We need to have 50 signed up for the Waterford Hills Track Day by June 15th or it will be canceled! (stop me if I'm wrong George.) Right now there are ONLY 30.
Pleeeeaaaaaaase sign up!!!!
I really want to go. I have been putting hundreds of hours into my Fiero SS Project to get it running and ready in time for this event on July 17. Heck I even took a week of work just to get it done in time. This will be my racecar's first track day. I WILL EVEN BE LETTING PEOPLE RIDE WITH ME IF THEY WANT. For those of you who have not seen my car it is a 645hp, 2300 lb. SCCA Super Production Class car (The rules say my car is too fast for GT1 class) Shows are great (and I'll be out there Saturday for the 20th) but I want to run this thing!
Top 10 reasons for going........
1. This is the most fun you will have at the 20th show. You can drive as fast or as slow as you want.
2. This is a REAL ROAD RACING TRACK. Not an oval.
3. You will never find track time for under $100. Trust me, this is a steal.
4. There will be ITA and ITB class racing guys there to get experience from. (I know I will be asking them for pointers)
5. You get to find out what a great job Pontiac did with their design.
6. You can find out what all of your mods did for the performance of your car and what to do next!
7. It lasts much longer than drag racing. (more seat time)
8. Improve your street and track driving skills.
9. You will never have this much fun at an amusement park for under $100.
10. George Ryan needs our support!
Thank you for listening!!!!
------------------ Paul Hosler 87 GT 217,xxx Daily diver. Modified IMSA 600+ hp Tube chassis racecar (in progress)
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08:00 AM
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FieroMaster88 Member
Posts: 7680 From: Mattawan, MI Registered: Nov 2000
We have a local track on this side of the state too. It's $50 on weeknights from 5 to dusk to race your car on the track. Pretty fun, been there a few times. I'll register for this if I end up getting the time off work to come to the show! I'm sure it will be a blast!
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10:01 AM
Nashco Member
Posts: 4144 From: Portland, OR Registered: Dec 2000
I'm in FULL support of this event as well, I think it's one of the best Fiero events ever to be held! I've jumped some major hoops (for me and my budget...rebuilt tranny, tires, alignment, brakes, days off from work, 800 mile drive, etc.) to be ready for this and I really want to see it happen.
I was waiting for a paycheck to sign up, actually just did it yesterday. In my opinion, the entry fee is sooo low, it'd be worth it just for a ride in Paul's AWESOME car! (Where do I sign up for a ride Paul, I don't want to miss out on an offer like that!?!)
Like he said, this is a REAL track, a good track where you'll get a lot of seat time and experience with your vehicle. Also, everybody from rookie to expert will be able to race in the appropriate class. Lastly, if we don't support this, we'll probably never get any AWESOME events like this again...but if we do support it, we may get even better events in the future. This is a huge turning point for Fiero racing, and will determine the future for it in my opinion.
Bryce 88 GT
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10:02 AM
Cheever3000 Member
Posts: 12400 From: The Man from Tallahassee Registered: Aug 2001
Originally posted by Cheever3000: Also, the Milan drags have a pitiful number of entries. What are you waiting for?
Honestly, a bigger engine. My stock 2.8 GT is far from a drag car, as I'm sure many other Fieros coming to the show are.
I'd say forget the drags, concentrate on the Waterford Hills thing. Fieros are built for the turns, and there will be instructors to teach you *how* to do the turns.
Do the Waterford Hills thing, guys, it'll be worth it!
The road course sure sounds like fun, but I have absolutely no experience on a track. I watch races on ESPN, and that's about it. Plus I'd be afraid that I'd bump into someone. I don't want to mess up anyone else's car or mine.
On the drag races, is the $35 just for one shot down the track?
------------------
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12:04 PM
California Kid Member
Posts: 9541 From: Metro Detroit Area, Michigan Registered: Jul 2001
The road course sure sounds like fun, but I have absolutely no experience on a track. I watch races on ESPN, and that's about it. Plus I'd be afraid that I'd bump into someone. I don't want to mess up anyone else's car or mine.
On the drag races, is the $35 just for one shot down the track?
If I understand the rules right for Waterford, it's single file, no passing, if a slow car is holding people up, they are flagged to pits until everyone passes, then they can go back out on the track. I think they will be grouping cars based on lap speed to minmize the above from causing too much congestion.
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12:11 PM
Doug Chase Member
Posts: 1487 From: Seattle area, Washington State, USA Registered: Sep 2001
The road course sure sounds like fun, but I have absolutely no experience on a track. I watch races on ESPN, and that's about it. Plus I'd be afraid that I'd bump into someone. I don't want to mess up anyone else's car or mine.
