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Rear diffusers by ALLTRBO
Started on: 01-23-2010 04:20 PM
Replies: 85
Last post by: dobey on 08-26-2010 03:47 PM
Australian
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Report this Post02-18-2010 07:26 AM Click Here to See the Profile for AustralianClick Here to visit Australian's HomePageClick Here to Email AustralianSend a Private Message to AustralianDirect Link to This Post
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/DIFF...?hash=item2a03ddd963
70$ + delivery

This is the new one i love below.



Ok i got one for $100 delivered.
i havent got pics of the rear of my flared guards so i could not photoshop my car but it is the right price lack of pics make it a gamble the fiero rear track is about 7 inches wider so few mods will need to be made.

http://www.wedriveexcitement.com/

[This message has been edited by Australian (edited 02-18-2010).]

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IIKool
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Report this Post02-27-2010 07:32 AM Click Here to See the Profile for IIKoolClick Here to Email IIKoolSend a Private Message to IIKoolDirect Link to This Post
Who makes the one on the red car?
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skuzzbomer
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Report this Post02-27-2010 12:38 PM Click Here to See the Profile for skuzzbomerSend a Private Message to skuzzbomerDirect Link to This Post
I think that red car is a Vauxhall...
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Report this Post03-05-2010 02:09 AM Click Here to See the Profile for faaaaqClick Here to Email faaaaqSend a Private Message to faaaaqDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by fieroguy123:

I feel the same way man. I'm in too deep with my car to turn back. Now I MUST have a diffuser too. I really want one. I have a yellow fast back. Can anyone photoshop a pic of the blue car above in yellow?




not sure why it looks so green. just a quick photoshop, hope its good enough
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Report this Post03-05-2010 02:36 AM Click Here to See the Profile for AustralianClick Here to visit Australian's HomePageClick Here to Email AustralianSend a Private Message to AustralianDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by skuzzbomer:

I think that red car is a Vauxhall...


The brand is on the number plate HSV Holden special vehicles made for Vauxall and Pontiac.

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Report this Post03-05-2010 11:44 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ALJRClick Here to Email ALJRSend a Private Message to ALJRDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by ALLTRBO:







I like this one the best... When I was looking at the ones at the top of the post, I was thinking it covered too much of the rear bumper and overpowered the look of the rear. Not to mention if you got bumped from behind, it would get damaged very easy...

The above pic looks the nicest and it retains more of the "bumper" and is not as overpowering. However, I think it would look best if more of the "bumper" was retained... Maybe use the bottom half of the facia from end to end (around the exhaust tips as well)...

Just my .02
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Report this Post03-06-2010 08:57 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ALLTRBOSend a Private Message to ALLTRBODirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by ALJR:
Maybe use the bottom half of the facia from end to end (around the exhaust tips as well)...
Just my .02

Much like the 2010 Camaro diffuser (except functional). I could definitely see that on a Fiero.

[This message has been edited by ALLTRBO (edited 03-06-2010).]

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skuzzbomer
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Report this Post03-07-2010 01:10 AM Click Here to See the Profile for skuzzbomerSend a Private Message to skuzzbomerDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by ALLTRBO:

Much like the 2010 Camaro diffuser (except functional). I could definitely see that on a Fiero.



I didn't even notice the new Camaro had a "diffuser" - though, the only ones I've seen in person were going the other way.
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Report this Post03-08-2010 02:48 AM Click Here to See the Profile for AustralianClick Here to visit Australian's HomePageClick Here to Email AustralianSend a Private Message to AustralianDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by skuzzbomer:


I didn't even notice the new Camaro had a "diffuser" - though, the only ones I've seen in person were going the other way.


Evey single new car coming out has a diffuser even crappy little hatchbacks i mean everything.
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Report this Post03-08-2010 08:00 AM Click Here to See the Profile for Macs86GTSend a Private Message to Macs86GTDirect Link to This Post
it's the hot new me too look. Who c ares if it actually functions; i do of course, but that's just me.
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americasfuture2k
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Report this Post03-08-2010 12:36 PM Click Here to See the Profile for americasfuture2kSend a Private Message to americasfuture2kDirect Link to This Post
love the way diffusers look, but what do they do as far as aerodynamics? i never really heard or looked it up.

