I'm going to go ahead and step on a lot of toes: The kit Countach is dangerous as so much of the Fiero structure is cut away. Keep it as a Fiero or consider a rebody kit that retains the original structural integrity of the passenger compartment.
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10:20 AM
ducattiman Member
Posts: 674 From: TheNetherlands Registered: Mar 2003
Its called a exaust manifold, and since the very first internal combustion engine we have used them. 6 pipes into a single flange, then just like almost every single modern V engine theres a Y pipe connecting the two manifolds into the exuast, or in this case the turbo flange.
Why are we a cocky person. .Gee with that design why even brother with it,,.And as for a kitcar guy u say but never heard of a bundle of snakes..
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Originally posted by fierogt3800:
and as far as the search your talking about. please, PLEASE show me a single build thread for a car of this nature. heck id even like to see just the 4 rotor swap in a fiero, or the lamborghini, and unless theres a new nut on the kitcar forum the only V12 to touch a rebody is the BMW or in small doses the Etype/ XJS jag motor.
And again,,just because U CANT see it with YOUR eyes does not mean it does not exist..There r many reasons why i stop posting about my swap,it does not mean i stopped with the project,i am just not sharing.WOW and bet u just jump on read whats there and then log off,,What no phone calling,emailing,and follow up on other projects from people that r alittle to shy about sharing their hard work project so some lame hole can copy it and reap the rewards..I HAVE **** loads of pics from members that will never hit the net just because of i just said. And the BMW is only one,,the jag is overweight and outdated.
Originally posted by ducattiman: And the BMW is only one,,the jag is overweight and outdated.
That is actually a good point, which brings me to this.....
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Originally posted by Racing_Master: Grab a V12 from a BMW 8 series, or go to Lamborghini and order a replacement countach V12, or something of the sort, mate up a 5 or 6 speed transaxle, mount the engine Longitudinally, and get as much HP out of it as I can, and have a street dominating black lamborghini countach.
Not to bash you at all Racing_Master (I really like lambo projects.), but do you realize the amount of time and money that it actually takes to even acquire a V12 from Lamborghini? Go call up your closest Lamborghini dealer and ask for a crate V12 and IF you get a quote below $30,000 I'll be shocked. Even a used unit is going to set you back at a good deal HALF that (more liks $20,000 - $30,000).
Now on the otherhand BMWs, while they are more frequent and HAVE been thrown into replicas (there was a yellow Ferrari I've seen on the net with a BMW V12 on a tube frame), they just don't show up at pick-and-pulls or your local BMW dealership parting them out. I mean really for the cost of what it takes to get the motor and the accessories you probably could have nearly bought a completed kit. I have seen some completed units go pretty cheap though - like between $1,000-$2,000 cheap.
Good luck.
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12:18 PM
ALLTRBO Member
Posts: 2023 From: College Park, MD Registered: Mar 2006
Originally posted by Racing_Master: And about the twin turbo V12, a Countach has 4 seperate exhaust systems, a twin turbo is easy (3 pipes to 1 pipe on one side, doubled, those two pipes per side curled around to a Y pipe to make it a single pipe, flange for the turbo system, oiling system etc, you get the idea) it would be kinda weird looking at all the piping though. And the reason to have twin turbos is not about boost, its about turbo lag, a small turbo on one side, big on the other, to use the expanding exhaust gasses to spin the turbine, the smaller one would create the boost at lower RPMs, but not as much, but will reduce turbo lag, and then the bigger one spools up at higher speeds to produce the high RPM boost I want for racing. The small turbo is for taking off from a standstill. Late model turboed cars/trucks use twin turbos, or a varying vane single turbo.
I'm not going to get into an 'opinions' fight about body styles, but I will ask you kindly to do more research in the above area before you act like you know what you're talking about.
Here are a few links for you to get started, read them in succession. Understand them well, then continue to research more as they don't explain nearly everything about the subject.
Originally posted by Fiero84Freak: Now on the otherhand BMWs, while they are more frequent and HAVE been thrown into replicas (there was a yellow Ferrari I've seen on the net with a BMW V12 on a tube frame), they just don't show up at pick-and-pulls or your local BMW dealership parting them out. I mean really for the cost of what it takes to get the motor and the accessories you probably could have nearly bought a completed kit. I have seen some completed units go pretty cheap though - like between $1,000-$2,000 cheap. Good luck.
www.car-part.com has many of them listed in junkyards complete, with the cheapest tested, running, complete engine going for $700. They're somewhat common and cheap, you just have to look in the right places.
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12:24 PM
pacethis Member
Posts: 510 From: Simpsonville, SC USA Registered: Jun 2005
Your option #2 could easily cost you $100k. In my opinion, there are dozens of good ways to spend 100k, but this isn't one of them. To be honest, you're probably looking at 1/2 that cost (50k) just to acquire the countach V12 and TT it...
Earlier you said that money is not something you have...if that's true, you need to set your sights a lot closer to home...
If you have a little $$ to burn, start with a completed countach kit...then rework the drivetrain to your satisfaction. There are no shortage of kits out there, and many are sold for 1/2 their build cost...
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12:27 PM
rogergarrison Member
Posts: 49601 From: A Western Caribbean Island/ Columbus, Ohio Registered: Apr 99
A real Lambo drivetrain is about the most unreliable drivetrain in existence. I know of no one that bought one that didnt have manyyyyyyyy major problems. One local guy here kept one for a year and sued them for a complete refund after it broke down once a week. He got his money. I like the looks, but even if I had a real one, it would have a Mopar drivetrain. Porsche transaxle is OK.
