I don't even know where to start with a comment about how camaro's handle

Join the Fiero Racing list , lots of autocrossers , Track racers , Rally guys. Ask them what they think , I'm the moderator of the list ..170 or so people thus far from all over North America.... TOns of knowledge for people looking to set up a Fiero for fun or competition.

I mentioned in an earlier post how we sold our 15th anniversary F body...Y? we took it to an autocross and it handled like a shopping cart... So we ordered a vette.

Live Axle VS all independant suspension...Hmmmm it's a no brainer.

JM

HMMM....
Brand new Camaro (2001 with a V-8)
Skidpad = .81G
Slalom speed = 65.1mph

Fiero V-6 1985-1987 1988
Skid pad = .86G .89G
Slalom = 68.5mph 71.0mph

Source: Car and Driver website.

Not bad for a 13 to 16 year old "chevette" suspension.

BTW ~ the pre-94 F-bodies did worse than the new ones as for handling goes.

Man, this is weak.

Youve got some ****ed up info. the 2001 maro will get .89 at the skid pad, a z28 3rd gen maro will get .82. The only reason fiero's handle is because of the fat tires. The platform itself is a good one to upgrade but isnt **** otherwise. Fat tire on an otherwise basic suspension make it handle unpridectibly. I do have to admit though that they are nimbler and can handle better then a camaro

SLAMMEDFIERO- quit comparing the camaro to the corvette, it cost more for a reason.

FROSTY- kiss my ass, ive been posting in the fiero community longer then you.

MIKE- umm... 135hp vs. 190hp 165ftlb vs. 240ftlb me thinks not, and dont say its because of the weight
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91'RS 305TBI no mods to date
92' Lumina 275,000 miles and still humping!!!!

[This message has been edited by LottaBallsCamaro (edited 03-19-2001).]

[This message has been edited by LottaBallsCamaro (edited 03-19-2001).]

[This message has been edited by LottaBallsCamaro (edited 03-19-2001).]

I guess some people just can't handle the fact that a 15 year old "POS" car can handle the road just as well as most new high performance vehicles. BTW the Fiero has such good handling due to engine placement. Just ask the guys at Ferrari and Lamborghini why they put the engine behind the rear wheels! H*ll, I think the Fiero with bicycle tires would likely perform as well, or better than a camaro.

Someone is getting testy....

There have been a number of people who say they smoked a 305 Camaro, Because you own one and it's an all mighty camaro you find this hard to believe. Camaro's don't handle as well as a fiero .. I have autocrossed a 94 Lt1 Camaro with hotchkis suspension , it didn't handle as well as my fiero (mind you I have mods). Yeah it was fast in a straight line (wheel hop). Your 305 is not. Go to the strip , then come back with some slips showing us how fast it is.

Go to
http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/Track/1335/cayugapage.html

15.2 @ 90mph ..your 305 would probably best a high 15. This is a bone stock 86 GT with 140,000kms on it , George the owner is a damm good driver..

Was is this so hard to believe..you said don't mention the weight...Why not?? I had my car weighed at an Scca Event 2720lbs , whats a Camaro 500lbs heavier?

as for the #'s being F'd Up ....He said he got them From Car and Driver and I would be inclined to believe a major publication. But if thats not good enough I 'm sure I can dig up the original roadtests and scan them. All I have right here with me is the 87 Automobile roadtest for the fiero , there's no break down of cars tested like in other magazines , But I'm sure i can track one down.

Fiero's are not fast cars ..but 305 Camaro's are even slower... I'm sure there is a Fiero owner in the area with a GT 4 or 5spd what would be pleased to show you

I just searched the third gen list...Everyone says mid 15's to low 16's for a 305...sorry

JM

I just have one thing to say here. Citation X-11. Now THATS a car.Saw oneyesterday, White with silver.Man that thing was BAD!
OH, sorry, what about MR2s?

