Here are a couple really short and bad vids. I made these on the way to work this morning. Boost is ~4psi. It starts off a little over three and builds to a little over 4 in the upper RPM. I think I'm going to replace the actuator in the next couple weeks if the boost controller doesn't smooth it out. Vids are on a private road with no traffic...
I got home late last night so the only thing I was able to do is build a boost controller and install it. To be expected from an mbc (manual boost controller), it let the turbo spool up a bit faster by keeping the manifold pressure off the wastegate accuator until the very last minute. This being a very quickly spooling system as it is, it really hits hard when you roll into it. I guess my video camera will only do 5 seconds of video at a time. I've asked for another one for xmas but we'll see about that...
I've got a couple more vids but they really suck so I think I'm going to hold out for a decent one. Here is a top of 1st gear and a low 4th gear run...
Thanks for the compliments everyone. As far as computer programming, not a great deal really. Everything I've done was detailed in the thread previously. I'm not running an optimal tune but it isn't complaining about 6psi to 5k. I'm actually very impressed with how hard the car hits in the lower gears. 1st gear is over before it starts and 2nd is much fun. I was amazed yesterday that the 3-4 shift slipped the clutch. It's a pretty new clutch but I think it's just an autozone stock replacement the original owner put in not too long before he sold it.
I'm open to questions in this thread. I think I am going to start another thread with dyno results and tuning when I started playing with it.
Quick little update here. I went out for lunch and cranked the boost up to 9psi. I'm truely impressed with it's performance in the lower gears. This car would do well stoplight to stoplight. However I think I've found a limit. I took it out on the highway and tried to do a quick 4th gear run but it slips the clutch at will. 3rd feels like it's letting go to once the boost hits 9psi and holds. It's BRUTAL!!!
Supposedly the clutch was replaced not too long before I bought the car and it's never showed signs of slippage before. I'm simply over powering the clutch in the upper gears. That leads me to beleive the clutch isn't as new as I was told or it wasn't installed correctly. It's kinda sad because I wanted to play with this setup with quite a bit of boost without having to pull everything apart. If it can't handle 3000lbs of car and driver, I don't know how it's going to handle 5000lbs of dynojet rollers. hmmmmmmm
If I'm going to go far enough into it to replace the clutch, I might as well put in my 3800.
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03:25 PM
Dec 27th, 2004
Scythe Member
Posts: 1055 From: Burke, Virginia Registered: Apr 2003
Thanks for the replies guys. I was begining to wonder if anyone cared about this thread or not .
Scythe - I've had a couple people PM me about it and I don't see why making a few from scratch would bad. If you want one lmk!
Ralphy Boy - So far on mine, the clutch was the first to go. It held my kit at 5psi with no noticable slipage. At 6psi, it didn't seem to want to hold in the upper gears as a quickly but properly shifted through the gears. At 6psi, if it started slipping a bit between shifts, the power could keep the clutch loose. At 9psi, 2nd gear roll on wanted to get the car a bit sideways. On the highway, in 4th I nailed it and all it did is jump a split second and the clutch would let go and slip. Tried that a couple times. After that, the clutch just wouldn't bite hard enough to do much in the upper gears. I can't get that 2nd gear push to the side anymore. Sooooooooo today, I ordered a Spec Stage III. However I'm not going to stick with the stock 2.8 if I'm getting that far into the car. There is a local guy who wants my 2.8 so while I'm there, I'm going to swap in a 3.4. My 3800 won't be done in the time frame I want and the 3.4s are pretty popular. So I'm going to see how that goes.
For limits, so far, mine has been 9psi for the clutch. Engine unknown but it took a brief bit of driving with 9psi on 93 octane gas with no complaints. I've read of others running 10psi but all I can speak for is what I'm doing with my setup.
[This message has been edited by caddyrocket (edited 12-27-2004).]
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04:59 PM
Dec 28th, 2004
KurtAKX Member
Posts: 4008 From: West Bloomfield, MI Registered: Feb 2002
Last night I removed the stock 2732 chip from my Formula's ECM and soldered in the adapter for the 29C256 chip. I think I might build my own adapter later on so I can install more than one program in the chip and switch between them. For now, I burn 3 chips. One with the stock bin, one with the 2bar map enabled, and one with the injector constant adjusted for the larger LS1 injectors + previous changes. Anyway, this way I can test the ECM, then swap in the 2bar map, test that program, then swap in the larger injectors and test them.