When was the last time you bumped into somebody on the street? It's more or less the same on the track except that a) you're going faster and b) you have a little confidence that the idiot in front of you knows what he's doing and is aware you're behind him.
As California Kid said, track days are pretty much single file except for one or two designated passing areas. If you see cars piling up behind you then at the next passing area you move over to let them by, then carry on driving at your own pace.
There will be a handful of pretty experienced people there who can help you out. You'll be able to ride with somebody more experienced or have them ride with you so you can learn the ropes.
This is some of the most fun you'll have in a car for only $65. Do it, you'll be glad you did.
------------------ Doug Chase '88 Fiero Formula 5-spd (autocrosser) '88 Fiero GT 5-spd (daily driver) '85 Fiero GT 5-spd (rally car) '87 Fiero SE V6 5-spd (for sale $2200) '88 Fiero Formula 5-spd (parts car / future rally car #2) Custom roll cage fabrication available Custom exhaust fabrication available
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12:51 PM
jstricker Member
Posts: 12956 From: Russell, KS USA Registered: Apr 2002
Actually, this is NOT a race, it's High Speed Touring and if you haven't ever been on a road track before then this is perfect for you if you want to try it. You get to drive fast safely on a track with other drivers.
There are also supposed to be instructors there, although the rules only mention them in passing. Maybe George can elaborate a bit. You are also permitted to take passengers so you could take an experienced driver along, or ride with one, and gain experience that way too.
Not having any experience in doing this isn't much of an excuse and if you've EVER wanted to try a road course, this it the time.
The road course sure sounds like fun, but I have absolutely no experience on a track. I watch races on ESPN, and that's about it. Plus I'd be afraid that I'd bump into someone. I don't want to mess up anyone else's car or mine.
On the drag races, is the $35 just for one shot down the track?
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12:53 PM
Rare87GT Member
Posts: 5087 From: Wichita, KS USA Registered: Oct 2001
So we can have a track driver there drive our cars if we want to see what they are capable of if we want to fully see the potential?
Only if you don't care that he may put it into a guard rail!!!
Waterford is a pretty tight course for anyone running over 300 hp. Hot Foots better keep in mind that you don't want to lift off the gas pedal in turns, so if you go into a corner 'hot' you'd better know what you're doing. There isn't much 'run off' room at the Waterford Track, and they do have rail barriers that will do a real nice job on your car if it gets away from you.
[This message has been edited by California Kid (edited 06-08-2003).]
I would love to drive on a real road course. Autocrossing is really fun but this would be much more exciting. The only thing is my car has like 164K on it and I'm afraid I'll end up breaking down or something. That's why I have temporarily quit autocrossing until I get a new motor in my other car. Anyone care to let me drive their car instead? If it weren't for that I would definately sign up. You can't beat the price thats for sure.
Does anyone need until July 1st to pay the registration cost? If that would help, and if you COMMIT yourself, then we will take your registration by the 15th and give you until July 1st to pay. But don't agree to it and then back out.
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03:02 PM
cadero2dmax Member
Posts: 1266 From: Brighton, CO Registered: Oct 2001
So we can have a track driver there drive our cars if we want to see what they are capable of if we want to fully see the potential?
Sure, but why stop there. Watch and learn, then go out an do it yourself - - -
I am going to do everything I can to get everybody a minimum of 3 twenty minute sessions on the track. That is enough time to (1) get checked out by an instructor (mandatory) just as you suggest; (2) try it on your own; (3) ride with somebody else to compare notes (4) drive it on your own again!
There have been a lot of questions about the "rules". Go to www.cfogi.org/hst_gr.htm to read a preliminary copy of the "rules" - - you will get a better idea of what is happening out there on track. I specifically said "preliminary", because there are some details being discussed with our insuror, so there may be some subtle differences in the end.
That is why it is mandatory to come to the drivers school. The first car out will be at 12 noon, last car in at 4:30. But to be fully prepared, plan on being at the track at 10:30 for drivers school and meeting.
G
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03:38 PM
kslish Member
Posts: 1479 From: Womelsdorf, PA Registered: Apr 2000
I am really close to committing....just need to work hard to make sure the car is going to be safe and reliable at those speeds when run hard. I need to install a breather catch can, or at least re-route the breather tube assembly, as it's not working well with my turbo under boost and a little oil is making it's way to the exhaust manifold and it tends to smoke a little repeated full throttle runs. The brakes are another question mark as I've roasted them once already coming down Pennsylvania hills too hard.
I do have my hotel room reserved already though so I can be there.
Have we gotten any closer to the 50 count needed?
