I say hell no. Nothing makes it superior or super. It's a unique car, a sports car, but not a supercar. The elise has its extreme light weight on its side; that allows it to be called a supercar, and they aren't very common, and come with high price tags here in the states. A fiero is cheap, common enough, and performs with par, not above.
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09:34 PM
vinny Member
Posts: 1690 From: starkville MISSISSIPPI Registered: Mar 2003
I don't know about super car but in its day it could hold its own with alot of the so-called performance cars of the day. If the DOHC had been availible it may have had a oustanding rep as a performance car. You will get alot of opinons on this topic both positive and negative. My opinion is Pontiac was trying to slip one in there on GM by saying it was a commuter car, but really, how many commuter cars do you know of that are V6 powered (GT) midengine two seaters? I believe Pontiac tryed but Corvette got more pull.
I am not sure I would even qualify the Elise as a super car. It is a very good performing, light weight sports car, but when I think of a Supercar, I think of something like a Ferrari or Lamborgini, high end Porsche, etc. Cars that cost a ton, and have incredible performance. The Elise is very good, but it's not in that league either.
The Fiero? Nah. A lot of people won't even accept it as a sports car, much less a supercar.
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09:42 PM
Unsafe At Any Speed Member
Posts: 2299 From: Cheyenne, WY Registered: Feb 2003
First, define "Supercar"? Are what year is your reference? The year of production means everything. Obviously, if you compare a Fiero to car produced in the 50's, 60's and 70's then yes, the Fiero would outproduce EVERYTHING at that time. If the supercar moniker was used then, and the Fiero was produced a few years earlier, exactly as it was made today, the Fiero would be worth tens of thousands more than what is is selling for today. The Fiero in 2008 could be called a supercar only against the cars produced by its comparables at the time: Aston Martin, Jaguar, certain Ferrari models, only against certain parameters. Obviosly, not against stock vs. stock. I would bet alot of my own money on the Fiero to take some modern classics if the modifications Fiero owners have done can be included.
im not joking what makes a supercar a supercar? i was watching that show supercars exposed. and was thinking back in 87 the fiero was the same as the elise is today! and they claim that the elise is a supercar, so why not the fiero?
First, define "Supercar"? Are what year is your reference? The year of production means everything. Obviously, if you compare a Fiero to car produced in the 50's, 60's and 70's then yes, the Fiero would outproduce EVERYTHING at that time. If the supercar moniker was used then, and the Fiero was produced a few years earlier, exactly as it was made today, the Fiero would be worth tens of thousands more than what is is selling for today. The Fiero in 2008 could be called a supercar only against the cars produced by its comparables at the time: Aston Martin, Jaguar, certain Ferrari models, only against certain parameters. Obviosly, not against stock vs. stock. I would bet alot of my own money on the Fiero to take some modern classics if the modifications Fiero owners have done can be included.
Cordially, Kevin
ok so the hennesy viper is not stock but its call a super car so why not a archie choptop v8?
" Supercar is a term generally used for a high-end sports car, whose performance is highly superior to that of its contemporaries. It has been defined specifically as "a very expensive, fast or powerful car with a centrally located engine"[1], and stated in more general terms: "it must be very fast, with sporting handling to match," "it should be sleek and eye-catching" and its price should be "one in a rarified atmosphere of its own."[2] but the proper application of the term is subjective and disputed, especially among enthusiasts. The use of the term can be dependent on the era: a vehicle that may have been considered a supercar at one time may not retain its superiority indefinitely.[citation needed] The term supercar may refer to factory-built, street-legal sports cars.[3] Some supercars include some of the features required for race cars, like the roll cage, [4] while other supercars are in general race cars with only the minimum legal required modifications made (e.g. meeting emission regulations, legal tyres, limited exhaust note) to be street legal. "
i think the fiero fits this explanation all except the price tag. ive seen lots of cars called supercars that dont fit all of these specifecations and what was a contemporarie car in the 1980s
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12:33 AM
PFF
System Bot
Chris Hodson Member
Posts: 3099 From: Carpentersville Registered: Aug 2006
The Fiero is not a supercar, not even close. It's a sports car. The Elise isn't a supercar, either, just because it's ridiculously expensive, but it handles better than 99.999999% of cars ever made. More of a stree-legal gokart than anything else.