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02:51 PM
PerKr Member
Posts: 641 From: Mariestad, Sweden Registered: Nov 2006
Well, a real one would not be as reliable as a custom built one, buying one someone else made could result in faulty craftmanship. I like building things, and custom fabricating, and I am a wizard at automotive electronic systems and fuel injection. if I get the V12 with my own custom built Countach (with the wing, dont forget that limited edition wing) then I am gonna induvidual runner fuel injection it, and give it twin turbochargers to try and boost the output. I might spend more than a real countach on it, making it have 4x as much HP as a real countach.
didn't notice this before or I would surely have started wondering... 4 times the output of the real countach. Let's say the engine produced 375 bhp (I'm sure there were versions which produced more, closer to 450bhp, but this is the figure I found). That means you're aiming to get 1500bhp out of it. I'm sorry to say it, but I don't think you will be able to get it there reliably. Unless you upgrade just about every component (new custom-made everything), including the transmission, at that point it would be spitting parts all over the neighbourhood. You'd actually have to spend enough money that you might as well develop an entirely new car using an existing engine.
If output is what matters, build a custom v8 with turbochargers. It will cost you a lot less in the long run. If you just want a v12, I'd suggest the BMW v12 and tune that. At least it won't cost you as much as the lambo engine.
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03:24 PM
ducattiman Member
Posts: 674 From: TheNetherlands Registered: Mar 2003
Originally posted by PerKr: didn't notice this before or I would surely have started wondering... 4 times the output of the real countach. Let's say the engine produced 375 bhp (I'm sure there were versions which produced more, closer to 450bhp, but this is the figure I found). That means you're aiming to get 1500bhp out of it. I'm sorry to say it, but I don't think you will be able to get it there reliably. Unless you upgrade just about every component (new custom-made everything), including the transmission, at that point it would be spitting parts all over the neighbourhood. You'd actually have to spend enough money that you might as well develop an entirely new car using an existing engine.
If output is what matters, build a custom v8 with turbochargers. It will cost you a lot less in the long run. If you just want a v12, I'd suggest the BMW v12 and tune that. At least it won't cost you as much as the lambo engine.
of course the 4x was a random number I put out, I would settle with 700HP :P but more than a real Countach. I like the V12 sound over the V8 sound, so for cost efficency I would probably go with the BMW if I go the replica way.
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03:48 PM
PFF
System Bot
Philero Member
Posts: 390 From: Medford, OR, USA Registered: Oct 2007
Dreaming is fun, but sooner or later you will have to come back down to earth. Gathering information for a project is a good thing also, but this sure seems very premature.
Your first question is easily answered with: Build what you will be proud of, not what the masses want you to.
Pace yourself, because no matter which way you go, time and money will be a factor. Buy yourself a Fiero and drive it. See what you think of the stock power and handling. Upgrade from there. I agree with the statements about the Lambo engine though.. there is no reason.. initial cost, availability and repetitive cost of parts, and all the trouble you will experience. There are much better and readily available solutions out there that I am sure you will be very pleased with in regards to cost, power, installation woes (or lack of), and upkeep.
I personally prefer to take a Fiero and mod it with some parts from others, but mostly my designs and fabrication. Pride factor soars when someone sees your work and really likes what you have done. Just look at the constant comments about the other's cars!
------------------ Phil Always trying to create something new! Philero ~ Phil and his Fiero, melding into one (soon to be my license plate too!)
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04:16 PM
kooljess Member
Posts: 1135 From: FIEROS WEST USA Registered: Jul 2004
And I'm all for each to their own, but anyone that wants to compare this, when finished
to this when finished?
Hhhmmmmm...Sorry, but in MY book, there is no comparision.
Back on the topic though, honestly, if you don't have some deep pockets, neither is going to happen.
Kevin
Yes when finish you still have a fake Countach but have a extremely modified Fiero.......still see the Fiero in that car. Still gotta go with the modified Fiero!!!! Just my opinion!!!
[This message has been edited by kooljess (edited 11-27-2007).]
Personally I think that a chopped Madarch widebody GT (above) is the way to go. The bimmer V12 would sound boss if you could make it happen. You do have to stretch the frame about 3-4 inches a la https://www.fiero.nl/forum/F...1/HTML/033676-2.html (no V12 but a stretch) if you want to fit the BMW V12 in. One of my personal favorite Fieros.
all i have to say is if you go option 2 and get that V12 anything with a V12 = expensive not only to buy but to maintain they are a very tempermental engine but good luck.
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07:14 PM
rogergarrison Member
Posts: 49601 From: A Western Caribbean Island/ Columbus, Ohio Registered: Apr 99
Personally I think that a chopped Madarch widebody GT (above) is the way to go. The bimmer V12 would sound boss if you could make it happen. You do have to stretch the frame about 3-4 inches a la https://www.fiero.nl/forum/F...1/HTML/033676-2.html (no V12 but a stretch) if you want to fit the BMW V12 in. One of my personal favorite Fieros.
Mine is stretched 12 inches and I'm not even sure if the BMW V12 would fit longitutinally with the Porsche Transaxle...but as a former BMW nut it sounds interesting! Reading page 1 made me think thisthread is a teenager's pipe dream, but my vote is to see option 1 begin...
Anyone notice that it was just over a year between posts?
It don't matter! Good conversation. This is what I might do if I had the chance (money)
build a Countach rep just like the one in the beginning of the thread and do like what Madcurl sayes.......tweek it!...............a little It wouldn't say Lambo anywhere on it. Call it the .............Nolambo,.....Notaghini (or something like that), and put badges on it. LS7 5or6 speed. BLACK! Red interior.
.Gee with that design why even brother with it,,.And as for a kitcar guy u say but never heard of a bundle of snakes..
