wrong by the agreement and still has yet to respond.


**EDIT** I also find it VERY peculiar that he stopped posting in HIS OWN THREAD once the other party explained his side of things. Basically, I think Ramses was/is pulling a fast one here, and hopefully no one else will let him buy anything on credit. I'm sure there will be something wrong with that too, and he will refuse to pay.

[This message has been edited by mptighe (edited 12-27-2010).]

quote Originally posted by mptighe: I would read his entire response, as it seems more credible than Ramses', especially considering how Ramses has been making a profit off of the motor already and has fully admitted he did wrong by the agreement and still has yet to respond. **EDIT** I also find it VERY peculiar that he stopped posting in HIS OWN THREAD once the other party explained his side of things. Basically, I think Ramses was/is pulling a fast one here, and hopefully no one else will let him buy anything on credit. I'm sure there will be something wrong with that too, and he will refuse to pay.

Well, I got side tracked with my own story about a car that I sold, that was then sold to someone else who wasn't totally honest to the person that HE sold it to. The kid overpaid I think, (although that doesn't make it inherently dishonest), but the information that he was given was incorrect based on the history of the car that I knew since I was one of the original owners.

But the bottom line is, he should still pay the $75 simply because it's not such a clear cut case of dishonesty, and he should still uphold his end of the bargain. Either that, or return the whole thing and get all the money back (which I guess is impossible at this point).

------------------
Todd,
2008 Jeep Patriot Limited 4x2
2002 Ford Explorer Sport 2dr 4x2
2002 Ford Crown Victoria LX
1987 Pontiac Fiero SE / V6
1973 Volkswagen Type-2 Transporter

$75 for a engine, trans, and cradle is nothing. you can see from the exterior of the engine alone that its filthy, so I'm confused why you were expecting the inside to be in good shape?

My take is this........ Are you serious? You bought a complete engine and cradle and harness for $75.00!! Hell I would pay more than that just for a good cradle...!! To have a complete engine even if it is covered with oil and gunk and is in need of a rebuild would be worth nearly that much alone if it was rebuildable at all. Then you say that he let you take it and even delivered it to your house without being paid for it and you have the audacity to post a thread to gripe about it? I think he did you a favor.... I think that if you intentionally ducked out on paying him for personal financial difficulties and then made it difficult for him to contact you about getting his money that does not say a whole lot of good things about your character. Everyone has difficulties in life and financial and physical setbacks it is just part of life. If you thought you would have difficulty paying for this you should have never taken delivery of it. If you physically looked at it and it is obvious from the pics it was not in the best of shape yet you still agreed to buy it then I say you are stuck with it. You should sell something YOU own or whatever you have to do to pay him the money you agreed to and then clean up what you got from him and THEN sell it to recoup your money. You should easily be able to do that from what it sounds like. I gotta tell you I am more than familiar with financial setbacks and in fact I have been out of work for nearly three months now due to a health issue and the people on this forum have been MORE than amazing with their kindness and generosity so IMHO you NEED to do whatever you can to save face here. These fellas are cool, understanding, helpful, and kind in ways that you cannot imagine and if you intend to ever be a part of this community and own a fiero in the future it is in your best interest to make things right between you two. $75.00 is NOTHING in this world no matter how much money you make but your character and respect in the eyes of others is PRICELESS..... Do the right thing no matter how much you think it hurts and you will be better off in the future. Good luck and peace...

Pete

quote Originally posted by 82-T/A [At Work]: Well, I got side tracked with my own story about a car that I sold, that was then sold to someone else who wasn't totally honest to the person that HE sold it to. The kid overpaid I think, (although that doesn't make it inherently dishonest), but the information that he was given was incorrect based on the history of the car that I knew since I was one of the original owners. But the bottom line is, he should still pay the $75 simply because it's not such a clear cut case of dishonesty, and he should still uphold his end of the bargain. Either that, or return the whole thing and get all the money back (which I guess is impossible at this point).

Strangely enough, I went back and read the original for sale post, and nowhere in it did Driven claim it was rebuilt or had any work done to it. Also, Ramses is trying to get orders going in the mall for his Y-pipe setup. He has the time energy and funds to start that project, but has none to pay Driven? I wonder if he'll let anyone pay him after they receive their part from him?

https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum4/HTML/054948.html

quote Originally posted by mptighe: I've seen many other posts from the OP... did you pay for the engine yet, or are you just hoping this will go away? I've even seen posts in the mall started by you.

Its nice to see people taking a vested interest in the integrity of the community.