Supercars:
Ferrari Enzo Ferrari F40 Ferrari Testarossa McLaren F1 Jaguar XJ220 Lamborghini Countach Lamborghini Diablo Lamborghini Murcielago Bugatti Veyron Lotus Esprit Porsche 959 Audi R8
my modded 82 z28 could beat all of the cars listed 1/8, 1/4 mile and up to 150 mph but was it a super car?? To me yeah it was because I built it and it could play and beat these super rediculously expensive cars on a budget up to the point of my limit in one catergory anyway..the same goes for the "sufficiantly "modded" Fiero ...not a stock one
[This message has been edited by Erik (edited 04-23-2008).]
The Ferrari 308 is a close competitor to the Fiero in more ways than most people realize. Pontiac purchased a few examples of the 308 to compare their Fieros with. The reason the Fiero is so similar to the 308 may likely be due to the fact Pontiac's goal was to make the Fiero as close to the 308 as possible with what they had to work with.
Ferrari never installed grease fittings on the 308, so a complete renewel of the suspension is required after every 50,000 miles of driving. The lack of rustproofing is another negative 308 trait. Just purchasing and trying to maintain the 308 are the rest of the negative traits. From a financial standpoint, the Fiero makes much more sense. You would not be sacrificing any performance (in fact, gaining in many areas) by going with the Pontiac. And if you think the Fiero had a bad problem with headlight motor failure, the Ferrari would surprise you. The Fiero has shorter overhangs and a longer wheelbase. The Fiero is also wider with plenty of tire for the weight. I actually had a Ferrari 308 owner tell me his Fiero GT ('86) was a far better car overall. He used the Fiero as a daily driver and hardly drove the 308 at all since it let him down so many times and was not as comfortable as his Pontiac was.
Some Interesting Fiero Stuff
skidpad
The V-6 Fiero hit .84-.86g on the skidpad (4-cyl was roughly .80-.82g) Porsche 911 Carrera -> .85g (the Carrera 4 was at .83g) Ferrari Testarossa -> .84g Lotus Esprit Turbo -> .86g Lamborghini Diablo VT -> .87g Acura NSX -> .87g Acura Integra GS-R -> .82g Pontiac Firebird Trans Am/Formula ('93+) -> .82g-.85g Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX -> .86g
slalom
The Fiero ran the slalom at 63.4-63.9 mph (about 61.5 for 4-cyl. models). Pontiac Firebird Trans Am -> 59.7 mph Lotus Epsrit S4 -> 60.6 mph Porsche 911 Carrera -> 61.9 mph BMW M3 -> 62.8 mph Corvette ZR-1 -> 63.6 mph Ferrari 348 -> 62.8 mph Acura NSX -> 62.3 mph Dodge Viper -> 62.7 mph Ford Mustang Cobra (1994) -> 61.1 mph Nissan 300ZX Turbo -> 63.0 mph
acceleration, maximum speed
The V-6 Fiero consistantly accelerated from 0-30 in 2.2 seconds. The Lamborghini Diablo manages 0-30 in 2.2 seconds.
Best 1/4-mile time for a stock V-6 Fiero: 14.7 @ 92 mph Worst: 17.0 @ 80 mph Both Fieros were GT's with manual transmissions.
Best top speed for a stock V-6 Fiero: 135 mph Worst: 115 mph Both Fieros were '85 GT's, the latter with an automatic transmission.
General
- Pontiac purchased Ferrari 308's for handling engineering and comparison purposes. - Many V-6 engines in Fieros dynoed at between 150 and 160 bhp. - The Fiero turned in a profit every year it was sold (including 1988). - Fiero prototypes were running in 1980. - Most foreign auto magazines raved about the Fiero's superior handling, its nimble response and excellent road feel. Most American auto magazines criticized the Fiero's handling as being numb, heavy and not responsive. - The decisions to kill the Fiero was made on February 29, 1988. - The Fiero had nearly 3 times as many sales as the MR2 during any given year in its lifetime. - Pontiac spent over $300,000,000 to produce the Fiero, yet cancelled the car on a "hunch" they would lose a maximum of $20-million between 1988 and 1995. - Several factory prototypes were made of a Fiero convertible. - Two prototypes were made in 1986 of a Fiero with an aluminum frame. One of the aluminum Fieros had a 190 bhp Quad-4. - Car & Driver called the Fiero, "One of the best cars in America" and gave the Fiero a slot in their top ten best category. - The Los Angeles Auto Expo gave the Fiero their Design of the Year Award. - The Fiero accounted for nearly 1/4 of all Pontiac sales in 1984. - Spectators at the unvailing of the fastback Fiero mistook the GT version as a new Corvette. - GM was struggling with the problem of employees purchasing Fieros before the public had an opportunity. Never before had this been a problem with a GM car. - Even though the highest sticker price for an '84 Fiero was about $10,000, one Michigan buyer paid over $15,000 for an '84 SE. - The Fiero was the first American car to win in IMSA GTU. - In 1985, the Fiero won at Sears Point (one of 3 straight victories), beating such successful competitors as Chevrolet's Corvette and Ford's Mustang. - A 4-cylinder Fiero belting out only 370 bhp took the NHRA's Competition Eliminator title at the Keystone Nationals on September 15, 1985 with a best 1/4-mile time of 9.72 seconds at 134.41 mph. - The Fiero won well over 40 races in the 36 months it raced.
