I'll race yah i hope to have mine in within the same time frame.

I'm almost done the wiring, i just need the rear mount made, my cradle bushing pushed in, adn a few misc dealer parts

------------------
Calgary - August 1, 2004 Fiero Fiesta
@ SouthCenter Mall

Love the blue on the manifold! did you have yours powdercoated? I finished the wiring months ago, but have to shorten and extend a few things here and there. Right now I am cleaning up all the dirty parts and getting ready to paint them. I wish I had better quality paint, but it will still will look beautiful. It's too bad the good looking side of the motor is buried in the firewall Oh well! Are you going to Carlisle?

I know nothing about Carslise right now, I'm currently trying to complete the engine then I'll go from there, I've never been out of canada ether so it could be interesting if i did, When is it, My intake adn IDI cover were powdercoated and my exhaust manifold (still waiting for it) is being ceramic coated.

------------------
Calgary - August 1, 2004 Fiero Fiesta
@ SouthCenter Mall

Bump. Update coming tonight. Iv'e been working REALLY hard on it for the past 3 days, And its getting much closer. The deadline is not looking so bad anymore. 18 days and counting!

It's raining outside right now so we should be getting that update soon I guess .

Dave

Actually Dave, I'm still working on it in the rain, mostly just fitting my wiring harness, All I have to say is : The powersteering pump has REALLY messed up everything. I origionally routed the wires through the area witch the powersteering pump now resides. So I had to re-route and extend a whole lota wires And I had a thermostat housing all welded up and on the engine, but that hit the powersteering pump too when I added it. Thats why I needed that 4 cyl housing from you. The new ones perfect. And to top it all off... When I put the transmission onto the engine, I found that the powersteering pump will totally interfere with my shifter cable support bracket. Witch took me more then 8 hours to fabricate. So right now Im pretty ticked to say the least. But you can bet on it that I will not slow down or give up, no matter how angry these problems make me. But the progress made in the past 3 days has gotten the project far enough along that I will get it done in time. Some update pics. So, Dave, get it running yet???



Have a look at the transmission, notice the mount bolted to it. I will add more bracketry to utilize the mount that came with the 3.94 Getrag I got. This mount will help deal with the torque loads and hopefully prevent the front liquid mount from tearing. I don't plan on babying this engine at all so It has to be sturdy. I think I have finally settled on an exhaust system. It will NOT be the quietest, but will flow well and be emmissions legal. One 2.5" pipe coming down from the manifold to a "T" in eather direction into 2, 2¼" Catalytic converters. then it will turn rearward on eather side to dual resonator tips. I really wanted to use the stock pace car tips, but it just doesn't seem to work out. Hopefully this setup won't be too loud (at an idle) or sound like a honda. Can't have that!
Cams are supposed to be here Wednesday, I plan on completing the engine assembly this week, heck, maybe I'll have the exhaust completed and in the car by then, but thats quite optomistic.

[This message has been edited by Fierobsessed (edited 04-13-2004).]

Since everyone is showing off their shiny quads I had to add my contribution.

------------------

87 Quad 4 HO convertible

Lookin good Matt!

Youre alot more talented then I am

Automoda,

Did you polish that engine?
That looks SWEET!!!!!!!!

How will the shine hold up over use? Will it dull pretty quick?

Man that is sweet. It makes me ALMOST wanna yank the motor out of my toyota and polish it

My official To do list:

FIX WIRING HARNESS
WIRING DIAGRAM
THROTTLE BODY

CHAIN HOUSING
OIL PAN
ENGINE ASSY
OIL
ACCY BELT
BATTERY
GET THE ENGINE RUNNING
EXHAUST
SPRINGS

REPAIR BATTERY TRAY RUST
FIX BATTERY TRAY
PAINT ENGINE BAY
CLEAN AND PAINT SPINDLES,
AXLES,
A ARMS
FUEL PUMP
GAS TANK

SHIFTER BRACKETRY
CLEAN AND DETAIL ENGINE
INSTALL ENGINE CRADLE

FUEL FILTER
FUEL LINES
COOLANT LINES
POWER STEERING LINES
THROTTLE CABLE

IP CLUSTER
RADIO
INTERIOR

Does anyone feel like hosting an 8 mb video?