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I did a search of stock camaro spec's for 2000/2001 model years.
First link 1997 Camaro SS Z28 skid pad = .85
http://www.caranddriver.com/xp/Caranddriver/roadtests/199 8/October/199810_shorttake_chevrolet_camaroz28ss.xml?&page=3

Next link 2000 Camaro RS Skid Pad .81
http://www.caranddriver.com/xp/Caranddriver/features/2000/December/200 012_feature_SB_firehawk_Camaro.xml

Next link

Motor Trend 2000 Z28 skid pad .83 speed 65.7 mph (click on the data link on the page)

http://www.motortrend.com/sept99/camstang/camstang_f.html

(Left figures is camaro, right ones are the Mustang)
Specifications & Performance
Chevrolet Camaro Z28 Ford Mustang GT
Vehicle configuration Front engine/rear drive
2-dr. convertible Front engine/rear drive
2-dr. convertible
Engine type V-8, OHV, 2 valves/cyl. V-8, SOHC, 2 valves/cyl.
Displacement, ci/cc 346.0/5669 280.1/4588
Horsepower @ rpm 305 @ 5200 260 @ 5250
Torque @ rpm 335 @ 4000 300 @ 4000
Transmission type 4-speed auto. 4-speed auto.
Wheelbase, in/mm 101.1/2568 101.3/2573
Base curb weight, lb 3574 3429
0-60 mph, sec 5.5 6.2
Quarter mile, sec/mph 14.0/101.3 14.6/95.4
Braking 60-0 mph, ft 125 123
Lateral acceleration, g 0.83 0.84
600-ft slalom, mph 65.7 65.0
EPA city/hwy, mpg 17/24 17/24
Base price $27,850 $24,870
Price as tested $31,358 $27,900

So I have checked 2 major automotive magazines and 3 different models of a camaro and still cannot see you getting higher than
.85! Not to mention the low MPH in the slalom. These are the newer cars, your 1991 handles worse than these. The Fiero numbers were with stock wheels and tires. (tire designs have improved in the last 10 years too!) So if with 12 years of improvements in suspension design and tires a camaro still cannot match a Fiero in handling.

P.S.~ Note the weight of the camaro.

[This message has been edited by Oreif (edited 03-19-2001).]

I just went out to find a 3rd Gen F-body to see for myself.All I found was a C5. I lost, go figure.

[This message has been edited by danny boy (edited 03-19-2001).]

LottaBalls, I did not see the carbed HO 305's in your list of engines. Those were good for 190 HP. Your TBI 305 is not an HO. Just compare the Y-pipe and cat. inlet/outlets to a HO and look at the differences. I have had both the HO 5.0 and the TBI and the carbed is powerful, just not as consistant. Mine was an '84 Z-28 and good for mid 15's and almost 90 MPH in the quarter. The TBI car was a 16 second++++ car. Now, my 88 GT Fiero will run circles around the Z-28. The only real race that I have had was with a mid 70's Camaro with a built 350- 10 to 1 forged, lumpy cam, big carb, headers, flowmasters and big pipes. I kicked his a$$ so bad that I had to let off for the guy to catch up. He started making the usual excuses until his buddy said, "Look dude, you just got waxed by a damn 6 cylinder! It's time to go home."
I highly doubt that a TBI 305 could be any better. But maybe the new Vortec 6 liter engines in full size trucks are faster. I hope so, because I smoked one of them too.

quote ...Im not as stupid as you think.

You started us thinking it with the second sentence of your original post, and have done more to reinforce our belief with every subsequent reply. You also said you love the Fiero too, so why split hairs? You want to bash MR2's but use this thread to bash Fieros instead. My guess is you have some Fiero-hating cronies you're trying to show off to. We don't care. We don't care that you attempt to put us down to make yourself feel better. But in spite of that, we actually want you to enjoy whatever car you drive, and if it's not a Fiero that's okay.

We did the MR2 bashing already, and got real tired of it. But we're more than ready to bash anybody who wages flimsy attacks on our beloved cars then loses those battles and uses double-talk to avoid admitting it. Some people want to kill rattlesnakes, not because they're causing problems, but because they're some of the meanest muthas on land, and that's an ego threat. Some want to take sharks out of the water, not because they want one, but because sharks are mean. A nice Fiero is a mean machine, and there's always someone who wants to take em out. That gets our bristles up.

