When I get done and painted, I'll take pictures of next to a stock Y pipe. It will likely be $250. Dont look like much to make, but it really takes quite a bit, especially those adapters to mate with the headers and that Y collector it has to be pressed from a large pipe into 8 and then cut, fitted and welded back into a V. As it turned out, I could not use our regular jigs for any of it, had to make new ones and still need to make a few more. As can be expected my, "oh I can make a better one of those easy"... wrong about the easy part. I never learn, always think it will be a piece of cake to do something.

Lokin' good! Can't wait for the,"Finished Product".

Francis, will that work with your headers? or its just for people that want stock ported manifolds, and looking to get a better flowing Y pipe? is this for 88's? Auto or 5 speed?

The FS pipes are for 84-87. Has someone made a pipe to fix the restriction on the 88 as well?

quote Originally posted by 88White3.4GT: Francis, will that work with your headers? or its just for people that want stock ported manifolds, and looking to get a better flowing Y pipe? is this for 88's? Auto or 5 speed?

They will not work with our headers just the stock ones and likely the Sprints, but still have to confirm the Sprint fit. If you look at our headers you'll see that we relocated the collectors so we could make # 5 & # 6 cylinders equal lenght and get better entery angles into thge collectors.

OK, here's the finial verison, i cut the lower section off and made it larger at 2.5" dia. We can provide a three bolt flange with adapter to your exhaust if you want.

[img]tp://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s16/writerfrank/YandY2.jpg[/img]
[img]tp://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s16/writerfrank/YandY4yview.jpg[/img]
[img]tp://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s16/writerfrank/YandY.jpg[/img]

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Trueleo.com/fiero.htm
RSpiderII@aol.com

Just a heads-up....the pictures didn't show up or the links don't work. DARN!

Hmm... screwed that one up? No pictures.

At the beginning of the links, you had "tp" instead of "http". So I fixed the typos.

[This message has been edited by Blacktree (edited 03-10-2007).]

Francis T, might you be able to post just one more photo? How about a photo focusing in more closely on just the "Y" in your Y-pipe design (the silver-painted pipe in your earlier photos) versus just the "Y" in the stock Y-pipe design (the other pipe in your photos)? Such a photo might better help everybody see how unrestrictive YOUR design is compared to the stock design.

some thoughts on exhaust restrictions

to look for a restriction i use a boost/vacum gage and tap in at various points along the way.
pressure = back pressure
several times I was about to spend hours grinding and smoothing and found that it wasnt necessary
because there was no pressure just before that point.

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87 Fiero GT 5sp with Vortec L35 4300 Turbocharged V6
Bully Stage 2 clutch
Syclone intake manifold and engine management with Moates adapter and chip burner
Air/water intercooler and Devil's Own progressive water/alky injection
50lb injectors, 3 bar map sensor, Walboro fuel pump and Jabasco Intercooler pump
LM1 wideband on custom manifolds and 3" stainless exhaust system
T31/T04B S4 turbo with a Super T61 in the box
S10 caliper conversion.
Murphy's Constant Matter will be damaged in direct proportion to its value
Murphy's Law of Thermodynamics Things get worse under pressure.
Arthur C. Clarke "Any significantly advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic"

Your suggestion, vortecfiero, sounds like one way that might help more clearly identify where a part has restrictions to its airflow --- before always grinding away on that part in a certain area --- especially since that area may not even present a restriction in the first place. In short, I think I understand WHAT you're proposing, but in fairness to you, I don't think I have as good an understanding as to WHY you're proposing it.

For example, at this point, we probably can't expect Francis T to tap into his new Y-pipe design at various points just to see where it may still be restrictive, especially since his pieces are hand-fabricated, and, I'm guessing, take hours to make just one.

A related point here is that Francis T's new Y-pipe design doesn't involve identifying and then grinding down any obstructions in the STOCK design. Instead, he's created a new Y-pipe design entirely, and fabricated that with larger diameter pipe than stock, along with much less crimping than the stock design has at the "Y" of its Y-pipe. In short, while I'd agree that somebody always can improve on something, it seems that the new Y-pipe design Francis T has created already is pretty impressive.