I'll host it.

------------------
*ring* *ring* *ring* *ring* *ring* Hi, this is Kettle, leave a message at the beep.. *beep* Hello Kettle, this is the pot.. You're black

Bump

A few ?'s.. I was wondering what the hp on these engines is stock, and the potential still naturally asperated. Also I was told by a mech. about a 4 banger that gm. prototyped in the fiero, the engine was from a Calius. well they tested it against the vette,and the fiero out performed in 0-60, 1/4mile, 100-0, and handling. It was so bad for the vette that the enjine upgrade was scrapped. I have been interested in this but had very little info is this the same enjine as teh Quad 4?

quote Originally posted by nightonfire: A few ?'s.. I was wondering what the hp on these engines is stock, and the potential still naturally asperated. Also I was told by a mech. about a 4 banger that gm. prototyped in the fiero, the engine was from a Calius. well they tested it against the vette,and the fiero out performed in 0-60, 1/4mile, 100-0, and handling. It was so bad for the vette that the enjine upgrade was scrapped. I have been interested in this but had very little info is this the same enjine as teh Quad 4?

I believe there were 3 ratings for the High Output. 175(later models with balance shafts), 180 and 190(W-41, Oldsmobile exclusive engine, Calais Quad 442 and Achieva SCX had it). There was also a Low Output DOHC and a SOHC version.

You are right, GM did prototype Quad 4's in Fiero's. Rumor has it that the car was an aluminum chassis version of our beloved cars. The Quad 4's power is as follows:
120 HP 93+ SOHC (Junk motor, The Block and crank is good though)
150 HP 88-95 Vin D DOHC (LO)
170 HP 94-95 Vin A HO
180 HP 91-93 Vin A HO
190 HP 91-93 Vin A HO w/ W41 Option.
Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Best years for the engine block are 93-95
Best years for heads are 91-93
Best intakes, all HO models.
Best cams, 91-93 HO w41, any HO is good though.

Just some little secret info on the quad 4's another quad thats worth playing with is the newer 2.4 twin cams used in the newer grand am's and etc. Now the common upgrade on the 2.4 is adapting the 2.3ho intake mani and tb to the 2.4 and swapping in the 2.3 cams into the 2.4 major power improvements and for the few that thinks the 2.4 is crap and wont move the fiero very fast i also own a 00 4dr grand am with a heavy body kit and sound system this car ran mid 17's this is stock and lighter, now heavier it currrently runs a 13.8 now i do have some upgrades on it but i can build up another 13 sec 2.4 for cheaper than doing a 4.9 swap and for about another G i can boost the car i put in in the 12's. I cant imagine this setup in the fiero.

And for the guys with the 2.3 already installed you can replace your 2.3 heads with 2.4 heads and get close power improvements or just find a w41 quad 4 good power but a hard motor to find.

Any time you have a fiero vid that needs hosting just pm NY_FIERO
I have un limited server space at
www.nyfiero.com

------------------
thanks to XXX for the image ;)

Wow... I just realized that I hadn't read this topic since you started it - very impressive. I can hardly believe how quickly you get stuff done (and so well thought out too)!

Keep the updates coming

------------------

Looking for Fiero posters?

quote Originally posted by Fierobsessed: You are right, GM did prototype Quad 4's in Fiero's. Rumor has it that the car was an aluminum chassis version of our beloved cars. The Quad 4's power is as follows: 120 HP 93+ SOHC (Junk motor, The Block and crank is good though) 150 HP 88-95 Vin D DOHC (LO) 170 HP 94-95 Vin A HO 180 HP 91-93 Vin A HO 190 HP 91-93 Vin A HO w/ W41 Option. Please correct me if I'm wrong. Best years for the engine block are 93-95 Best years for heads are 91-93 Best intakes, all HO models. Best cams, 91-93 HO w41, any HO is good though.