so if you conceder the Ferrari 308 a supercar then the fiero has to be called a super car by default. and of course the fiero doesnt compare to the most moderen cars its 20+ years old
[This message has been edited by 3.6lvvt6spdgt (edited 04-23-2008).]
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04:55 AM
Australian Member
Posts: 4701 From: Sydney Australia Registered: Sep 2004
so if you conceder the Ferrari 308 a supercar then the fiero has to be called a super car by default. and of course the fiero doesnt compare to the most moderen cars its 20+ years old
well pretty much 20 years ago we were eating civics. The new civics that now beat the fiero would also beat the ferrari. The evolution of the motorcar means the fiero and 308 are not fast cars anymore in comparison. In the 80s we would think they both had performance.
well pretty much 20 years ago we were eating civics. The new civics that now beat the fiero would also beat the ferrari. The evolution of the motorcar means the fiero and 308 are not fast cars anymore in comparison. In the 80s we would think they both had performance.
i havent seen a stock civic beat a stock fiero. and yes a 20+ years old supercar cant be compaired to a 2008 suppercar it would look like a geo metro in retrospect. so is it a classic supercar?
[This message has been edited by 3.6lvvt6spdgt (edited 04-23-2008).]
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05:26 AM
PFF
System Bot
Australian Member
Posts: 4701 From: Sydney Australia Registered: Sep 2004
i havent seen a stock civic beat a stock fiero. and yes a 20+ years old supercar cant be compaired to a 2008 suppercar it would look like a geo metro in retrospect. so is it a classic supercar?
It could be defined as one or V8 enhanced but i dont think many would really agree. The sledgehammer vette in about 1990 was recognised as the first American supercar anyway until then either nothing was agknowledged or just reserved to likes of Italian and German cars. Sure plenty of fast vettes and cars made in US before i raise a storm but none were called or known to the world as supercars.
As far as lotus goes i dont think they model or market every model as a supercar. Perhaps offering supercar perfomance at a fraction does not define it as a supercar. Then again supercar performance maybe modelled on 0-60 in 6-7 seconds and not in 3-4 that we would expect today.
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05:54 AM
Hank is Here Member
Posts: 4458 From: Hershey, Pa Registered: Sep 2000
i havent seen a stock civic beat a stock fiero. and yes a 20+ years old supercar cant be compaired to a 2008 suppercar it would look like a geo metro in retrospect. so is it a classic supercar?
No, the Fiero was designed as an economy car. A stock Fiero is not a supercar in any sense of the word. In fact supercar and Fiero don't belong togther in the same sentance.
In stock form, its grossly fast! The 2.8l V6 is revolutionary in design. Brakes are amazing! I can't count how many times I've stopped faster than the Porsche 911 in the next lane- which I'm racing (I always win ) My 14 inch wheels with Eagle GT+4's stick to the road like slicks. My aerodynamics are off the f'n hook. I even have air brake headlight doors in case of excess 100mph emergencies. My racing suspension was stolen from a formula one team who designed the Chevrolet grocery getters of the 80's. The interior is racing ergonomic. Only the finest plastics and heavy alloys. Fiero's are so sought after, many families choose to decorate their lawns with them. After all, you can buy six Fiero's for a little over $5000.00
The geneal non internet discription of a superr car is
A expensive,fast, low volume, top high perfroming, highly sought after exotic sports car.
The Fiero is not expensive, Not Fast in stock form, not low volume, It is different but not exotic. Nor is it a poster on the wall of many teenagers bedroom wall.