Care to share what you did to rescale the ECM for a 2 bar MAP? Which ECM are you using? Do you lose resolution in your MAP table when you go to the 2 bar? Is this some kind of patch for the code or is it a simple flag in the stock stuff? I don't know that I have heard anything about what sounds like a simple solution to a tricky problem.
Thanks
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05:12 AM
Scythe Member
Posts: 1055 From: Burke, Virginia Registered: Apr 2003
Care to share what you did to rescale the ECM for a 2 bar MAP? Which ECM are you using? Do you lose resolution in your MAP table when you go to the 2 bar? Is this some kind of patch for the code or is it a simple flag in the stock stuff? I don't know that I have heard anything about what sounds like a simple solution to a tricky problem.
Thanks
I don't mind sharing the info as long as you don't mind giving a plus for it. I am using the 7170 that came stock in my 88 Formula. Using the shareware version of GMEpro I DLed from Rockcrawls website (www.fieroaddiction.com), the 2 bar map option is a flag to be set. Thank you Rockcrawl BTW, for putting that up there. It has been extremely helpful so far. I tested this by installing the 2 bar map on a 1 bar program and the car ran like hell. It actually had a pretty cool sounding bumpity bump idle. Everything else except what is listed in the thread earlier is as delivered in the definition files and the stock bin. You do loose resolution in the spark tables but the fuel tables are modified by a set of constants and tables that are modified outside the main fuel table.
In anycase, I swapped in the 2 bar bin and it idled out fine. It's not at all a simple solution, just the first step of many to tune the car for a boosted application. The point was to get the car running with the new hardware before worrying about the tune and dyno time. So what I've listed is enough to get you running with the hardware I used. Unfortunately, the clutch isn't holding the higher boost pressures. I want to give it a good tune on the 2.8 but on the same token, if I am far enough into the car for a clutch swap, I might as well swap in a bigger motor. We've had a great deal of luck with the 3.4s and turbos and I'm pretty pumped to see what kind of numbers I can make with one in a fiero.
[This message has been edited by caddyrocket (edited 12-28-2004).]
I'm going to try to keep the keep the costs on par with what's out there but give a little more. I plan on including an intercooler in my kit as well as modify and test the user's computer to use the newer and much better 29C256 chips.
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09:42 AM
Jan 5th, 2005
debug Member
Posts: 203 From: Austin, Texas Registered: Nov 2004
I'm pretty sure I would be interested in this after I get my 2.8 running like it should. The quad 4 I was looking to buy got sold to someone else and my 2.8 seems to be in alot better shape than I thought it was, so tweaking it out sounds like it might be a good plan. You definately get a + from me
I'm pretty sure I would be interested in this after I get my 2.8 running like it should. The quad 4 I was looking to buy got sold to someone else and my 2.8 seems to be in alot better shape than I thought it was, so tweaking it out sounds like it might be a good plan. You definately get a + from me
-Randy
Thanks for the plus! I'm hoping one day to get enough to get a rating bar lol. I've put several build up threads on the board but I just can't seem to squeeze it past lol. Anyway, I started another thread with some answers to questions folks have sent me about turbocharger kits. https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/048425.html . If you post up any questions, I'll shoot you a PM to keep the thread uncluttered. Anyway, I'm going to be doing a 3.4/Spec clutch install this weekend. I'll start another thread to cover that. That swap is probably the MOST documented swap in the world but perhaps I can provide someone with a little different angle in the pic or say something a little differently to answer a question. Plus I like throwing in driving impressions .
Here some pics of the some of the system installed with the engine out of the car. Everything is dirty because I just finished swapping in the clutch and new engine.
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05:59 PM
Feb 15th, 2005
Alex4mula Member
Posts: 7408 From: Canton, MI US Registered: Dec 1999
Originally posted by Alex4mula: What about mounting the turbo where the cat is? Is there enough space there?
You can't. Turbo's use gravity to get the oil out of them - at the cat level, it'd just pool inside it (ok, unless you used some exotic pump setup to suck the oil out and shoot it back into the pan, etc...)
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01:04 PM
mrfixit58 Member
Posts: 3330 From: Seffner, Fl, USA Registered: Jul 99
You can't. Turbo's use gravity to get the oil out of them - at the cat level, it'd just pool inside it (ok, unless you used some exotic pump setup to suck the oil out and shoot it back into the pan, etc...)