------------------
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Youtube Videos of My GT | modernize your fiero with technology!
If you can't fix it with a hammer, you've got an electrical problem
Fiero's are people too. We pay just as much attention to them, if not more than our loved ones
screw paying those bastards. im not going to become rich by paying for things.....

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Report this Post03-08-2010 01:16 PM Click Here to See the Profile for doublec4Click Here to Email doublec4Send a Private Message to doublec4Direct Link to This Post
A proper rear diffuser should increase the efficiency of the evacuation of air from underneath the vehicle. They are supposed to be coupled with underbody trays and front splitters to work properly and gain the maximum benefit. Together, they will increase downforce. Thats my understanding of it.
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Report this Post03-08-2010 07:54 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ALLTRBOSend a Private Message to ALLTRBODirect Link to This Post
^ You are correct, and there's more. It functions, along with a splitter and underbody trays, via Bernoulli's principle.

Here's the link I posted earlier in this thread. It'll explain all of the basics.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diffuser_(automotive)

More:
http://www.racecar-engineer...users-explained.html
http://www.shell.com/home/c...explained/diffusers/

Visuals:
http://www.europeancarweb.c..._guide/photo_01.html
http://www.europeancarweb.c..._guide/photo_07.html
http://www.modified.com/tec...part_2/photo_07.html
http://www.supercars.net/Pi...5_Ferrari_F43012.jpg

Math:
http://www.symscape.com/pressure-coefficient

It's harder and less efficient to do on a Fiero with our mid-engine layout that requires airflow to travel into the engine bay from underneath and out of the vents (which has its own advantages), but very positive results can still be had when done correctly. I'm researching on how to do that correctly. The Fiero bottom side is already relatively flat, so will be an easy upgrade to add easily removable flat sheets everywhere possible under there to clean up the airflow. I'd like to take several pressure sensors and airspeed sensors and place them under the car to datalog where and how much pressure and flow changes in different areas with different mods.
Of course the faster you go, the more this comes into play.
Reasons like this are part of why I'm selling off my stock of toys (the fast cars, not the fast ZX-10R. ) and buying a 2010 V6 Camaro to DD (that I'll just have to turbo. DOH!). I'm tying to go 'all out street' with this turbo Fiero, it will be my only 4-wheeled toy. Semi-engineered, not cobbled together. Wish me luck, heh.

Yes, it's unfortunate that it's the current fad amongst car manufacturers (and ricers). Just like most of the scoops that are slapped on all over cars by the factories (and ricers), these "diffusers" are usually only for looks.
The Camaro 'diffuser' should be mildly effective though, if the stock mufflers are retained as shown above. It won't do much to eliminate the turbulence in the flow, but it looks like it would provide the means for the higher velocity (though 'dirty') flow underneath to slow back to ambient pressure somewhat properly. It would be even better if the fake vent directly above the 'diffuser' were opened up into a real vent (very easy to do, I'd think).

[This message has been edited by ALLTRBO (edited 03-08-2010).]

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nitroheadz28
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Report this Post03-08-2010 08:22 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nitroheadz28Send a Private Message to nitroheadz28Direct Link to This Post
I LOVE that look on the Fiero, when I get mine and if something good looking gets produced, count me in!
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Report this Post08-05-2010 12:50 AM Click Here to See the Profile for doublec4Click Here to Email doublec4Send a Private Message to doublec4Direct Link to This Post
bump..

Really hoping some kind of diffuser for the stock aero rear bumper gets made one day...

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//www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum3/HTML/000100.html

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Report this Post08-05-2010 01:35 AM Click Here to See the Profile for BlacktreeClick Here to visit Blacktree's HomePageClick Here to Email BlacktreeSend a Private Message to BlacktreeDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by ALLTRBO: Much like the 2010 Camaro diffuser (except functional). I could definitely see that on a Fiero.

http://myfiero.com/uploads/20747_.jpg

IMO, the stock Fiero trunk and functional rear diffusers are mutually exclusive. The trunk hangs down too low. It's at the same level as the bottom of the rear fascia. This leaves no room for a diffuser section. If you're afraid to cut the trunk, you'll have to settle with something like that Camaro one.