Is what you're proposing addressed more to the people who want to try and modify the stock Y-pipe by grinding on it (or even grinding on Francis T's design once they buy it --- and I wish them luck in trying to improve upon it), or are you simply proposing that the stock Y-pipe may not be that restrictive in the first place?

As I cautioned at the outset of this post, I think I understand WHAT you're proposing, but I admit I don't have as good an understanding as to WHY you're proposing it. Could you elaborate a bit on the latter?

Whereas you can R&D something completely our of what near everyone can afford, I'm satisfied that our pipe will outflow the stock and Sprint pipe. Some things are just so plain to see they really dont need much R&D to imporve them. We'll leave getting (maybe) that last 1/4 HP out of it to FI and NASCAR boys with the deep pockets. I think it's plain to see that our pipe is much better, but then I am biased. BTW: it took me about a week to come up with that pipe, what with making gigs, test fitting, changing the gigs etc. Looks simple to do, but it's, not you want a good fit AND good flow.

Well now that I have the gigs made we can take orders for them
Here it is with stock headers and EGR connected

Blacktree, thank you for your earlier posts in this thread which have helped develop my "eye" for seeing what an unrestrictive Y-pipe design looks like.

Francis T, your new Y-pipe design looks VERY unrestrictive. This is particularly evident in the topmost of the two Y-pipe photos of your preceding post, as well as in the second last photo on the first page of this thread. Thank you for your efforts. My order for one of these new Trueleo Y-pipes of yours is on its way to you now.

FrancisT that Y pipe looks real nice.

Arn

Thanks for comments people. I may even look into using that type of Y on the Y pipe for our own headers, though is lot more work to make, and the one for ours also flows great.

Francis, I'd like one to go with my Sprint headers but don't see it available on your web site yet.

[This message has been edited by triker (edited 03-11-2007).]

Sorry Triker and anyone else; we have to update our website and have been having a problem doing it so this new item is not there yet. Send any request to me for now and I'll send them to Troy.
We need to know:
Do you want an EGR mount?
What type and size exhaust system you have, stock two-bolt flange, 3-bolt custom etc.
Do you need a wide bong in addition to to an O2, (additional charge)

88 crossovers are different

quote Originally posted by triker: Francis, I'd like one to go with my Sprint headers but don't see it available on your web site yet.

For my money, I wouldn't do that Y pipe without the sprint headers at least. It seems to me that the stock manifold really won't get the full benefit of such a free flowing Y. Just my .02

Arn

quote Originally posted by Arns85GT: For my money, I wouldn't do that Y pipe without the sprint headers at least. It seems to me that the stock manifold really won't get the full benefit of such a free flowing Y. Just my .02 Arn

You can gain some with a stock or ported stock headers over the OEM Y, but they will indeed work better with good headers. Ummm.. which we make also :-)

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Trueleo.com/fiero.htm
RSpiderII@aol.com

I just bought a new crossover Y pipe from the Fiero Store - the aftermarket heat coated one. After reading this thread I was very concerned I had made a mistake and would end up with a restricted pipe. Well, it just arrived so I got out one of those little mirrors that dentists use and a flashlight and looked to see what was what.

The two pipes are complete circles inside and there are no restrictions whatsoever. They are NOT CRUSHED TOGETHER INTO A 'D' SHAPE. I'd post pics, but I can't get the camera in there.

I had called the Fiero Store earlier today and asked how the pipe is different from the factory one - specifically, if there was the restriction or not. I think the guys name was Bob. He said there was no restriction and that when they had contracted to have these built for the Store there was no discussion as to how they should be made and the restriction problem was not addressed - they just happened to made without it.

I should clarify that I bought the Y pipe for an '88. I'm just guessing that the heat coated aftemarket pipe for the other years would be the same - without any restrictions.