The Camaro part of your UserName may be accurate, but the first part certainly is not.

Perfectly said Cheever

Well first off not all Fiero's had the chevette suspension so throwing that around means nothing to me. Also someone with a Camaro should not be insulting anyone's suspension for that matter.

You said there's a reason the vette costs more. It doesn't cost that much more anyway. What maybe $10k more for a vette? I would take the vette any day because its a 10k times better sports car. No wonder F-Body's don't sell. Doesn't take expert financial analysis to figure it out. Your comment about the Fiero being only a few tenths faster so its a pos too, well no one here was saying that if your car isn't faster then mine its a pos, I'm just saying that with my bone stock 3.4 heavy GT I could take them by 2-3 car lengths all night long.

Like Oreif pointed out, the .85 on the skidpad is a new Camaro, not an old 80s Camaro. Not that much of a difference since most of the F-Body technology dates back to the 60s anyway but still a little difference.

bhooper, I saw that commercial too, I wasn't sure if they were MR2's or not at first. I don't know why they used them, but I do know they sold MR2's here until 95 so maybe it was shot around then or something. Would be possible.

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Jeff
'88 GT t-top 3.4
Baltimore, MD

OK let me set a few things straight. I like camaros, I like fieros. I think a 305 fi would take a GT fiero. Ive done it to my friends 85gt. Was this a fluke? maybe. I think Fieros are better handlers. They are lighter and have better weight distribution. When i said dont mantion weight, I was referring to the differecne in weight between a V6 camaro and a V8 camaro. Yes, sombody called my camaro a slow POS. No, I dont think any of are cars are POS's. I like whatever car you drive(as long as its american)too. I'm not tring to split hairs, I just think that a 305fi would be faster in the 1/4. I wasnt tring to offend anybody, I just stated what I thought. Yes a 3.4 would definatly take my car by alot. I dont use double talk to avoid admitting anything, If a GT beat my ass I would come up here and say, holy **** !!! You guys were so right!!! Or something stupid like that. I have raced one and I took it. Not by much, but I took it. And if I'm wrong about everything else I know it would be a close race either way. As far as a shitty suspension, I just said that stuff about the Chevette because its funny. 3rd gen suspension is capable of over 1g at the skid pad and it is not 30year old technology. So lets not get to personal about it. Just a few monthes ago, I read a motortrend with an article in which they compared the camaro ad corvette with a bunch of other cars. They rated theirs at .87g's but I'm sure I've read somewhere that they were capable of .89g's. I just remembered reading that article so your right about the new ones probably. I wouldnt buy a new one anyway. Well, maybe next years because itll more then likly have an LS6 in it.

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91'RS 305TBI no mods to date
92' Lumina 275,000 miles and still humping!!!!

[This message has been edited by LottaBallsCamaro (edited 03-19-2001).]

[This message has been edited by LottaBallsCamaro (edited 03-19-2001).]

"No wonder F-Body's don't sell."

I think the biggest problem with Camaro/Firebird sales is they don't seem to be trying! My wife just bought a new Mustang (just a V6 auto). I wanted her to check out the Camaro/Firebird before she decided for sure on the Mustang. It was almost impossible to find a new one on the lot to look at... And when they did have one, it was loaded with a V8 for almost $30k.

BUT... It seemed EVERY Ford dealer had at least 5 or 6 Mustangs sitting there... Most right at $20k or a little less with maybe one loaded GT.

No wonder the Mustang is outselling the Camaro and Firebird combined. Seems like I heard 2 to 1???

The main reason Camaros dont sell, Base price is like 25,000 and a fully loaded GT will set you back 28,000

Don't forget insurance costs , rising costs of gas.

JM

The trend today seems to be sport compacts...

and sport utes.

I raced a camero with a beefed up exhaust system, it was a POS rustbucket, but it still sounded pretty good. I think it was an 88 anyways, i took him by 3 car lengths!!!