I'd be more than happy to make diffuser fascias. I even have one. But it requires cutting out some of the trunk.
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Report this Post08-05-2010 02:08 AM Click Here to See the Profile for doublec4Click Here to Email doublec4Send a Private Message to doublec4Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Blacktree:

IMO, the stock Fiero trunk and functional rear diffusers are mutually exclusive. The trunk hangs down too low. It's at the same level as the bottom of the rear fascia. This leaves no room for a diffuser section. If you're afraid to cut the trunk, you'll have to settle with something like that Camaro one.

I'd be more than happy to make diffuser fascias. I even have one. But it requires cutting out some of the trunk.


I agree to some extent.. but when I look at height that the subframe is from the ground, and then look at the height of the bottom of the trunk, the trunk sits quite a bit higher. There is some room to work with so that a "tunnel" or channel can be upturned from the rear cradle area, to the bottom of the bumper. When I was messing around with cardboard, I was able to get a nice curve that followed that path.
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Report this Post08-05-2010 07:17 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ALLTRBOSend a Private Message to ALLTRBODirect Link to This Post
The bottom of my trunk is now cut. I'll also weld up a tubular rear bumper in place of the stocker if I need to. The sport/race exhaust is going under there, but as high and as far forward as possible to make room for a reasonably functional diffuser. The top of the diffuser will be vented to help extract the exhaust heat. The diffuser will likely also extend slighty rearward of the fascia (maybe an inch or so), helping to get a more gradual slope. I think I can make that look good.

I have a spare rear fascia, it'll be getting hacked up so I can make the diffuser, then the nicer rear fascia will be properly cut to accept it. This will all take a while, but I'll accept no less.

------------------

'10 Camaro LT/RS, 312hp V6 6-speed
'88 Fiero GT - coming soon! - Project MIDTRBO

The rest of my cars are for sale
There's no replacement for turbo placement

[This message has been edited by ALLTRBO (edited 08-05-2010).]

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Report this Post08-05-2010 07:22 AM Click Here to See the Profile for AustralianClick Here to visit Australian's HomePageClick Here to Email AustralianSend a Private Message to AustralianDirect Link to This Post
Alltrbo be sure post pics when done. My diffuser is on back burner a while i just painted whole car so will leave it 12 months for now i do have the diffuser itself but going to enjoy my car a while before i make further changes.
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Report this Post08-22-2010 12:55 AM Click Here to See the Profile for doublec4Click Here to Email doublec4Send a Private Message to doublec4Direct Link to This Post


------------------

Check out my build!
//www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum3/HTML/000100.html

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Report this Post08-22-2010 06:07 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ALLTRBOSend a Private Message to ALLTRBODirect Link to This Post
Cool, that'll look pretty sweet, can't wait to see it installed!
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Report this Post08-22-2010 08:39 PM Click Here to See the Profile for madcurlClick Here to Email madcurlSend a Private Message to madcurlDirect Link to This Post
I saw this at SEMA 2009. I think the mounting point are a bit ugly.








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Report this Post08-22-2010 09:11 PM Click Here to See the Profile for doublec4Click Here to Email doublec4Send a Private Message to doublec4Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by madcurl:

I saw this at SEMA 2009. I think the mounting point are a bit ugly.



I'm not going to mount it like that. That does look ugly. Mine will sit flush with the bumper, not with a 6 inch gap lol. Don't worry

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//www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum3/HTML/000100.html

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Report this Post08-23-2010 09:01 PM Click Here to See the Profile for doublec4Click Here to Email doublec4Send a Private Message to doublec4Direct Link to This Post
Is this better for mounting?





More pictures in my build thread, and I'll take more tomorrow!

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Check out my build!
//www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum3/HTML/000100.html

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Report this Post08-23-2010 10:16 PM Click Here to See the Profile for nitroheadz28Send a Private Message to nitroheadz28Direct Link to This Post
Love it!!!!!!! Love your car! Haha great job.
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Report this Post08-23-2010 11:16 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BlacktreeClick Here to visit Blacktree's HomePageClick Here to Email BlacktreeSend a Private Message to BlacktreeDirect Link to This Post
Hey Chris, that looks pretty good. I'm looking forward to some "at a distance" shots.

