My first post... so a little intro. I am a Fiero nut. I have owned three. My first was a silver '86 2M4 with power windows, A/C (that didn't work) and a sunroof. That one was totalled years ago when a girl on her 1st day with her license pulled out in front of me. Hit her doing about 50mph. Ouch.
The second was the replacement for the first one. A red '86 2M4. Power nothing, but still much fun. Had to sell that one.
Now, I have in my possession a 1987 Fiero GT. It has 47,000 miles on it, and had been in storage for 14 years. Power everything (including rear defogger), luggage rack, but no sunroof.
When I first got it, the IAC valve pintle (and the area it seats in) was horribly dirty. This was causing the IAC to stick and resulted in 500rpm idles, IAC error codes, and stalling. A thorough cleaning of the throttle body fixed it right up.
There are only two outstanding problems with the car. The first is inoperative cruise control. My original 2M4 had an inoperative cruise until I figured out that the clutch switch was out of adjustment. So, I adjusted both of the brake switches, but it hasn't made a difference. I have a Helms manual, and I intend on troubleshooting this soon. Any pointers?
The other problem (which sounds like a much more significant issue to me) is that when I start it, for about 30 seconds, one of the lifters taps. Of course, because it had been sitting in 14-year-old oil, I changed it, ran it for a couple of weeks, and changed it again... but that hasn't made any difference. I ran Gunk ValveMedic (solvents) through the oil, and it seemed to help for about a day... then it's right back to tapping. (1) Is this a serious problem? (2) Is there something short of mechanical work that can fix it (or make it better)? (3) Am I damaging something with this?
The car has *not* had the recall work done on it. I asked some tech folks about the parts, and they are evidently still available from Pontiac for the work. I plan on getting it in soon to have it done. However, there seems to be NO record anywhere of this car's VIN. I have checked CarFax... no records. I have checked with Pontiac directly... no record. Could it be that it had been out of service for so long that it's records were just purged (on the assumption that it was a long gone car)?
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03:21 PM
PFF
System Bot
shop_rat45 Member
Posts: 3271 From: Lapeer, Michigan Registered: Mar 2004
welcome, when do you hear the voices? ...interesting sig?.........like any car the has sat , you would probable do good and change just about everything, plugs, wires, rotor, cap, fuel filter, air filter. do oil changes, fresh gas and injector cleaner in tank, also drop tank and check/replace pump and little tube/pulsator, also run it for a while sometimes seals have dried up and start toleak when the get hot, just keep an eye on evrything, if engine is oily/dirty steam clean it, also check cat conv fro cloggedness, i just invented a word!,.....it is just a long list , step by step, also brake hoses will swell after years, check those too...........good luck........................................
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05:37 PM
webbee Member
Posts: 1149 From: Los Angeles, Ca. USA Registered: Jun 2000
I have always had good luck with Marvel Mystery Oil freeing sticking lifters. 1 qt at oil change substituted for a regular qt or remove 1 qt of dirty oil and add MMO. If after that it still sticks, then a kerosene flush is called for. If that doesn't do it then the lifters have to come out.
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06:03 PM
BV MotorSports Member
Posts: 4821 From: Oak Hill, WV Registered: May 2001
Before I started dumping a bunch of crap in the engine and making those old seals and gaskets leak, I'd just pull and replace the lifters. Only talking about $60 or so and a few hours.
BTW, nice find! Oh yeah, not sure if you said it was a manual or not but if it is pull the rubber accordian hose away from the slave cyl and master cyl and check for leaks. I would be VERY surprised if they arent leaking after setting for so long then being put back into service.
Steven
------------------ '02 Subaru WRX, 5MT, Loaded, "free mods", Green induction, Vishnu silicone hoses & Stage 1ECM, Helix up-pipe , Halman ES MBC @ 15.5psi, JDM STi guage cluster, EGT/02/CEL fix. '88 Fiero Formula 5-speed, Loaded, Sunroof, YELLOW! EBC Green stuff pads, Poly everything, Bridgestone Potenza RE930's, K&N, Sprint headers, Cat elim, T/B coolant elim, MSD, Holley ign module, Dickman UGSK w/ comp short throw shifter, KYB's and the list continues..... '87 Fiero GT 4.9/4T60e w/3.33 final drive, ZEX nitrous 65hp shot, 88 cradle w/ 325# coil overs, Poly everything, Upgraded sway bars, KYB's, 16X7 M11's, 11.25 "Zettner" front brakes, Complete MSD ignition w/ 6AL box, Custom 2.5" Flowmaster exhaust, Grand Sport Corvette paint, Carbon fiber interior trim, '98 T/A CD w/ ETR, Reverse Indiglo guages, Pillar mounted AutoMeter O2, Hella H4 conversion. Follow its built up here: https://www.fiero.nl/forum/Forum1/HTML/027460.html Sadly... SOLD.