Ken S.
[This message has been edited by kslish (edited 06-08-2003).]
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03:50 PM
R Runner Member
Posts: 3703 From: Scottsville, KY Registered: Feb 2003
I want to let everyone know that this is not just for racecars. Quite the opposite. Most of the cars there will likely be street cars. I have taken my 217,xxx mile GT out for track days before. Lots of FUN! It is PERFECTLY OKAY TO BRING A STOCK 4 CYCLINDER. You will still have lots of fun.
If you have ever broken the speed limit on some local twisties, more than likely it was more dangerous than this. You saw what I'm bringing. Do you think I want to mess it up? Of course not! Please don't think of this as a race.
People will be talking about this event for years to come. You can say "I was there!"
PS: Bring a helmet (SN95 or better) if you have one. Please check the rules listed in the posts above.
------------------ Paul Hosler 87 GT 217,xxx Daily diver. Modified IMSA 600+ hp Tube chassis racecar (in progress)
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04:04 PM
fierobear Member
Posts: 27106 From: Safe in the Carolinas Registered: Aug 2000
The road course sure sounds like fun, but I have absolutely no experience on a track. I watch races on ESPN, and that's about it. Plus I'd be afraid that I'd bump into someone. I don't want to mess up anyone else's car or mine.
But that's the idea...there will be instructors to teach you. You don't have to go any faster or harder than your ability.
This isn't an all out race. They won't let you get in a situation where you'll bump someone. I've never been on the track, either. A friend of mine that is going with me is an instructor for these kinds of events, and will likely be instructing at Waterford. He's been trying to get me out to the track for a long time. He recommends doing it because you learn how to handle your car better on the road, and become a more knowledgeable and safer driver.
Give it a shot, guys!
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06:05 PM
Formula88 Member
Posts: 53788 From: Raleigh NC Registered: Jan 2001
What about helmets? Will rentals be available or do we need to buy one in advance? Any idea how much a cheap one that still meets the requirements would be?
Does anyone need until July 1st to pay the registration cost? If that would help, and if you COMMIT yourself, then we will take your registration by the 15th and give you until July 1st to pay. But don't agree to it and then back out.
Cheev, that would help me out. I will definately be able to pay for it by the 1st.
And I'd also like to know if there is somewhere to rent a helmet, or if someone is willing to let me borrow one.
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06:49 PM
jstricker Member
Posts: 12956 From: Russell, KS USA Registered: Apr 2002
I'd also like to know if there is somewhere to rent a helmet, or if someone is willing to let me borrow one.
I would suggest that you check out pawn shops, yard sales, or flea markets. You can find them pretty cheap at those places.
Two things - - (1) Look for cracks or dings. Once a helmet has been zapped, it isn't safe any more, and (2)Make sure that it is Snell rated - Snell 90 or newer - DOT rated is not legal!
BTW, Motorcycle helmets (M rated) are OK for track days, SA are not required.
If all else fails, I may have an old helmet lying around here somewhere.
G
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06:58 AM
cadero2dmax Member
Posts: 1266 From: Brighton, CO Registered: Oct 2001
There are now 33 registered (30 paid), with another 10 that have said that they will be registering before the 15th.
As Cheever said, if you need more time to come up with the registration fee, please go ahead and sign up anyway. All you need to do is communicate with us and tell us how we can help. We will work the $ out with you.
However, if you haven't taken the time to fill out the registration form by the 15th, you could be missing out!
Go to www.cfogi.org/waterford.htm and fill out the registration form now if you want to be a part of this historic event.
G
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07:07 AM
Pyrthian Member
Posts: 29569 From: Detroit, MI Registered: Jul 2002
I would suggest that you check out pawn shops, yard sales, or flea markets. You can find them pretty cheap at those places.
Two things - - (1) Look for cracks or dings. Once a helmet has been zapped, it isn't safe any more, and (2)Make sure that it is Snell rated - Snell 90 or newer - DOT rated is not legal!
BTW, Motorcycle helmets (M rated) are OK for track days, SA are not required.
If all else fails, I may have an old helmet lying around here somewhere.
G
Thanks. I'll go look around today. My dad told me he has an old one, but I doubt it's in good shape, and probably doesn't have the right rating.
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11:18 AM
PontiacFiero Member
Posts: 760 From: Huntsville, AL Registered: Apr 2002
Sent you an e-mail about a ride in your car. I am flying up for the 20th anniversary, so I will not have any of my Fieros. I would really appreciate a ride in your car at the track.