That said, the rear mounting setup is making me cringe. That doesn't look very sturdy. If the diffuser makes enough downforce, it could cause problems.

I'm not trying to poo-poo your idea, though. That's a great proof of concept, which IMO could be made even better with a little tweaking.
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Report this Post08-23-2010 11:30 PM Click Here to See the Profile for doublec4Click Here to Email doublec4Send a Private Message to doublec4Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Blacktree:

Hey Chris, that looks pretty good. I'm looking forward to some "at a distance" shots.

That said, the rear mounting setup is making me cringe. That doesn't look very sturdy. If the diffuser makes enough downforce, it could cause problems.

I'm not trying to poo-poo your idea, though. That's a great proof of concept, which IMO could be made even better with a little tweaking.


Thanks

Its not too bad in terms of sturdyness, I was pulling on it pretty hard and it didn't budge, however I'm very open to suggestions. Throw some ideas at me!
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Report this Post08-23-2010 11:38 PM Click Here to See the Profile for dobeySend a Private Message to dobeyDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by Blacktree:
Hey Chris, that looks pretty good. I'm looking forward to some "at a distance" shots.

That said, the rear mounting setup is making me cringe. That doesn't look very sturdy. If the diffuser makes enough downforce, it could cause problems.

I'm not trying to poo-poo your idea, though. That's a great proof of concept, which IMO could be made even better with a little tweaking.


That 'diffuser' isn't going to change the aerodynamics of the car enough to make any useful difference one way or the other. Notice the smooth up-turned lip at the upper edge of the exit? It will actually help air to stick to the body longer. It might even cause a slight decrease in fuel economy too. It looks nice, but that's about all this particular one is designed for.

This one though (yeah, it's huge, but notice that it's all flat/sharp edges on the back side. This causes the air to 'break' off the car sooner. http://www.lotustalk.com/fo...er-large-pics-79353/

And here's some good info about the JGTC NSX diffusers: http://www.scienceofspeed.c...user/default_sub.asp
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Report this Post08-24-2010 12:13 AM Click Here to See the Profile for doublec4Click Here to Email doublec4Send a Private Message to doublec4Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by dobey:


That 'diffuser' isn't going to change the aerodynamics of the car enough to make any useful difference one way or the other. Notice the smooth up-turned lip at the upper edge of the exit? It will actually help air to stick to the body longer. It might even cause a slight decrease in fuel economy too. It looks nice, but that's about all this particular one is designed for.

This one though (yeah, it's huge, but notice that it's all flat/sharp edges on the back side. This causes the air to 'break' off the car sooner. http://www.lotustalk.com/fo...er-large-pics-79353/

And here's some good info about the JGTC NSX diffusers: http://www.scienceofspeed.c...user/default_sub.asp


I'm not really expecting staggering results, but man that lotus is bad ass! That diffuser is a bit much for the street lol.
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Report this Post08-24-2010 07:32 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ALLTRBOSend a Private Message to ALLTRBODirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by dobey:

I think he's going for looks almost exclusively, at least that's what I gathered. A diffuser is only one part of a system, afterall. I don't think it'll hurt anything though, I seriously doubt that it'll add drag over the stock bumper, providing that air isn't getting trapped above it (creating the 'parachute effect'). It should clean up some turbulence a bit.

Of course I'm only going by a few pictures so I suppose YMMV.
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Report this Post08-24-2010 07:33 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ALLTRBOSend a Private Message to ALLTRBODirect Link to This Post

ALLTRBO

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That Lotus looks like a cartoon, heh. It fits the rest of the styling well! I bet it sticks, though.
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Report this Post08-24-2010 09:13 AM Click Here to See the Profile for BlacktreeClick Here to visit Blacktree's HomePageClick Here to Email BlacktreeSend a Private Message to BlacktreeDirect Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by doublec4: Its not too bad in terms of sturdyness, I was pulling on it pretty hard and it didn't budge, however I'm very open to suggestions. Throw some ideas at me!