I would not thow the 308 in as today many true Ferrari purist reject it and the Mondial as a over blown Fiats with great syling. Yes even supercars like the 308 or 928 can lose their supercar status. Even the Lotus is marginal due to the fact it is considered just a expensive sports car since it is not very poiwerful. It's under 2000 pounds is what make it exceptional.
The bottom line is the Fiero is not a supercar now in the past nor anytime in the future.
When large numbers of rich people in Newport Beach start craving them and paying high prices for them I will change it to Supercar status myself.
If your not rich and can afford it it is not s supercar.
The Fiero is a fun car, affordable car, and neat car but in stock form it is not a performance leader by a long shot.
Supercar....>NO!
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06:51 AM
Xanth Member
Posts: 6886 From: Massachusetts Registered: May 2006
In stock form, its grossly fast! The 2.8l V6 is revolutionary in design. Brakes are amazing! I can't count how many times I've stopped faster than the Porsche 911 in the next lane- which I'm racing (I always win ) My 14 inch wheels with Eagle GT+4's stick to the road like slicks. My aerodynamics are off the f'n hook. I even have air brake headlight doors in case of excess 100mph emergencies. My racing suspension was stolen from a formula one team who designed the Chevrolet grocery getters of the 80's. The interior is racing ergonomic. Only the finest plastics and heavy alloys. Fiero's are so sought after, many families choose to decorate their lawns with them. After all, you can buy six Fiero's for a little over $5000.00
Ha! I can take a Saleen S7.... !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1111oneoneeleventyone
ROFL!!
Sweeeeeeet, I've got a $300 supercar sitting outside
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08:01 AM
Formula88 Member
Posts: 53788 From: Raleigh NC Registered: Jan 2001
i say if the lotus elise is a suoper car then the pontiac fiero is a super car. what do you think?
I think crack is a helluva drug.
I also don't consider the Elise to be a supercar. An entry level Ferrari, maybe. "Super car" to me means something like the Bugatti Veyron, Pagoni Zonda, Ferrari Enzo or FXX, McLaren F1, Koenigsegg, and Lamborghini Murcielago.
The Elise is a sports car. Maybe even an exotic car, but not a super car.
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08:50 AM
Philphine Member
Posts: 6136 From: louisville,ky. usa Registered: Feb 2000
If a Fiero owner can afford it, then it's not a SuperCar!
Seriously, the Fiero was a "cute little commuter car" with sports car aspirations ... what used to be called a "personal car." There's no way it could ever have been considered a SuperCar, even in the context of the 1980s. Not based on price. Not based on aesthetics. Not based on performance. Not based on technical innovation. Not based on design refinement. Not based on component and/or assembly quality. Not based on ergonomics. Not based on rarity. Not based on competition history.
FWIW, the Testarossa was Ferrari's SuperCar of the 1980s, not the 308. The 928 was Porsche's SuperCar of the 1980s, not the 911, and even the 928S barely qualifies for SuperCar status.
Does any of this make the Fiero less fun to own and drive today? No way!
quote
Originally posted by Philphine:
a "shadetree supercar"
I like that!
[This message has been edited by Marvin McInnis (edited 04-28-2008).]
I'd call the Elise a semi-exotic, not a "Supercar".
"THE" Fiero is just an everyday semi-sports car, individual cars like "Perfect Union" are Supercars.
------------------ ~Michael
"Your mileage may vary." '85 GT 4sp white - SOLD | | '85 2M6 Auto red - SOLD | | '84 2M4 bare chassis - SOLD Crap, I'm out of Fieros! Time to buy another!!
Yeah i wouldnt go that far a supercar cant have a model offering 92 bhp. if the fiero is a supercar so is the mr2 since its really the fiero closest competition. The lotus is not a supercar either. I think is 50% of the mass's can afford said car no matter how fast it is or how well it handles its not a supercar. A supercar is more than fast and well handling its a status symbol so it must be rare and expensive. look on ebay you can find 20 or so lotus's for sale at any given time in a price range that if a middle class person wanted one could easy save and obtain (what 60k new thats cheaper than some vettes). But yes Id like a lotus myself lots of high rpm fun.
i say if the lotus elise is a suoper car then the pontiac fiero is a super car. what do you think?
My son will be buying elise soon and even before he puts a turbo on it, I know it will kick even turbo Fiero's ass. They don't wieght much more than a golf cart with two fat guys in it. Sorry they are in a league apart from our Fieros and on the track can stay with cars costing way more. Personly I;m not big fan of the looks, but can't deny the proformance. Can't wait to barrow his when he gets it.
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