PAGE 2!

Who'da thunk this thread would go two pages?!?

2 pages and not one other post from the Northwest.

I am sorry I started it up now.

That's ok, Senor Quixote, the windmills don't care.

OK, OK . . . another post from the Northwest. Sorry to be so late to the party, but I had to go to the storage room and get my helmet before I felt safe participating in this high energy thread.

I too am disappointed that the Shasta event was cancelled, but I'm sure that I will have plenty of fun in my Fiero and attend as many events as time allows. I drove my Fiero 40,000 miles in 5 months this year, including 6,500 miles to and from the 20th. (John, have you been keeping your gas receipts?) For me it is not the distance or the number events, I just need to have an excuse and time in the schedule to take a road trip to anywhere for almost anything. I used to live in CA and still travel the 630 miles one way (8:38 hrs) just to spent a weekend (day) with friends. When you drive a Fiero, half the fun is getting there!

Last year I was able to get to the historic races at Sears Point and partricipate in the Fiero corral. I'm still trying to remove some of the many finger prints from the back of my car. Sorry you guys have so much trouble with engine swaps in CA, but appreciated the kind words and interest. I guess that's why we get together, to BS about our cars, share ideas, experiences and have the occational bout with some food and drink. I know that many of you are a lot more fun in person than in this thread.

This year I hope to get to as many Washington and Oregon events as possible, add at least one more CA event in addition to the historic races and a trip to Indy in August to satisfy my NASCAR jones.

I was not in favor of eliminating the NWFF event for a couple of reasons. The first reason for me was that I had attended the first NWFF that was not originally supported by the club that I currently belong. It was a great event in the first year and I had not been able to attend again until this year. It is nice to see what can be accomplished by having an annual event, fine tuning it every year and most important, by participating. It has become a very nice event and I don't want to quit supporting it every year. Another reason I did not want to cancel the NWFF for Shasta was that the NWFF is the only multi club event that some of the Fiero owners in the NW can attend. It would not seem right to stop the momentum that this event has created or force those participants to either go to Shasta or not have a larger event to attend.

I was looking forward to some BS (OK, lots of BS), a trip down the drag strip in Redding and a couple of laps around Thunder Hill. I know it takes a lot of planning and effort on the part of many volunteers. Those are the same people who take the heat because some body gets their Mr Mike seat covers in a bunch because they didn't win a door prize. Sorry!

I guess what surprised me (and obviously others) was that I just saw this issue on the Fieros NW club Yahoogroup yesterday. I went from survey, to offering to help, then to cancellation. Maybe I have not kept in touch with the right people to know that there must have been a lot of conversation going on about this event between the time that I had offered to help, emailed some suggestions and then the event was cancelled. I do remember that a lot of the 20th events were at risk right up to the wire and there was a lot of promotion going on to get the necessary participation to meet minimums. Some who signed up at the last minute indicated that they had not been aware until late and were willing to sign up as soon as they were made aware.

I know this rambling has not changed anything, but just thought I would share more ramblings from another Fiero gearhead from the NW.

Bill

Well, Bill, if you don't mind not sitting around in a parking lot polishing valve caps, we are going to be having a fun gathering in Central California in May. Love to have y'all come down! https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/036457.html

I have put it on the calendar as a reminder and will try to work it in to an excuse to head south. May 9th is Mother's Day, so it might be a stretch. Thanks for the invitation.

Bill

quote Originally posted by 87GT3800SC5SPD: May 9th is Mother's Day.

Aww, crap! I didn't catch that! How about if we move it back to May 1st?

quote Originally posted by stimpy: Aww, crap! I didn't catch that! How about if we move it back to May 1st?

Good call. Somewhere, someone's mother thanks you.

Thoughts from another NW guy...

I have been on the planning committe for the NWFF since the begining and each year the show has gotten better and better (not to mention easier to do). Our original "plan" was to always keep the show in the same area and on the same date etc.... We did have to move the date (one week) after the first show due to other events that also go on in the area. Since then we have kept the date the same. We have moved the location within the area once to better ourselves (from a car dealers paved lot to a nice riverside park with shade). So, basically except for a a little "tweaking" here and there we have a great show that we really didn't want to throw away.