The best part is getting them to follow you into a corner,then they slide out of the corner and that horrible screaching sound you hear isn't coming from your car Hmmmmmmmmm...HeHeHe

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88 Formula T-top
85 GT Turbo

84-87 Fiero suspension is good for well over 1g at the skidpad with a skilled driver, too. Just ask 1FST2M6. 1.13g

Throw on some new tires and decent shocks and Fiero's will pull .90g all day long... it's called physics... all other things being equal, a mid-engine car will be able to out turn a front-engine, while the front-engine will be more stable at high speeds.

Now get over it, man. Of course, haven't seen you posting any timeslips...

You are absolutly right about the suspension thing, I was just saying camaros arent as bad as you say.

STANDERD- Uh, hello? did you even read my last post? were not even talking about that anymore.

You guys are showing about as much class at times as they do over at the MR2 forum. Shame on you.

------------------

I hate to hear everybody dissing the Camaro/Firebird. If all the rumors are true, it will soon be gone, and the F-body guys will be in the same boat with us Fieroholics. What American performance cars will be left? Corvette, Viper, Mustang... gee, that's it!

F-body memories...

1971 - My dad has a wife, a newborn son (me) and $3000 to spend on a new car. Mom wants something sensible, like a second-hand Impala. Dad comes home with a brand-new Camaro...just a 307 w/2-bbl and 3-sp stick, but hey - it's a brand-new Camaro! Ran great for 10 years, but rusted to the ground. R.I.P.

1986 - Buddy borrows his dad's IROC. It's a 305 with tuned-port injection, but it has a 5-speed and a 3.50-something rear gear. It hauls ass.

1989 - Beautiful manager at clothing store where I work takes me out to make her boyfriend jealous. I get to drive her brand-new Camaro around all night. Hey, I was 17, and it was fun. It was slow (305 w/TBI and automatic), but who cares? Best of all, he didn't kick my ass.

1990 - Go to visit a buddy in the Navy who's stationed in Memphis. One of the guys he's stationed with has an '86 Berlinetta, and he has replaced the 2.8 with a tuned-port 350 with nitrous. We go barhopping and street-racing with it. I was drunk, but it seemed like that car was faster than the Millenium Falcon.

1995 - My uncle buys a bright-red '91 Z28 convertible. We go crusing around like little kids on Christmas morning. He thinks it's really fast...it isn't (tuned-port 305, highway gear, automatic). But there is nothing more American than a bright-red Z28 convertible and I wish I had one just like it.

1997 - Fly to Phoenix to visit Chris, my old college buddy. We go cruising ASU campus in his bright-red '93 Camaro. I give him lots of $hit because it's a 3.4 auto and isn't much faster than my 4-banger Fiero. It still looks sweet and we get lots of looks from young women, until they figure out we're, like, OLD. Lots of kids in Hondas want to race. Chris wisely declines.

I can't speak for you guys, but I love the F-bodies, and I will miss them when they're gone.

[This message has been edited by ChadMan (edited 03-20-2001).]

quote Originally posted by LottaBallsCamaro: STANDERD- Uh, hello? did you even read my last post? were not even talking about that anymore.

LottaBellsCamaro - uh, sorry. I guess I should have talked about how overpriced the 4th gens are. Sorry I'm not on this forum 24 hours a day and can't reply to a thread 2 minutes after it's updated...

quote Originally posted by Godsend: You guys are showing about as much class at times as they do over at the MR2 forum. Shame on you.

Well, doesn't it get a little annoying when someone comes on the board and says "My _______ will smoke any Fiero made!"... I'm sure I'd get the same reaction if I went to ls1.com and said I could kill any 4th gen, 'cause I did rip a 4th gen camaro a new butthole once. of course, it was also a 3.4 v6, think it was an auto, too. But that sure doesn't mean I can take 'em all...

Don't get me wrong, f-bodies are cool. Don't really like how the 4th gen camaro's look too much, but I really want to lease a new Trans-Am WS6 before they stop making them...

Well, my 86 s10 4x4 is faster then the 85 GT Fiero I used to own. My truck has a 2.8 v6 and a Flopro exhaust (read Flowmaster wannabe)with 3.73 gears and a 5speed manual. Although my Fiero was completly stock. What this has to do with this post I have no idea. Besides there is always someone faster.