To answer your inquiry as best I can, I have received neither money nor contact of any kind. Sure some sort of communication to give closure to the issue would be nice, but I have pretty much given up on this whole situation. It's unfortunate that it had to come to this, but that's life sometimes.

quote Originally posted by Driven5:Its nice to see people taking a vested interest in the integrity of the community. To answer your inquiry as best I can, I have received neither money nor contact of any kind. Sure some sort of communication to give closure to the issue would be nice, but I have pretty much given up on this whole situation. It's unfortunate that it had to come to this, but that's life sometimes.

Sorry to hear about this. In my opinion he doesn't need to be doing business here then.

[This message has been edited by mptighe (edited 12-30-2010).]

quote Originally posted by nutherproject68: I talked with Ramsespride this morning. Due to some recent run-ins with other PFF members he no longer feels welcome on the forum. He will not be making these Y-pipes and he will no longer be active on PFF. He said I could post some sort of message here if I wanted to. I thought that the guys interested in his idea deserved some sort of explanation as to why they will never see an end product. Please don't shoot the messenger.

From his Y-Pipe thread in the mall. At least he bailed before he ripped anyone else off. Sorry Driven5

quote Originally posted by Driven5: My wife has already chalked it up to a $75 lesson that she's never going to let me forget, nor will she let me trust anybody in the car world at their word again, and I'll finally be able to do the same.

^ ^ ^
This made me laugh.

It sounds like your wife and my wife need to get together and go bowling.

thanks for posting your side, and good luck on resolution for both of ya's.

------------------
<---- did you buy Cliff a beer?

quote Originally posted by blakeinspace: ^ ^ ^ This made me laugh. It sounds like your wife and my wife need to get together and go bowling. thanks for posting your side, and good luck on resolution for both of ya's.

Yours too? must be something in the water. (maybe is comes in the estrogen)

I think it’s funny that this thread it titled “A Rant and APOLOGY to the forum.”
I read this originally and then again when it was linked to the Y pipe thread and nowhere do I see where ramsespride was apologetic about not paying. It was more like this is why I didn’t pay and don’t think I should, don’t you agree!!?? I was interested in the Y pipe thing but quickly became skeptical when it went from 25 to 45 and then even though he said he had made 3, there never was a picture. It sucks Driven5 got screwed out of 75 but luckily it was only 75. Thats why i'll only use Paypal or in person.
I also think it’s funny that rams didn’t get speed banned from posting this when others have gotten the boot for much less much quicker. Oh well.

quote Originally posted by DLCLK87GT: I also think it’s funny that rams didn’t get speed banned from posting this when others have gotten the boot for much less much quicker. Oh well.

You know I was wondering about this as well. That's why when I saw him posting trying to sell more things in the Mall, I decided to push the issue.

quote Originally posted by mptighe: You know I was wondering about this as well.

From what I’ve seen it's not WHAT you do, just WHO you do it to. It's like being in High School all over again and the little clicks. It’s ok to pick on the geeks, just don’t mess with somebody on the football team.

Seriously! Pay him HIS money. Sorry, but that is stealing if you do not pay for the goods that you have in your posession. If you are really broke, then cut the guys lawn. Do something to make amends for this. As it sits, with Ramsespride TRYING TO SELL PARTS THAT ARE NOT HIS, he is being a crook. No grey area. Period.

I haven't negged you yet, but really, I frickin'n hate CROOKS!

Tony Kania

Ive stayed out of this thread long enuf due to myself being put right in the middle of this thing so, I will say this I am going to see to it that driven gets paid one way or another even if it has to be out of my own pocket.
I do not agree with how Rams went about all this but I do understand his living situation and the things going on within his familys home at this moment, things that everyone on here are not aware of.
Let me just say its messed up to say the least.

Anyhoo Driven pm sent
lets get this sorted out so we can all get along within the club and get back to what matters.

At some point in our lives we all have a moment of poor judgment be it speeding, drinking, whatever it is but, we ALL do it, let this just be a life lesson for Rams its ok to ask for help once and awile.

[This message has been edited by jetsnvettes2000 (edited 01-06-2011).]

quote Originally posted by jetsnvettes2000: Ive stayed out of this thread long enuf due to myself being put right in the middle of this thing so, I will say this I am going to see to it that driven gets paid one way or another even if it has to be out of my own pocket. I do not agree with how Rams went about all this but I do understand his living situation and things going on within his familys home at this moment, things everyone on here is not aware of. Let me just say its messed up to say the least. Anyhoo driven pm sent lets get this sorted out so we can all get along within the club and get back to what matters. At some point in our lives we all have a moment of poor judgment be it speeding, drinking, whatever it is but, we ALL do it, let this just be a life lesson for Rams its ok to ask for help once and awile.