I will admit I was one of the ones that voted to NOT combine the shows but to continue on with our annual show but, I also was planning to attend the Mt. Shasta event as well.
My thoughts were also along with several others: If we don't have it next year, will they come the following year? We really hated the thought of throwing away all of our hard work over the years. It was felt that since the shows were almost 2 months apart we would have no problems in supporting both shows. Look at the Mid west and the East coast, they have events all of the time! Some of them are just weeks are part and they all draw from the same group of people!

Being up in this corner of the country it is hard for me personally to attend other shows due to logistics and was looking forward to meeting some other Fiero people from outside of the NW area. I have met Fierobear(nice guy!), Kim from Nevada (what a sweetheart) and George (won't go there!) Other than that I only know the other NW clubs (Seattle, Boise & Portland).

It's a shame that this show didn't work out but I hope no one has any hard feelings and continue to support other clubs events and shows...

Happy Holidays!

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Greg
'86 SE
Inland Northwest Fiero Club
Spokane, WA

http://www.cardomain.com/id/lilrdfiero

quote Originally posted by LilRdFiero: Thoughts from another NW guy... I have been on the planning committe for the NWFF since the begining and each year the show has gotten better and better (not to mention easier to do). Our original "plan" was to always keep the show in the same area and on the same date etc.... We did have to move the date (one week) after the first show due to other events that also go on in the area. Since then we have kept the date the same. We have moved the location within the area once to better ourselves (from a car dealers paved lot to a nice riverside park with shade). So, basically except for a a little "tweaking" here and there we have a great show that we really didn't want to throw away.

I've been to two of your shows, and really enjoyed both. I'm sorry I couldn't make it up there this summer, but I got involved in the Vegas thing, so duty called.

When I discussed this with you folks, and then Ben Didlot afterward, Ben thought it would be nice to take a break from the organizing and work for a year. I doubt your show would have fallen by the wayside. You guys (and the folks that attend) have too much dedication, passion and fun doing it. But hey, it's your show, I can't blame you for wanting to protect it.

quote I will admit I was one of the ones that voted to NOT combine the shows but to continue on with our annual show but, I also was planning to attend the Mt. Shasta event as well. My thoughts were also along with several others: If we don't have it next year, will they come the following year? We really hated the thought of throwing away all of our hard work over the years. It was felt that since the shows were almost 2 months apart we would have no problems in supporting both shows. Look at the Mid west and the East coast, they have events all of the time! Some of them are just weeks are part and they all draw from the same group of people!

The folks in the east are a different breed. I really have to hand it to them for going to all those shows. They have a lot of passion for car shows, moreso than we seem to have here on the west coast. God bless 'em. Out here, we just don't seem to have folks with the same attitude. One car show seems to be enough for most of them. In all fairness, though, the distances we have between clubs is, on average, much longer and the population out here is less concentrated. That's what makes it tough to count on reliable numbers of people to do *two* car shows, especially if there is a lot of distance involved.

quote Being up in this corner of the country it is hard for me personally to attend other shows due to logistics and was looking forward to meeting some other Fiero people from outside of the NW area. I have met Fierobear(nice guy!), Kim from Nevada (what a sweetheart) and George (won't go there!) Other than that I only know the other NW clubs (Seattle, Boise & Portland). It's a shame that this show didn't work out but I hope no one has any hard feelings and continue to support other clubs events and shows... Happy Holidays!

I was disappointed and a bit let down when you guys made the decision, but I can't blame you. It's your show, you want to keep the momemtum going. I can't blame you, and won't dwell on any hard feelings. I just hope you guys understand that I am very protective of the money that the clubs contribute to the shows. If we took a big loss, it could kill future shows. I don't want the WestFest to die by my financial negligence.

Another thought for a NW Guy

I am really sad that they arent doing two shows because me and my dad would have went to both but it is up to you guys, but i think you shold have asked how many cars would be comming. oh well see u guys at Fiero Fest

Joe Sokol

Inland Northwest Fiero Club
Coeur D' Alene ID

Looks like things have cooled off and I can come out of my hole. I just joined the site and would like to be accountable to all. I am a 7-yr member and newsletter editor of Fieros NW (Oregon) as well as the coordinator of the 2003 NWFF. Ben informed me of the decision to move the show south due to lack of sufficient interest from the NW so I posted the info on our Yahoo group site to let of membership know for their planning purposes. Little did I know it would become such a heated topic elsewhere.
After reading this tread I would like to note that Bill and Greg expressed the facts as well as anyone. Most of us that show were not satisfied with only one show to attend next year. I am convinced the lack of our past involvement in the SW is a result of inadequate communication and maybe some past politics. There are 9 members in our club that were eager to head south and check out the competition and meet some new friends.
It also appears the organizers have financial concerns. May I suggest you discuss this issue with Ben. He set up a method with the NWFF participating clubs so that no individuals were at risk. To date each club has received back more than their initial investment with this past year maybe the most successful. The planning is crucial to a successful event but working with people like Ben who actually participate makes the job much easier and enjoyable.
Lastly, my intention was to inform, not instigate. If you are interested in checking us out on the net go to http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/fierosnw/. If you want to exchange newsletters let me know.
Mike