I've been bit by the 'low mileage bug' a couple of times too. I picked up a garage stored Deville with 9,000 miles on it. It had been in a body shop/mechanic shop since it was about 2 years old and would be considered properly stored. When I put the engine in a Fiero, the water pump started pouring, the oil pan leaked, one exhaust rocker pulled out of the head, the injectors were stuck and had to be replaced, fuel pump was gummed up, the transmission had collected condensation and had to be flushed several times and the valve body is stuck so that it will only shift from 1st to 2nd gear. Sometimes low mileage is not all its cracked up to be
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09:34 PM
Indiana_resto_guy Member
Posts: 7158 From: Shelbyville, IN USA Registered: Jul 2000
On occasion I've found that if you slide the on/off switch for the cruise to the ON position the cruise will set. After that the cruise acts normally till the car is shut off as I recall.
Welcome to the forum! Thought I'd suggest checking the vacuum hoses on the cruise. They tend to dry rot over time. Just replaced some myself.
I'd say that a lifter problem can just get worse. It's probably best to go ahead and replace the bad one, or change them all. It is tough on a car to let it set (even in storage). Over time, everything in the engine will begin to set in place because nothing has moved. If you store a car, it's always good to start it every few weeks and let it run for a few minutes. Doing that always helps keep the internals lubricated. Just my $0.02.
The problem about the lifters is that I am a small-time, small-stuff mechanic. I can fix most external things on the engine and most everything body- and interior-wise... but when it comes to things like replacing lifters, I am at a complete loss on how-to knowledge.
Would I be better served to just take it somewhere (Pontiac dealer?) and let them have a crack at it?
[This message has been edited by VoicesInMyHead (edited 07-01-2004).]
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11:24 PM
Firefox Member
Posts: 4307 From: New Berlin, Wisconsin Registered: Feb 2003
Lifters are actually pretty easy to replace. It might seem like a huge big time project, but in fact it's pretty straight forward. Like Steve said, a few hours and about $60 ( I think that's right) and you'll be good to go. Plus, you get to see the inside of the engine!
If you decide to do this yourself, we'll be here to help if you run into problems. With a service manual, you'll do just fine.
Lifters are generally mated to the cam lobe they broke in with when the engine was new. Installing new lifters may or may not result in fairly rapid failure of the cam and the need to rebuild the engine. If the aforementioned flushes and Ed Park's decarbonizing kit (http://www.thefierofactory.com) don't work you can pull the lifters to disassemble and clean them, that will fix the problem, and put them back on the exact same lobe they came off of. This procedure will require a top end gasket set, about $50-75 for the full set so you can replace the valve stem seals while you have the valve covers off.
Regarding the cruise, most often the problem is a faulty stalk, either the switches inside or the wiring pigtail that runs down the column. Next are faulty pedal switches, you checked those with a meter when you adjusted them, right? Looks good is not the same as works good.
If you have some basic DC electrical experience you can check most of the cruise using this schematic:
New lifters on the original cam wont hurt or wear out any thing. The stock lifters removed/cleaned and put back in the wrong order will damage cam lobes.
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07:02 AM
RGBaker Member
Posts: 112 From: Ottawa, ON Canada Registered: Jun 2004
I've just put an '86 SE 2M6 with 75K Km (50K mi) back on the road after years of sitting on blocks. In addition to the obvious -- brakes, fluids, plugs, wires -- I had some success with a 'break-in' schedule.
Four weeks and 1000Km ago, the car ran very differently than it does today. I ran it from cold to full hot in a 25Km each-way run to the office. The first week, I kept it off the highway, hitting bursts of 80Kph but largely running a stop & go cycle on secondary roads. Part throttle acceleration was poor and unpredictable. Temperature (reported) erratic. Idle hunted. Fuel gauge never hit 'full'. Gas mileage (old school -- I still report in miles per imperial gallon) hovered in mid-teens. As the performance stabilized, I added a steady 110Kph run to the same trip cycle ...
Today, the idle is rock solid steady at 800rpm. Part & low throttle acceleration is fine; WOT thrilling. MPG a steady 21 -- all fluids stable and clean. The gas gauge reports a full tank when there is one -- even that lazy drivers headlight has decided to rise without help ... most of the time. There is a noisy exhaust note that probably indicates some degree of forward header failure, but even that is much quieter than it was ...
My point is I could have chased all sorts of 'issues' a month ago that have all sorted themselves out with steady operation. My guess is most of them have to do with sensors that weren't ready to perform at 100% after years of dormancy. High on the list of possible culprits is a TPS that had oxidized ... but all is well now. Maybe the injectors needed some heat & pressure to clean up fully. As long as the fundamentals are there -- oil pressure, clean exhaust, proper circulation in the cooling system -- consider putting some time and mileage on your engine before you get too deep in 'fixing' things.
When I first got it (about a month ago), there were numerous things wrong with it.