I also mentioned to Bob that the info regarding these pipes on their website was a little muddy. Maybe they'll fix that.

quote Originally posted by project34: Your suggestion, vortecfiero, sounds like one way that might help more clearly identify where a part has restrictions to its airflow --- before always grinding away on that part in a certain area --- especially since that area may not even present a restriction in the first place. In short, I think I understand WHAT you're proposing, but in fairness to you, I don't think I have as good an understanding as to WHY you're proposing it. For example, at this point, we probably can't expect Francis T to tap into his new Y-pipe design at various points just to see where it may still be restrictive, especially since his pieces are hand-fabricated, and, I'm guessing, take hours to make just one. A related point here is that Francis T's new Y-pipe design doesn't involve identifying and then grinding down any obstructions in the STOCK design. Instead, he's created a new Y-pipe design entirely, and fabricated that with larger diameter pipe than stock, along with much less crimping than the stock design has at the "Y" of its Y-pipe. In short, while I'd agree that somebody always can improve on something, it seems that the new Y-pipe design Francis T has created already is pretty impressive. Is what you're proposing addressed more to the people who want to try and modify the stock Y-pipe by grinding on it (or even grinding on Francis T's design once they buy it --- and I wish them luck in trying to improve upon it), or are you simply proposing that the stock Y-pipe may not be that restrictive in the first place? As I cautioned at the outset of this post, I think I understand WHAT you're proposing, but I admit I don't have as good an understanding as to WHY you're proposing it. Could you elaborate a bit on the latter?

only through testing can we prove or disprove mods or any gains
the origonal poster said he had "heard" there was a restirction...

I was simply pointing out that with his combo.. testing would determine if it was even necessary to
to go to all the trouble of grinding...

to drill a 1/4 in hole and twist in a pipe threaded fitting, that costs about $1.50, takes 5 min.
to weld the hole up takes about 2 min. I like to buy about 5 or 6 of the fittings and leave them in till im finished testing
when the offending area is identified i weld up the holes .. which takes about 30 min after pulling the system off.
It confirms where the problem is and how bad it really is with the reading on the guage.
sorry if I muddled it up a little

quote For example, at this point, we probably can't expect Francis T to tap into his new Y-pipe design at various points just to see where it may still be restrictive, especially since his pieces are hand-fabricated, and, I'm guessing, take hours to make just one.

there is nothing better than testing.. modifying and retesting to find you were correct and spent all that time.
was his goal to design and hand fabricate a part ? or to design and hand fabricate a part to to solve a problem ? how do you know the problem is solved ?

Nice looking pipes BTW Francis T

[This message has been edited by vortecfiero (edited 03-14-2007).]

BBQd, thanks for literally "looking into" your Y-pipe from The Fiero Store.

It appears the posters on this thread have some interesting differences of opinion about the various Y-pipe designs.

For example, you report seeing no apparent restriction within The Fiero Store's coated Y-pipe which you had just purchased. Much earlier in this thread (7th post on its 1st page), Oreif suggested taking The Fiero Store's coated Y-pipe to an exhaust shop to remove a restriction within it. Dodgerunner posted some "before" and "after" pics of the restrictive-looking D-shape within the STOCK Y-pipe. (These are in Dodgerunner's 8th post on the 2nd page of this other thread => https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum2/HTML/072303.html )

And now, if I understand vortecfiero correctly, his contention is we simply DON'T KNOW if either the new Trueleo Y-pipe design OR The Fiero Store Y-pipe design represents any improvement whatsoever in flow versus the stock Y-pipe design, because we don't know without testing that the stock Y-pipe was restrictive in the first place. (If that misstates your position, vortecfiero, please feel free to speak up about that, because that definitely was not my intent.)

quote Originally posted by Jncomutt: 88 crossovers are different

So, the 88 x-overs are not restrictive??

My guess is that Jncomutt's very brief and equally cryptic comment, which you've quoted immediately above in its entirety, simply reflects his concern (whether justified or not) that the new Trueleo Y-pipe may not fit an `88. I don't think Jncomutt meant to imply the `88 has a less restrictive Y-pipe than that of older Fieros.