Welcome Mike... Admittedly, this has been a heated thread. It could have been handled better from the start but it has taken a turn for the better lately. I don't think there are any hard feeling anywhere about this, but I also don't think there needs to be finger pointing and degrading either...

I for one would love to take a trip up North to meet some new folks. I'll be watching with interest to see what sorts of shows and run ya'll put together and hopefully I can make on in the future.

quote Originally posted by Custommodmike: 2003 NWFF. Ben informed me of the decision to move the show south due to lack of sufficient interest from the NW so I posted the info on our Yahoo group site to let of membership know for their planning purposes. Little did I know it would become such a heated topic elsewhere.

It wasn't lack of interest from the Northwest, it was the decision not to skip your show next year. An understandable decision, but I felt that 2 shows wouldn't work. More on that later.

quote After reading this tread I would like to note that Bill and Greg expressed the facts as well as anyone. Most of us that show were not satisfied with only one show to attend next year. I am convinced the lack of our past involvement in the SW is a result of inadequate communication and maybe some past politics. There are 9 members in our club that were eager to head south and check out the competition and meet some new friends.

Before the Truckee/Tahoe show in 2002, I sent fliers and several emails to your club presidents. I'm not sure what else we could have done, communication-wise. We only got one of your NW folks to show up. That's one reason why I didn't think we could do 2 shows. Obviously, if there is a show closer to home, that's the one people will pick.

quote It also appears the organizers have financial concerns. May I suggest you discuss this issue with Ben. He set up a method with the NWFF participating clubs so that no individuals were at risk. To date each club has received back more than their initial investment with this past year maybe the most successful. The planning is crucial to a successful event but working with people like Ben who actually participate makes the job much easier and enjoyable. Lastly, my intention was to inform, not instigate. If you are interested in checking us out on the net go to http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/fierosnw/. If you want to exchange newsletters let me know. Mike

When we changed the way of doing shows down here in the southwest, your Northwest Fest was the model. It used to be one club that did all the work and shouldered the financial resposibility. Now, we have 4 clubs contributing and getting back proceeds, if they wish, or leaving the money in the WestFest account, which they all chose to do.

Problem is, the Shasta show *could* have been big, meaning that we'd need a large meeting space. Now you're talking about a banquet, and the upfront money doubles or triples. Most of our clubs simply don't have the extra money, so individuals have to put their money on the line...or the event doesn't happen.

For the Vegas show, it was decided not to use the WestFest money (that's in the bank). Three individuals put up a total of around $2000 of their own money. We skipped the banquet, because that amount would have doubled.
Maybe, if the Northwest folks didn't do their show, they could have helped in this regard, but I can't see how it could be done with two shows, since they'd need the normal amount for their show. Where would the extra money come from? I didn't feel like writing a check for $1500-3000 for a banquet, especially when the total number of people was completely unknown.

I hope this helps to explain why we made the decision to abandon the Shasta show, and hopefully you understand.

I clearly understand your rationale on the issue. We have found most attendees at our show don't want to be in a sterile banquet facility however so we hold it in the park where the show is at. Caterers with excellent food were located and we were able to lower the dinner cost from $25 to $20 and still more than cover the costs. Maybe we can't pull it off in 2004 but I would sure like the opportunity to work with your committee to make it happen in 2005. Mt Shasta is known for holding car shows with ample local hotels etc and would be a great place for som beautiful drives.
Mike

The reason I started this is I was tired of the status quo.

For the most part NW fiero owners don't go to california shows and california fiero owners don't go to NW events. I have seen them posted on Pennocks along with pictures of the shows.

Maybe I could have worded it better!

It just seemed without some compromises and acceptance of the fact that the NW show did not have to be cancelled for a second combined show to be a success our two regions would continue to go their seperate ways.

I like the fact that there will always be windmills that need tilting.