1. The front passenger brake caliper was seized... had that replaced and a brake job completed. 2. The engine wouldn't run on it's own without adding throttle... extremely dirty IAC passage and valve. 3. The A/C was inoperative... A/C shop recharged it. 4. Both headlamps worked exactly one time before they started doing the wave, then quit altogether... replaced the now-dry powder with Rodney Dickman's bushing kit 5. The oil pressure gauge would peg at idle, but read normal anywhere above idle... I have a replacement AC/Delco sender on my way now... tried a Niehoff from AutoZone... it was the wrong calibration (60psi calibration instead of 80psi) 6. The tires were actually only tires in the academic sense. They were round, they had once been made of rubber. (ok... I stole that line from one of my favorite movies)... replaced all the way around 7. The headliner was falling... got it replaced with a perfect color match from a local shop 8. The sun visors were just as bad... same shop did these in the GT-style, too. 9. Cruise control inoperative... still is... will be diagnosing soon 10. While in a car wash, the old rusty O2 sensor decided it'd hang itself... spontaneously broke right off of the exhaust. That's been replaced, too.
As for general fitness, hoses are in mostly good shape. One of the rubber vac hoses for the EGR solenoid (as well as the small hard vac line between the EGR vac and the EGR diagnostic switch) were in very bad shape. Replaced both of those.
There are no leaks anywhere, grommets fit nice and tight (though I do have a new PCV and breather grommet on it's way along with the oil pressure sender). The fuel level gauge is completely accurate. No smoke anytime... the exhaust is that usual, almost sweet "no unburned hydrocarbons", "catyalytic converter is working well" GM exhaust smell. :-) I am getting 20mpg in rough stop-n-go commuting traffic here in Atlanta... pretty good, I figure. When I first got it, I was lucky to get 17mpg out of it.
All in all, it's probably the most fit Fiero I have ever personally seen (though I admit I haven't ever been to any of the Fiero shows... yet.)
I'm going through a lot of that now with an 18,000mi car that had been sitting on blocks for 10years. I have fixed a few things, one of the major areas that I had to spend money on was frontend pieces. The upper control arm bushings were so dried out they were basically dust. Other frontend components had siezed up a bit from not moving and as the person I bought the car from had not thought about putting a grease gun to them before operating the car it cost me ball joints and inner tie rods. I suspect that some of the vacuum lines will probably need replacing. But its a project and hopefully one step at a time is all that is needed. I am currently doing a "break in" approach to driving the car.
[This message has been edited by NoFiero (edited 07-01-2004).]
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03:58 PM
30+mpg Member
Posts: 4061 From: Russellville, AR Registered: Feb 2002
...However, there seems to be NO record anywhere of this car's VIN. I have checked CarFax... no records. I have checked with Pontiac directly... no record. Could it be that it had been out of service for so long that it's records were just purged (on the assumption that it was a long gone car)?
Remember that the internet that you and I know is newer than these cars. Carfax and others probably are pretty accurate concerning information about cars since the late '90s but mid '90s and earlier are sketchy at best. I imagine that these early cars only got populated in their databases at the time to give the reporting agencies something to sell to the public. When I was looking for Fieros, a few of the ones I checked on had history back to the mid or late '90s if I was lucky. Most started in 2000 or later. I'm sure that how information in different states is reported makes a difference also. I noticed that some states published information every time the plates were renewed, other states only report when the car changes owners.
------------------ RickN White 88GT 5spd - Grey Interior White 85GT Auto - Grey Interior
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10:07 PM
Jul 2nd, 2004
2farnorth Member
Posts: 3402 From: Leonard, Tx. USA Registered: Feb 2001
I highly reccommend that you check/change the rubber lines that come from the gas tank (the ones behind the shield right in front of the cat.) They are prone to become brittle with age. They can look good on the outside but be rotten on the inside. If they leak the fuel will find it's way to the hot cat. converter. You'll probably have to lower the gas tank a little to put new lines on.
You're going through many of the same problems that I had with an 32xxx mile 86 GT that had been stored in a barn for 8 years, but it sure is nice to drive when it's done. Even still smells new.
Good luck, Dave
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06:00 AM
Notorio Member
Posts: 3012 From: Temecula, CA Registered: Oct 2003
Originally posted by VoicesInMyHead: The tires were actually only tires in the academic sense. They were round, they had once been made of rubber. (ok... I stole that line from one of my favorite movies)... replaced all the way around
Good "Christmas Story" quote, Voices. Welcome to the Forum!
If you take the car in for recall work, take the weather seal off the front edge of the decklid before you do. Never did understand how a recall would entitle them to "steal" a part from my car. /shrug
Turns out, it wasn't a lifter at all. I had the 88-C-24 recall performed on it at my local dealer, and they discovered that one exhaust stud had already been broken off the rear manifold, which was causing a leak until the manifold heated up.