I admire your intention. I'm going to ask a question though. By offering to pay his debt for him, a debt he himself thinks he's not obligated to pay, are you really helping him or enabling him?

quote Originally posted by mptighe: I admire your intention. I'm going to ask a question though. By offering to pay his debt for him, a debt he himself thinks he's not obligated to pay, are you really helping him or enabling him?

In some cases I prob would agree I would be enabling him but in this case like I said above their are some circumstances within this situation that I wont say on here that has contributed to his behavior I am not making excuses for him by any means I dont agree with whats happend but I do understand the events that led up to it and being the type of person I am I will help him out this one time to get him over that bump so he can get on the important task of gettin things set right within his life. we all make mistakes this was a mistake on his part yes but it overall its one mistake. Rams takes care of his sisters and is a verry responsible guy for the most part. Im glad to have him in the club he is a verry helpful young man and someday when this is all passed im shure we will all have a laugh about it and maby see a 6 pack come back our way.

[This message has been edited by jetsnvettes2000 (edited 01-06-2011).]

I just wanted to add....

I like Rams. I know that he tries to be a good person. Age has a bit to do with it. Hopefully this will work out for all parties involved.

I am not threatening, or stirring the pot for anyone, but remember, people get killed for less. I go miles out of my way to make sure that I do not screw another. It is morals. Well, morals, and a few too many Mafia books.

I dunno Tony--the whole thing seems kinda odd.
Judging from some of his replys in the Fox Valley thread, I don't think money is the problem. He seems to have plenty to cruise on. And enough to make plans for this:

quote Originally posted by project34: Ramsespride, have you a plan you can share with all of us here for rectifying that unfortunate situation?

quote Originally posted by Ramespride: Step 1: Sell the Camaro and use that money coupled with the cash from the Fiero sale, a few small odds and ends Fiero related, and whats left from my last paycheck to find, and buy a decent 87 or 88 GT. Drive it till the 2.8 dies then do a 3400Supercharged swap. Yes i said 3400 Supercharged swap.

Seems like, he could have come up with a measly $75 to pay off his own debt. Driven was certainly more than patient.

https://www.fiero.nl/forum/F.../HTML/081969-11.html

quote Originally posted by maryjane: I dunno Tony--the whole thing seems kinda odd. Judging from some of his replys in the Fox Valley thread, I don't think money is the problem. He seems to have plenty to cruise on. And enough to make plans for this: Seems like, he could have come up with a measly $75 to pay off his own debt. Driven was certainly more than patient. https://www.fiero.nl/forum/F.../HTML/081969-11.html

lol ya rams has some ideas floatin around in his mind once and awile but like most young guys its all in mind and not really somthin that actually has happend maby someday but right now naw the kid isnt working and like i said above still is trying to take care of his siblings best he can so ill help him out and he has the opertunity to work it off for me w projects i have going on. he is a good kid just needs a bit of a kick in the pants to get back on track again.

quote Originally posted by jetsnvettes2000: lol ya rams has some ideas floatin around in his mind once and awile but like most young guys its all in mind and not really somthin that actually has happend maby someday but right now naw the kid isnt working and like i said above still is trying to take care of his siblings best he can so ill help him out and he has the opertunity to work it off for me w projects i have going on. he is a good kid just needs a bit of a kick in the pants to get back on track again.

This may be, but I don't see this changing anything for him on the forum. HE didn't handle his own situation, hell he didn't even admit he was in the wrong. I will still caution people not to deal with him on money matters, whether you're there to settle his debt or not. He needs to be a grown up here and not let you clean up after him. This won't really settle anything except for Driven5's missing $75.

Like I said in the first post I made in this thread, I got stuck in the middle of this and well I am a friend of both these guys. I am doing what I think is best here to temp fix the issue and after its delt with I will put it to bed and move on.
I've said how many times now, Rams will be givin the opportunity to work it off and save face.
Beyond that its his prerogative to apologize, if he does or not personally I really dont care what happens after this point.
I am just creating an opportunity for both partys to have closure, yes its costing me alittle cash but its only money and in the grand scheme of things I feel its worth the trouble.

ill fix my spelling later at work and in hurry typing on cell

[This message has been edited by jetsnvettes2000 (edited 01-07-2011).]

quote Originally posted by jetsnvettes2000: ill fix my spelling later at work and in hurry typing on cell

LOL I was going to ask when PK got on your computer... I get what you're saying. You're being a very considerate person, and even if it doesn't turn out, it's still worth a +1 from me.

quote Originally posted by mptighe: it's still worth a +1 from me.

X2 Thanks for your level head in a matter as touchy as this.