On a side note I did race a first gen. MR2 with my truck, the other day. Getting on the freeway, I had a full car length on him til I hit fourth gear. The top end on this truck is pretty weak. Then he passed me. He had a suprised look on his face when he finally passed me. Again I have no idea what this has to do with this post.

Now that we've got at least two aussies on the forum, let's get serious about this MR2 vs FIERO argument. First of all.....What is a Camaro??????

How hot does a thread have to get before the moderator closes it?

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88 Formula T-top
85 GT Turbo

O HISTORY OF THE CAMARO
MONTREAL - Right from the start - in the fall of 1966 - Chevrolet knew automotive enthusiasts would be looking hard at its new four-seat sportster. This was, after all, Chevy's eagerly awaited "answer to the Mustang." Chevrolet named the car Camaro, and the rest is the stuff of legends.

THE FlRST GENERATlON: 1967 - 1969
The 1967 Camaro was worth waiting for. Two models were available: a sport coupe and a convertible. The long-hood, short-deck styling was smooth and sleek, especially when compared with the sharp-edged Ford Mustang. The standard '67 sport coupe was notably well-equipped and, with sticker prices starting at just $2,466, very affordable. Standard equipment included all-vinyl front bucket seats, a 6-cylinder engine, padded instrument panel and a new energy-absorbing steering column. Both the sport coupe and convertible could be or.dered with Rally Sport (RS) equipment, which added special exterior trim and a distinctive black-out grille with hidden headlamps.For the performance enthusiast, the '67 option list featured the SS 35O package, consisting of a special 295-HP, 35O-cubic- inch, "small-block" V8, heavy-duty suspension, and distinctive "bumblebee" striping around the nose. Mid- 1967 announcements included a "big-block" SS 396 model and - the beginning of a legend the Camaro Z28. The limited-production 1967 Z28 was born to race, and specially modified Z28s soon established themselves as the most winning ears on the Trans-Am raeing circuit. Chevrolet promoted the Z28 as "the closest thing to a 'Vette yet," and it was. Z28 equipment highlights included a high-output 3O2-cubic-inch V8, heavy-duty suspension, 4-speed manual transmission and power front disc brakes. The Z28 was readily identified by its bold ra11y striping on the hood and rear deck. Only 6O2 were built in 1967.The word on Camaro performance was getting around quickly, and in February, 1967, an SS 396 convertible was chosen as the Indianapolis 5OO Pace Car, an honor Camaro would enjoy again in 1969 and 1982.By 1968, Camaro was firmly entrenched as one of America's top-selling sporty cars. Chevrolet advertising described the Camaro as "The Hugger" because of its road-hugging suspension system. Refinements included "Astro Ventilation" (replacing side vent windows), side marker lamps and revised grille and tail lamp designser for 1969, new sheet metal gave Camaro a more muscular look, especially on the Rally Sport-equipped coupes and convertibles.