Thanks Paul
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12:27 PM
blakeinspace Member
Posts: 5923 From: Fort Worth, Texas Registered: Dec 2001
I signed up for both events this Saturday evening. My wife was a little apprehensive: "I hope you don't break down?" (I drive a 100,000mi Formula.) If it's gonna die, what a way to go!
I just told her not to worry her pretty little head. Is it wrong of me to kinda hope the motor pops so that I can ship the car of to Alabama for a 4.9 transplant?
Adam, I know money is tight (especially for a student), but I got tired of loaner helmets at my local AutoX. I bought a SN95 helmet at a motorcycle shop for about $95.00.
This opportunity to run on a real track is rare. Much less for $65.00. NEVER with all your peers in ALL FIERO's. Man... what a sight this will be! I am so pumped.
Lastly... for anybody that needs a confidence boost at the drag races. I have a mostly stock automatic Formula with no christmas tree experience and can take a lot of smack talk if you want to line up opposite me. I saw that video of Her86GT. I think Becky could beat me in reverse.
We'll see how it goes. Here is the plan: There will be 3 20 minute sessions and I would like to get as much track time as possible. So, I figure the first time out is just mee to get a feel for the gal, and then in the 2nd session, a rider. Perhaps come in after 3 or 4 laps and get another. I figure that I may be able to take a total of 2 or 3. The only reason is because once the session is started, switching passengers would take time. I am guessing 5 minutes or more. (lots of safety stuff). Of course, if for some reason Joe Huffaker showed up (I have no idea if he will be there, just hoping!) I would like him to take a spin in it. Again, this is all contingent on it running, and operating properly at speed. I don't want to put somone in danger just because I want to practice.
..... But we still need 50 total......
As a fellow Fiero fan, I'm telling you, once you do it you won't look at another event (or even driving to work ) the same way again.
Fieros Rule!
------------------ Paul Hosler 87 GT 217,xxx Daily diver. Modified IMSA 600+ hp Tube chassis racecar (in progress)
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11:04 PM
cadero2dmax Member
Posts: 1266 From: Brighton, CO Registered: Oct 2001
<snip> Of course, if for some reason Joe Huffaker showed up (I have no idea if he will be there, just hoping!) I would like him to take a spin in it. <snip>
What would a historic Fiero Performance event like this be without Joe Huffaker?
Joe is planning on doing several things in conjunction with the 20th. First, he plans to be at the track day, possibly running the pace car. Second, he has been asked to judge the competition car class at the show. Third, he will award the trophy to that class, and fourth, he has been asked to speak at the banquet after Hulki finishes.
G
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11:28 PM
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System Bot
Cheever3000 Member
Posts: 12400 From: The Man from Tallahassee Registered: Aug 2001
Just wanted to explain the June 15 deadline date. You may be knowledgeable about the car show routine, where a date is given solely for the purpose of guessing attendance numbers in advance (the higher cost afterwards being the motivator).
But this is totally different. From the beginning of planning the 20th anniversary event, the performance activities have been under their own registrations, their own timeframes, and their own budgets. And the reasons for the pre-registration deadline are distinctly separate as well. Reason #1 - There had to be a Go/No-Go date, a point at which we cannot proceed any further without hope of a successful and enjoyable activity. Reason #2 - There are enormous costs for this, and if anything goes wrong, we did not want it to affect the rest of the event. There is a break-even point of attendance, and that number simply must be met.
So the date was not set just to get a better feel for how many are interested. If you're serious about doing this, you will sign up. If you're not, then you are invited to be a spectator if the activity is held, and you can still enjoy the other portions of the 20th anniversary celebration.
Negotiations are underway which could make our vision for the future of CFOGi's Performance Division much more assured. More about that if & when it is worked out. But the Waterford event will be a springboard for much more to come. It provides the very best opportunity for the inexperienced driver to test the waters and see if racing a Fiero is as much fun as they say. Racing opportunities for the average person are getting fewer, not greater... UNLESS you're a Fiero driver. We're finding ways to make it happen, in spite of tougher limitations. Join us!
Even those who know they aren't going to drive in this activity - I hope you'll get there on Thursday, July 17, and watch history in the making. A history which began 20 years ago, but which is taking new & exciting steps next month!
Beee Theerrrrreee!!!!
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11:30 PM
R Runner Member
Posts: 3703 From: Scottsville, KY Registered: Feb 2003
As a fellow Fiero fan, I'm telling you, once you do it you won't look at another event (or even driving to work ) the same way again.
Fieros Rule!
How true. Those that have driven this type event can know and appreciate the huge adrenaline rushes you can get.