I tend to be a little paranoid about stuff that can fall off the car. Your mounting setup may turn out just fine. As of right now, my only suggestion would be to drive it around and see how it holds up. It's a great excuse to hop in the Fiero and give it some exercise.
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Report this Post08-24-2010 06:32 PM Click Here to See the Profile for doublec4Click Here to Email doublec4Send a Private Message to doublec4Direct Link to This Post
Drove it a bit today, didn't fall off

I've yet to take it out on the highway though. I did take a few more pictures... again, excuse the filthy car! It's supposed to rain again so I didn't wash it.





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Report this Post08-24-2010 06:52 PM Click Here to See the Profile for BlacktreeClick Here to visit Blacktree's HomePageClick Here to Email BlacktreeSend a Private Message to BlacktreeDirect Link to This Post
That looks better than I expected. I was thinking it would hang down more, and look out of place. But IMO, it looks pretty good.

Just out of curiosity, is your Fiero lowered? I can't remember.

It looks like you've proven me wrong, Chris. Good job.
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Report this Post08-24-2010 07:00 PM Click Here to See the Profile for doublec4Click Here to Email doublec4Send a Private Message to doublec4Direct Link to This Post
I don't remember you being overly skeptical or doubtful, so I wouldn't say you were wrong! Constructive criticism is always welcome

I want to paint those aluminum flat bars black so they aren't visible. I'll get around to it when I wash the car.

Edit: Yes my car is lowered.. the front more so than the rear (Front: cut eibach springs Rear: Coilovers). I like the "raked look"

[This message has been edited by doublec4 (edited 08-24-2010).]

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Report this Post08-24-2010 11:36 PM Click Here to See the Profile for ALLTRBOSend a Private Message to ALLTRBODirect Link to This Post


That looks great with the wraparound spoiler and the raked stance!
You might want to watch the exhaust heat now that it's more boxed in, just something to think about.
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Report this Post08-25-2010 12:14 AM Click Here to See the Profile for doublec4Click Here to Email doublec4Send a Private Message to doublec4Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by ALLTRBO:



That looks great with the wraparound spoiler and the raked stance!
You might want to watch the exhaust heat now that it's more boxed in, just something to think about.


Check out my build thread and I think I posted a pic of the heat shield I whipped up for it. I will keep a close eye on it though.. from what I understand, carbon fiber is fairly heat resistent.
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Report this Post08-25-2010 12:19 AM Click Here to See the Profile for BlacktreeClick Here to visit Blacktree's HomePageClick Here to Email BlacktreeSend a Private Message to BlacktreeDirect Link to This Post
Yeah, the carbon will handle heat really well. The only concern would be the resin. But if it's not in direct contact with the hot muffler, then it shouldn't be a concern.
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Report this Post08-25-2010 12:42 AM Click Here to See the Profile for ALLTRBOSend a Private Message to ALLTRBODirect Link to This Post
Ahh, right, the build thread.
I wasn't referring to overheating the diffuser itself, but everything else, heh. There is less airflow to move the exhaust heat out behind the car, so it'll go into other things, like the trunk and the engine bay in general.
I guess it may not be an issue at all though, there is still a good bit of exposure, and it's not like you'll be running 30psi around a track like I plan to with the built 3.2 shortblock. That exhaust is going to glow! I'll need very good exhaust venting above the diffuser.
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Report this Post08-25-2010 01:05 AM Click Here to See the Profile for doublec4Click Here to Email doublec4Send a Private Message to doublec4Direct Link to This Post
 
quote
Originally posted by ALLTRBO:

Ahh, right, the build thread.
I wasn't referring to overheating the diffuser itself, but everything else, heh. There is less airflow to move the exhaust heat out behind the car, so it'll go into other things, like the trunk and the engine bay in general.
I guess it may not be an issue at all though, there is still a good bit of exposure, and it's not like you'll be running 30psi around a track like I plan to with the built 3.2 shortblock. That exhaust is going to glow! I'll need very good exhaust venting above the diffuser.


Cut the trunk out and vent it out from the top of the decklid, or maybe do something ferrari-ish and vent it out of the back of the bumper or between the tail lights with some mesh
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