THE SECOND GENERATlON: 1970 - 1981
The radically restyled "second generation" Camaro arrived to rave reviews in February, 197O. This series of Camaro - good enough that it would continue through 1981 - was available as a coupe only. But performance and luxury options abounded. The sport coupe model offered a choice of a 25O-CiD Six, 3O7-CiD V8 and a 35O-CID V8. The optional RS package had special front-end styling with a Ferrari-like appearance. RS equipment could be combined with the SS35O, SS396, or - Camaro's star attraction - Z28 equipment.The '7O Z28 was the - car for performance enthusiasts and for good reason: the package included a new high-performance 36O-HP 35O-CiD LT-1 V8, 4-speed manual transmission, special suspension, larger wheels and tires, hood and rear deck striping and a rear spoiler. Only minor differences separated the Corvette and Camaro LT-1s - the latter clied a slightly lower (10-HP) horsepower rating, a dual-snorkel air cleaner and exposed distributor and ignition wires.The LT - 1 -equipped Z28 set a new performance standard and the reviews were glowing: "... We'll have to say it's the best American car we've ever driven, and more importantly it's one of the most satisfying cars for all-around use we've ever driven," wrote Road & Track.The Camaro was little changed in the early Seventies, but high resale values, an excellent reputation and uncompromised performance kept loyalists coming back for more. A new luxury version - the LT - lived in 1973, and Federal bumper regulations necessitated new front and rear fascias the following year. The Z28 was discontinued in 1974 - temporarily as it would turn out - a victim ofthe year's energy crisis. Marketing experts who forecasted the Camaro's demise were proven wrong again in the mid-Seventies. Sales reached new highs every year, and the Z28 returned (by popular demand) in mid- 1977. New body-color front and rear bumpers gave a fresh look to the classic Camaro profile in 1978. Z28 sales soared, too. One memorable Z28 advertisement proclaimed, "it'll put butterflies in your stomach, a lump in your throat and a smile on your face." A stylish Berlinetta model replaced the LT for 1979. Other changes included new striping and new aluminum wheels for the Z28. "T-top" removable roof panels were an increasingly popular Camaro option in the late Seventies. A more fuel- efficient V6 replaced the in-line Six as standard equipment in 198O, but most Camaro buyers continued to opt for V8 power. By the early Eighties, though, it was time for a new Camaro. And Chevro1et was ready.

THE THlRD GENERATlON: 1982-1992
The 1982 Camaro was a sensationally styled 2+2 coupe that appealed to enthusiasts with its rear-wheel-drive configuration, available V8 power and precise handling characteristics. in Z28 form, the '82 Camaro was on the cover of every car-buff magazine, won Motor Trend's prestigious "Car of the Year" award and paced the Indianapolis 500 . Performance refinements kept Camaro ahead of its competition in the early 1980s. The most notable included the Z28's high-output 5.0L V8 option and a 5-speed manual transmission in 1983. An iROC option for the Z28 made its debut in 1985, commemorating the International Race of Champions racing series that used Camaros exclusively in the 198Os.Corvette-inspired features included 16-inch unidirectional tires . and a 5.0L V8 with Tuned Port Fuel injection. The 350 finally made a comeback in 1986 with over 230hp. The Camaro convertible came back in 1987 - after an 18year absence - to rave reviews from the car critics. Motor Trend wrote, "Out on the street, no One doesn't notice this car...The iROC-Z convertible will be one of the most desirable cars of this decade." For 1989, the RS nameplate returned, now signifying an upgraded standard Camaro that looked like a Z28. Chevy called it the "more practical, easy-to-own Camaro." Camaro entered the Nineties with the Personal Automotive Security System (PASS-Key) theft-deterrent system and a driver's side air bag, for reduced insurance rates and greater safety.Camaro's heritage runs deep in both professional and amateur racing circles, and to date the Camaro has 63 SCCA Trans-Am series race wins - the most first-place finishes for any model in the series'history.Camaro celebrated its 25th Anniversary in the 1992 model year. Chevrolet released a Heritage Appearance Package as optional equipment that included emblems, bold "Sixties-sty1e" hood and deck stripes, a body-color grille, black headlamp pockets and body-color wheel treatment.Technological advancements further improved Camaro's build quality and body integrity for 1992, including silicon-impregnated weather.striping, a water management system for T-tops and the use of structural adhesives on convertible and T-top models.

1993 - A NEW GENERATlON OF PERFORMANCE
Now a new generation of this American classic makes its entrance. The 1993 Camaro wass designed and engineered to offer outstanding value in the competitive sporty coupe market. Available in two coupe models - standard and an uplevel Z28 - the '93 Camaro offers enthusiasts an outstanding combination of technology, safety features and quality. The 280-HP LT1 V8-equipped Z28 is Chevy's highest-performance regular production Camaro and, as always, "the closest thing to a 'Vette yet.". Since 93, The camaro has gotten better, with the introduction of a 3.8 v6 in 96', and the LS1 in 98'.

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91'RS 305TBI no mods to date
92' Lumina 275,000 miles and still humping!!!!

Yes I have argued this point before, the 3.8 was introduced in 95, not 96.