With a professional photographer there to take action shots, you can take a pretty neat memento home with you to cherish. The poster size digital photos Jan and I have of us at the Solo II Nationals hang in our trophy room/office - a source of pride (as is the shot taken hot-lapping Texas Motor Speedway).
Don't miss out. We are up to 35 entries now - - but still more to go .
One additional thought. If it takes a few bucks more to hold the event due to the number of entries, or an insurance increase, or whatever - - would everybody be willing to pay a little more in lieu of a refund?
G
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11:36 PM
cadero2dmax Member
Posts: 1266 From: Brighton, CO Registered: Oct 2001
Think he would like to take my car for a lap or two around the track?
I talked to him a couple times about a year ago when I was still figuring the car out.
Paul
Who would miss achance like that????
I would have no doubts that he would take it for a spin. Might even get you some set-up advice, to boot.
It is not locked in stone yet, as this is smack-dab in the middle of his racing season. But he is scheduled, wants to come, and will let us know for sure within a few days.
Stay tuned!!
G
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11:45 PM
Jun 10th, 2003
cadero2dmax Member
Posts: 1266 From: Brighton, CO Registered: Oct 2001
For anybody that is interested in "hanging around" but not participating in the Waterford Track day, please consider lending a hand. I need about a dozen volunteers to do such things as Security, Grid and Paddock chiefs, photographer, Go-Fers, etc.
Also, for anybody that wants to get some experience, I will need helpers on the corners. We will have licensed corner workers, but they need another person to man the radio, etc. You learn a lot, are close to the action, and some of the stories those gnarly old vets can tell!!
Also the Event Chairman and Event Coordinator will need helpers. This is a great way to learn what all is going on at an event of this sort, could result in laps in the pace car, lots of time in the tower, with the announcers, etc.
please e-mail me at home if you think you could help out. gryan3@mindspring.com
Thanx
G
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09:47 AM
Pyrthian Member
Posts: 29569 From: Detroit, MI Registered: Jul 2002
so waterford is gonna be bust? not enough interest? I'd think just the michigan fiero club would fill the 50. I think there was 40 of us at MIS last year, and that was 3 laps at ~70mph. This is waterford - 3 20 minutes sessions. drive it like ya stole it. maybe thats what scaring people. dont want to be the first one off the track. I know I'm no mario andretti, but got a fresh motor, but sloppy suspension. All these guys with poly all around - rear sway bars - lowered, comeone - put it to work!
------------------ 1985 Fiero SE Plain Red V6 Coupe
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10:33 AM
Doug Chase Member
Posts: 1487 From: Seattle area, Washington State, USA Registered: Sep 2001
One additional thought. If it takes a few bucks more to hold the event due to the number of entries, or an insurance increase, or whatever - - would everybody be willing to pay a little more in lieu of a refund?
I've said this on the racing list but I'll say it here for this crowd.
You originally said we needed 65 entries to break even. Right now we have (roughly) half that. If this is all the entries that we recieve, that means everybody would have to throw in about another $65.
If it comes to that, count me in. $130 for a track day is cheap in this neck of the woods. Heck, I'm going to be spending about $800 in gas money to tow from Seattle to Michigan and back. Another $65 to get to play on the track for a day is nothing.
To anybody who is on the fence about this, I highly recommend that you sign up. If you drive within your abilities and don't get too excited and over your head then this won't be significantly more dangerous than driving on the street.
As for car wear, well you're going to be spending time at WOT and high RPMs, you're going to be braking hard, and you're going to be cornering hard. These are things that most of us do in our Fieros occasionally anyway. Your car isn't going to see anything that it doesn't see on the street, it's just going to see a little more of it in a shorter period of time.
See you all there,
------------------ Doug Chase '88 Fiero Formula 5-spd (autocrosser) '88 Fiero GT 5-spd (daily driver) '85 Fiero GT 5-spd (rally car) '87 Fiero SE V6 5-spd (for sale $2200) '88 Fiero Formula 5-spd (parts car / future rally car #2) Custom roll cage fabrication available Custom exhaust fabrication available
As for car wear, well you're going to be spending time at WOT and high RPMs, you're going to be braking hard, and you're going to be cornering hard. These are things that most of us do in our Fieros occasionally anyway. Your car isn't going to see anything that it doesn't see on the street, it's just going to see a little more of it in a shorter period of time.
See you all there,
The main thing I'm worried about is my brakes. The rotors on my car are kind of old, and have been machined down already. I might go by the parts store and see how much a new set will cost.
Hey G- I'm ready to sign up, but I was wondering if you had any details as to their "noise restrictions" and enforcement (how is it measured, at what distance, and at what RPM?) My car is pretty loud, and wouldn't want to have to worry about it
_______ 