Heads in 93 where different, I have one on my quad 90-92 have the best heads they are 086 casting.
90-92 crank pulleys on the HO are different then the others they are 5.5 inches in diameter rather then 6.5 on all others.
Exhaust manifolds are different in 94 i think they are much smaller.
w41 cams and HO cams are the same except w41 has longer duration.
don't forget the difference between timing chain designs

I fluxed out and i ended up this a frankenstein motor, It has 94 block, 93 head, 90 manifolds, 90 crank pulley, single row timing chain. All I wish is that i could get a hold of an 086 head.

P.S My engine going in this weekend I'm so excited, I'll have so many little things to work out after though, and hopefully my wiring will work. Postumane checked over some of it and so far so good.

------------------
Calgary - August 1, 2004 Fiero Fiesta
@ SouthCenter Mall

If you need to do any work on your water pump or if you need to replace the thermostat, DO IT NOW while you can get to it. Voice of experience from working on my dads 92 Grand Am with HO Quad 4. I think they made the water pump easier to get to in later years. The 92 was a nightmare. The thermostat was also a PITA to replace.

Yea the waterpump doesn't look like much fun to replace. But they are dirt cheep and easier on the Fiero then the Grand AM. I solved the thermostat problem (see pics above)
Thanks guys for the compliments.

As far as powersteering goes, Im going to build the car without it. I just dont have the time to make new shifter brackets, prep the front end and install the motor within in the next couple of weeks. I'm already behind schedule. But I promise it will have powersteering this year anyway, just probably not for Carlisle. Latley Iv'e been doing the very un-interesting work, preping the engine bay.

My "to do" list has gotten shorter, guess what got done!

ACCY BELT
EXHAUST
SPRINGS

PAINT ENGINE BAY
CLEAN AND PAINT SPINDLES,
AXLES,
A ARMS
FUEL PUMP
GAS TANK

INSTALL ENGINE CRADLE

FUEL LINES
COOLANT LINES
THROTTLE CABLE

IP CLUSTER
RADIO
INTERIOR

Here it is as of yesterday:

I have been making good progress the past couple of days. I made a decision to intervene on the slight (but threatening) rust issue that was developing. While the weather was nice yesterday I quickly gutted the interior, and removed the rear roof clip to deal with the rust. I couldn't believe that it only took 2 hours to do it! Now that the roof is off and everything has been removed from the engine bay, I got out the garden hose, a parts cleaning brush and some "Purple Power" cleaner. The engine bay and around the outside is now very clean. Now, for the rust treatment. In the location where the battery tray was no longer exists. This is typical. So I got out some sheet metal and bent it and welded it in to replace that section. It was very hard to weld! The metal was so thin it would constantly burn through. Even though the metal is replaced, its not too pretty. For the other rust that was just starting to bubble the paint, I got out the wire wheel to remove the loose paint. Then painted all these areas with POR-15. It's interesting to see how rust forms. On one side of the car it started to work its way from the bottom of the frame rail towards the inside, The other side was just the opposite. Either way, its now taken care of. Hopefully tomarrow, I will paint the whole rear frame. I have got to get this engine in for final pluming. Its just coming along so nicley! But I am running a bit behind schedual, It was suposed to be in and driving by may. So much for that, but Im only a few days behind that goal.


Im glad I decided to pull the clip before it was to late to do something about the rust.

You pulled that clip off quick!!

You make it seem like nothing man (btw i still need help sometime dropping the cradle on my 86, might not get to it till after carlile tho)

Any update i managaed to get mine running, all i have to do now is:

Fill the coolant
Bleed the breaks
bleed the clutch
get exhaust made
alignment

I ran it the first time and i got a code 26 because I forgot to connect the pink/black wire that goes to the canister purge.

Any idea where that wire (tan/white) went from the injector harness mine goes to the fuel pump relay and the oil pressure sender, but right now I'm experienceing hard starting, although that might be because i have no back pressure.

------------------
Calgary - August 1, 2004 Fiero Fiesta
@ SouthCenter Mall

All of you are doing great!

This is just gorgous.

quote Originally posted by Automoda: Since everyone is showing off their shiny quads I had to add my contribution.