Yeah what is the deal with those darn mr2's.The fastback mr2 is an obvious ripoff of the fiero fastback.It came out 3.5 years after the fiero did,But Toyota would say that it was on the design board at the Tokyo office since '79

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88 Formula T-top
85 GT Turbo

[This message has been edited by Mr.Frosty (edited 03-21-2001).]

HEY, to the guys saying that they can beat ANY fiero, have you ever heard of the Purple Pavement Eater???????

Bwahahahaha!!!!

Hey 88/2.8 do you live anywhere near Mid Rivers, MO? My Mom lives there,and when I visit there is a house with 2 fastbacks in the driveway,Is that you?

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88 Formula T-top
85 GT Turbo

This thread sucks, is pointless and deserves to die.
Keep the Camaro and MR2 Bulls**t on their respective boards.
C02M0

Camaro's are an american legend. I don't think any of us can deny that. But if their such a great popular sports car why are they getting the axe? I love my fiero because if I see one it's unusual seeing a camaro is typical. Money really doesn't matter. My wifes parents buy us a new car every 6 to 9 months...if I wanted a camaro or a stang I could have had one! We went out to ford to test drive the new stangs and it was the most depressing thing in my life. I was really pumped up for it and when I found out it drove like a sporty ford tauras I was completly depressed! I don't know where I'm going with this other then just making observations. Lets save are ragging and flaming for the ricers. Everybody likes what they like.One more thing...just because the corvette is a more expensive doesn't make them better. Hell who knows how fast they are on the street...It's an old mans sports car. Everytime I pull up beside one theirs and old guy in the drivers seat driving 20 miles under the speed limit. By the way has anyone here with a v6 ever lost to a 1st fen mr2? I know I haven't....

GALEN- Chiltons says 96' but you would know more about the V6 camaros rthen I.

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91'RS 305TBI no mods to date
92' Lumina 275,000 miles and still humping!!!!

Firebirds will be leaving us. Camaros will be gone for a little while but according to various auto magazines the Camaro will be coming back in 2004 and is supposed to rekindle the classic Camaro (1st gen)in response to all of the other retro stuff that Chrysler and Ford are doing.

As for F-body vs Mustang, it has always baffled me how F-bodies are faster, better handling and better looking inside and out AND CHEAPER than Mustangs (mustangs have been losing against Camaros in comparisons for years), yet the Mustangs outsell both F-bodies combined. Its a crazy chicken world, (Mystery Men) but I have always preferred the Camaro over Mustang.

But at the same time if I were given the keys to a brand new Camaro SS I would have to say I would sell it and either get another Fiero and fix it up or buy a pristine restored 67 SS. Ive just not been that comfortable in any car more than I am comfortable with my Fiero.

I saw that 2nd gen MR-2 comercial too...the salf flats must be busy with comercials lately...

Why can't we just get over the fact that Fieros beat certain Camaros? Just like certain Mustangs get beat by Fieros as well? We Fiero owners are the ones who have to defend our so called POS all the time.

All this bench racing is getting old, take it to the track and see if the bullshit walks!

If not Camaro will just have to admit that it might be possible through popular evidence that a carbed 3.5 can be beaten by a Fiero GT. I am more apt to believe someone who has done it than someone who hasn't.

The RS may have just been undercarbed to save gas to help the CAFE numbers for GM, keep insurance just a little bit lower for owners and simply allow the buyer to have a Camaro with a V8 but not want to have the gas mileage penalties. The Mustangs had to do it why not?

That was a pretty good rundown on the history of the Camaro.

I had an 86 T/A and while I thought the car was a pile of crap,(previous owners fault, so I cannot comment on the build quality or performance) it felt like you had closer control of the car, the throttle and shifter didn't have that long cable sluggishness that my Fiero does.

Mustangs outsell F-cars because 6 cyl Mustangs make better family cars. That's why the new version (or is that replacement?) of the 4th gen f body will be more in proportion to the Mustang.

Speaking of Mustangs, the next time a 5.0 owner calls your car a firey death trap, plese be couteous to remind them that they probably forgot about the fuel line clips or their ignition switches.