How about instead of trying to make this a big ole show then, why not just do a weekend gig like we did at the coast and see who shows up. It's a 7 hour drive for me... I'd drive up on a Friday for a Saturday gathering...

Now's the real test... Will people do it just for the love of the cars or will there have to be trophies to win for people to drive that far? It might be a good gauge of who would be willing to show up for a future event.

Great idea, Dale. Now if there were only an event coming up that people could come down from the NW for, and still be acessible for people from SoCal. Hmmm. Somewhere in the Central Coast area might be good. Hmmm. I know! The Rally Through The Valley coming May 1, 2004! https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/036457.html That would be GREAT!

quote Originally posted by stimpy: Great idea, Dale. Now if there were only an event coming up that people could come down from the NW for, and still be acessible for people from SoCal. Hmmm. Somewhere in the Central Coast area might be good. Hmmm. I know! The Rally Through The Valley coming May 1, 2004! https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/036457.html That would be GREAT!

Wow, Stimpy is really stumpin'!

I believe that the Coast run had all the comraderie of a regional without trophies and a car show. It was about a totally different attitude of hanging out.

Would I want to get rid of the car show and trophies of the regional. NO.

Yes there are some shallow people who go to the shows for the expressed fact of winning a trophy and not just a trophy but the FIRST place trophy in their class that they don't belong in anyways just because they ran up the bill on their JC Whitney catalogs....but I digress....but there is fun in awards ceremonies (and not just because I enjoy MC duties) its recognizing people's efforts in their Fieros. Cars look better with trophies next to them. But as long as its not the only thing.

I would hate to see the trophies go away.

I have never had any problem with the NW doing their own thing. I just had a dread of going up there and having it become the Bay Area/Southern California show.

Okay, my 2 cents is about up...

Seeya at the Rally!

quote Originally posted by Songman: Now's the real test... Will people do it just for the love of the cars or will there have to be trophies to win for people to drive that far? It might be a good gauge of who would be willing to show up for a future event.

I may be the odd man out, but I'd be more likely to come to some event if there was not a car show. I haven't made it to any of the car shows that our club attends (including the NW Fiero Fest) but I've made it to the Arlington picnic twice. Car shows don't interest me. I like driving my car and I like hanging out and chatting with other Fiero owners. Maybe it's just because I'm too lazy to clean my entire car with a toothbrush.

But maybe I'm not the only one because if I'm not mistaken (and somebody please correct me if I am), the Arlington picnic has attracted more cars than the Fest for each of the two years it's been held.

Just some food for thought and a reminder that not everybody cares about car shows. Car shows just get a lot of air time on this board.

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Doug Chase
Chase Race
Custom roll cage and exhaust fabrication

I'm with ya, Doug! My car is bone stock and I drive it... I would enter a show but doubt that I would win anything... I go to hang out, see other cars, and DRIVE!

I would never want a Run to replace a Show either.. Just offering up an idea on how to gauge how many people would actually drive that far to any event.

Well, if you folks want a Mt. Shasta event, there are three ways we can go.

1. Forget San Simeon next year, and do Shasta

I don't want to do this, because of the timing. CFOG-I's Wheatstock is in late June, the time I originally wanted to do the WestFest, and the Northwest show (and usually FOCOA's) are in early August. I like to schedule WestFest as far away from other stuff on the calendar as possible, so that if folks want to go to more than one show, they don't have to make a choice. That's why I picked July 16-18 of next year, halfway in between the above shows.

2. Make the Mt. Shasta event a non-carshow

Doable. Don't know if it will draw people long distance without the competition, which some folks like. Would they be replaced by more folks, who *don't* like competition? We'll need to ask around.

3. Do the Mt. Shasta show in June, 2005

We will need some place to do the '05 show. After 2 shows in a row in the "south" (Vegas and San Simeon), a break to the north might be nice.

Let's talk about it.

Personally, the Coast Run is something that I have been doing for years. Long before I moved to California I would come out here just to drive that road. I'll have a Coast Run on that road every year even if it is not an event that pulls people in. Since I am not really affiliated with any club, that puts it along the same lines of my Bakersfield gatherings... Just a guy and a car inviting other guys with other cars to go for a drive... I don't want it to take away from any other shows or runs. That's why I did it late in the year.

quote Originally posted by Songman: Just a guy and a car inviting other guys with other cars to go for a drive...

And there ain't nothing wrong with that!

[This message has been edited by stimpy (edited 12-19-2003).]