------------------
-Chris

Custom Gun Metal 86 GT
Look here for more pics - https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/040573.html

***95 Camaro 3.4 swap, Ported and polished heads and intakes, CRX CAI, Custom Cam, AFP Regulator, steel vacuum lines, steel braided EGR tube, new Wire Harness, New Exhaust, No Cat, Flowmaster, polished poly dog bone. Isuzu 5 speed, Short through shifter
***Intrax 2" drop springs, Full Polly Suspension, Sencetrack Struts and Shocks, Grand AM brake upgrade, steel braided brake lines, 17" Gun Metal Wheels, Khumo Tires
***Racing Seats, SunPro tach w/ shift light, White face guages, carbon fiber Steering wheel, Carbon Fiber dash accents and custom sphere shift knob,

It's been a while since I have updated this. I have some good news and some bad news. The good news, the swap was pretty much a great sucsess. The bad news, the car WILL not be ready for Carlisle. I have no rack in the car, the body is not completly on, no alignment, tires, and the brakes are not hooked up. So, Not going to happen in 1 day, without shakedown time. But the engine runs great. I only had a couple of problems, nothing major. I had a few codes, 26, 42. both are attributed to a couple of very minor mistakes in the harness. The car has NO muffler, just a pair of cats. It's not exactly the quietest car, but sounds really good. I really wish you could see how fast that little engine pegs out the stock tach! Since I will not be able to complete the car for Carlisle, I will take the time to re-do all the "quickies" I did just to get ready for Carlisle. I will do the struts, shocks, the power steering, and paint the axles and A-arms I skipped cleaning and painting. I can now work at a reasonable pace. Of course, I will still be bringing the 88 GT to the show, even though its not my nicest or best project. It has 199930 miles on it. And still drives better then my Pace car ever did. (I hope I didn't say that too loud) Im still kind of dissapointed that I couldn't get it done for the show. But then again, its better then risking it.

Well i can help with your Code 26, this page has lots of info

http://lhcmv.8m.com/

------------------
Calgary - August 1, 2004 Fiero Fiesta
@ SouthCenter Mall

Bump!!!! ANy more news on this Quad Fiero

Thanks for bumping this, It's been a while. Since I did not make my Carlisle deadline, I have decided to take a much more relaxed approach to working on the car. The past 2 weeks have been strictly devoted to completing the front end. Alot of things have been happening there. First, I did my power steering conversion, witch pushed my fabrication skills alittle. In doing so I promised myself that I would "fix" the cars simply unacceptible turning radius. After all that was done I put the suspension togather, loaded the crossmember into the car, and since I happen to have a Beretta brake conversion laying around I put that in too. I cut the steering travel stops off of the A-arms and spindles because power steering won't be stopped by them. Then I added the two new stops to the rack to keep it from over traveling its intended usage. Unfortunatly, neither the beretta brake conversion, the stock brakes, nor the stock wheels cleared the shock absorber when the wheels are all the way to one side. So Im modifying the A arms and crossmember to house 88 Shocks in a coil over fashion. Let's just say its going alot harder then I thaught it would. On the other hand I think it will all be worth it when its all said and done. But right now, I am seriously considering making tubular a-arms, the stock ones are almost too hard to modify, however tubulars are harder to make. We'll see what happens tomarrow.

Well thx for the update, I have been working on my fastback conversion slowly also, while the W41 is out getting massaged I noticed I have some very serious rust problem around the trunk and one of the frame arms around the trunk is almost all gone. Now Im stuck as to what to do.....Is it possible to cut it off and re-weld?
Ill take a picture and post it.

Im just bumping this to keep it out of the archives, since some rather impressive developments are about to take place. All to do with the power steering and the front end in general. Once this issue is settled, I may get to take it for a spin finally. Latley I have devoted alot of time and money toward my 88 GT, it had a few problems that needed attention MUCH more then the project car, since the 88GT is the daily driver. I also have a new set of wheels for the pace car! They are the base wheels that the real pace car used, minus the aluminum disk caps. They are only equipt with the 5X100 lug pattern though, but I'm not complaining. The real pace car used a 5X114.3 I think.

I would be very interested in seeing a pic and specs of the Real Indy wheel backs you are mentioning. Are they made by Centerline? Are they still available or did you get lucky and find a set? I have a number of people wanting a set of the real Indy Aluminum Disks. I have the capability of making them, just a matter of the cost involved. Having a source for the wheel rims would help in determining a price.

------------------
Fred Bartemeyer
Chairman Heartland Fieros
http://www.heartlandfieros.com
86 GT 4spd 26k miles
87 GT 5spd. Blue 37k miles
88 Silver T-Top Formula 275,000 miles
87 GT 5 spd Annette's Sunshine Driver
88 GT 5 spd Annette's Daily Driver

Yes the wheels are centerlines. I actually got them on ebay for $300. I think the wheels aren't terribly hard to get, but then again I have so far 3 different sizes of this particular rim. All 16". They are true 3 PC rims, and are fairly light. They break easily though. many sets have had a rim or two welded back togather. The disks are one of those challanges I've been considering undertaking. There are two ways I can think of to form the disk. 1, machine a solid piece of aluminum to shape (requires CNC and alot of aluminum) or somehow press or heat 3/16" thick aluminum sheet onto a form that will curve it nicley. Then weld on some sort of stand to hold the disk on. Alot of work either way. I don't know If anyone will be willing to spring the kind of money reqired just to make the things.
Oddly enough, my set CAME OFF of a Fiero too. Who'da thaught?

[This message has been edited by Fierobsessed (edited 07-28-2004).]

Is this what they look like?

The real Indy base wheel is different. While it was three piece design, the wheel center was flat. The bolts that held the disk on came from the back side in six places. The disk had bosses on the back side that the bolts threaded in to. I am told that the disks were originally made on a lathe and were turned manually ( No CNC ).

Looking in to this project, the billets I priced are $480 each and the machine run time was about 3-1/2 hours each just to finish the face side. So, that is why this project is on stand-still. That is a lot of money for a set of wheels.

Let me know if you look in to a different method as I have a small number of people that are interested.

Fred

I was at the 20th, I took the time to inspect the wheels on the pace car and was suprised to see that the wheels were really caps on what was obviously Centerline 3 pc wheels. I saw the rivits and said to myself, well... what do you know, I know where I can get a set of wheels like that! I could not see the face, but was pretty sure that these were the ones. I'm still wondering if its not all that impossible to heat and press-form the disks out of 3/16 or 1/4" aluminum plate, then put it in the lathe for final facing...

aah, goodies have arrived in the mail, the project continues...
A few weeks After placing my order with Held Motorsports, 3 mysterious boxes arrived with my name on them... There contents:

What you see is a Sport front suspension kit, a bump steer correction kit, and a rear coilover kit. (the struts are my KYB's I just bought) I wasted no time modifying them for the coilovers.
Also, as you can see, I was kinda anxious to get to the goodies

Thats the highlight of the day, but heres a few other things I have been working on latley.
This picture shows the hydraulic fittings I matched to the rack. In case anyone want's to know, M16 and M18 BSOP Hydraulic fittings seem to work BEAUTIFULLY with the firebird rack. They are Powertrac 3501 8-18 and 3501 8-16 and two Dayco Hy-08-08-FJ-90-T. (BTW, for those who don't know, I am a hydraulic mechanic) Once the front end is in place I will crimp the PS hoses.

Another fitting setup. The pressure switch is a SAE#3. I modified a fitting for the pressure sensor. Notice how dirty even a clean engine compartment gets just by sitting around.

And finally, a picture of the custom guage cluster installed, Can anyone guess what the wires are for sticking out of the steering colum? I might get that to work, but its been sparaticly working.

As for the aluminum wheel disks, aparantly there are companies around me that will roll aluminum into the shape I need them to be. Perhaps those disks are not such a challange to make.
Progress is always a good thing.

Matt, you know youre gonna have to let me come over and check out that suspention!!!

That car is going to be amazing